Most users probably never focus on anything but a single window at once whether it be their browser, some word processor, fullscreen game, etc. on their laptops/desktops. At least that's been my experience working with all sorts of computer users across various tech knowledge levels and age for more than a decade. It's usually only people such as power users, developers, etc. that tend to have tons of windows open at the same time that they are focusing on.
Hmm. So do you suppose that multi-window operating systems like OS X will soon become a niche product for power users and developers, and that most users will find a single-window OS such as iOS adequate for their computing needs?
Hmm. So do you suppose that multi-window operating systems like OS X will soon become a niche product for power users and developers, and that most users will find a single-window OS such as iOS adequate for their computing needs?
I wonder how long it will take for Microsoft to understand that not all people want their tablet computers to be like a Windows desktop computer or want to enrol in an expensive computer training program to learn how to use their tablet computers. There are far, far more people (aka customers) who will buy a device that is easy to use and has stacks of useful apps, rather than nerds who want to take a portable desktop computer to a baseball game.
Windows 8 tablet in Modern GUI is quite easy to use, IMHO. For customers with simple needs, "Desktop" tile can be removed from Start screen and users don't even need to know they can jump to classic desktop.
I guess "casual" and "general-purpose" computing were ill defined in my post, but I was getting at the distinction between tablets and laptops expressed in forum posts such as this one. The suggestion there is that the iPad defines what a tablet should be used for, and that tasks that would be awkward to perform on the iPad are properly reserved for laptops and desktops. The undercurrent of MS's Win8 ads has been "why shouldn't you be able to do that on a tablet?" As has been mentioned before in this forum, MS regards the tablet as essentially a highly portable, touch-optimized PC.
There is no harm in trying to push the envelope. It is happening all the time. Just consider where smart phones are now, compared to what is phone supposed to do by definition. Have people stuck with definition of phone - as it was for more than 100 years - we would still all be using feature cellphones at best.
iPad concept was perfect at the time of introduction - as in device small and portable enough to be easily used hand-held, and optimised for touch interface. Personally, I would not sacrifice those values for having more powerful device, but if I can have more powerful and capable device without sacrificing defining values? Why, thank you.
And doing a poor job since especially when many people do more than "casual" computing on both iPads and Android tablets. Outside of people dancing like goofballs and doing the clickity-clacking with the detachable keyboards I've yet to see much "general-purpose computing" being done in Microsoft's commercials. Not to mention that "general-purpose computing" does not necessarily entail multiple windows or multitasking. You are false conflating the concepts as if they are tightly related which they aren't. OSes like CP/M, MS-DOS, etc. offered plenty of "general-purpose computing" without having either multiple windows or multitasking.
Well, these are commercials, not in-depth reviews. They are simply implying that W8 tablet can do more than iPad, hoping to get as many customers as possible interested to find out more.
I'm not sure where are you going with CP/M and MS-DOS parallel here. They were what they were at the time - best or most convenient option available, probably both. So was typewriter perfectly fine for journalists, writers, academics. And feature cellphones served well in their time. But guess what? They were all replaced with more versatile solutions, once such solutions were available.
Apple has sold over 100 million iPads that don't have "proper multitasking"
Are we to believe there are tons of people who are saying "OMG it's finally here! The tablet I can run two apps side-by-side!!!!"
Or... you can ask it in another way:
Was the iPad a failure this whole time because it couldn't run two apps side-by-side?
Because I certainly didn't notice that...
But then, DOS was not a failure for not having GUI at all. Until GUI systems started emerging and reducing DOS usage until it became completely obsolete.
I'm not saying iPad will go dinosaur, but I do expect that, at some time in future, iOSX or XY will have more desktop-like multitasking. What was hard to achieve with early iPad hardware performance, will simply be no excuse for future hardware - probably current hardware already. Like desktop OS evolved from command line, no GUI, no multitasking keyboard-muncher to what modern OS is now, tablet OS will also evolve from single app, no multitasking, full screen environment. We will see different implementations, but features will be there.
I'm not sure where are you going with CP/M and MS-DOS parallel here. They were what they were at the time - best or most convenient option available, probably both. So was typewriter perfectly fine for journalists, writers, academics. And feature cellphones served well in their time. But guess what? They were all replaced with more versatile solutions, once such solutions were available.
The point is that one can have "general purpose computing" without multiple windows or multitasking. The person was falsely conflating the two concepts.
My iPads infuriated me countless times when ive been imessaging or typing an email to someone and need to keep switching back to safari to look stuff up. The 4 finger swiping or double clicking the home button are some of the worst design ever! In an ad it looks great, in reality you end up with multiple apps between the two you want to switch between so your actually doing the gesture 4 times to get between the two, by which time you've forgotten what you just looked at. Then you try the home button method which then changes the order all the apps are open in, not to mention plays a stupid animation every time. Seriously when you've watched that thing 20 times in less than a minute it gets old. If you need to switch between 3 apps things get even worse as the order changes even more and you have no idea if you should swipe left or right.
Every user may not use it every day, and you may never want to use it for a video call, but i reckon most users at some point will want to look at two apps at the same time. Or maybe not even 2 apps, win 8.1 is extending it so 1 app can use multiple window panes, e.g. 2 emails, 2 web pages etc.
I agree, and think I posted somewhere here that having side by side docs would be useful (and I think there are apps that make this happen). But this I don't see as an everyday use for the iPad, which doesn't mean it should be excluded, and that Microsoft continually pushes every desktop feature to every device when that feature would be used so seldom.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJones
Most users probably never focus on anything but a single window at once whether it be their browser, some word processor, fullscreen game, etc. on their laptops/desktops. At least that's been my experience working with all sorts of computer users across various tech knowledge levels and age for more than a decade. It's usually only people such as power users, developers, etc. that tend to have tons of windows open at the same time that they are focusing on.
Hmm. So do you suppose that multi-window operating systems like OS X will soon become a niche product for power users and developers, and that most users will find a single-window OS such as iOS adequate for their computing needs?
Quote:
Originally Posted by d4NjvRzf
Hmm. So do you suppose that multi-window operating systems like OS X will soon become a niche product for power users and developers, and that most users will find a single-window OS such as iOS adequate for their computing needs?
No!
History repeats. Back in the days, MS had money and Apple had poke-in-the-eye adds.
Windows 8 tablet in Modern GUI is quite easy to use, IMHO. For customers with simple needs, "Desktop" tile can be removed from Start screen and users don't even need to know they can jump to classic desktop.
There is no harm in trying to push the envelope. It is happening all the time. Just consider where smart phones are now, compared to what is phone supposed to do by definition. Have people stuck with definition of phone - as it was for more than 100 years - we would still all be using feature cellphones at best.
iPad concept was perfect at the time of introduction - as in device small and portable enough to be easily used hand-held, and optimised for touch interface. Personally, I would not sacrifice those values for having more powerful device, but if I can have more powerful and capable device without sacrificing defining values? Why, thank you.
Well, these are commercials, not in-depth reviews. They are simply implying that W8 tablet can do more than iPad, hoping to get as many customers as possible interested to find out more.
I'm not sure where are you going with CP/M and MS-DOS parallel here. They were what they were at the time - best or most convenient option available, probably both. So was typewriter perfectly fine for journalists, writers, academics. And feature cellphones served well in their time. But guess what? They were all replaced with more versatile solutions, once such solutions were available.
But then, DOS was not a failure for not having GUI at all. Until GUI systems started emerging and reducing DOS usage until it became completely obsolete.
I'm not saying iPad will go dinosaur, but I do expect that, at some time in future, iOSX or XY will have more desktop-like multitasking. What was hard to achieve with early iPad hardware performance, will simply be no excuse for future hardware - probably current hardware already. Like desktop OS evolved from command line, no GUI, no multitasking keyboard-muncher to what modern OS is now, tablet OS will also evolve from single app, no multitasking, full screen environment. We will see different implementations, but features will be there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133
I'm not sure where are you going with CP/M and MS-DOS parallel here. They were what they were at the time - best or most convenient option available, probably both. So was typewriter perfectly fine for journalists, writers, academics. And feature cellphones served well in their time. But guess what? They were all replaced with more versatile solutions, once such solutions were available.
The point is that one can have "general purpose computing" without multiple windows or multitasking. The person was falsely conflating the two concepts.
This Microsoft ad knocking Apple's iOS iDevices,
illustrates again that MS just doesn't understand what users do with iDevices.
Too bad MS, but you'll survive by creating Office updates for business,
who now are wondering if they need all your updates anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by timgriff84
They seem to understand this one though.
My iPads infuriated me countless times when ive been imessaging or typing an email to someone and need to keep switching back to safari to look stuff up. The 4 finger swiping or double clicking the home button are some of the worst design ever! In an ad it looks great, in reality you end up with multiple apps between the two you want to switch between so your actually doing the gesture 4 times to get between the two, by which time you've forgotten what you just looked at. Then you try the home button method which then changes the order all the apps are open in, not to mention plays a stupid animation every time. Seriously when you've watched that thing 20 times in less than a minute it gets old. If you need to switch between 3 apps things get even worse as the order changes even more and you have no idea if you should swipe left or right.
Every user may not use it every day, and you may never want to use it for a video call, but i reckon most users at some point will want to look at two apps at the same time. Or maybe not even 2 apps, win 8.1 is extending it so 1 app can use multiple window panes, e.g. 2 emails, 2 web pages etc.
I agree, and think I posted somewhere here that having side by side docs would be useful (and I think there are apps that make this happen). But this I don't see as an everyday use for the iPad, which doesn't mean it should be excluded, and that Microsoft continually pushes every desktop feature to every device when that feature would be used so seldom.