AI: you should have visited mainland china, not taiwan. Taiwan is not China. Shanghai, Beijing, Chengdu, Guangzho. That's China. I wouldn't even consider Hong Kong and parts of Shanghai really China. They are much too westernized now.
The cultural revolution and communist party policies destroyed so much of Chinese culture in China that arguably Taiwanese culture is closer to traditional Chinese culture (pre-Mao) than on the mainland. And the one child policy has skewed the cultural norms that survived. If you aren't old you really don't have the reference point to tell others what is or isn't China and who is too westernized. Its not like the CCP wasn't also a Western import from the Soviet Union.
And Beijing is not what it used to be either with the razing of the old hutongs with the exception of the areas around small "heritage" sites which are touristy like the Gulou area.
The cultural revolution and communist party policies destroyed so much of Chinese culture in China that arguably Taiwanese culture is closer to traditional Chinese culture (pre-Mao) than on the mainland. And the one child policy has skewed the cultural norms that survived. If you aren't old you really don't have the reference point to tell others what is or isn't China and who is too westernized. Its not like the CCP wasn't also a Western import from the Soviet Union.
And Beijing is not what it used to be either with the razing of the old hutongs with the exception of the areas around small "heritage" sites which are touristy like the Gulou area.
Also a hutong area in Shanghai.
Something that surprised me about Shanghai was the undercurrent of mistrust and distaste for the country Chinese immigrants (who were everywhere) and whom were evidently quite ignorant of even basic things. The Shanghainese viewed them as a plague. I also found the locals disliked the imposition of Han Chinese language and culture.
The cultural revolution and communist party policies destroyed so much of Chinese culture in China that arguably Taiwanese culture is closer to traditional Chinese culture (pre-Mao) than on the mainland. And the one child policy has skewed the cultural norms that survived. If you aren't old you really don't have the reference point to tell others what is or isn't China and who is too westernized. Its not like the CCP wasn't also a Western import from the Soviet Union.
And Beijing is not what it used to be either with the razing of the old hutongs with the exception of the areas around small "heritage" sites which are touristy like the Gulou area.
I was talking more about the Post-Mao era. Despite western influences the culture and the younger generations have create the China that you see today. There's a drastically different culture even between the generations. But I suppose that's true with a lot of cultures globally too.
I'm an editor of tech news media in Taiwan. It's great to see AppleInsider described Taiwan in details. I agree that we should have Apple retail stores here. One more thing to note about us: not everyone in Taiwan has western-level incomes. The reason why we don't have pool, kids, boat is not because we don't want to but because we can't. And I don't think we spend all our money on only two things.
Welcome to AI Wendy! You make a great point. I just moved back to US after living in Xiamen China for 6 years and spent time doing business in Taiwan. It should also be noted that good job opportunities for young Taiwanese are very scarce and millions have moved to the mainland to find work. Also, I was told by one of my Taiwanese clients that only about 10% of people living in Taipei own their own home. This is far from "Western-level incomes".
Something that surprised me about Shanghai was the undercurrent of mistrust and distaste for the country Chinese immigrants (who were everywhere) and whom were evidently quite ignorant of even basic things. The Shanghainese viewed them as a plague. I also found the locals disliked the imposition of Han Chinese language and culture.
Heh...it's okay, they just charge mandarin speakers a little more.
As long as the country Chinese immigrants can find work and keep their families fed in the big cities the probability of another revolution is low. The city folks need to remember that the bulk of the PLA is made up of those same country Chinese immigrant class. When the local divisions would not run over the Beijing citizens the troops from the countryside ran their tanks over the protestors in Tiananmen.
You'd have to pay me a lot of money to bring my family over there for a long term job. Its one thing to be a single ex-pat enjoying the nightlife which would be quite fun for a few months or years...
I was talking more about the Post-Mao era. Despite western influences the culture and the younger generations have create the China that you see today. There's a drastically different culture even between the generations. But I suppose that's true with a lot of cultures globally too.
Yah, but what's too western about Taipei and not about Beijing? The younger generations in both seem pretty materialistic.
What a joke! I'm glad you got refusals. Apple suppliers are not supposed to talk to reporters.
And I'm pretty sure Apple wouldn't give Appleinsider the time of day.
At least DED has some journalistic integrity, which is more than one can say about anyone at Business Insider. Also I think I can learn more about Apple reading Apple Insider than I can from leafing through a 12 page advertisement in Vogue.
I was a grad student in Beijing from 87 to 89. The state of Apple was quite dismal in those days. There was a Computerland, that reportedly carried Macs, on the main boulevard into Tiananmen Square that closed right before I got there. I lugged my Mac SE around with me everywhere. The great thing was that the universal transformer could tolerate an incredible range of voltages, and it had to since the power was incredibly unstable. The voltage instability totally fried my Toshiba dot matrix printer.
Why did I have a Mac? It had Chinese input, quite similar to what we have today. PCs needed fancy keyboards to do Chinese input. And it was an all-in-one, since laptops weren't yet a thing.
On my holidays, I would head off to Hong Kong and Taiwan. Interestingly, I stopped at a large Hong Kong Apple Reseller to buy the latest Apple OS, Chinese OS 6.1! 40 diskettes! I had been using Chinese OS 4.6. I still have that Mac SE and all of those diskettes. There was no Apple HQ in Hong Kong, that was in Taipei. Taipei had about 6 Apple Centers, no authorized resellers that I can remember. Anyhow, I did stop at the Apple HQ and talk to the President in charge of Apple China for about an hour. Those were the days.
I also remember stopping at the Taiwan Economic News and inquiring about a job, since I had a background in finance. They did their layout on Macs with full-page white displays.
Comments
AI: you should have visited mainland china, not taiwan. Taiwan is not China. Shanghai, Beijing, Chengdu, Guangzho. That's China. I wouldn't even consider Hong Kong and parts of Shanghai really China. They are much too westernized now.
The cultural revolution and communist party policies destroyed so much of Chinese culture in China that arguably Taiwanese culture is closer to traditional Chinese culture (pre-Mao) than on the mainland. And the one child policy has skewed the cultural norms that survived. If you aren't old you really don't have the reference point to tell others what is or isn't China and who is too westernized. Its not like the CCP wasn't also a Western import from the Soviet Union.
And Beijing is not what it used to be either with the razing of the old hutongs with the exception of the areas around small "heritage" sites which are touristy like the Gulou area.
Also a hutong area in Shanghai.
Something that surprised me about Shanghai was the undercurrent of mistrust and distaste for the country Chinese immigrants (who were everywhere) and whom were evidently quite ignorant of even basic things. The Shanghainese viewed them as a plague. I also found the locals disliked the imposition of Han Chinese language and culture.
Studio A has done a great job filling in for true Apple Store there, I am curious to see how arrival of an Apple Store will change the dynamics there.
Dragonstar in Beijing malls are also very nice stores, all Apple. It's almost like they copied the apple store's look too.
The cultural revolution and communist party policies destroyed so much of Chinese culture in China that arguably Taiwanese culture is closer to traditional Chinese culture (pre-Mao) than on the mainland. And the one child policy has skewed the cultural norms that survived. If you aren't old you really don't have the reference point to tell others what is or isn't China and who is too westernized. Its not like the CCP wasn't also a Western import from the Soviet Union.
And Beijing is not what it used to be either with the razing of the old hutongs with the exception of the areas around small "heritage" sites which are touristy like the Gulou area.
I was talking more about the Post-Mao era. Despite western influences the culture and the younger generations have create the China that you see today. There's a drastically different culture even between the generations. But I suppose that's true with a lot of cultures globally too.
Welcome to AI Wendy! You make a great point. I just moved back to US after living in Xiamen China for 6 years and spent time doing business in Taiwan. It should also be noted that good job opportunities for young Taiwanese are very scarce and millions have moved to the mainland to find work. Also, I was told by one of my Taiwanese clients that only about 10% of people living in Taipei own their own home. This is far from "Western-level incomes".
Then authoritarian communist leaders in Bejing should let the UN recognize Taiwan's apparent de facto sovereignty.
Then authoritarian communist leaders in Bejing should let the UN recognize Taiwan's apparent de facto sovereignty.
Taiwan is not China to the Taiwanese. Taiwan is China to the Chinese.
Then authoritarian communist leaders in Bejing should let the UN recognize Taiwan's apparent de facto sovereignty.
This thing is not determined by the leaders. Almost 100% of the people in mainland China think Taiwan is part of China.
It seems the well informed DED could not explain why such a technologically advanced place like Taiwan does not have a 'real' Apple Store.
Also a hutong area in Shanghai.
Something that surprised me about Shanghai was the undercurrent of mistrust and distaste for the country Chinese immigrants (who were everywhere) and whom were evidently quite ignorant of even basic things. The Shanghainese viewed them as a plague. I also found the locals disliked the imposition of Han Chinese language and culture.
Heh...it's okay, they just charge mandarin speakers a little more.
As long as the country Chinese immigrants can find work and keep their families fed in the big cities the probability of another revolution is low. The city folks need to remember that the bulk of the PLA is made up of those same country Chinese immigrant class. When the local divisions would not run over the Beijing citizens the troops from the countryside ran their tanks over the protestors in Tiananmen.
You'd have to pay me a lot of money to bring my family over there for a long term job. Its one thing to be a single ex-pat enjoying the nightlife which would be quite fun for a few months or years...
I was talking more about the Post-Mao era. Despite western influences the culture and the younger generations have create the China that you see today. There's a drastically different culture even between the generations. But I suppose that's true with a lot of cultures globally too.
Yah, but what's too western about Taipei and not about Beijing? The younger generations in both seem pretty materialistic.
What a joke! I'm glad you got refusals. Apple suppliers are not supposed to talk to reporters.
And I'm pretty sure Apple wouldn't give Appleinsider the time of day.
At least DED has some journalistic integrity, which is more than one can say about anyone at Business Insider. Also I think I can learn more about Apple reading Apple Insider than I can from leafing through a 12 page advertisement in Vogue.
I was a grad student in Beijing from 87 to 89. The state of Apple was quite dismal in those days. There was a Computerland, that reportedly carried Macs, on the main boulevard into Tiananmen Square that closed right before I got there. I lugged my Mac SE around with me everywhere. The great thing was that the universal transformer could tolerate an incredible range of voltages, and it had to since the power was incredibly unstable. The voltage instability totally fried my Toshiba dot matrix printer.
Why did I have a Mac? It had Chinese input, quite similar to what we have today. PCs needed fancy keyboards to do Chinese input. And it was an all-in-one, since laptops weren't yet a thing.
On my holidays, I would head off to Hong Kong and Taiwan. Interestingly, I stopped at a large Hong Kong Apple Reseller to buy the latest Apple OS, Chinese OS 6.1! 40 diskettes! I had been using Chinese OS 4.6. I still have that Mac SE and all of those diskettes. There was no Apple HQ in Hong Kong, that was in Taipei. Taipei had about 6 Apple Centers, no authorized resellers that I can remember. Anyhow, I did stop at the Apple HQ and talk to the President in charge of Apple China for about an hour. Those were the days.
I also remember stopping at the Taiwan Economic News and inquiring about a job, since I had a background in finance. They did their layout on Macs with full-page white displays.