ARM severs ties with Huawei, creating crisis for future phone designs

Posted:
in General Discussion
Chip designer ARM is reportedly cutting off business with Huawei, a move that could potentially cripple the Chinese smartphone maker on top of the existing U.S. restrictions.

Huawei Mate 10 Pro


ARM is instructing its workforce to end "all active contracts, support entitlements, and any pending engagements" with Huawei, according to internal documents seen by BBC News. Despite being based in the U.K., ARM said that it believes it's affected by U.S. bans on Huawei because it relies on "U.S. origin technology."

Publicly, ARM stated only that it's "complying with all of the latest regulations set forth by the U.S. government."

ARM designs form the backbone of most modern smartphone processors, even if companies like Apple apply heavy customization. It's unclear therefore how Huawei might continue building phones and other mobile devices.

While U.S. restrictions have been temporarily softened, Huawei still faces the prospect of losing key American suppliers, infrastructure buyers, and its commercial Android license. It may have to switch to the Android Open Source Project, preventing its devices from offering key Google features like the Google Play Store, Gmail, and YouTube apps.

The White House is concerned that Huawei technology could result in network backdoors, given the company's links with the Chinese goverment. Huawei has denied any threat, arguing that the Trump administration is really interested in diminishing a major Chinese business in the context of a broader trade war.

Huawei is the leading smartphone vendor in its home country, trouncing not just Apple but local rivals like Oppo and Xiaomi. Crippling it could open opportunities for American products like the iPhone, although a boycott movement may limit Apple's prospects.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 81
    ericthehalfbeeericthehalfbee Posts: 4,067member
    Called it.

    Now what will Huawei do, since they lack the ability to design their own processors?
    magman1979jbdragonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 81
    georgie01georgie01 Posts: 241member
    Probably a good call. 
    magman1979jbdragonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 81
    tzeshantzeshan Posts: 1,968member
    Huawei may lesson the pressure by splitting into two. US government only has a legitimate reason(?) to ban Huawei for 5G. Its smartphone is no different from Samsung Galaxy phones. 
    Carnage
  • Reply 4 of 81
    genovellegenovelle Posts: 942member
    Well based on potential back doors, our technology is a threat to other countries as well as our business are subject to court orders in the name of national security. We are on a path to isolation. It is not in our best interest to go there and once we remove ourselves from the world economy our place will be quickly filed. Interestingly the primary winners in this  scenario are China and Russia. 
    frantisekcolor
  • Reply 5 of 81
    tzeshan said:
    Huawei may lesson the pressure by splitting into two. US government only has a legitimate reason(?) to ban Huawei for 5G. Its smartphone is no different from Samsung Galaxy phones. 
    China is more of a threat to the USA compared to South Korea. 
    racerhomie3magman1979airnerd
  • Reply 6 of 81
    ravnorodomravnorodom Posts: 205member
    Strange that China can do everything except fabricating chip. They didn’t see that coming. 
    jbdragonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 7 of 81
    macplusplusmacplusplus Posts: 1,654member
    It is either licensing or pirating. This is how it works in technology.
    hydrogenjbdragonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 8 of 81
    doctwelvedoctwelve Posts: 25member
    Strange that China can do everything except fabricating chip. They didn’t see that coming. 
    More difficult to reverse-engineer and copy. 
    ravnorodomracerhomie3StrangeDaysmagman1979elijahgjbdragonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 81
    dewmedewme Posts: 2,063member
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. A lot of the concerns seem to be pure conjecture or hypotheticals and ignore the fact that all countries, US and EU ones included, have both the ability and incentives to place surveillance inside any hardware or software communication platforms and equipment, whether at the manufacturing point of origin or through interception anywhere in the supply, distribution, or service channels and pretty much regardless of where the equipment is deployed. It's not like Huawei is building a giant ship with a massive crane to mine manganese nodules from the bottom of the ocean off the east coast of the US, or anything like that...
    muthuk_vanalingammacplusplusfrantisektoysandmefotoformatcolorwatto_cobra
  • Reply 10 of 81
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 3,788member
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. A lot of the concerns seem to be pure conjecture or hypotheticals and ignore the fact that all countries, US and EU ones included, have both the ability and incentives to place surveillance inside any hardware or software communication platforms and equipment, whether at the manufacturing point of origin or through interception anywhere in the supply, distribution, or service channels and pretty much regardless of where the equipment is deployed. It's not like Huawei is building a giant ship with a massive crane to mine manganese nodules from the bottom of the ocean off the east coast of the US, or anything like that...
    There is absolutely nothing more than you point out.

    The Trump administration simply didn't want to see the Chinese take a tech lead (5G for example) over the US.

    Trump tried to get other countries to do the dirty work by banning Huawei. Most of those countries refused (after requesting evidence and not getting any) and as a US ban wasn't going to be enough, he simply declared a 'national emergency' to justify an executive order. This in spite of court cases (by both sides) already being underway.

    Why wait for the legalities to be cleared up when you can skip that part altogether?

    We are now in Wild West Politics and the sheriff is acting like one of those dodgy sheriffs in some crazy western.

    Blatant protectionism and nothing else save for the conjecture and hypotheticals.

    This is not the precedent the US should be setting on a world stage. 

    macplusplustoysandmefotoformatcolor
  • Reply 11 of 81
    tzeshantzeshan Posts: 1,968member

    mrmacgeek said:
    tzeshan said:
    Huawei may lesson the pressure by splitting into two. US government only has a legitimate reason(?) to ban Huawei for 5G. Its smartphone is no different from Samsung Galaxy phones. 
    China is more of a threat to the USA compared to South Korea. 
    Only true for hegemonists. 
  • Reply 12 of 81
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,109member
    Strange that China can do everything except fabricating chip. They didn’t see that coming. 
    Chip fabs cost multiple billions and chip designers are rare talents who are highly paid. I doubt there are more than a handful of people capable in the world.
    magman1979ravnorodomwatto_cobra
  • Reply 13 of 81
    sirozhasirozha Posts: 551member
    Called it.

    Now what will Huawei do, since they lack the ability to design their own processors?
    Who says they lack the ability to design their own processors?
  • Reply 14 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,760member
    sirozha said:
    Called it.

    Now what will Huawei do, since they lack the ability to design their own processors?
    Who says they lack the ability to design their own processors?
    Good luck with that, and good luck doing it without some leading edge silicon design software, as that is almost certainly banned as well.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_design_automation

    https://www.cadence.com

    edited May 22 watto_cobra
  • Reply 15 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,760member
    avon b7 said:
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. A lot of the concerns seem to be pure conjecture or hypotheticals and ignore the fact that all countries, US and EU ones included, have both the ability and incentives to place surveillance inside any hardware or software communication platforms and equipment, whether at the manufacturing point of origin or through interception anywhere in the supply, distribution, or service channels and pretty much regardless of where the equipment is deployed. It's not like Huawei is building a giant ship with a massive crane to mine manganese nodules from the bottom of the ocean off the east coast of the US, or anything like that...
    There is absolutely nothing more than you point out.

    The Trump administration simply didn't want to see the Chinese take a tech lead (5G for example) over the US.

    Trump tried to get other countries to do the dirty work by banning Huawei. Most of those countries refused (after requesting evidence and not getting any) and as a US ban wasn't going to be enough, he simply declared a 'national emergency' to justify an executive order. This in spite of court cases (by both sides) already being underway.

    Why wait for the legalities to be cleared up when you can skip that part altogether?

    We are now in Wild West Politics and the sheriff is acting like one of those dodgy sheriffs in some crazy western.

    Blatant protectionism and nothing else save for the conjecture and hypotheticals.

    This is not the precedent the US should be setting on a world stage. 

     
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-huawei-usa-5g-specialreport/special-report-hobbling-huawei-inside-the-u-s-war-on-chinas-tech-giant-idUSKCN1SR1EU?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews

    "Europeans pushed back, too. During one closed-door session, senior representatives from European telecom operators pressed a U.S. official for hard evidence that Huawei presented a security risk. One executive demanded to see a smoking gun, recalled the U.S. official. 


    The American official fired back: “If the gun is smoking, you’ve already been shot. I don’t know why you’re lining up in front of a loaded weapon.”


    I suspect that the U.S. sees Huawei as both "personal' and "strategic" to both Xi and China, based on all of the telegraphing Huawei and China have been doing about Huawei's breadth of accomplishments and basic resistance to Huawei.

    "Politics is war by other means"

    https://oll.libertyfund.org/pages/clausewitz-war-as-politics-by-other-means



    Or, as Tony Soprano might say, "We're going to bust their balls"


    Xi should have never backed out on the agreements that they made in the earlier trade negotiations.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/16/world/asia/trade-xi-jinping-trump-china-united-states.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share

    "BEIJING — China’s leader, Xi Jinping, seemed confident three weeks ago that a yearlong trade war with the United States could soon subside, handing him a potent political victory.

    He even made a speech saying China would protect intellectual property, encourage foreign investment, and buy more goods and services from abroad — all changes the United States had been demanding as the countries tried to negotiate a deal.

    But just a week after that speech, Chinese negotiators sent the Americans a substantially rewritten draft agreement, prompting President Trump to accuse Beijing of reneging on terms that had been settled.

    That has left hopes for a historic breakthrough in tatters."

    Credit to the Czechs and Australians for leading off against Huawei.


    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-huawei-usa-5g-specialreport/special-report-hobbling-huawei-inside-the-u-s-war-on-chinas-tech-giant-idUSKCN1SR1EU?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews


    https://www.smh.com.au/world/asia/how-australia-led-the-us-in-its-global-war-against-huawei-20190522-p51pv8.html

    edited May 22 lostkiwiwatto_cobra
  • Reply 16 of 81
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 17,035member
    avon b7 said:
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. A lot of the concerns seem to be pure conjecture or hypotheticals and ignore the fact that all countries, US and EU ones included, have both the ability and incentives to place surveillance inside any hardware or software communication platforms and equipment, whether at the manufacturing point of origin or through interception anywhere in the supply, distribution, or service channels and pretty much regardless of where the equipment is deployed. It's not like Huawei is building a giant ship with a massive crane to mine manganese nodules from the bottom of the ocean off the east coast of the US, or anything like that...
    There is absolutely nothing more than you point out.

    The Trump administration simply didn't want to see the Chinese take a tech lead (5G for example) over the US.

    Trump tried to get other countries to do the dirty work by banning Huawei. Most of those countries refused (after requesting evidence and not getting any) and as a US ban wasn't going to be enough, he simply declared a 'national emergency' to justify an executive order. This in spite of court cases (by both sides) already being underway.

    Why wait for the legalities to be cleared up when you can skip that part altogether?

    We are now in Wild West Politics and the sheriff is acting like one of those dodgy sheriffs in some crazy western.

    Blatant protectionism and nothing else save for the conjecture and hypotheticals.

    This is not the precedent the US should be setting on a world stage. 


    This is incredibly naive.  It's not just an insecure platform or the specter of secret surveillance/tracking.  It's about:  

    1.  The relationship between the Communist Party/Government and "private" business.  
    2.  The requirements placed upon said business, including surveillance and cooperation with government "requests" (e.g. spying, targeting). 
    3.  China's advanced cyber and and industrial espionage programs 
    4.  The company's advanced presence in 5G technology, which will soon be deployed world-wide.  

    In the end, this about China's wish to be globally dominant in all areas.  Technology/the Internet is a key goal for them.  Imagine an Internet run, in essence, by the Communist Chinese instead of the free market West.  Huawei is not just some company that might be risky to do business with.  They are an integral part of China's government, which seeks world domination.  This is is why we are banning them.  China has had it out for us since the late 1970's.  They have been executing a 75 year plan to take us on militarily, economically and geopolitically.  By 2050, their goal is to be the world's Super Power.   

    But yeah, that Trump is nuts, huh?  
    tmaymobirdStrangeDaysmagman1979lostkiwiwatto_cobra
  • Reply 17 of 81
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 19,157member
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. 
    Your creating an equivalency, regarding the quality of information provided by a democratically elected, accountable government (Trump's and Obama's, both of whom have found issues with Huawei -- in fact, Trump is merely following up on many of the issues left over from the Obama administration) operating in a society with a free press to a draconian IP-thieving communist dictatorship that controls speech and movement, is beyond troubling.

    It's actually shocking.
    tmayStrangeDayssdw2001magman1979LordeHawkelectrosoftlostkiwiwatto_cobra
  • Reply 18 of 81
    tzeshantzeshan Posts: 1,968member
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. 
    Your creating an equivalency, regarding the quality of information provided by a democratically elected, accountable government (Trump's and Obama's, both of whom have found issues with Huawei -- in fact, Trump is merely following up on many of the issues left over from the Obama administration) operating in a society with a free press to a draconian IP-thieving communist dictatorship that controls speech and movement, is beyond troubling.

    It's actually shocking.
    You are being fooled about the IP-thieving accusation. It is done by Chinese companies. Chinese government has repeatedly denied it and the denial are simply ignored. You are full of logic mistakes just like the US government. Huawei is a private company as it has insisted. In order to justify the statement that China is a draconian IP-thieving communist dictatorship, the China bashers insisted that Huawei is a Chinese government entity although they provided no evidence. The situation is like when Bush wants to attack Iraq he has to justify Saddam is making WMD. The war proved that it is big lie. But US did nothing in regard to the lie. So US is very accustomed to making lies about other nations. and taking no responsibility. All the leaders can do is announcing national interests and national emergency. And these are lies. US fabricated a lot of facts. Is the western world which triumphed with scientific revolution to lead the world are falling into? Fabricating facts just not Christian culture? Democracy can thrive only through lies? 
    muthuk_vanalingamtoysandmehydrogen
  • Reply 19 of 81
    tzeshantzeshan Posts: 1,968member

    sdw2001 said:
    avon b7 said:
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. A lot of the concerns seem to be pure conjecture or hypotheticals and ignore the fact that all countries, US and EU ones included, have both the ability and incentives to place surveillance inside any hardware or software communication platforms and equipment, whether at the manufacturing point of origin or through interception anywhere in the supply, distribution, or service channels and pretty much regardless of where the equipment is deployed. It's not like Huawei is building a giant ship with a massive crane to mine manganese nodules from the bottom of the ocean off the east coast of the US, or anything like that...
    There is absolutely nothing more than you point out.

    The Trump administration simply didn't want to see the Chinese take a tech lead (5G for example) over the US.

    Trump tried to get other countries to do the dirty work by banning Huawei. Most of those countries refused (after requesting evidence and not getting any) and as a US ban wasn't going to be enough, he simply declared a 'national emergency' to justify an executive order. This in spite of court cases (by both sides) already being underway.

    Why wait for the legalities to be cleared up when you can skip that part altogether?

    We are now in Wild West Politics and the sheriff is acting like one of those dodgy sheriffs in some crazy western.

    Blatant protectionism and nothing else save for the conjecture and hypotheticals.

    This is not the precedent the US should be setting on a world stage. 


    This is incredibly naive.  It's not just an insecure platform or the specter of secret surveillance/tracking.  It's about:  

    1.  The relationship between the Communist Party/Government and "private" business.  
    2.  The requirements placed upon said business, including surveillance and cooperation with government "requests" (e.g. spying, targeting). 
    3.  China's advanced cyber and and industrial espionage programs 
    4.  The company's advanced presence in 5G technology, which will soon be deployed world-wide.  

    In the end, this about China's wish to be globally dominant in all areas.  Technology/the Internet is a key goal for them.  Imagine an Internet run, in essence, by the Communist Chinese instead of the free market West.  Huawei is not just some company that might be risky to do business with.  They are an integral part of China's government, which seeks world domination.  This is is why we are banning them.  China has had it out for us since the late 1970's.  They have been executing a 75 year plan to take us on militarily, economically and geopolitically.  By 2050, their goal is to be the world's Super Power.   

    But yeah, that Trump is nuts, huh?  
    All are one sided biased talks. 
    toysandme
  • Reply 20 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,760member
    tzeshan said:
    dewme said:
    I really wish there was some objective, scientific, and non-politicized coverage of the actual issues the US has with Huawei. 
    Your creating an equivalency, regarding the quality of information provided by a democratically elected, accountable government (Trump's and Obama's, both of whom have found issues with Huawei -- in fact, Trump is merely following up on many of the issues left over from the Obama administration) operating in a society with a free press to a draconian IP-thieving communist dictatorship that controls speech and movement, is beyond troubling.

    It's actually shocking.
    You are being fooled about the IP-thieving accusation. It is done by Chinese companies. Chinese government has repeatedly denied it and the denial are simply ignored. You are full of logic mistakes just like the US government. Huawei is a private company as it has insisted. In order to justify the statement that China is a draconian IP-thieving communist dictatorship, the China bashers insisted that Huawei is a Chinese government entity although they provided no evidence. The situation is like when Bush wants to attack Iraq he has to justify Saddam is making WMD. The war proved that it is big lie. But US did nothing in regard to the lie. So US is very accustomed to making lies about other nations. and taking no responsibility. All the leaders can do is announcing national interests and national emergency. And these are lies. US fabricated a lot of facts. Is the western world which triumphed with scientific revolution to lead the world are falling into? Fabricating facts just not Christian culture? Democracy can thrive only through lies? 
    I previously provided a link to a scholarly article, by individuals with background in Chinese legal constructs,  that concluded that Huawei was in fact 1% owned by Ren, and 99% owned by a Chinese Workers Union, that is the Chinese Government. Huawei responded to that. but did not provide any transparency that disproved the conclusion of the authors. 

    Easy fix. Huawei opens up its books to independent parties. But of course, that won't happen in China, will it.

    Just for future reference, whataboutism isn't actually a good debating strategy, unless, as I suspect, you don't actually have any facts to debate.
    edited May 22 anantksundaramStrangeDayselijahgLordeHawkwatto_cobra
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