First, the G5 is going to be justlike the iMac. Everyone thought it was coming out at so and so show and nothing. Then the next show comes around and everyone is almost certain...nothing. Finally MWSF 2002 and it shows up. I think we will see the same thing with the G4 to G5.
MacUser UK who has an excellent track record posted before MWSF that Power Macs may show up at up to 1GHz. So this report from this guy could be right on. Maybe Naked Mole Rat knows something we don't know because the Rat has been hitting about 75% this year but I would place my money on MacUser UK which stated up to GHz.
There also is nothing groundbreaking about this bump, and Apple would not gather press around and spend the money on food and beverages and all of the hassle of having all of those people come to Apple just to announce a speed bumped Power Mac, the press would not be happy about that.
Apple speed bumped the Powerbooks, added a faster system bus and faster graphics and then added a combo drive to them without Steve Jobs uttering a word, they can do the same for the Power Macs.
Like I have said before, do not get your hopes up when it comes to Mot, you will ALWAYS be disappointed.
Intel is up to 2.2 ghz now</strong><hr></blockquote>
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
Dual G4 + OS X is indeed the way to go.</strong><hr></blockquote>
How many "real" PC users are there and, your average friend joe's dad won't be reading the latest issue of PC magazine.
"True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact."
I think it's about time. but it took Intel and AMD struggling to get their chips any higher to do it. They wouldn't believe anyone else including Apple.
If this was really the case then Apple would have announced this @ MWSF don't you think? I mean a small little speed bump like this on the towers would not take any of the iMac spotlight. Just doesn't make any sense. If anything this lat MWSF has proved that all the rumors sights know DICK about what's going on... Let alone some chump at a store outside of apple. When apple announces the new Pro's , they'll be a lot better than this rubbish.......
The highest clock chip would most likely be single, judging from past experience. I would assume that the new low end model will be the 867MHz chip. Perhaps the 733MHz model would be kept at the educational store.
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
Dual G4 + OS X is indeed the way to go.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Don't forget there are dual or even quad cpu Pentinum 4 Xeon machines out there. Using DP machine to say Pentinum or AMD killer is total non-sense
<strong>If this was really the case then Apple would have announced this @ MWSF don't you think? I mean a small little speed bump like this on the towers would not take any of the iMac spotlight. Just doesn't make any sense. If anything this lat MWSF has proved that all the rumors sights know DICK about what's going on... Let alone some chump at a store outside of apple. When apple announces the new Pro's , they'll be a lot better than this rubbish....... </strong><hr></blockquote>
Makes sense if the "speed bump" is as insignificant as this. It's rather embarassing if you ask me.
You are aware of a company called Motorola are you not? You are aware that in 12+ months time they have moved us a whopping 134MHz faster. That's it. No more. In 12 months. 134MHz.
Please, let's get rid of a new myth that has just evolved, and that's about the Athlon beating any and every CPU there is.
The Athlon XP 2000+ (1.67GHz) is generally accepted to be faster than a Pentium 4 2GHz with the Willamette core. In some points the P4 beats the Athlon, but in most points the Athlon wins.
Then there's the comparison between the XP 2000+ and the 2GHz Northwood core P4. There things already look different, the two chips are about on par. Now there's also the 2.2GHz Northwood P4, and while some of the benchmarks still favor the Ahtlon XP 2000+, the overall winner is definitely and by quite a margin in some benchmarks, teh Northwood P4 2.2GHz.
So,what you can rightfully say, is that the Athlon XP has better Instruction per clockcycle performance, but you can no longer say that the P4 is in any case slower than the Athlon. If you do say that, you just expose yourself as an ignorant Mac user to all the PC users who know it, and I trust all who ever knew that the Athlon was faster despite lower clock rates, has now had to give that medal back to the P4. Also the Northwood P4 is based on 0.13 micron and currently overclocks to over 3.5GHz, while the Athlon is still based on 0.18 and thus has nearly reached it's limits until it's also moved over to 0.13 micron.
So please stop telling us the Athlon is the undisputed king of Wintel CPUs, it's just plain wrong. There are many arguments that speak for the Athlon (price, performance, availability), but if you want the overall fastest machine in the Wintel world (which you will want if you want to compare the fastest Mac to the fastest PC), you have to take the Northwood P4 until further notice.
Btw, why is the Athlon, and AMD so popular now? Back at the K5 and K6 chips, everyone laughed at them because they were so slow, and everyone loved Intel. Now all of a sudden Intel is set equal to the devil himself and AMD is the heavenly savior, that gives choice and alternatives to the market, similar to linux, which is also hailed beyong reason. Hey after all Intel is a great company, and even we mac users owe them a lot, I mean A LOT.
Only because they chose MHz over IPS doesn't mean they're bad or anything.
If you want a baddie, take Microsoft, although we owe even them also quite a lot of stuff. (good and bad).
Conclusion:
The Athlon did show that MHz don't equal to higher performance, especially in the Wintel market, but we should try to stick on the rug of reality and see what is really going on, instead of blindly calling a king that is none.
I really hope this is not true. Irrespective of what may or may not be coming, people really belive that the G5 wil come this year. With this in mind, who is going to be dumb enough to buy a G4 tower? even one with the apollo name? Certainly not a PC user. I think apple's hype this time round has got them into serious trouble plus the proliferation of "Gosh, we have some great products coming out" quips that apple execs seem addicted to making.
a Pmac with any G4 in it is going to be a failure - people really are not THAT stupid. With Adobe and especially Macromedia effectively abanddoning the Mac platform apple needs to set the world alight soon.
As for the moto (spit) situation. I don't get it. From all accounts Steve Jobs is the kind of guy who'll scream at anything he doesn't like or get and will in a fit of incredible pique dump companies like a stone. I can't believe that he has put up with the moto thing for so long unless he wanted to.
The 733,933 and dual 1 Ghz makes perfect sense and Apple will do this. The 733 will be priced below the 800 G4 iMac and hence will attract a different person. The lack of a 800 tower would make sure to differentiate the imac from the towers. This is right on. It sucks - but it is right on!
You are aware of a company called Motorola are you not? You are aware that in 12+ months time they have moved us a whopping 134MHz faster. That's it. No more. In 12 months. 134MHz.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Thier point is then why is Apple not releasing these slow sorry towers now? They rev every six months, we are close to missing that window.
The reason to miss that window is because the towers will be much faster then this xlr8 thread is speculating and wouldn't stolen some of the iMac's glory.
offtopic-
Why are we all of a sudden putting faith in a thread at xlr8 where as other forums have been laughed at for thier threads? Seems like if you are going to laugh, you need to laugh at them all until something solid is out.
Thier point is then why is Apple not releasing these slow sorry towers now? They rev every six months, we are close to missing that window.
The reason to miss that window is because the towers will be much faster then this xlr8 thread is speculating and wouldn't stolen some of the iMac's glory.
offtopic-
Why are we all of a sudden putting faith in a thread at xlr8 where as other forums have been laughed at for thier threads? Seems like if you are going to laugh, you need to laugh at them all until something solid is out.</strong><hr></blockquote>
There are many reasons why they may be waiting. Maybe to get the G4 above 933 it has to be an Apollo therefore the wait. Maybe the channel was still too full and they wanted another 2-3 weeks to go by. Who knows why but we all should learn from the past, create a learning curve when it comes to Apple Computer. Every time you expect what seems to be the reasonable and logical thing to do, you will be disappointed.
I have to admit that the new iMac is the first time I said to myself: Wow, that actually is a good machine that exceded my expectations. But the only reason that was possible was because Motorola has been making these chips for well over 6 months. When it comes to advancing the chips speed, which the Power Mac is always the first to receive...Motorola moves as fast as sap on a Pine tree.
Comments
<strong>Bodhi
Got to tell you, I'm getting to the point that when I see you post I get a little unnerved.
First you post that we may very well not see any changes to the PowerMacs @ MWSF and the rest is history.
Now this
But based on the comments a Motorola rep made to, who was it, Macworld?, that the next G4 would be SOI on 0.18µ this seems accurate.
[ 01-17-2002: Message edited by: rickag ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well lets put some pieces of the puzzle together.
First, the G5 is going to be justlike the iMac. Everyone thought it was coming out at so and so show and nothing. Then the next show comes around and everyone is almost certain...nothing. Finally MWSF 2002 and it shows up. I think we will see the same thing with the G4 to G5.
MacUser UK who has an excellent track record posted before MWSF that Power Macs may show up at up to 1GHz. So this report from this guy could be right on. Maybe Naked Mole Rat knows something we don't know because the Rat has been hitting about 75% this year but I would place my money on MacUser UK which stated up to GHz.
There also is nothing groundbreaking about this bump, and Apple would not gather press around and spend the money on food and beverages and all of the hassle of having all of those people come to Apple just to announce a speed bumped Power Mac, the press would not be happy about that.
Apple speed bumped the Powerbooks, added a faster system bus and faster graphics and then added a combo drive to them without Steve Jobs uttering a word, they can do the same for the Power Macs.
Like I have said before, do not get your hopes up when it comes to Mot, you will ALWAYS be disappointed.
<strong>1000 x 2 (200 bus 5x) <-- AMD, P5 Wintel killer
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....o ohhhh.......ooooohhhhh man......AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA....OK, I'm done</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, at least one of you found it funny, I have to work in my choice of words next time - punch line was too soft...
... but, then again, it maybe not so far fetched after all. Or is it? Just looking for a reason to leave the PC side myself on my next tower purchase.
<strong>
Not in fantasy land where Jobs and Mot live.</strong><hr></blockquote>
true
<strong>
1000 x 2 (200 bus 5x) <-- AMD, P5 Wintel killer
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Intel is up to 2.2 ghz now
<strong>
Intel is up to 2.2 ghz now</strong><hr></blockquote>
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
Dual G4 + OS X is indeed the way to go.
<strong>
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
Dual G4 + OS X is indeed the way to go.</strong><hr></blockquote>
How many "real" PC users are there and, your average friend joe's dad won't be reading the latest issue of PC magazine.
I think it's about time. but it took Intel and AMD struggling to get their chips any higher to do it. They wouldn't believe anyone else including Apple.
<strong>
True, yet the new AMD (which has a slower mhz rating) smokes past the latest Pentium... so the whole idea of "higher clock cycles makes for a faster system" is pretty much a broken myth in the PC camp now a days. And you can ask any *real* PC user about this fact.
Dual G4 + OS X is indeed the way to go.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Don't forget there are dual or even quad cpu Pentinum 4 Xeon machines out there. Using DP machine to say Pentinum or AMD killer is total non-sense
[ 01-17-2002: Message edited by: Leonis ]</p>
<strong>If this was really the case then Apple would have announced this @ MWSF don't you think? I mean a small little speed bump like this on the towers would not take any of the iMac spotlight. Just doesn't make any sense. If anything this lat MWSF has proved that all the rumors sights know DICK about what's going on... Let alone some chump at a store outside of apple. When apple announces the new Pro's , they'll be a lot better than this rubbish.......
Makes sense if the "speed bump" is as insignificant as this. It's rather embarassing if you ask me.
Excellent point.
- Mark
You are aware of a company called Motorola are you not? You are aware that in 12+ months time they have moved us a whopping 134MHz faster. That's it. No more. In 12 months. 134MHz.
The Athlon XP 2000+ (1.67GHz) is generally accepted to be faster than a Pentium 4 2GHz with the Willamette core. In some points the P4 beats the Athlon, but in most points the Athlon wins.
Then there's the comparison between the XP 2000+ and the 2GHz Northwood core P4. There things already look different, the two chips are about on par. Now there's also the 2.2GHz Northwood P4, and while some of the benchmarks still favor the Ahtlon XP 2000+, the overall winner is definitely and by quite a margin in some benchmarks, teh Northwood P4 2.2GHz.
So,what you can rightfully say, is that the Athlon XP has better Instruction per clockcycle performance, but you can no longer say that the P4 is in any case slower than the Athlon. If you do say that, you just expose yourself as an ignorant Mac user to all the PC users who know it, and I trust all who ever knew that the Athlon was faster despite lower clock rates, has now had to give that medal back to the P4. Also the Northwood P4 is based on 0.13 micron and currently overclocks to over 3.5GHz, while the Athlon is still based on 0.18 and thus has nearly reached it's limits until it's also moved over to 0.13 micron.
So please stop telling us the Athlon is the undisputed king of Wintel CPUs, it's just plain wrong. There are many arguments that speak for the Athlon (price, performance, availability), but if you want the overall fastest machine in the Wintel world (which you will want if you want to compare the fastest Mac to the fastest PC), you have to take the Northwood P4 until further notice.
Btw, why is the Athlon, and AMD so popular now? Back at the K5 and K6 chips, everyone laughed at them because they were so slow, and everyone loved Intel. Now all of a sudden Intel is set equal to the devil himself and AMD is the heavenly savior, that gives choice and alternatives to the market, similar to linux, which is also hailed beyong reason. Hey after all Intel is a great company, and even we mac users owe them a lot, I mean A LOT.
Only because they chose MHz over IPS doesn't mean they're bad or anything.
If you want a baddie, take Microsoft, although we owe even them also quite a lot of stuff. (good and bad).
Conclusion:
The Athlon did show that MHz don't equal to higher performance, especially in the Wintel market, but we should try to stick on the rug of reality and see what is really going on, instead of blindly calling a king that is none.
Do I make myself clear enough to follow?
G-News
a Pmac with any G4 in it is going to be a failure - people really are not THAT stupid. With Adobe and especially Macromedia effectively abanddoning the Mac platform apple needs to set the world alight soon.
As for the moto (spit) situation. I don't get it. From all accounts Steve Jobs is the kind of guy who'll scream at anything he doesn't like or get and will in a fit of incredible pique dump companies like a stone. I can't believe that he has put up with the moto thing for so long unless he wanted to.
COME ON apple, lets see the 2.5Ghz G5
(and pigs will fly)
<strong>budz420 & sc_markt :
You are aware of a company called Motorola are you not? You are aware that in 12+ months time they have moved us a whopping 134MHz faster. That's it. No more. In 12 months. 134MHz.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Thier point is then why is Apple not releasing these slow sorry towers now? They rev every six months, we are close to missing that window.
The reason to miss that window is because the towers will be much faster then this xlr8 thread is speculating and wouldn't stolen some of the iMac's glory.
offtopic-
Why are we all of a sudden putting faith in a thread at xlr8 where as other forums have been laughed at for thier threads? Seems like if you are going to laugh, you need to laugh at them all until something solid is out.
<strong>
Thier point is then why is Apple not releasing these slow sorry towers now? They rev every six months, we are close to missing that window.
The reason to miss that window is because the towers will be much faster then this xlr8 thread is speculating and wouldn't stolen some of the iMac's glory.
offtopic-
Why are we all of a sudden putting faith in a thread at xlr8 where as other forums have been laughed at for thier threads? Seems like if you are going to laugh, you need to laugh at them all until something solid is out.</strong><hr></blockquote>
There are many reasons why they may be waiting. Maybe to get the G4 above 933 it has to be an Apollo therefore the wait. Maybe the channel was still too full and they wanted another 2-3 weeks to go by. Who knows why but we all should learn from the past, create a learning curve when it comes to Apple Computer. Every time you expect what seems to be the reasonable and logical thing to do, you will be disappointed.
I have to admit that the new iMac is the first time I said to myself: Wow, that actually is a good machine that exceded my expectations. But the only reason that was possible was because Motorola has been making these chips for well over 6 months. When it comes to advancing the chips speed, which the Power Mac is always the first to receive...Motorola moves as fast as sap on a Pine tree.