Apple, Inc. iPad is obliterating Samsung, Google's Android in tablet profits

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  • Reply 81 of 146
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by rjc999 View Post


     


    Who cares what they make in profits in innovation breakthroughs, why is everything related to profit with you people? 



     


    The mountains of vacuous garbage you are vomiting all over the comments here aren't really worth anyone's time to reply to, but I will address your self-contradiction about market competition being critically important and, at the same time, that earning profits are essentially bad.


     


    Perhaps you worked in such a high ivory tower of conceptual research that you were never exposed to market realities, but profits are the reason why companies compete. That's pretty basic stuff.


     


    Android fans keep repeating this idea that Apple is cheating everyone by charging money for devices made by slave labor, based on technology it just bought off the shelf. If that were actually the case, it would make Samsung, Google's Motorola, Amazon and everyone else look even all the more incompetent for not being able to do the "simple," valueless work you accuse Apple of unfairly profiting from, when they are all clearly trying to do just that.


     


    Are you telling us with a straight face that anyone else puts more effort into building products, particularly within Android?


     


    Google just paid Asus to build another Nexus 7. Asus exercises less concern than Apple's contractors in the matters of worker rights, environment, etc.


     


    Samsung does build its own chips. So why can't it sell finished products anyone wants outside of smartphones, which are "sold" essentially for free in most markets. Why can't anyone "sell" such a product at a profit?


     


    Apple's profits aren't coming from high prices or low quality components. It's coming from exceptional operational competency (including inventory management) and vast economies of scale, which are only possible if there is demand to fill. There's only demand (going on 6 years for iOS products) if those products are competitive.


     


    Really, everything you write is such embarrassing drivel. It's not a matter of a difference of opinion or viewpoint or what features you value. Those are all valid things to express a differing opinion about, and plenty of people feel better served by a different shape or software or whatever. Good for them.


     


    Your "arguments," however, are purely inane rambling about how the leading technology company in the world is evil in every way. Contradictory, unilateral metrics you only apply to Apple and then excuse for everyone else. They are just stupid. You're free to post stupid things in limited quantities, but don't attempt overwhelm and suffocate the discussion by hyper posting pages of your garbage anymore. That's simply inappropriate and unacceptable. 

  • Reply 82 of 146
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member


    this article is another good rebuttal by DED of a stupid - if not dishonest - "analysis" of what is going on in the post-PC era, as "reported" by the web media. unfortunately for all of us, that kind of utterly shallow commentary is the norm, with a prevailing anti-Apple pro-anyone else double standard to boot.


     


    for a good example of the last few days, consider the coverage of the new Nexus 7 tablet from Google/Asus. - almost all of which directly compares it to the 2012 iPad mini, focusing on the Nexus' retina screen "superiority." only a few of those posts note that its battery life is much shorter - one measured only 5.5 hours of video playback vs. the mini's 8.4 hours in the same test. and you will not find in any of those posts the simple spec fact that the mini's 7.9" 4:3 screen provides about 30% more viewing area than 7's 16:10 screen. all this despite the fact that both weigh almost the same (the 7 is 0.75 oz lighter). nor will you find the overall observation that the iPad's 4:3 aspect is obviously significantly better for web browsing than 16:10, altho many note the 7's widescreen aspect is optimal for video.


     


    so to sum up the user value proposition/choice for the two product's display: the 2012 mini offers a substantially larger viewing/UI area which is definitely better for web browsing (the #1 tablet use), lasting for a much longer period of time, yet weighs about the same as the Nexus 7 which instead offers a sharper image on a smaller screen - for as long as it lasts - for $100 less.


     


    well, for some folks maybe saving $100 and getting a sharper image is worth all these other trade offs. that's the bottom line. but you won't find that reported in the web coverage. instead the general theme is the 2012 mini is somehow passed by ... because that is the story they WANT to write.

  • Reply 83 of 146
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post


    this article is another good rebuttal by DED of a stupid - if not dishonest - "analysis" of what is going on in the post-PC era, as "reported" by the web media. unfortunately for all of us, that kind of utterly shallow commentary is the norm, with a prevailing anti-Apple pro-anyone else double standard to boot.


     


    for a good example of the last few days, consider the coverage of the new Nexus 7 tablet from Google/Asus. - almost all of which directly compares it to the 2012 iPad mini, focusing on the Nexus' retina screen "superiority." only a few of those posts note that its battery life is much shorter - one measured only 5.5 hours of video playback vs. the mini's 8.4 hours in the same test. and you will not find in any of those posts the simple spec fact that the mini's 7.9" 4:3 screen provides about 30% more viewing area than 7's 16:10 screen. all this despite the fact that both weigh almost the same (the 7 is 0.75 oz lighter). nor will you find the overall observation that the iPad's 4:3 aspect is obviously significantly better for web browsing than 16:10, altho many note the 7's widescreen aspect is optimal for video.


     


    so to sum up the user value proposition/choice for the two product's display: the 2012 mini offers a substantially larger viewing/UI area which is definitely better for web browsing (the #1 tablet use), lasting for a much longer period of time, yet weighs about the same as the Nexus 7 which instead offers a sharper image on a smaller screen - for as long as it lasts - for $100 less.


     


    well, for some folks maybe saving $100 and getting a sharper image is worth all these other trade offs. that's the bottom line. but you won't find that reported in the web coverage. instead the general theme is the 2012 mini is somehow passed by ... because that is the story they WANT to write.



    Any company that's stupid enough to sell a product called PADFONE or FONEPAD is a company to stay from....  They can't make up their mind.    That introduction to the PADPHONE was comical.  It was so cheesy...   It's a pad, it's a phone. PADFONE!!!  Totally ridiculous.  They made about 6% net profit.  Probably because of the PADFONE!!!


     


    This is hilarious.

  • Reply 84 of 146
    tommcintommcin Posts: 108member


    And Lenovo, which bought the IBM line and name, and was doing well, is being mistrusted by many in the non-Chinese world.

  • Reply 85 of 146
    qamfqamf Posts: 87member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TomMcIn View Post


    And Lenovo, which bought the IBM line and name, and was doing well, is being mistrusted by many in the non-Chinese world.



    was? 0.o Lenovo is the fastest growing Windows OEM in the world currently.  They are also one of the few who has a line of products that isn't garbage (dell, hp, acer, etc) in the Thinkpad Line.  Of course, many of the real thinkpads are priced like Macs, which is a hard sell for most people due to having Windows.



    I only have one because a retailer was desperate to get rid of it (And because I only had $850 to spend on a laptop, otherwise I would currently have a Macbook)



    -QAMF

  • Reply 86 of 146
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TomMcIn View Post


    And Lenovo, which bought the IBM line and name, and was doing well, is being mistrusted by many in the non-Chinese world.



    Have you seen their financials?  THey did $33 Bil in 2012 in Gross Revenue.  $635 Million in Net Profit.  What's the ROI?  They barely broke even.  That's not doing well, that's just wasting people's time trying to buy market share kind of money.   $635 Million in Net Profit from $33 Billion in sales is HORRIBLE.  They might as well take their cash on hand, lay everyone off and invest that money in a passbook savings account.  They'd probably make more money that way.  That's  not even keeping up with inflation.




    Learn how to read a company's financial report rather than market share unit sales.  

  • Reply 87 of 146
    v5vv5v Posts: 1,357member


    A co-worker and I were discussing Apple yesterday. While we both like Apple products, we both feel that Apple products are too damn expensive and Apple's hardware choices are too confining. We agreed that Galaxy tablets are probably outselling iPads, and it's probably because iPads are so expensive. We KNOW that our friends and neighbours buy Windows computers instead of Macs because they can get them for $600 at Best Buy.


     


    We also agreed that nothing is likely to change as long as Apple sells every single unit of everything they make as fast as they can make it.


     


    He and I both have iPhones, use only Macs, view our entertainment via Apple TV and get our wireless from Airports. I guess that makes us part of the problem, since Apple sure as hell isn't going to do anything differently as long as we keep buying whatever they make!


     


    image

  • Reply 88 of 146
    v5v wrote: »
    We agreed that Galaxy tablets are probably outselling iPads, and it's probably because iPads are so expensive.

    That made me laugh :D
  • Reply 89 of 146
    v5vv5v Posts: 1,357member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post



    That made me laugh image


     


    Busted. I "embellished."


     


    We didn't actually discuss tablets at all. What we really said is that the reason Android phones are outselling iPhones may be greater selection (including larger screens) and lower pricing.


     


    I just substituted "tablet" for "smartphone" to keep the point in line with the subject of the article! It didn't change the meaning or the point, which was and is:


     


     


    Despite our complaints, Apple sells everything they make as fast as they can make it.


     


    and


     


    Nothing will change as long as we keep buying everything they make as fast as they can make it!

  • Reply 90 of 146
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by v5v View Post


    A co-worker and I were discussing Apple yesterday. While we both like Apple products, we both feel that Apple products are too damn expensive and Apple's hardware choices are too confining. We agreed that Galaxy tablets are probably outselling iPads, and it's probably because iPads are so expensive. We KNOW that our friends and neighbours buy Windows computers instead of Macs because they can get them for $600 at Best Buy.


     


    We also agreed that nothing is likely to change as long as Apple sells every single unit of everything they make as fast as they can make it.


     


    He and I both have iPhones, use only Macs, view our entertainment via Apple TV and get our wireless from Airports. I guess that makes us part of the problem, since Apple sure as hell isn't going to do anything differently as long as we keep buying whatever they make!


     


    image



    Have you compared the AIOs?  Aside from not having the Haswell chips yet, they offer the best 27 inch available and it's priced very close to the high end Dell. When you make comparisons, Apple should be compared to the higher end model PCs, not the consumer grade products most commonly sold to the public.  WHY?  Because Apple gives you things the other cheap PC mfg don't give you.  Apple won't make cheaper products that yield no profits.  They kind of want to stay in business.  HP, Dell, Lenovo all make so little profits I'm surprised their doors are still open. Even HP would like to find a sucker to buy their PC division, but they can't find anyone interested. Pretty sad isn't it?



    Dell just went private because they don't want to get bought out and since their financials suck, they are taking the company private. If they can't get their act together, they may find themselves closing the doors if they can't find a buyer down the road.


     


    Yeah, a lot of people are price conscious, but they don't have wide spread Thunderbolt adoption in the PC world, this is something Apple has been doing and it's the future of I/O.  You have to look really carefully for a PC to have a Thunderbolt port and the devices on the market are more for OS X users and not as much for PC users.  Apple just wants their eco system to work well together and to continually improve their products. They have flaw like any other company, but I don't want to worry if the company is going to be out of business.  Apple already had that scare, but they don't have to worry about that anymore. They are financially secure for pretty much the next 100 years.  Apple can't help if it they make a product line people want to buy and they manage the company so they can make decent profits.

  • Reply 91 of 146
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,883member
    v5v wrote: »
    Busted. I "embellished."

    We didn't actually discuss tablets at all. What we really said is that the reason Android phones are outselling iPhones may be greater selection (including larger screens) and lower pricing.

    I just substituted "tablet" for "smartphone" to keep the point in line with the subject of the article! It didn't change the meaning or the point, which was and is:


    Despite our complaints, Apple sells everything they make as fast as they can make it.

    and

    Nothing will change as long as we keep buying everything they make as fast as they can make it!

    Android us outselling the iPhone because there are hundreds of Android phone sellers and you can get many of them for free.
  • Reply 92 of 146
    robmrobm Posts: 1,068member
    lol v5v

    Ewe are just being rambunctious !
  • Reply 93 of 146
    v5v wrote: »
    Busted. I "embellished."

    We didn't actually discuss tablets at all. What we really said is that the reason Android phones are outselling iPhones may be greater selection (including larger screens) and lower pricing.

    I just substituted "tablet" for "smartphone" to keep the point in line with the subject of the article! It didn't change the meaning or the point, which was and is:

    Despite our complaints, Apple sells everything they make as fast as they can make it.

    and

    Nothing will change as long as we keep buying everything they make as fast as they can make it!

    I figured you were being silly. :)

    It's true that Android phones vastly outsell Apple phones by 5 to 1 for the reasons you've mentioned. Variety and price are those reasons. And that certainly makes a nice headline: "Android Dominates Smartphone Market Share"

    But you're right... Apple is already selling every single iPhone they make. And they are rather expensive phones... $500+ each worldwide.

    So should a bunch of crappy $100 Android phones really bother Apple?

    And it's the same for tablets. I'd really like to know which tablets make up Android's phenomenal market share.

    Are they $500 Android tablets or are they $50 Android tablets? If it's the latter... those people wouldn't be buying an iPad anyway.

    But Apple still sells every iPad they make. They certainly don't have to make a billion dollar write-down :)
  • Reply 94 of 146
    v5vv5v Posts: 1,357member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by drblank View Post


    Have you compared the AIOs? [...] When you make comparisons, Apple should be compared to the higher end model PCs, not the consumer grade products most commonly sold to the public.



     


    *YOU* know that, and *I* know that, but most people don't know and don't CARE. Facebook, email, a way to get the pictures out of the camera... that's all they do with their computer. And let's be honest, they don't NEED a "high-end" machine to do that.


     


    Apple is doing its best to get those people into iPads instead of cheap computers, but it'll probably take a half-generation or so for the new paradigm to sink in.

  • Reply 95 of 146
    tommcintommcin Posts: 108member


    Apple does not have to own the whole world, only the profitable part.


     


    I too would like to see a breakdown of SALES by Price Point to the Manufacturer. And if that might be distorted if companies give product away with other products.

  • Reply 96 of 146
    heliahelia Posts: 170member


    another great article from DED! Thank you pal


     


    at the end, it's only the profit that matters. you can sell zillions of devices and make no money, when another one can sell 1% of it and make billions

  • Reply 97 of 146
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by v5v View Post




    Apple is doing its best to get those people into iPads instead of cheap computers, but it'll probably take a half-generation or so for the new paradigm to sink in.



    The thing that comes to mind occasionally is that replacing computers with iPads is essentially dumbing down the next generation.


     


    Without a real computer available, kids will just be learning how to become consumers without a platform to learn how to code on. The current crop of young app developers didn't develop their skills on a tablet, their parents and teachers encouraged them on a regular computer.


     


    It is like, why teach children how to prepare a healthy meal at home when it is so convenient to just drive through the fast food chain restaurant?

  • Reply 98 of 146
    qamfqamf Posts: 87member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by drblank View Post


    Have you compared the AIOs?  Aside from not having the Haswell chips yet, they offer the best 27 inch available and it's priced very close to the high end Dell. When you make comparisons, Apple should be compared to the higher end model PCs, not the consumer grade products most commonly sold to the public.  WHY?  Because Apple gives you things the other cheap PC mfg don't give you.  Apple won't make cheaper products that yield no profits.  They kind of want to stay in business.  HP, Dell, Lenovo all make so little profits I'm surprised their doors are still open. Even HP would like to find a sucker to buy their PC division, but they can't find anyone interested. Pretty sad isn't it?



    Yeah, Apple products build quality and such needs to be compared to biz class products, for example:

    HP ProBooks

    Lenovo Thinkpad (T, W and X series)



    These products generally generally are about equal in terms of perf/price to Apple's Macbooks, and often have different build features.  It really comes down to if you want something thinner/lighter/sleeker or something bulkier/more rugged/replaceable battery.



    As for AIO's, Apple pretty much takes the cake.  Unless you want a 20-30" Tablet with like 1 hours of battery life.  To which, I ask WHY?




    And what does Apple offer besides trackpads and OSX and high def displays (if you pay extra)?  Just wondering for the exacts.


    Quote:


    Dell just went private because they don't want to get bought out and since their financials suck, they are taking the company private. If they can't get their act together, they may find themselves closing the doors if they can't find a buyer down the road



    note: anyone who doubts the dell thing, http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Dell-Buyout-special-Committee-Carl-Icahn-Complaint,23775.html


    Quote:


    Yeah, a lot of people are price conscious, but they don't have wide spread Thunderbolt adoption in the PC world, this is something Apple has been doing and it's the future of I/O.  You have to look really carefully for a PC to have a Thunderbolt port and the devices on the market are more for OS X users and not as much for PC users.  Apple just wants their eco system to work well together and to continually improve their products. They have flaw like any other company, but I don't want to worry if the company is going to be out of business.  Apple already had that scare, but they don't have to worry about that anymore. They are financially secure for pretty much the next 100 years.  Apple can't help if it they make a product line people want to buy and they manage the company so they can make decent profits.



    Thunderbolt is not the future of I/O USB 3.0 now has a 10Gbps model finalized, and it costs drastically less.  Thunderbolt has its uses, but due to the cost of the controller it will never replace USB, at least not unless someone subsidizes it a lot.  Currently TB devices cost 50-100+ dollars more (Hopefully less, but that is what it was last I checked it) and much of the stuff it is really good at are things only enthusiasts want (generalization, of course).  That being said, I hope I am wrong and TB does manage to replace USB 3.0, It is a much better technology.



    And yeah, Apple is one of the most solid companies in the world right now. :)



    -QAMF

  • Reply 99 of 146
    v5vv5v Posts: 1,357member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by QAMF View Post


    Thunderbolt is not the future of I/O USB 3.0 now has a 10Gbps model finalized, and it costs drastically less.  Thunderbolt has its uses, but [...] much of the stuff it is really good at are things only enthusiasts want



     


    Yup, you nailed it. For the vast majority of the population even 5GHz USB is plenty.


     


    Moving the kind of data streams that require the bandwidth of Thunderbolt is primarily the province of those who CREATE content. By the time said content is ready for consumption by a consumer it's no longer so bandwidth-intensive so TB is overkill.

  • Reply 100 of 146
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post





    Android us outselling the iPhone because there are hundreds of Android phone sellers and you can get many of them for free.


    A free phone is not outselling an iPhone.  It's giving away a crap phone for FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE..  It's either that or dump product as landfill. 


     


    Apple makes decent profit and they are selling more product each year which is all they really care about.  

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