Apple ditches physical SIM cards from all US iPhone 14 models

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 41
    kpomkpom Posts: 657member
    ralphie said:
    Getting rid of the SIM tray is a stupid move. In a world of open standards, where SIM cards are still used everywhere in the world, why move to esims only? 
    Perhaps to reduce costs, simplify design, and make the phone more water resistant? Which of these reasons makes no sense to you?
    Tray is still there is EVERY country outside US. So none of your hypothesis hold any validity.  The move ONLY serves US carrier interests.
    Apple has 50% market share in the US and has more sway with carriers than in other countries. Most likely Apple told them they were going eSIM-only and that they needed to get with the program.
    edited September 7 doozydozenronnStrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 41
    Great!  With the room they saved, maybe they could put the headphone jack back... ;)
    darkvaderretrogusto
  • Reply 23 of 41
    Getting rid of the SIM tray is a stupid move. In a world of open standards, where SIM cards are still used everywhere in the world, why move to esims only? The old model where you had both esim and physical SIM tray was the best option and gave customers choice. Apple's reasoning around multiple esims and security is nonsense. They could have multiple esims and a physical SIM tray if they wanted. If people wanted security then use an esim, if they wanted convenience then use their physical SIM card.
    I wonder if this move is related to Apple bowing to pressure from US carriers who don't want people to avoid roaming costs by using a local country SIM card when they travel? If so, it opens up another antitrust issue that Apple could do without.
    Are you still hurting from when the headphone plug was removed from iPhones? Or maybe the home button fingerprint detector? I'm sure you resent having to buy a $15 USB-C dock in order to add SDHC card slots, USB-3 ports, HDMI output.   Hey, YOU can still get the iPhone 13 lineup. Or a SE, lol. But I'll happily send you to GTFO with a nice Samsung where you should be safe for at least a year. 
    doozydozenronnStrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 41
    So iPhone 14 can have multiple phone numbers with multiple cellular providers?
    This has been true of iPhones since the XS.
    I want a Verizon phone number as well as an AT&T number.
    I have that on my iPhone 11 Pro for 2 years now.  Personal is Verizon and Work is AT&T.  Only downside has been impact on battery life since phone is always seeking out both networks - solved with Smart Battery Case.  Looking forward to this iPhone 14 Pro upgrade!
    doozydozenretrogustowatto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 41
    mpantonempantone Posts: 1,934member
    The biggest problem with this decision is that some American iPhone users can't upgrade because Apple will not sell an iPhone 14 with a physical SIM card tray to Americans.

    For example, Mint Mobile only supports physical SIM cards right now. Hopefully these carriers (they're all MVNOs) will eventually add eSIM support for customer retention. Right now their customers can't buy the new iPhone 14 models without jumping ship.

    But the fact remains that without a SIM card tray, that limits all carrier usage (both US domestic and international) to those companies that support eSIMs. 
    edited September 7 retrogusto
  • Reply 26 of 41
    ralphie said:
    Getting rid of the SIM tray is a stupid move. In a world of open standards, where SIM cards are still used everywhere in the world, why move to esims only? 
    Perhaps to reduce costs, simplify design, and make the phone more water resistant? Which of these reasons makes no sense to you?
    Tray is still there is EVERY country outside US. So none of your hypothesis hold any validity.  The move ONLY serves US carrier interests.
    So you've already checked that these foreign versions aren't a bit more expensive? I would confidently state that the internal design is more complex, and there is certainly another potential place for water to leak in.    In any case Apple again pushes the envelope towards a superior way of doing things, and they move the industry with high end phones.
    Madbumwatto_cobra
  • Reply 27 of 41
    netroxnetrox Posts: 1,266member
    ralphie said:
    I think the whole no sim tray is a deal made with US carriers to force you into their high priced roaming when traveling.  Should be investigated.
    Just no.

    I want convenience of SIM being activated from home and I want my phone tracked if it's stolen. I want my phone to be free from specific carriers. I want to have more than one plan. I want the freedom that eSIM offers. 

    Criminals hate that. What good is the new iPhone if they cannot sell it or can be tracked? 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 41
    It will be a problem for some users. For example my brother in-law travels back to the Philippines regularly and you can't use eSIM except with Post-paid plans. Roaming on Verizon is very expensive so not having that option is tough. He will have to hold off on upgrading until there is support for the eSIM on prepaid type plans there. As others stated hopefully this will push the providers to move towards that.
    Calamanderbubblefreewatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 41
    Getting rid of the SIM tray is a stupid move. In a world of open standards, where SIM cards are still used everywhere in the world, why move to esims only? 
    Perhaps to reduce costs, simplify design, and make the phone more water resistant? Which of these reasons makes no sense to you?
    Er... all of them. Reduce costs - negligible in a phone which costs $1000. Simplify design - Sim tray is still being used in EVERY other market apart from USA. Design is the same. Make Phone more water resistant - iPhone 13 is already very water resistant.
    This isn't about any of these things OR the stuff Apple is saying (Security or using multiple esims). This is simply about control. GSM became the overriding technical standard over CDMA because it allowed people to choose which service they wanted to use without the carrier getting involved. Buy a SIM and put it in your phone. Apple is now trying to reassert this control into its products. Trouble is it will be years (if ever) before the rest of the world follows. Mention esim in most developed countries and they look at you like you are an alien. This isn't about what is right for Apple's customers but what is right for Apple's commercial partners - the mobile carriers.
    muthuk_vanalingamCalamanderdarkvaderretrogustoelijahg
  • Reply 30 of 41
    whodiini said:
    so i need to buy an iphone 14 outside the US to be able to use it traveling outside the US?
    *SNIP*

    The iPhone 13 and 14 both support dual ACTIVE eSIMs,*SNIP*
    Are you 100% sure of that? The reason I ask is because I did not hear Apple saying this in their presentation.

    Where I am (and maybe elsewhere too) people use at least two numbers on one phone, one for work and one for personal use; and both are active at the same time. This feature, if available with just eSIMs would be a boon for such people.

    Thanks and cheers
    Calamanderwatto_cobra
  • Reply 31 of 41
    Amazing how Apple is now using its monopoly just like Microsoft used to - doing things that are good for corporate and carriers and bad for customers. 

    Maybe they have a secret plan on how to usurp the carriers with this - who knows. 

    But on paper, it makes no sense whatsoever, so they are clearly lying about the reasons they're doing it. 

    They're also making an iPhone a bad choice for travelers. It's the all in one approach where you're married to a US carrier and if you wanna leave the country well you better pay for the roaming plan! 

    I am in Asia, no way you can get an eSim for travelers. 

    The SIM card empowers the user, the carrier has no say in what phone you use, neither does the manufacturer of the phone. It's a standard and I can buy a SIM card and use it however I want. Carriers and manufacturers support the SIM standard. 

    I had an eSim on my XS when it first came out. Then I got an 11 pro - turns out the eSIM is married to the phone and can't be transferred. Apple has a transfer eSim function, except it doesn't work. It told me I have to go to a service office of my carrier to transfer the number. Meaning - total carrier control! No thanks. I eventually ditched the number and got a physical SIM card, after keeping the XS forever just for that eSim phone number which I needed for banking. I was out of the country. So basically this prevented me from selling the phone. 

    eSim may be OK if its is under full user control - it's basically just permission to access the network, the same as a SIM card. But there would need to be standards. And they don't exist, so currently eSim is the worst of all worlds - you are now controlled by both Apple and the carrier! 

    Think you can transfer your eSim to a device not made by Apple? Fat chance of that. Not gonna happen. One more lock on your Apple prison door. 

    I won't be affected since I will be getting an overseas version, but so far I believe this is a very bad move from Apple.

    I am wondering about the true motives. So far - I don't know. Saving that tiny bit of space - not it. Apple carrier - maybe. 
    edited September 8 darkvaderbubblefree
  • Reply 32 of 41

    You cannot get a LOCAL prepaid / pay as you go plan on an eSIM in most of the world.

    Let me clarify why this is a problem for travelers. Yes, you can get data plans on eSIM that work while you travel but these are through MVNO operators that piggyback on local networks. They can be challenging to get setup, performance can be inconsistent, and you need to register on their app and be tracked, usually pay more than a local plan, and if something goes wrong it can be difficult to get corrected. Additionally, most of these services do not include a local phone number.

    This is all more stress than is needed.

    Many of us that travel prefer to go to a local mobile service provider, purchase a prepaid / pay as you go SIM, and pop it in our phone. Usually, the store clerk will help get it set up in a few minutes. If there is a problem, you can just pop back in a store and get it fixed.

    I doubt saving space is the primary reason Apple is doing this. It is likely so they can monetize the eSIM. Imagine Apple telling carriers that they will not provision their plans on iPhones unless they give Apple a cut of the cellular service revenue. This would eventually drive up the cost of cell phone service and limit consumer choices. I do not understand how consumers can think any of this is a good.

    Taking away the ability to put a local SIM in my phone is absolutely a deal breaker.

    retrogustomuthuk_vanalingambubblefree
  • Reply 33 of 41

    It looks like the Canadian models contain all the LTE & 5G bands as the US models, but also have a physical SIM card tray. I live in the US, an hour away from the Canadian border. Am I correct in thinking that I could go to Canada, buy an unlocked iPhone over there for full price, use it at home here in the United States, and only be giving up mmWave capabilities? 

    jddesouza
  • Reply 34 of 41
    Two steps forward, one step back.

    When I travel for extended periods, I usually get a pre-paid SIM card with a local plan. I guess I can look into getting a non-US model when the time comes. 

    At first I assumed it was a case of Apple “courage,” like getting rid of USB-A on Macs while it was still the predominant standard but no longer state-of-the-art, to force the industry by putting their customers in an awkward situation for leverage. But if all of the big US carriers already support eSIM, why eliminate eSIM only for the US market? To hurt smaller US carriers? Why not sell an unlocked version with SIM for those who want it, since they already make them, and sell SIM-free versions through the carriers if they want to? The roaming theory may be correct, but it seems like a stretch.

    An iPhone is like the Swiss Army knife of electronic devices, but it’s jarring when they remove highly useful features. 
    muthuk_vanalingambubblefree
  • Reply 35 of 41
    netrox said:
    ralphie said:
    I think the whole no sim tray is a deal made with US carriers to force you into their high priced roaming when traveling.  Should be investigated.
    Just no.

    I want convenience of SIM being activated from home and I want my phone tracked if it's stolen. I want my phone to be free from specific carriers. I want to have more than one plan. I want the freedom that eSIM offers. 

    Criminals hate that. What good is the new iPhone if they cannot sell it or can be tracked? 
    "The freedom that eSIM offers"?!? What freedom is that? Freedom to have to use Apple software to add or change any eSIM? The freedom to be able to only use foreign carriers that support eSIM when travelling? (of which there are very very few) The freedom to not be able to add a physical SIM card from almost any network carrier on the planet because your phone doesn't have a SIM tray?
    Apple created Find My to stop phones being stolen and used by thieves. It doesn't work. The thieves simply found a way around it. I know because my daughters iPhone was stolen this year and showed up in China being used. What makes you think that eSIM's will stop phone theft. Chances are they won't and like Find My they won't stop thieves.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 36 of 41
    mpantone said:
    The biggest problem with this decision is that some American iPhone users can't upgrade because Apple will not sell an iPhone 14 with a physical SIM card tray to Americans.

    For example, Mint Mobile only supports physical SIM cards right now. Hopefully these carriers (they're all MVNOs) will eventually add eSIM support for customer retention. Right now their customers can't buy the new iPhone 14 models without jumping ship.

    But the fact remains that without a SIM card tray, that limits all carrier usage (both US domestic and international) to those companies that support eSIMs. 
    I don't think that's correct. From Mint's website:

    https://www.mintmobile.com/faqs/is-my-phone-compatible-with-esim/

    ...I ran it for the iPhone 13 (they don't have 14 listed yet) and got this: "Get excited. Your Apple iPhone 13 Pro has an eSIM and qualifies for free digital delivery."
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 37 of 41
    Amazing how Apple is now using its monopoly just like Microsoft used to - doing things that are good for corporate and carriers and bad for customers. 
    ERRRNT. Apple doesn't have anything close to a monopoly market share on smartphones. Try again.

    I've seen no evidence this change somehow locks you in to Apple-only devices as you speculate. I'm sure you can still switch to another device and keep your number, etc.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 38 of 41
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,834moderator
    mpantone said:
    The biggest problem with this decision is that some American iPhone users can't upgrade because Apple will not sell an iPhone 14 with a physical SIM card tray to Americans.

    For example, Mint Mobile only supports physical SIM cards right now. Hopefully these carriers (they're all MVNOs) will eventually add eSIM support for customer retention. Right now their customers can't buy the new iPhone 14 models without jumping ship.

    But the fact remains that without a SIM card tray, that limits all carrier usage (both US domestic and international) to those companies that support eSIMs. 
    They have a page for eSim plans here:
     
    https://www.mintmobile.com/esim/
    https://coveragecritic.com/2021/01/15/mint-mobile-officially-launches-esim/

    Apple has probably given carriers a heads up for a while and they have a customer base of over 1 billion users, which gives them some leverage to push for support.

    Physical sim is like VGA or floppy disks, if they keep putting it in the hardware, carriers won't stop using it and they need to stop using these archaic standards. People shouldn't have to go into a store to get connected to the internet.

    There have been many times there was little support for an emerging standard (USB-C being another example) and Apple is the company that pushes people to adopt the new standard. There's usually some headache along the way because other companies stubbornly stick to the status quo but give it a couple of years and Apple's huge userbase will be pushing carriers to support eSim or they'll lose business to the carriers who do offer support.
    StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 39 of 41
    MadbumMadbum Posts: 299member
    Amazing how Apple is now using its monopoly just like Microsoft used to - doing things that are good for corporate and carriers and bad for customers. 

    Maybe they have a secret plan on how to usurp the carriers with this - who knows. 

    But on paper, it makes no sense whatsoever, so they are clearly lying about the reasons they're doing it. 

    They're also making an iPhone a bad choice for travelers. It's the all in one approach where you're married to a US carrier and if you wanna leave the country well you better pay for the roaming plan! 

    I am in Asia, no way you can get an eSim for travelers. 

    The SIM card empowers the user, the carrier has no say in what phone you use, neither does the manufacturer of the phone. It's a standard and I can buy a SIM card and use it however I want. Carriers and manufacturers support the SIM standard. 

    I had an eSim on my XS when it first came out. Then I got an 11 pro - turns out the eSIM is married to the phone and can't be transferred. Apple has a transfer eSim function, except it doesn't work. It told me I have to go to a service office of my carrier to transfer the number. Meaning - total carrier control! No thanks. I eventually ditched the number and got a physical SIM card, after keeping the XS forever just for that eSim phone number which I needed for banking. I was out of the country. So basically this prevented me from selling the phone. 

    eSim may be OK if its is under full user control - it's basically just permission to access the network, the same as a SIM card. But there would need to be standards. And they don't exist, so currently eSim is the worst of all worlds - you are now controlled by both Apple and the carrier! 

    Think you can transfer your eSim to a device not made by Apple? Fat chance of that. Not gonna happen. One more lock on your Apple prison door. 

    I won't be affected since I will be getting an overseas version, but so far I believe this is a very bad move from Apple.

    I am wondering about the true motives. So far - I don't know. Saving that tiny bit of space - not it. Apple carrier - maybe. 
    Did you write the same post 6 years ago when they took out the head phone jack.


    watto_cobra
  • Reply 40 of 41
    Amazing how Apple is now using its monopoly just like Microsoft used to - doing things that are good for corporate and carriers and bad for customers. 
    ERRRNT. Apple doesn't have anything close to a monopoly market share on smartphones. Try again.

    I've seen no evidence this change somehow locks you in to Apple-only devices as you speculate. I'm sure you can still switch to another device and keep your number, etc.
    Sure you can, BUT that requires carrier intervention.  With physical sim you simply swap it into another device.  If your eSim device dies, you’re SOL without the convenience of sim swap.

    Also since the eSim can’t be removed, you can be tracked continuously. With eSim you’re giving up a lot of anonymity, and very few prepaid carriers offer eSim.
    edited September 9 elijahg
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