This story illustrates that the company building Apple's products doesn't have to be based in the country where the labour is found. This means, for example, that Apple could start a company in China or Vietnam and hire a million people. Why doesn't Apple do that? Probably because Apple would be skewered for hiring people using local wage rates and labour practices. Apple wants plausible deniability.
No, it's because Apple isn't a manufacturing company nor does it want to be.
So you are hypothesizing that the $2/hour rate of pay in China is not a valid reason Apple pays them to manufacture their goods. If you are right, then why doesn't Apple insist on paying them the same minimum wage as US workers?
No, I'm saying Apple isn't a manufacturing company nor does it want to be. The sentence is super clear.
As for payment. I, like you, don't know the details of Apple's contracts with their manufactures. Also like you, I don't now how much people working on making Apple products are compensated and if that compensations os above or below market rate. Unlike you, I'm not going to speculate wildly.
I notice the guy who always argues with me and swears at me is sticking up for you. At least you are polite, like me, so I credit you with that. But my questions are polite and sincere. Do you think that the low wages are a factor in Apple's choice of manufacturers? If not, why doesn't Apple insist on fair wages by US standards? I'm polite and I'm sincere and I'm just trying to understand your point of view.
I just noticed a second person who has a deep hatred of me advising you not to talk to me. I guess some people can't face simple facts that come from the New York Times.
My comments was about why Apple doesn't do manufacturing. Questions about why Apple choses the manufactures they do isn't related to the subject I commented on. You seem really eager to have a discussion on wages in China and I hope you find someone that want's to indulge you with that.
Also, a side note. Based on The NY Times article, people making Apple products aren't making two dollars an hour as you suggested. Two dollars an hour doesn't even meet the minimum wage in China though I suspect you rounded down rather than say 2.10. Anyway, the article says they are paying 3.15 an hour which is 150% of minimum wage in China.
I paused the video on a iJustine unboxing, and the box still says Made in China. Very much possible that it is made in mixed countries some in China some in Vietnam, or review boxes are China, and consumer versions are Vietnam. just like some Nike models.
This story illustrates that the company building Apple's products doesn't have to be based in the country where the labour is found. This means, for example, that Apple could start a company in China or Vietnam and hire a million people. Why doesn't Apple do that? Probably because Apple would be skewered for hiring people using local wage rates and labour practices. Apple wants plausible deniability.
No, it's because Apple isn't a manufacturing company nor does it want to be.
So you are hypothesizing that the $2/hour rate of pay in China is not a valid reason Apple pays them to manufacture their goods. If you are right, then why doesn't Apple insist on paying them the same minimum wage as US workers?
No, I'm saying Apple isn't a manufacturing company nor does it want to be. The sentence is super clear.
As for payment. I, like you, don't know the details of Apple's contracts with their manufactures. Also like you, I don't now how much people working on making Apple products are compensated and if that compensations os above or below market rate. Unlike you, I'm not going to speculate wildly.
I notice the guy who always argues with me and swears at me is sticking up for you. At least you are polite, like me, so I credit you with that. But my questions are polite and sincere. Do you think that the low wages are a factor in Apple's choice of manufacturers? If not, why doesn't Apple insist on fair wages by US standards? I'm polite and I'm sincere and I'm just trying to understand your point of view.
I just noticed a second person who has a deep hatred of me advising you not to talk to me. I guess some people can't face simple facts that come from the New York Times.
Just on the bolded part - Could it be because it does not make sense economically? For example, why should Apple insist to Foxconn/Wistron/Pegatron on paying say $5000 dollar (US standard) equivalent in local currency as monthly salary for an iPhone assembly job in India when there would be many people willing to do that job for one tenth of that amount (say $500 equivalent in local currency)? Why should Apple pay the contract manufacturer ten times than what is the minimum required to get the job done and pass-on the additional cost to buyers of their products? How would that make them competitive in the market?
Isn't it one of the key reasons (along with Infrastructure, availability of skilled labor) why the manufacturing is spread out all over the world, wherever the products can be manufactured at the lowest cost possible? Why would they keep that manufacturing work outside of US, if they can get it done in US itself for the same amount? If you think through this further, it would be clear that it does not make economic sense. Apple can and does insist on fair wages by the local standards in which their contract manufacturers operate and rightly so.
Without disputing your basic point, there is more to it than simply labor costs
Apple has said repeatedly that cost is not their only concern. Apparently, quality and reliability are major factors in deciding who and where is chosen. They could build a plant in the middle of some desert and hire some cheap, uneducated, unskilled labor but it wouldn't have the support systems to make it reliable and viable over the long run.
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Ohhhhh... don't get me started on Common Core! An absolute atrocity which needs to be expunged from every school system in the country. My children are being indoctrinated in this dribble and I spend far too much time explaining how to do "real math". Without exception, EVERY teacher I have spoken to agrees with me, but they are stuck as common core is a required part of the curriculum. The reading is no better... My children have learned more about reading, writing and arithmetic than from the schools. THAT is the crucial factor... Involved parents. Bloody common core idiots need to be taken out and shot for all the damage they have caused.
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Ohhhhh... don't get me started on Common Core! An absolute atrocity which needs to be expunged from every school system in the country. My children are being indoctrinated in this dribble and I spend far too much time explaining how to do "real math". Without exception, EVERY teacher I have spoken to agrees with me, but they are stuck as common core is a required part of the curriculum. The reading is no better... My children have learned more about reading, writing and arithmetic than from the schools. THAT is the crucial factor... Involved parents. Bloody common core idiots need to be taken out and shot for all the damage they have caused.
Yes, involved parents are always the key to a kid's education. Well,, that and a good choice in friends. I was fortunate to have both.
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Ohhhhh... don't get me started on Common Core! An absolute atrocity which needs to be expunged from every school system in the country. My children are being indoctrinated in this dribble and I spend far too much time explaining how to do "real math". Without exception, EVERY teacher I have spoken to agrees with me, but they are stuck as common core is a required part of the curriculum. The reading is no better... My children have learned more about reading, writing and arithmetic than from the schools. THAT is the crucial factor... Involved parents. Bloody common core idiots need to be taken out and shot for all the damage they have caused.
Common Core Math is not math. It is application of math. This is a job for other disciplines. I think it is important for other classes to synchronize with math teachings. If a student cannot do arithmetic correctly and efficiently, how can he/she spend money wisely?
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Because of the failure of China in industrialization, the Chinese culture has been looked down by many westerners. They laughed at Confucius. Thus the western intellectuals failed to notice that Confucius is being revered as the greatest educator. His birthday is celebrated as a holiday for teachers. Maybe his teachings are outdated. But the spirit of regarding knowledge as utmost important for kids have been preserved by Asian countries. The parents push their kids in learning and enrolling in best schools. This tradition is built in Chinese culture even CCP cannot erase it. American education system cannot provide enough best engineers for the largest economy of the world. American born engineers are outnumbered by engineer from foreign countries especially India, China, and everywhere else. Trump did not understand this. He wasted US four years by focusing on China trade. US democracy is a system that cannot admit its own problems instead using foreign governments as scapegoat. The news about an alleged Chinese woman spy is just a tactic used by Republicans shifting political attention to China. This is utterly stupid. Of course, China will like to influence US opinion, but China has no capacity to cause US problems as these Republicans such as Pompeio claimed repeatedly.
Some posters are ignorant about the manufacturing process. It still needs engineers. It is reported that Vietnam cannot provide enough engineers. And the Vietnamese engineers pay is more than Chinese engineers.
That is perhaps one of the reasons the U.S. revamped its education system with common core and related testing: For too long U.S. schools were pushing out kids who could barely read, write or do math thinking they would get a good union job in the mill. Meanwhile, Asian countries (Japan at the time) were churning out high quality engineers. The U.S. went a long way to improving its public education system (It's up to about #36 now), but now it needs to work on its higher education systems that are becoming unaffordably expensive.
The need for uneducated or poorly educated labor will continue to shrink as automation takes over. Who ever would have thought that drivers of long haul trucks would soon be as obsolete as candle makers?
Because of the failure of China in industrialization, the Chinese culture has been looked down by many westerners. They laughed at Confucius. Thus the western intellectuals failed to notice that Confucius is being revered as the greatest educator. His birthday is celebrated as a holiday for teachers. Maybe his teachings are outdated. But the spirit of regarding knowledge as utmost important for kids have been preserved by Asian countries. The parents push their kids in learning and enrolling in best schools. This tradition is built in Chinese culture even CCP cannot erase it. American education system cannot provide enough best engineers for the largest economy of the world. American born engineers are outnumbered by engineer from foreign countries especially India, China, and everywhere else. Trump did not understand this. He wasted US four years by focusing on China trade. US democracy is a system that cannot admit its own problems instead using foreign governments as scapegoat. The news about an alleged Chinese woman spy is just a tactic used by Republicans shifting political attention to China. This is utterly stupid. Of course, China will like to influence US opinion, but China has no capacity to cause US problems as these Republicans such as Pompeio claimed repeatedly.
Yes, instead of strengthening U.S. education Trump and his shill DeVos weakened it. But even without that, there are ongoing attacks against public schools in the U.S. which, 100 some years ago was one of the things that attracted immigrants to this country.
Meanwhile, in the last proficiency tests, China crushed the U.S.
The U.S. needs to step up its game. More than at anytime in the history of the world, an educated workforce will be key to a nation's future success.
Comments
My comments was about why Apple doesn't do manufacturing. Questions about why Apple choses the manufactures they do isn't related to the subject I commented on. You seem really eager to have a discussion on wages in China and I hope you find someone that want's to indulge you with that.
Also, a side note. Based on The NY Times article, people making Apple products aren't making two dollars an hour as you suggested. Two dollars an hour doesn't even meet the minimum wage in China though I suspect you rounded down rather than say 2.10. Anyway, the article says they are paying 3.15 an hour which is 150% of minimum wage in China.
Very much possible that it is made in mixed countries some in China some in Vietnam, or review boxes are China, and consumer versions are Vietnam.
just like some Nike models.
Because of the failure of China in industrialization, the Chinese culture has been looked down by many westerners. They laughed at Confucius. Thus the western intellectuals failed to notice that Confucius is being revered as the greatest educator. His birthday is celebrated as a holiday for teachers. Maybe his teachings are outdated. But the spirit of regarding knowledge as utmost important for kids have been preserved by Asian countries. The parents push their kids in learning and enrolling in best schools. This tradition is built in Chinese culture even CCP cannot erase it.
American education system cannot provide enough best engineers for the largest economy of the world. American born engineers are outnumbered by engineer from foreign countries especially India, China, and everywhere else.
Trump did not understand this. He wasted US four years by focusing on China trade. US democracy is a system that cannot admit its own problems instead using foreign governments as scapegoat. The news about an alleged Chinese woman spy is just a tactic used by Republicans shifting political attention to China. This is utterly stupid. Of course, China will like to influence US opinion, but China has no capacity to cause US problems as these Republicans such as Pompeio claimed repeatedly.