Google taking Nexus smartphone program in more iPhone-like direction - report

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 41
    jdnc123 said:
    HAHAHAHAHAHA.  Employees don't care about their compensation.  What a utopian work environment Apple has created.  I imagine many dislike Tim Cook for the same reason investors do.  His lack of vision is costing them money.
    You obviously have a reading comprehension, or are just being an ass. Twice under Steve Jobs 2.0 Apple stock lost 40-50% of its value. Should Steve have been fired? Also Apple's market valuation is a joke and my guess is this just motivates employees to prove these clowns wrong. 
    Please point to the period time when Apple lost 40-50% while the broad market was near all-time highs and other tech companies were media darlings and creating tens of billions if not hundreds of billions of value for their employees and shareholders.

    I'll save you the time looking, that period in history does not exist.

    It's no fair to say well Apple lost 40-50% when the entire market went down that much.  What we are talking about is Apple losing hundred of billion of market cap while others make hundreds of billions.  Is that lost on your and your meaningless anecdote about Jobs being fired?
  • Reply 22 of 41
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,557member
    jdnc123 said:
    lkrupp said:
    And my response will be the exact same thing YOU said when Apple passed up Microsoft and Google to become the most valuable company. YOU and your ilk said, and I paraphrase, “It means nothing. Microsoft and Google are still better than Apple will ever be. Just because Apple is worth more now than Microsoft or Google doesn’t mean its bigger or better. Ha, ha, ha, ha. Apple sux!”

    Yes, YOU and your ilk said those very things when AAPL raced by MSFT and GOOG. Are you now going to say it now does mean something that Google passed up Apple? Really? You are going to say that? And keep a straight face too?
    There has never been a company in the history of the world that has lost as much market cap as Apple in the midst of a broader bull market.  

    FACT.  That is on Apple and Tim Cook.

    A broader bull market? What are you smoking? Look, it’s okay for you iHaters to gloat, just don’t be stupid about it.
    iqatedocornchip
  • Reply 23 of 41
    jdnc123 said:
    You obviously have a reading comprehension, or are just being an ass. Twice under Steve Jobs 2.0 Apple stock lost 40-50% of its value. Should Steve have been fired? Also Apple's market valuation is a joke and my guess is this just motivates employees to prove these clowns wrong. 
    Please point to the period time when Apple lost 40-50% while the broad market was near all-time highs and other tech companies were media darlings and creating tens of billions if not hundreds of billions of value for their employees and shareholders.

    I'll save you the time looking, that period in history does not exist.

    It's no fair to say well Apple lost 40-50% when the entire market went down that much.  What we are talking about is Apple losing hundred of billion of market cap while others make hundreds of billions.  Is that lost on your and your meaningless anecdote about Jobs being fired?
    No what's not lost on me is Apple the company and APPL the stock are two completely different things. There's no way Google and Microsoft warrant PEs in the 30s while Apple is around 10. That's just nuts.
    iqatedo
  • Reply 24 of 41
    The problem is Android.
  • Reply 25 of 41
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,799member
    jdnc123 said:

    Please point to the period time when Apple lost 40-50% while the broad market was near all-time highs and other tech companies were media darlings and creating tens of billions if not hundreds of billions of value for their employees and shareholders.

    I don't see a 40% loss in the last year, more like 20% and all in the last two months. A two month period does not make a trend unless you are a day trader. AAPL has been tracking the general market fairly closely for awhile. GOOG has done surprisingly well during that same period but it is just the stock market. It goes up and down. But you really can't compare Apple to Google in any meaningful way because their primary industry segments are completely different. I don't deny that Apple has challenges in the phone space because of saturation, but that in itself is an indicator of Apple's success. AAPL is up nearly 1000% since the iPhone was introduced. It is near impossible to maintain that rate of growth. They are becoming a value stock now.


    edited February 2016
  • Reply 26 of 41
    lkrupp said:
    jdnc123 said:
    There has never been a company in the history of the world that has lost as much market cap as Apple in the midst of a broader bull market.  

    FACT.  That is on Apple and Tim Cook.

    A broader bull market? What are you smoking? Look, it’s okay for you iHaters to gloat, just don’t be stupid about it.
    The s&p is less than 9% off its all-time high.  Google and Facebook (ie big tech names) are at their all-time highs.
    palomine
  • Reply 27 of 41

    jdnc123 said:
    Please point to the period time when Apple lost 40-50% while the broad market was near all-time highs and other tech companies were media darlings and creating tens of billions if not hundreds of billions of value for their employees and shareholders.

    I'll save you the time looking, that period in history does not exist.

    It's no fair to say well Apple lost 40-50% when the entire market went down that much.  What we are talking about is Apple losing hundred of billion of market cap while others make hundreds of billions.  Is that lost on your and your meaningless anecdote about Jobs being fired?
    No what's not lost on me is Apple the company and APPL the stock are two completely different things. There's no way Google and Microsoft warrant PEs in the 30s while Apple is around 10. That's just nuts.
    Apple the company, the company that has more cash than any company in the history of the world, is telling you they don't have the resources or ideas to grow and is guiding to negative unit growth for their products.  Apple the stock is reacting to what Apple the company is telling the market.
  • Reply 28 of 41

    jdnc123 said:
    Please point to the period time when Apple lost 40-50% while the broad market was near all-time highs and other tech companies were media darlings and creating tens of billions if not hundreds of billions of value for their employees and shareholders.

    I'll save you the time looking, that period in history does not exist.

    It's no fair to say well Apple lost 40-50% when the entire market went down that much.  What we are talking about is Apple losing hundred of billion of market cap while others make hundreds of billions.  Is that lost on your and your meaningless anecdote about Jobs being fired?
    No what's not lost on me is Apple the company and APPL the stock are two completely different things. There's no way Google and Microsoft warrant PEs in the 30s while Apple is around 10. That's just nuts.
    Apple and its mgmt team have had years to watch hardware company after hardware company go away through obsolescence, some of it Apple's doing.  They watched those companies trade at very low P/E multiples.  Apple has for years now, an eternity in tech life cycles, had more cash than it could use in its iPhone/IPad/Mac business units.  It decided to do nothing productive with it that would help continue to grow the brand and diversify its revenue stream such that its multiple wouldn't face the same fate as many hardware companies before it.  Decided not to make a big and bold push into software.  Decided not to buy Netflix like Icahn did $35 billion in mkt value ago.  They thought they were better than the others, bought into their own crap about taking market share and continuing to grow and user experience, blah, blah, blah.  They failed.  Units are being guided lower this year than last.  That's fact.  Sure the company is strong, has a solid installed base - me included - and a pristine balance sheet.  Its core business has nowhere to go but down though.  That's not the case with Google and FB where online advertising continues to grow and will for years.
  • Reply 29 of 41
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 13,002member
    sog35 said:
    Lets see for FY2015 Apple revenue grew 28% YOY. Google was 13.5% Apple grew earnings 35% YOY, Google 16.2%. It's totally misleading to compare Apple's Q1 actuals and Q2 guidance as those two quarters last year were an anomaly, not the norm. I mean my god what company is posting $18B of profit in one quarter? Apple's profit in Q1 2016 was about equal to Google's profit for all of 2015! I'll take Apple's hard numbers over anything else any day. 
    You know what?  That's Tim Cooks fault.  Instead of explaining to investors that the Dec2014, March2015, and Jun2015 quarters were going to be anomalies he said nothing and took all the credit for the 35% YoY growth.  He should have said their was pent up demand for big phones and that these results are out of the ordinary and won't be beaten in 2016.  But the company will return to growth in 2017.

    He and the CFO should have figured out a way to even out last years revenue.  They should have deferred some of the iPhone6 revenue for 2016.  They could have done this is if recognized the software portion of iPhone sales over 2 years.

    It has been a total mismangement of investor expectations by Cook.  Even up to Oct 2015 he was still preaching that iPhone sales would continue to grow.  
    How did he know those quarters were going to be anamolies? 
  • Reply 30 of 41
    kkerstkkerst Posts: 330member
    sog35 said:
    jdnc123 said:
    Well, it was fun while it lasted, but starting tomorrow, Apple will no longer be the most valuable company in the world after Google beat earnings and the stock is up $50+ after-hours, if it holds.  No lamenting the global economy, or currency or any other lame excuses, they just keep growing earnings.  Vision and execution is trumping a huge void of vision and a whole heck of a lot of stubbing their own toes at Apple.  Best Tim Cook could do was blame the macro environment.  Good companies just execute.

    Edit:  Google +$70 dollar now, it'll be a tens of billions gap starting tomorrow, but wont even be close at to who is the biggest and baddest company in the world soon with Cook leading Apple.
    Google is worth more than Apple even though Apple makes 3x more profits.

    I would not be surprised if Tim Cook is fired within the next 12 months. I'm not going to blame everything on Cook.  But its painfully obvious that Wall Street and even individual investors (Note individuals own 40% of Apple's stock) don't have confidence in Tim Cook.  If they did the stock would have not dropped 40% in 2013 and 30% in 2016.  We can't just blame Wall Street and the media.  Its real investors who are selling Apple stock in mass amounts because they see the company slowly shrinking. You don't get a 10 PE and a sub 7 PE otherwise.

    Sometimes a CEO is just not a good fit for a company. I think that's the case with Tim Cook. Apple needs a CEO who is a visionary. Apple needs a CEO who instills confidence in Apple's future. Tim Cook does not.  

    The facts are too strong. The only time Apple has had a decent PE ratio of 15+ was when Apple was growing revenues by 100% (from 2011 to late 2012) and 35% (early 2015). Besides those strong periods the stock has been chronically undervalued in the 10 PE range or less.
    Dude...really?
  • Reply 31 of 41
    genovellegenovelle Posts: 1,480member
    jdnc123 said:
    Well, it was fun while it lasted, but starting tomorrow, Apple will no longer be the most valuable company in the world after Google beat earnings and the stock is up $50+ after-hours, if it holds.  No lamenting the global economy, or currency or any other lame excuses, they just keep growing earnings.  Vision and execution is trumping a huge void of vision and a whole heck of a lot of stubbing their own toes at Apple.  Best Tim Cook could do was blame the macro environment.  Good companies just execute.

    Edit:  Google +$70 dollar now, it'll be a tens of billions gap starting tomorrow, but wont even be close at to who is the biggest and baddest company in the world soon with Cook leading Apple.
    Their net income is up less than 5% for the quarter while they have had drops the 3 previous quarters. Apple was still up nearly 3 percent and had blowout quarters the previous 3. The difference?  Googlites pushed up Google's price even when their revenues dropped and they had misses. On the other hand when Apple had blowout numbers their price went down. Keep in mind these numbers are against a miss the year ago quarter where their stock initially went down 3% but ended up 2%. When you look at the fact that they are just getting to the Net income Wall Street was expecting Q4 2014 their price really don't make sense. At their current price they would need almost 12 years to make the equivalent in revenue, 40 years by net income. If Appe had the same it would be 12 by net income, just 10 quarter by revenue.
  • Reply 32 of 41
    jakebjakeb Posts: 562member
    Good, good... Let the bad sentiment flow through you. It's the only way Apple will ever increase in price again. Apple stock price has a history of compressing down to unreasonable levels and then going up on multi month upswing. 

    Its good old to shake out the unreasonable expectations and let people see the company for what it is. Which is: not bad at all. 
  • Reply 33 of 41
    nolamacguynolamacguy Posts: 4,758member
    koop said:
    You've got to be kidding me. The Nexus 6P looks nothing like an iPhone. I've owned both phones. 

    nolamacguy said:
    i see the LG nexus has a camera bump. was there mass hysteria?

    i saw the other one pictured in a tv commercial...its stylings are definite echos of an iphone, right down to the chamfered fingerprint scanner ring. pathetic.

    oh yeah, no resemblance or shared design language at all....




    try again, son.
    cornchip
  • Reply 34 of 41
    Felt compelled to create an account when I came across this one (read: too lazy, but this piece got me fired up)

    The idea of Google manufacturing their own phones is fine by me. Just a hypothesis, but I believe Google is the only company (if at all), other than Apple which can actually deliver mobile hardware innovations. 
    That's good for the consumers, and hopefully a little bit of legitimate competition will see the iPhone move beyond incremental updates with every iteration.

    More importantly, it would spell Doom™ for that scumbag of a company, Samsung. And HTC.

    PS. Former Samsung S4 owner. I hate them from the bottom of my heart.
    edited February 2016 cornchip
  • Reply 35 of 41
    misamisa Posts: 827member
    You know it's OK for google to manufacture it's own devices, I just don't see them building anything compelling unless they take the whole Android ecosystem with it.

    As for "omg Google is the most valuable company in the world" nonsense... Their stock price is LOWER than it was at the end of December, and they don't payout dividends. Apple's stock price pretty much remains in a tight trading range ever since they started doing dividends. The only people who care about the stock price are those who rob retail investors by high speed trading their money out of the stock.

    cornchip
  • Reply 36 of 41
    Doesn't Wall Street and analysts/investors just have somewhat unrealistic expectations for Apple at this point?  They make spectacular products but they aren't growing or selling "enough" iPhone for what they "think" Apple SHOULD be selling, thus, a downturn in the stock. Aren't we nearing a point of saturation? Look at the iPad for example, people are not feeling the need to keep upgrading them like their phones, not as often maybe this has also hurt Apple. People can only buy so many products. 
    cornchip
  • Reply 37 of 41
    wood1208wood1208 Posts: 2,905member
    It is Human nature that once your interest is not served well, loyalty disappears fast. So, before human nature of loyal Apple stock holder, supporter, etc crowd turn away from Apple, my advice to Apple is stop listening Carl Ichan or wall-street. Steve Jobs never cared to listen and that is why no one had dare to ask him like pay dividents or stock buyback, Steve Jobs believed instead of distributing money and make Apple financially weaker; put that money to innovation and raise the bar higher so competitor can't touch. Tim Cook is no less CEO or not able to run Apple smoothly but too soft to take the company to the next level. Apple may need visionary, no bull-shit, ass-hole CEO to make it happen.
    edited February 2016
  • Reply 38 of 41
    WiseGuy said:
    Felt compelled to create an account when I came across this one (read: too lazy, but this piece got me fired up)

    The idea of Google manufacturing their own phones is fine by me. Just a hypothesis, but I believe Google is the only company (if at all), other than Apple which can actually deliver mobile hardware innovations. 
    That's good for the consumers, and hopefully a little bit of legitimate competition will see the iPhone move beyond incremental updates with every iteration.

    More importantly, it would spell Doom™ for that scumbag of a company, Samsung. And HTC.

    PS. Former Samsung S4 owner. I hate them from the bottom of my heart.
    Uh no. All of Google's hardware initiatives have failed. The Nexus only succeeds because they are built by hardware companies that know what they're doing. 

    No way that LG, Huawei, or HTC build Google phones without their own branding. 

    And Google is incompetent with hardware.  

    Even Microsoft is incompetent with hardware. 

    As far as Google being more valuable than Apple, ludicrous. It's due to Wall Street traders who have no knowledge of the technology industry. They simply see Google aping Apple technology the same way that Microsoft did so many years ago. It made Microsoft the largest company for a long time and they see Google trying to duplicate that model. Apple still gets 94% of the smartphone profits. Android makes nothing for Google as a standalone product and is dwarfed by iOS as an advertising platform. 

    Apple will drop Google search as the default engine. It is coming. They are still a little sensitive over the whole maps issue. Still, Google maps is being steadily displaced off of the iPhone. 

    Apple still has some big things in store and Google will be in serious trouble. Just a matter of time. 

    cornchip
  • Reply 39 of 41
    canukstormcanukstorm Posts: 2,695member
    sog35 said:
    jdnc123 said:
    Well, it was fun while it lasted, but starting tomorrow, Apple will no longer be the most valuable company in the world after Google beat earnings and the stock is up $50+ after-hours, if it holds.  No lamenting the global economy, or currency or any other lame excuses, they just keep growing earnings.  Vision and execution is trumping a huge void of vision and a whole heck of a lot of stubbing their own toes at Apple.  Best Tim Cook could do was blame the macro environment.  Good companies just execute.

    Edit:  Google +$70 dollar now, it'll be a tens of billions gap starting tomorrow, but wont even be close at to who is the biggest and baddest company in the world soon with Cook leading Apple.
    Google is worth more than Apple even though Apple makes 3x more profits.

    I would not be surprised if Tim Cook is fired within the next 12 months. I'm not going to blame everything on Cook.  But its painfully obvious that Wall Street and even individual investors (Note individuals own 40% of Apple's stock) don't have confidence in Tim Cook.  If they did the stock would have not dropped 40% in 2013 and 30% in 2016.  We can't just blame Wall Street and the media.  Its real investors who are selling Apple stock in mass amounts because they see the company slowly shrinking. You don't get a 10 PE and a sub 7 PE otherwise.

    Sometimes a CEO is just not a good fit for a company. I think that's the case with Tim Cook. Apple needs a CEO who is a visionary. Apple needs a CEO who instills confidence in Apple's future. Tim Cook does not.  

    The facts are too strong. The only time Apple has had a decent PE ratio of 15+ was when Apple was growing revenues by 100% (from 2011 to late 2012) and 35% (early 2015). Besides those strong periods the stock has been chronically undervalued in the 10 PE range or less.
    Question is, who are you going to replace Cook with? What visionary leader exists out there that can fit right in with Apple's design / product oriented culture? Is there anyone within Apple let alone outside Apple?
  • Reply 40 of 41
    canukstormcanukstorm Posts: 2,695member
    wood1208 said:
    It is Human nature that once your interest is not served well, loyalty disappears fast. So, before human nature of loyal Apple stock holder, supporter, etc crowd turn away from Apple, my advice to Apple is stop listening Carl Ichan or wall-street. Steve Jobs never cared to listen and that is why no one had dare to ask him like pay dividents or stock buyback, Steve Jobs believed instead of distributing money and make Apple financially weaker; put that money to innovation and raise the bar higher so competitor can't touch. Tim Cook is no less CEO or not able to run Apple smoothly but too soft to take the company to the next level. Apple may need visionary, no bull-shit, ass-hole CEO to make it happen.
    This is why SJ never put any importance or value on stock price or market cap. He knew it could change on a dime. As long as Apple was focused on making great products that made technology more personal, they would be successful.
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