If Steve ends up putting a G4 in the iBook (PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE!), then I think he`s going to announce the death of the G3 chip in Macintoshes, similar to how he announced the `death` of CRTs with the introduction of the new iMac.
I'd like to see OS X 10.2 released and optimized even furthur so that when running it on any G3 or greater chip, it runs MUCH faster than it does now.
This single improvement would probably make me get rid of my 8600/200 asap and buy a dual 1GHz. I've been waiting for DDR with an improved G4 (or G5) to buy so that it runs OS X halfway decent.
I think that Apple will finally release a new handheld. Moves that Apple has made recently point to it.
For example, they allowed you to 'sync' your address book with the iPod. Then they adopted Bluetooth. Even if Apple is going to come out with a wireless keyboard and mouse, they wouldn't be hyping Bluetooth as much as they are. Bluetooth primarily allows you to connect to PDAs and cell phones. So I strongly believe that Apple will finally come out with the sucessor to the Newton.
<strong>I think that Apple will finally release a new handheld. Moves that Apple has made recently point to it.
For example, they allowed you to 'sync' your address book with the iPod. Then they adopted Bluetooth. Even if Apple is going to come out with a wireless keyboard and mouse, they wouldn't be hyping Bluetooth as much as they are. Bluetooth primarily allows you to connect to PDAs and cell phones. So I strongly believe that Apple will finally come out with the sucessor to the Newton.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I hope a Newton successor is on its way! I miss the Newton's assistant technology.
If the Newton was Einstein, my Visor is Forrest Gump.
Well, the 'official' news is that apple have been so successful in making their own Generation chip, that the name G'5' simply isn't enough. Instead, the clever boffins at apple have named the chip the G7, which has a 1.5Ghz bus, 800Mhz DDR RAM, with 15- 1GB slots, and rruns at speeds of 10Ghz to 30Ghz. The entry level model, will cost $1000, with a 1600x1024 22" LCD. The top model has a GeForce 4 Ti4600 overclocked, 8 G7s, and 1000Gb or 1TB of storage, thanks to new holographic technology. The top model will cost $3599.
*Wakes up*
The most likely thing we will see will be 1.2Ghz G4s, hopefully with a DDR bus, and mac os 10.2, and maybe a demo of the G5 as an anniversary thing.
Just wondering, where do people get the idea that the PowerPC is going to go from 1.0GHZ to 1.4 GHZ in one jump? We usually don't get a 40% increase in speed and only went from 500MHZ to 733 MHZ last year because the chip was stalled for so long. Just because Intel and AMD can keep pumping up the MHZ because they have so much revenue to spend doesn't mean that Motorola is going to do any better than they have for the last ten years.
So If in July Apple releases a dual 1.2 MHZ G4 we will hear nothing but complaining about the measly increase when everyone was expecting more. I'd say we'll be lucky to get to 1.5GHZ by the end of the year. I see no reason to expect a 40% increase in clock frequency in 5 months. Sorry to be harsh but the best predictor of the future is the past.
<strong>Just wondering, where do people get the idea that the PowerPC is going to go from 1.0GHZ to 1.4 GHZ in one jump? We usually don't get a 40% increase in speed and only went from 500MHZ to 733 MHZ last year because the chip was stalled for so long. Just because Intel and AMD can keep pumping up the MHZ because they have so much revenue to spend doesn't mean that Motorola is going to do any better than they have for the last ten years.
So If in July Apple releases a dual 1.2 MHZ G4 we will hear nothing but complaining about the measly increase when everyone was expecting more. I'd say we'll be lucky to get to 1.5GHZ by the end of the year. I see no reason to expect a 40% increase in clock frequency in 5 months. Sorry to be harsh but the best predictor of the future is the past.
Personally, I'd expect dual 1.2 g4s aswell, but I can see alot depends upon Motorola introducing their new technology's. The move to 0.13 Apollo could easily bring G4's up to 1.6GHZ and above, and a change inn architecture could yield 2GHZ, aka 7500. But I think MWNY is too early for this, I believe, albeit from rumour sites, that the 0.13 move comes in August/September and the 7500 comes in Jan/Feb 2003.
However 1.4 is not a pipe dream, because for Apple to offer dual 1GHZ at present must mean that yields are pretty good at 1GHZ, no doubt there could have been a mid range machine at single processor 1.2GHZ or thereabouts, if the line had followed the prevous pattern of 733/867/2x800. If Apple reverted to this style, I could see maybe 1GHZ/1.4GHZ/Dual 1.2 or maybe even 1GHZ/1.2/Dual 1.4 if yields were really good.
But then as always, Apple will want to maximise profits, so there will be no great increase in MHZ,
I would say that MWNY wil be about Powermacs but not G5. I don't see and increase in bus speed until the G5.
I expect 1.2, 1.4 and dual 1.4
The ready availability of the 1ghz chip and by all accounts it was ready long before Apple announced it means that Moto has had plenty of time to scale production of higher speed chips. In fact some one at Apple said that there was a lot more to come from the G4.
Oh and one more thing... 10.2 see how fast it is.
We really haven't seen anything happen to OS X for a long time (I don't count 10.1.3, as it didn't really do anything) and as it is, it is only half finished. So many options are greyed out that I cannot believe that they havn't been working hard to finish off. I think the timeing is now right for a new quantium leap. I hope we can down-load the installer-updater. Software update is OK but I don't want to have to download it for each machine, once is fine.
By mid July Intel will be lowering prices of their 2.6Ghz 0.13 P4 w/533Mhz FSB and 1066Mhz RDRAM. Look for on die USB 2.0 controler, and possibly on die FSB and memory subsystem.
They'll be lowering the price because the 2.8 and 3Ghz chips with on die 802.11b system and antenna, integrated on die graphics control and support for 1200Mhz RDRAM will be coming out August-September time frame.
Hey Apple, what are you planning?
"we don't comment on future products"
makes it hard for a business to plan IT purchasing, and very easy to go with Wintel.
I would tend to agree with the general consensus here. I'd love to see a G5, but I'm not holding my breath. I'm in the market for a new high end system. I was considering buying a dual G4 1GHz system, but decided against it. At the time I was waiting for the real Geforce 4ti to be available as an option. To my knowledge, they still aren't shipping on Macs yet, at least, I haven't seen any benchmarks. Likewise, I figured, by the time the Geforce4 Ti's are shipping and any small bugs are worked out, it will be time for MWNY anyway.
That said, I'm not expecting anything more than dual 1.2GHZ G4s at the high end. Moving to the HiP7 (.13u) process should make this clock speed easily attainable. I would be floored if Apple were to ship dual 1.4GHZ G4s, especially with a new DDR based motherboard. Also, the die shrunk .13u G4s might very well include twice the onboard L2 cache. Either way, dual 1.2GHZ G4s (or higher) is sufficiently faster than what I'm using now, so I'll upgrade either way.
On a side note, I agree with JasonPP's comments regarding Apple's "we don't comment on future products" policy. This is great for consumer trade shows, but it's a poor policy for any type of stategic planning. However, based on Apple's product announcements, it's clear that the consumer market, rather than the corporate market, is Apple's target.
<strong> Just because Intel and AMD can keep pumping up the MHZ because they have so much revenue to spend doesn't mean that Motorola is going to do any better than they have for the last ten years.
I don't think this is fair. I would be surprised if Motorolla makes much less on the 5% of processors it sells to Apple then the 15% of processors AMD ships. AMD is in a price war with intel. Motorolla has fat profit margins on its chips to Apple and the ones it sells as DSPs. I don't imagine their research dollars could be that much different than AMDs. Intel is a whole other story I suppose.
You can't base predictions of future chip speeds on past motherboard architectures. The G4 has had the same motherboard since January of 2001, with some minor tweaks here and there. Come July it will be 1.5 years old. What do you think Apple's PowerMac engineers do for 1.5 years? Figure out how to insert a Dual GHz G4 into the motherboard? I think we are going to be seeing a truly next generation PowerMac at MWNY, similar to the B&W G3 and the G4 unveiling at Seybold, except this time, it's gonna be the G5, and all these bitches here will finally shut their mouths about Intel and AMD.
Comments
[ 03-29-2002: Message edited by: mclaugd1 ]</p>
-DDR (266Mhz) based motherboard
-PPC 7610(???) based G4 running at 1.0Ghz, Dual 1.2Ghz, Dual 1.4Ghz
-256MB, 256MB, 512MB DDR
-CD-RW, SuperDrive, SuperDrive
-USB 1.1, Firewire 2.0
-Same SlowSilver (tm) case
-$1799, $2499, $3099 <------ Hope they could be lower but seem unlikely
iMac
-Maybe using 133Mhz motherboard
-800Mhz,933Mha,1Ghz
-CDRW, Combo, SuperDrive
-128MB, 128MB, 256MB PC 133 RAM
-$1299, $1499, $1799 <---- Back to normal price (in other words. NO price drop until this day)
iBook
-14.1" screen model scrapped!
-800Mhz G3
PowerBook
-Don't know since I am not too interested on this
This single improvement would probably make me get rid of my 8600/200 asap and buy a dual 1GHz. I've been waiting for DDR with an improved G4 (or G5) to buy so that it runs OS X halfway decent.
For example, they allowed you to 'sync' your address book with the iPod. Then they adopted Bluetooth. Even if Apple is going to come out with a wireless keyboard and mouse, they wouldn't be hyping Bluetooth as much as they are. Bluetooth primarily allows you to connect to PDAs and cell phones. So I strongly believe that Apple will finally come out with the sucessor to the Newton.
and:
between now and November 2002 there will be:
- 1 Ghz iMac (for sure)
- minimum 867 Mhz PowerBook G4 SE with many many advantages to the PowerBook from today (higher resolutions, bigger display)
- minimum 867 Mhz iBook G3 along with 133Mhz bus speed
- iPod: next revision will get significiant new features and applications...
and last but not least: one more thing!!! i think steve has got to say this sentence again...
<strong>I think that Apple will finally release a new handheld. Moves that Apple has made recently point to it.
For example, they allowed you to 'sync' your address book with the iPod. Then they adopted Bluetooth. Even if Apple is going to come out with a wireless keyboard and mouse, they wouldn't be hyping Bluetooth as much as they are. Bluetooth primarily allows you to connect to PDAs and cell phones. So I strongly believe that Apple will finally come out with the sucessor to the Newton.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I hope a Newton successor is on its way! I miss the Newton's assistant technology.
If the Newton was Einstein, my Visor is Forrest Gump.
<strong>PowerMac:
-DDR (266Mhz) based motherboard
-PPC 7610(???) based G4 running at 1.0Ghz, Dual 1.2Ghz, Dual 1.4Ghz
-256MB, 256MB, 512MB DDR
-CD-RW, SuperDrive, SuperDrive
-USB 1.1, Firewire 2.0
-Same SlowSilver (tm) case
-$1799, $2499, $3099 <------ Hope they could be lower but seem unlikely
iMac
-Maybe using 133Mhz motherboard
-800Mhz,933Mha,1Ghz
-CDRW, Combo, SuperDrive
-128MB, 128MB, 256MB PC 133 RAM
-$1299, $1499, $1799 <---- Back to normal price (in other words. NO price drop until this day)
iBook
-14.1" screen model scrapped!
-800Mhz G3
PowerBook
-Don't know since I am not too interested on this
The new iMac, with 933 Mega Hectares of area...it can cover the entire state of Wyoming!
Powermac
--------
4GHZ G5, 333DDR, 4GB ram, 80MB 10,000rpm HD, GF4 Ti 4400 Hypertransport Superdrive 2 $999
Dual 4GHZ G5, as above $1599
Quad 4GHZ G5, dual GF4 ti 4600 (for 4 monitors), RAID Array, $2299
Imac
----
2GHZ G4 Apollo, Radeon8500, 1GB RAM ddr266 17" ACD 1280x1024 80MB 7200rpm HD Combodrive $999
2GHZ G4 as Above, Superdrive2 $1399
Powerbook G5
------------
3GHZ G5, Radeon8500mobility! DDR333 1GB. Combodrive, $1599
4GHZ G5 As Above, Superdrive2, 2GB DDR333 $1999
Dual 3.5GHZ G5 as above $2499
Ibook
-----
2GHZ G4 Apollo radeon7500 mobility, DDR266 512MB $999
2.5GHZ G4 Apollo as above, superdrive 1GB ram $1399
OSX 10.5 optimized, customizable and fast.
iMaya $499
iPod 50GB PDA, G3 sahara @1GHZ OSXlite, Blootooth, 640x480 colour screen, remote control, electrostatic headphones. $599
56" Cinema display, 3200x2048 resolution $1999
Oh, and 1 last thing,
32 Processor G5@4GHZ rackmount renderfarm with Geforce 5 Ultra Titanium 5000 512bit 2GHZ 96 pixelshaders OpenGL2, 100 billion Flops, 10 Billion Texels per second,
Ok, I know the last one is a bit unreasonable!
(Wakes up and dodges missiles
*Wakes up*
The most likely thing we will see will be 1.2Ghz G4s, hopefully with a DDR bus, and mac os 10.2, and maybe a demo of the G5 as an anniversary thing.
PowerMac G4:
Optimistic:
- up to 1.4 GHz PPC7470
- DDR266 RAM
- dual 200 MHz bus, 400 MHz effective
- ATA-133
- updated SuperDrive: 4x/8x DVD-R, 8x/12x/40x CD-RW
Realistic:- up to 1.2 GHz PPC7470
- DDR133 RAM
- 133 MHz bus
- ATA-66
- same SuperDrive: 2x/4x DVD-R, 4x/8x/24x CD-RW
PowerBook G4:Pretty Optimistic:
- 733 or 867 MHz G4
- DDR266 RAM
- dual 200 MHz bus, 400 MHz effective
- ATA-100
Realistic:- 667 or 800 MHz G4
- 133 MHz SDRAM
- 133 MHz bus
- ATA-66
iBook:Very Optimistic:
- up to 800 MHz G3
- 133 MHz SDRAM
- 133 MHz bus
- ATA-100
Realistic:- up to 700 MHz G3
- 100 MHz SDRAM
- 100 MHz bus
- ATA-66
No iMac updates until Jan 2003 or June/July 2003, where a 17-inch model will be introduced.The G5 (probably a 1.5 GHz PPC7500) won't be introduced until Jan 2003, and may not be 64-bit.
[ 03-30-2002: Message edited by: Carbon3 ]</p>
So If in July Apple releases a dual 1.2 MHZ G4 we will hear nothing but complaining about the measly increase when everyone was expecting more. I'd say we'll be lucky to get to 1.5GHZ by the end of the year. I see no reason to expect a 40% increase in clock frequency in 5 months. Sorry to be harsh but the best predictor of the future is the past.
[ 03-31-2002: Message edited by: spindler ]</p>
<strong>Just wondering, where do people get the idea that the PowerPC is going to go from 1.0GHZ to 1.4 GHZ in one jump? We usually don't get a 40% increase in speed and only went from 500MHZ to 733 MHZ last year because the chip was stalled for so long. Just because Intel and AMD can keep pumping up the MHZ because they have so much revenue to spend doesn't mean that Motorola is going to do any better than they have for the last ten years.
So If in July Apple releases a dual 1.2 MHZ G4 we will hear nothing but complaining about the measly increase when everyone was expecting more. I'd say we'll be lucky to get to 1.5GHZ by the end of the year. I see no reason to expect a 40% increase in clock frequency in 5 months. Sorry to be harsh but the best predictor of the future is the past.
[ 03-31-2002: Message edited by: spindler ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Personally, I'd expect dual 1.2 g4s aswell, but I can see alot depends upon Motorola introducing their new technology's. The move to 0.13 Apollo could easily bring G4's up to 1.6GHZ and above, and a change inn architecture could yield 2GHZ, aka 7500. But I think MWNY is too early for this, I believe, albeit from rumour sites, that the 0.13 move comes in August/September and the 7500 comes in Jan/Feb 2003.
However 1.4 is not a pipe dream, because for Apple to offer dual 1GHZ at present must mean that yields are pretty good at 1GHZ, no doubt there could have been a mid range machine at single processor 1.2GHZ or thereabouts, if the line had followed the prevous pattern of 733/867/2x800. If Apple reverted to this style, I could see maybe 1GHZ/1.4GHZ/Dual 1.2 or maybe even 1GHZ/1.2/Dual 1.4 if yields were really good.
But then as always, Apple will want to maximise profits, so there will be no great increase in MHZ,
I expect 1.2, 1.4 and dual 1.4
The ready availability of the 1ghz chip and by all accounts it was ready long before Apple announced it means that Moto has had plenty of time to scale production of higher speed chips. In fact some one at Apple said that there was a lot more to come from the G4.
Oh and one more thing... 10.2 see how fast it is.
We really haven't seen anything happen to OS X for a long time (I don't count 10.1.3, as it didn't really do anything) and as it is, it is only half finished. So many options are greyed out that I cannot believe that they havn't been working hard to finish off. I think the timeing is now right for a new quantium leap. I hope we can down-load the installer-updater. Software update is OK but I don't want to have to download it for each machine, once is fine.
They'll be lowering the price because the 2.8 and 3Ghz chips with on die 802.11b system and antenna, integrated on die graphics control and support for 1200Mhz RDRAM will be coming out August-September time frame.
Hey Apple, what are you planning?
"we don't comment on future products"
makes it hard for a business to plan IT purchasing, and very easy to go with Wintel.
That said, I'm not expecting anything more than dual 1.2GHZ G4s at the high end. Moving to the HiP7 (.13u) process should make this clock speed easily attainable. I would be floored if Apple were to ship dual 1.4GHZ G4s, especially with a new DDR based motherboard. Also, the die shrunk .13u G4s might very well include twice the onboard L2 cache. Either way, dual 1.2GHZ G4s (or higher) is sufficiently faster than what I'm using now, so I'll upgrade either way.
On a side note, I agree with JasonPP's comments regarding Apple's "we don't comment on future products" policy. This is great for consumer trade shows, but it's a poor policy for any type of stategic planning. However, based on Apple's product announcements, it's clear that the consumer market, rather than the corporate market, is Apple's target.
Steve
<strong> Just because Intel and AMD can keep pumping up the MHZ because they have so much revenue to spend doesn't mean that Motorola is going to do any better than they have for the last ten years.
[ 03-31-2002: Message edited by: spindler ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't think this is fair. I would be surprised if Motorolla makes much less on the 5% of processors it sells to Apple then the 15% of processors AMD ships. AMD is in a price war with intel. Motorolla has fat profit margins on its chips to Apple and the ones it sells as DSPs. I don't imagine their research dollars could be that much different than AMDs. Intel is a whole other story I suppose.
1982 - too!
[ 04-02-2002: Message edited by: iDome ]</p>
[ 04-02-2002: Message edited by: little mouse ]</p>