Nitpicky but relevant, you can't say Apple has an audience of more than a billion users because nothing supports that. You can say Apple has more than a billion active devices. Those two things are not the same and can't be used interchangeably. We both know there's no 1-to-1 correlation. Apple does have a ton of potential subscribers. There's no doubt about that. But they don't have as many potential subscribers as Netflix so their base of users isn't the advantage you make it out to be. Netflix includes Apple's base as potential customers along with users of any device that has streaming ability regardless of ecosystem.
Except, that 1 Billion Apple users using 1.4 billion active Apple devices ARE ALREADY signed up users with AppleIDs in Apple's ecosystem. That is a big difference from billions of users who have a web browser that *might* sign up for Netflix.
The barrier of entry is significantly different - Apple users would merely click a button or two to enable AppleTV+ and in many cases their credit card details are already also on file as iTunes, App Store or iCloud paid users.
Way back in Sept 2014, there were 885 million active iTunes/App Store users, all with credit card enabled accounts already set up with Apple.
All Netflix has is 149m existing users and a much higher bar for users to jump to even try out their services.
Nitpicky but relevant, you can't say Apple has an audience of more than a billion users because nothing supports that. You can say Apple has more than a billion active devices. Those two things are not the same and can't be used interchangeably. We both know there's no 1-to-1 correlation. Apple does have a ton of potential subscribers. There's no doubt about that. But they don't have as many potential subscribers as Netflix so their base of users isn't the advantage you make it out to be. Netflix includes Apple's base as potential customers along with users of any device that has streaming ability regardless of ecosystem.
Except, that 1 Billion Apple users using 1.4 billion active Apple devices ARE ALREADY signed up users with AppleIDs in Apple's ecosystem. That is a big difference from billions of users who have a web browser that *might* sign up for Netflix.
The barrier of entry is significantly different - Apple users would merely click a button or two to enable AppleTV+ and in many cases their credit card details are already also on file as iTunes, App Store or iCloud paid users.
Way back in Sept 2014, there were 885 million active iTunes/App Store users, all with credit card enabled accounts already set up with Apple.
All Netflix has is 149m existing users and a much higher bar for users to jump to even try out their services.
Where are you getting 1 billion users? As I said to DED, there's nothing to back that claim. 1.4 billion devices divided by the average number of devices per person... yeah that ain't going to get you a billion users. Back in 2016 when Apple had 1 billion active devices, the per customer device average was 1.7 (per Credit Suisse estimates). That's 588 million. Even if you use the same 2016 estimate of 1.7 devices per person against 1.4 billion devices, you still don't get a billion users. I'd bet the device per person number is even higher now considering iPhones, iPads, iPods, Macs, ATV's, and Watches. I'd be darn near shocked if the average Apple device per person isn't over 2. Anecdotally, I have an MBP and an MBA. Both my daughters have iPhones. We have 4 iPads in our home. That's 2.7 devices per person. I'd bet your personal numbers would be even higher. To achieve the billion users, the average device per person would have to go down from the 2016 estimate of 1.7. Neither one of us believes that happened. There is no realistic combination of numbers that net you a billion users. ← That was my point to DED. He equated more than a billion active devices with more than a billion users. Can't do it.
Apple users aren't Borg. There is no monolithic group think. ATV+ would face the same issues as Netflix: convincing the user the service is worth subscription. I'm not sure what barrier of entry you think Netflix has. There is no much higher bar. Signing up for the service it easy. If ATV+ has a couple fewer clicks the significance seems pretty insignificant. Content is going to be the driver, not "they already have my cc info".
If Apple gave a free streaming only tv dongle say with a years subscription to tv+ they would really do well. Once they are in people’s homes they could up sell the more capable Apple TV.
If Apple gave a free streaming only tv dongle say with a years subscription to tv+ they would really do well. Once they are in people’s homes they could up sell the more capable Apple TV.
How about a free software app, and then they could up sell the more capable Apple TV
Nitpicky but relevant, you can't say Apple has an audience of more than a billion users because nothing supports that. You can say Apple has more than a billion active devices. Those two things are not the same and can't be used interchangeably. We both know there's no 1-to-1 correlation. Apple does have a ton of potential subscribers. There's no doubt about that. But they don't have as many potential subscribers as Netflix so their base of users isn't the advantage you make it out to be. Netflix includes Apple's base as potential customers along with users of any device that has streaming ability regardless of ecosystem.
Except, that 1 Billion Apple users using 1.4 billion active Apple devices ARE ALREADY signed up users with AppleIDs in Apple's ecosystem. That is a big difference from billions of users who have a web browser that *might* sign up for Netflix.
The barrier of entry is significantly different - Apple users would merely click a button or two to enable AppleTV+ and in many cases their credit card details are already also on file as iTunes, App Store or iCloud paid users.
Way back in Sept 2014, there were 885 million active iTunes/App Store users, all with credit card enabled accounts already set up with Apple.
All Netflix has is 149m existing users and a much higher bar for users to jump to even try out their services.
Where are you getting 1 billion users? As I said to DED, there's nothing to back that claim. 1.4 billion devices divided by the average number of devices per person... yeah that ain't going to get you a billion users. Back in 2016 when Apple had 1 billion active devices, the per customer device average was 1.7 (per Credit Suisse estimates). That's 588 million. Even if you use the same 2016 estimate of 1.7 devices per person against 1.4 billion devices, you still don't get a billion users. I'd bet the device per person number is even higher now considering iPhones, iPads, iPods, Macs, ATV's, and Watches. I'd be darn near shocked if the average Apple device per person isn't over 2. Anecdotally, I have an MBP and an MBA. Both my daughters have iPhones. We have 4 iPads in our home. That's 2.7 devices per person. I'd bet your personal numbers would be even higher. To achieve the billion users, the average device per person would have to go down from the 2016 estimate of 1.7. Neither one of us believes that happened. There is no realistic combination of numbers that net you a billion users. ← That was my point to DED. He equated more than a billion active devices with more than a billion users. Can't do it.
Apple users aren't Borg. There is no monolithic group think. ATV+ would face the same issues as Netflix: convincing the user the service is worth subscription. I'm not sure what barrier of entry you think Netflix has. There is no much higher bar. Signing up for the service it easy. If ATV+ has a couple fewer clicks the significance seems pretty insignificant. Content is going to be the driver, not "they already have my cc info".
Every substantiation mentioned here indicates that they’re simply too late, given their ambitions.
Same for Music Streaming, and Project Titan soon.
iPhone was too late Apple Watch too late Airpods was too late iPad was too late Apple Music too late
If “too late” means “this is where you’ll find the profits, if any...” then that’s where I’ll invest my money hats.
Nobody said any of that, certainly not the phone, Watch, AirPods, iPad. Music maybe.
In this case most people have a limited budget for entertainment and will not pay for all services. With Spotify the service is the same as Apple Music, replacing one with the other makes sense. I did it. Also the HomePod, though not a great personal assistant is a great speaker. I love it for that.
I might add Apple TV if it is bundled with Apple Music, but to move to a new TV service it has to, out of the gate, have the same or better content than my existing tv service, or be a cheap add on in addition to it ( like Amazon Prime) and Apple are not costing it like that.
Of course all that will change if Apple have one great series worth watching.
All Apple has to do is make it convenient to use and enjoyable to consume. Period. People pay for that. Not everyone will of course, which is why it may be a small audience at first. But then there’s process improvements, cost reductions, and that small audiences premium purchase pays for new stuff, then the old stuff continues to sell at a reduced price to the remaining audience who won’t quite pay top shelf.
If you’re unsure if your device supports Netflix, follow the steps in the “Set up Netflix” section to attempt to locate the Netflix app.
Netflix Features
Set up Netflix
Sign out of Netflix
Netflix in HDR
Netflix is available on iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch models running iOS 12.0 or later, and is compatible with devices running iOS 5.0 or later that have already downloaded the Netflix app. Instructions for determining which iOS version you have can be found on Apple's support site.
Netflix streaming features for supported devices include:
Comments
Except, that 1 Billion Apple users using 1.4 billion active Apple devices ARE ALREADY signed up users with AppleIDs in Apple's ecosystem. That is a big difference from billions of users who have a web browser that *might* sign up for Netflix.
The barrier of entry is significantly different - Apple users would merely click a button or two to enable AppleTV+ and in many cases their credit card details are already also on file as iTunes, App Store or iCloud paid users.
Way back in Sept 2014, there were 885 million active iTunes/App Store users, all with credit card enabled accounts already set up with Apple.
All Netflix has is 149m existing users and a much higher bar for users to jump to even try out their services.
Apple users aren't Borg. There is no monolithic group think. ATV+ would face the same issues as Netflix: convincing the user the service is worth subscription. I'm not sure what barrier of entry you think Netflix has. There is no much higher bar. Signing up for the service it easy. If ATV+ has a couple fewer clicks the significance seems pretty insignificant. Content is going to be the driver, not "they already have my cc info".
Once they are in people’s homes they could up sell the more capable Apple TV.
Also, the article didn't actually link Apple's vast number of accounts (ie, captive audience customers) with "active devices," you did. So be careful when you're inventing problems that you're not simply wrong and complaiing about things that are not issues, nor claims, just to waste other people's time.
Netflix has ~150 subscribers. That's great. Apple doesn't have that many TV subscribers or even Apple Music subscribers yet. But Apple isn't going to have a problem finding enough subscribers to stay in business, and you know that. It doesn't have to sign up a billion people and it doesn't need an installed base of a billion devices. But it does have a billion pockets to appeal to, as Oprah pointed out.
If you’re unsure if your device supports Netflix, follow the steps in the “Set up Netflix” section to attempt to locate the Netflix app.
Netflix is available on iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch models running iOS 12.0 or later, and is compatible with devices running iOS 5.0 or later that have already downloaded the Netflix app. Instructions for determining which iOS version you have can be found on Apple's support site.
Netflix streaming features for supported devices include: