Apple rumored to pick and choose which markets will get sideloading in iOS 17

Posted:
in iOS
A new report from a reliable leaker thinks that sideloading may not even be mentioned at WWDC, and the company is rumored to limit the feature to regions that have laws requiring it.

App Store
App Store


The company is working on such features, allowing users to install apps outside Apple's App Store in iOS 17. However, Apple is doing it solely to comply with European regulations and may not introduce sideloading in other markets.

Bloomberg's Mark Gurman sat down with MacRumors to discuss features in the next generations of Apple operating systems. Along with changes to the Wallet and Find My apps, they discussed the topic of sideloading.

"I think it will be a Europe-only feature," Gurman said. "I think that they're not going to shoot themselves in the foot and expand this globally if they don't have to."

"They're not gonna do anything extraneous that would further hurt their grip on the App Store," he continued. "They're really going to stick to the letter of the law here."

Gurman believes that Apple may charge developers to be part of the sideloading program, using a process based on configuration profiles. The company may also have a review process for these apps, even though they would be installed outside of the App Store.

The Digital Markets Act

Europe approved the Digital Markets Act rules in July 2022, and they entered into force in November. The rules will be applicable starting on May 2, 2023.

The Act aims to force businesses like Apple to provide substitutes to permit third-party app stores on their platforms and alternate payment mechanisms.

"We expect the consequences to be significant," said Gerard de Graaf, an EU official who helped pass the DMA. "If you have an iPhone, you should be able to download apps not just from the App Store but from other app stores or from the internet."

The EU determines which businesses are significant and well-known enough to be categorized as "gatekeepers." De Graaf said he expects approximately a dozen companies to be affected, including Apple.

According to the European Parliament, a gatekeeper must offer browsers, messaging services, or social media and have at least 45 million monthly end users in the EU. Additionally, they must have a market cap of at least 75 billion euros ($82 billion), 10,000 annual business users, or a yearly revenue of 7.5 billion euros ($8.2 billion).

Since the EU created and passed the law, that's where Apple might contain sideloading and not bring it to US customers or elsewhere. Gurman also expects Apple to downplay sideloading and not mention it as a feature at WWDC.

Apple will announce the next versions of iOS and macOS in June. Rumors include a journaling app, a redesigned Control Center, and many more possible features.

Read on AppleInsider

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 19
    twolf2919twolf2919 Posts: 112member
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    edited April 2023 MacProstrongywatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 19
    xyzzy-xxxxyzzy-xxx Posts: 185member
    twolf2919 said:
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    Side loading works great on the Mac as long as you only load software with a valid developer certificate. I expect the same on iOS. If you believe that the App Store protects you from malware you are just wrong. The App Store review process is great to enforce the rules defined by Apple on how apps should behave and on content restrictions, but any well hidden malware would not be detected.
    Oferlkruppbyronlwilliamlondon
  • Reply 3 of 19
    JapheyJaphey Posts: 1,767member
    twolf2919 said:
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    Yes, that would be nice. It might be wishful thinking, however, since it’s impossible to predict the chaos that will ensue once the genie is out of the bottle. The warning popups are a sure thing, though Apple may have to do much more than that to educate its users on potential pitfalls. 
    radarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 4 of 19
    Be interesting to see how many in the EU sideload a Pegasus app. 
    radarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 5 of 19
    I would just assume that they would limit it to markets where it is legally required unless they figured out a way to make it even more profitable than the current model.
  • Reply 6 of 19
    boboliciousbobolicious Posts: 1,148member
    ... at last check was Apple the one bypassing user VPN and privacy settings to scrape data within what has been called a secure or 'walled garden'...?

    gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-ipad-privacy-problems-data-gathering-1849855092/slides/9#replies
    gizmodo.com/apple-iphone-analytics-tracking-even-when-off-app-store-1849757558


    edited April 2023 byronlwilliamlondon
  • Reply 7 of 19
    The Mac doesn’t have side loading. You can choose to get your apps wherever you want, from anywhere, signed apps, or Apple App Store only. This isn’t side loading. 

    Is it Apple going to choose what markets get this for iOS Apps, or is it just just normal Apple slowly rolling out features? 

    People forget that the Mac has more malware than iOS versions when they say you can still get malware from Apple App Store. 
    edited April 2023 watto_cobra
  • Reply 8 of 19
    I wonder if this will provide an advantage to EU companies and developers. It seems EU policy changes in past have contained bias. Apple and others will of course conform, but I seriously believe this will not be good for the vast majority of iOS users.
    williamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 19
    kkqd1337kkqd1337 Posts: 432member
    I have been doing this on windows since 1992 and never had a problem 
    byronlwilliamlondonbeowulfschmidt
  • Reply 10 of 19
    xyzzy-xxx said:
    twolf2919 said:
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    Side loading works great on the Mac as long as you only load software with a valid developer certificate. I expect the same on iOS. If you believe that the App Store protects you from malware you are just wrong. The App Store review process is great to enforce the rules defined by Apple on how apps should behave and on content restrictions, but any well hidden malware would not be detected.
    Side loading works great on a Mac because you can install endpoint protection tools to help you fight malware. You can’t do that (yet) on iOS, or at least the available tools don’t have the deep level of access to iOS that they would need to be able to be as effective. I can only imagine the battery killer that something like Symantec would be on your iPhone as it constantly scans for malicious software. The App Store does protect you from malware and shitty apps, not 100%, but way better than Android’s wild, wild, west app stores.

    Ultimately mobile and desktop are NOT the same and should not be treated as such.

    I appreciate Apple’s “walled garden” and use it for that reason. If I wanted my device to be riddled with crapware and full of additional attack vectors for malicious actors I would have chosen Android.
    williamlondonradarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 11 of 19
    davidwdavidw Posts: 2,065member
    xyzzy-xxx said:
    twolf2919 said:
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    Side loading works great on the Mac as long as you only load software with a valid developer certificate. I expect the same on iOS. If you believe that the App Store protects you from malware you are just wrong. The App Store review process is great to enforce the rules defined by Apple on how apps should behave and on content restrictions, but any well hidden malware would not be detected.
    That is like saying we don't need child-proof caps on our prescription medicine bottles, so long as we keep our medicine bottles away from kids. Security should be geared toward protecting the most vulnerable, not toward the ones that knows better.  One can still install malware unknowingly on a Mac by clicking on an email link or a link on a website. It is almost impossible to install malware this way on your iPhone. But that can change if Apple is forced to allow side loading on iOS. Once Apple puts in the door, hackers and scammers will find a way to get their malware into your devices, using that door. No matter how many locks Apple puts  on that door. The hardest part for the hackers and scammers before, was installing a door.

    Desktop OS's are originally designed from the ground up to allow users to install software from many sources, despite any decrease in security. (Remember how computers were infected by viruses by using infected floppies?)  Desktop computers were around before the internet. IOS was designed from the ground up with security in mind and only allowed software to be installed from just one secure source, for the sake of a more secure ecosystem. It's not perfect but way more secure that allowing side loading.

    Why don't you compare iOS (which don't allow side loading) to Android (which do allow side loading) and claim that side loading works great on Android devices?  Both are designed for today's more modern mobile devices. And today's modern mobile devices needs to be more secure than even today's desktop, not just as secure.
    edited April 2023 watto_cobra
  • Reply 12 of 19
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,855moderator
    twolf2919 said:
    If side loading becomes a reality, I hope Apple insists on putting up a clear warning dialog whenever a user tries to side load an application.  The EU doesn't seem to give a sh1t about the safety/security of naive users who, until this becomes available, relied on Apple to keep them secure from malicious apps.  I can already see the Safari popups inviting users to download a cool free app from lord-knows-where.   A warning that they're about to install an application from a potentially dangerous source should be done for sure.  It would be even nicer if Apple required all apps - side loaded or not - to go through the Apple review process or at least be signed with a valid certificate so there's at least traceability.

    Go through the app review process at a cost, that at least covers employee pay and other expenses Apple incurs. Play-to-Side-Play.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 13 of 19
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,855moderator
    JP234 said:
    If Eurozone governments want to mandate Apple to allow sideload apps, let 'em. In fact, if anyone chooses to sideload apps, let 'em.

    We all have choices, and as long as the App Store is open, that's where I choose to shop.
    That's where you choose to shop until a bunch of the apps you use leave the app store in favor of alternate app stores or direct side-loading.  

    Also, Apple's brand value, currently somewhere north of $100 billion, could be at risk the more side loading is done by naive users.  
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 14 of 19
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,740member
    JP234 said:
    If Eurozone governments want to mandate Apple to allow sideload apps, let 'em. In fact, if anyone chooses to sideload apps, let 'em.

    We all have choices, and as long as the App Store is open, that's where I choose to shop.
    That's where you choose to shop until a bunch of the apps you use leave the app store in favor of alternate app stores or direct side-loading.  

    Also, Apple's brand value, currently somewhere north of $100 billion, could be at risk the more side loading is done by naive users.  
    If you already trust the app, there is a valid argument to be made for downloading it directly from the author's website. Why go through a store and pay a commission? Why be limited to other people's guidelines? 

    One reason would be to be free from the everyday running costs of bandwidth, payment processing etc. In that case, why not simply provide a link to the app in the store of your choice? Your binary, hashed and certified in the store you want to use.

    Users would get the app, unmodified exactly as you provided it. 

    That’s choice. If Apple were to lose out, it would be for a reason. They would then have to consider adapting their ways. Competing. 
  • Reply 15 of 19
    aderutteraderutter Posts: 609member
    There’s a lot of options for Apple.

    At a minimum I expect Apple to still always review apps before providing a signed/certified version to be available for distribution. 

    Where the distribution is outside the app store the developer will have to pay for the review, and may have to choose from a tier of distribution fees, for example pay $1000 for 1000 device installs, or $100k for unlimited installs.

    If people want Apple to be classified as a Gatekeeper then they have to accept Apple acting as a Gatekeeper = reviewing every app. 
    JP234watto_cobra
  • Reply 16 of 19
    davidwdavidw Posts: 2,065member
    avon b7 said:
    JP234 said:
    If Eurozone governments want to mandate Apple to allow sideload apps, let 'em. In fact, if anyone chooses to sideload apps, let 'em.

    We all have choices, and as long as the App Store is open, that's where I choose to shop.
    That's where you choose to shop until a bunch of the apps you use leave the app store in favor of alternate app stores or direct side-loading.  

    Also, Apple's brand value, currently somewhere north of $100 billion, could be at risk the more side loading is done by naive users.  
    If you already trust the app, there is a valid argument to be made for downloading it directly from the author's website. Why go through a store and pay a commission? Why be limited to other people's guidelines? 

    One reason would be to be free from the everyday running costs of bandwidth, payment processing etc. In that case, why not simply provide a link to the app in the store of your choice? Your binary, hashed and certified in the store you want to use.

    Users would get the app, unmodified exactly as you provided it. 

    That’s choice. If Apple were to lose out, it would be for a reason. They would then have to consider adapting their ways. Competing. 
    Apple is competing. Apple competes with Samsung, Xiaomi, Huawei, LG, Oppo, Nokia, Vivo, Google and all the others smartphone brands. Apple iOS competes with all smartphones using Android.

    Your always distorted view of "competing"  and "choice" would force Walmart to allow Costco to sell their Kirkland brand products in Walmart stores. Or force Volkswagen to sell Lexus brand autos in their dealerships.  And neither Walmart or Volkswagen would earn any "commission" for allowing Costco and Ford to use their property to make money. They just have to "compete".

    Oh, I forgot, Walmart and Volkswagen aren't labeled some BS "gatekeeper". Being labeled  a "gatekeeper" means that you are not allow to "compete" using your own IP and must allow others to use your IP for free, in order for them to compete with you. You saying that Apple competitors should be able to make money using Apple iOS, without paying Apple a "commission" is just socialism wanting all the benefits of capitalism, but not willing to pay the price. 

     
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 17 of 19
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,740member
    davidw said:
    avon b7 said:
    JP234 said:
    If Eurozone governments want to mandate Apple to allow sideload apps, let 'em. In fact, if anyone chooses to sideload apps, let 'em.

    We all have choices, and as long as the App Store is open, that's where I choose to shop.
    That's where you choose to shop until a bunch of the apps you use leave the app store in favor of alternate app stores or direct side-loading.  

    Also, Apple's brand value, currently somewhere north of $100 billion, could be at risk the more side loading is done by naive users.  
    If you already trust the app, there is a valid argument to be made for downloading it directly from the author's website. Why go through a store and pay a commission? Why be limited to other people's guidelines? 

    One reason would be to be free from the everyday running costs of bandwidth, payment processing etc. In that case, why not simply provide a link to the app in the store of your choice? Your binary, hashed and certified in the store you want to use.

    Users would get the app, unmodified exactly as you provided it. 

    That’s choice. If Apple were to lose out, it would be for a reason. They would then have to consider adapting their ways. Competing. 
    Apple is competing. Apple competes with Samsung, Xiaomi, Huawei, LG, Oppo, Nokia, Vivo, Google and all the others smartphone brands. Apple iOS competes with all smartphones using Android.

    Your always distorted view of "competing"  and "choice" would force Walmart to allow Costco to sell their Kirkland brand products in Walmart stores. Or force Volkswagen to sell Lexus brand autos in their dealerships.  And neither Walmart or Volkswagen would earn any "commission" for allowing Costco and Ford to use their property to make money. They just have to "compete".

    Oh, I forgot, Walmart and Volkswagen aren't labeled some BS "gatekeeper". Being labeled  a "gatekeeper" means that you are not allow to "compete" using your own IP and must allow others to use your IP for free, in order for them to compete with you. You saying that Apple competitors should be able to make money using Apple iOS, without paying Apple a "commission" is just socialism wanting all the benefits of capitalism, but not willing to pay the price. 

     
    You label my view as 'distorted' but if legislative bodies the world over are leaning in precisely that direction, I must refute that wild claim. 

    Distorted, it is most certainly not. 

    Nor are Walmart or VW even remotely comparable to gatekeepers. 

    When was the last time you bought into a retail system and found yourself limited to just one store?

    You do not pay to enter a Walmart or VW dealership for starters. You do pay to enter the Apple ecosystem. You may argue that the purchase price includes more than access to an online retail store but that is irrelevant.

    The point is it cost money and the user is NEVER clearly made aware of the App Store limitations and restrictions of choice and competition at purchase time. 

    I'm sure that if the user were clearly made aware of those limitations and required to sign off on them, then most of Apple’s problems here would just vanish overnight. 

    Why not give that a go in the name of transparency? What’s there to lose? Most of the people defending Apple on this issue claim that users buy iPhones precisely to have those limitations in place. 

    Well, make it so! Tell the users and let's see how 'in' on the deal they really are. 

    No. Apple would never choose that option because it knows full well it has no ground to stand on. It has laughed all the way to the bank for over a decade until legislation and investigations caught up with it. It will fight and try to thwart efforts to have it open up and that is logical but do you really think everything will stop at the EU? 
  • Reply 18 of 19
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,362member
    avon b7 said:
    davidw said:
    avon b7 said:
    JP234 said:
    If Eurozone governments want to mandate Apple to allow sideload apps, let 'em. In fact, if anyone chooses to sideload apps, let 'em.

    We all have choices, and as long as the App Store is open, that's where I choose to shop.
    That's where you choose to shop until a bunch of the apps you use leave the app store in favor of alternate app stores or direct side-loading.  

    Also, Apple's brand value, currently somewhere north of $100 billion, could be at risk the more side loading is done by naive users.  
    If you already trust the app, there is a valid argument to be made for downloading it directly from the author's website. Why go through a store and pay a commission? Why be limited to other people's guidelines? 

    One reason would be to be free from the everyday running costs of bandwidth, payment processing etc. In that case, why not simply provide a link to the app in the store of your choice? Your binary, hashed and certified in the store you want to use.

    Users would get the app, unmodified exactly as you provided it. 

    That’s choice. If Apple were to lose out, it would be for a reason. They would then have to consider adapting their ways. Competing. 
    Apple is competing. Apple competes with Samsung, Xiaomi, Huawei, LG, Oppo, Nokia, Vivo, Google and all the others smartphone brands. Apple iOS competes with all smartphones using Android.

    Your always distorted view of "competing"  and "choice" would force Walmart to allow Costco to sell their Kirkland brand products in Walmart stores. Or force Volkswagen to sell Lexus brand autos in their dealerships.  And neither Walmart or Volkswagen would earn any "commission" for allowing Costco and Ford to use their property to make money. They just have to "compete".

    Oh, I forgot, Walmart and Volkswagen aren't labeled some BS "gatekeeper". Being labeled  a "gatekeeper" means that you are not allow to "compete" using your own IP and must allow others to use your IP for free, in order for them to compete with you. You saying that Apple competitors should be able to make money using Apple iOS, without paying Apple a "commission" is just socialism wanting all the benefits of capitalism, but not willing to pay the price. 

     
    You label my view as 'distorted' but if legislative bodies the world over are leaning in precisely that direction, I must refute that wild claim. 

    Distorted, it is most certainly not. 

    Nor are Walmart or VW even remotely comparable to gatekeepers. 

    When was the last time you bought into a retail system and found yourself limited to just one store?

    You do not pay to enter a Walmart or VW dealership for starters. You do pay to enter the Apple ecosystem. You may argue that the purchase price includes more than access to an online retail store but that is irrelevant.

    The point is it cost money and the user is NEVER clearly made aware of the App Store limitations and restrictions of choice and competition at purchase time. 

    I'm sure that if the user were clearly made aware of those limitations and required to sign off on them, then most of Apple’s problems here would just vanish overnight. 

    Why not give that a go in the name of transparency? What’s there to lose? Most of the people defending Apple on this issue claim that users buy iPhones precisely to have those limitations in place. 

    Well, make it so! Tell the users and let's see how 'in' on the deal they really are. 

    No. Apple would never choose that option because it knows full well it has no ground to stand on. It has laughed all the way to the bank for over a decade until legislation and investigations caught up with it. It will fight and try to thwart efforts to have it open up and that is logical but do you really think everything will stop at the EU? 
    I'm guessing you see Apple as "Hotel California", but reading the rant above made my day. 

    Was that you or ChatGTP?

    Either way, it's odd how you seem to consider iPhone buyers specifically, and Apple consumers broadly, as unable to evaluate Apple's business model, after almost 50 years of operation. I'm just not seeing masses of iPhone owners with buyers remorse, but sure, you are free to link to that if it is actually happening.


    ihatescreennameswatto_cobra
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