Sonos CEO insists iOS app cannot be rolled back to the older, better one

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in iOS

Sonos users will have to continue using the current and hugely disliked iOS app, with the company's CEO making it clear that it's not possible to roll back to the older app any longer.

Hand holding a smartphone displaying a music app interface with albums, playlists, and recently played songs. Background shows a computer screen with various web pages.
The Sonos app on an iPhone



Since its app update in May, Sonos has received frequent complaints about the revision, with users upset by a number of missing features and functionality. While the company CEO has already apologized for the disruption caused by the new app, there's apparently no way back for the app at all.

In an "Office Hours" Q&A session on Reddit on Monday, Sonos CEO Patrick Spence, continued the apology tour with assurances about the app. However, those assurances would not include rolling back the app to a previous state.

Spence admits that he had been hopeful of a release of the old app, referred to as S2, but it turns out that it's not possible. The problem is that it has gone too far adjusting other software elements to ever go back.

"The trick of course is that Sonos is not just a mobile app, but software that runs on your speakers and in the cloud too," Spence writes. "In the months since the new mobile app launched we've been updating the software that runs on our speakers and in the cloud to the point where today S2 is less reliable & less stable then what you remember."

After "extensive testing," Spence says that the re-release of S2 would "make the problems worse, not better."

Spence adds that, as a "silver lining," Sonos is now focused on getting the new software working properly for consumers.

As promised in a previous apology, changes are on the way, including making the set-up process of new products more reliable. The company is also keen to reduce the number of "something went wrong" errors that users encounter.



Read on AppleInsider

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 17
    thrangthrang Posts: 1,031member
    This is fatal-blow level error IMO for a company - you do one thing, and you bork it so severely, They could not have tested the app extensively, OR AT ALL, given the number of problems. How poorly run can a company be that this gets anywhere near the App Store for release?

    I still cannot add song to a Sonos Playlist, and still get something wrong errors accessing recently played content from their Home Screen, and Apple Music content played from the Sonos app is way too loud, and the lowest volume levels cut out completely.

    This is ongoing for months now.

    So no more Sonos for me. Ever
    VictorMortimerwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 17
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 13,067member
    Was always curious about Sonos, but complaints about their software has been vocal for over a decade so I stayed away. AirPlay does what I need it to and don't see myself moving away from it.
    tokyojimujahbladewatto_cobrazeus423
  • Reply 3 of 17
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,608member
    I love Sonos as a system. I currently use a Beam 2, a pair of ones as the surround, and the Sub Mini, plus a pair of Era100's in the master. Once set up it's stable, sounds wonderful, and the components unobtrusive. But getting to that point seems to be getting harder and harder. 

    Sonos has made so many missteps in recent years that it's tarnishing the image. 
    muthuk_vanalingambala1234jahbladeluke hambly
  • Reply 4 of 17
    flydogflydog Posts: 1,139member
    thrang said:
    This is fatal-blow level error IMO for a company - you do one thing, and you bork it so severely, They could not have tested the app extensively, OR AT ALL, given the number of problems. How poorly run can a company be that this gets anywhere near the App Store for release?

    I still cannot add song to a Sonos Playlist, and still get something wrong errors accessing recently played content from their Home Screen, and Apple Music content played from the Sonos app is way too loud, and the lowest volume levels cut out completely.

    This is ongoing for months now.

    So no more Sonos for me. Ever
    What a drama queen. 
  • Reply 5 of 17
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,604member
    A friend of mine was a high level programmer for Chase bank. We were discussing programming disasters. He told me of one major problem. They were updating a database for a major database center in the bank. They went through a number of testing procedures. First, a handful of computers. Then a department and so on. When they were satisfied, on a weekend, when things were slow, they rolled it out to the entire company. The entire system immediately crashed.

    weve all had experiences where new software causes unexpected problems. It seem that here, a major mistake they made was to continue updating other software for devices while this problem existed, making it impossible le to revert to the previous system while the tracked the problems down and, hopefully, eliminated them. Chase was able to revert until they found and fixed the problem. That’s usually a standard thing for Marge companies. As we know, if you update your OS, Apple gives several weeks to over a months for you to revert if there’s a problem.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 17
    I don’t know if it is available outside the UK but there’s a lovely system called BRENNAN2.
    It stores several thousand tracks and can use the Sonos speakers.
    VictorMortimerwatto_cobra
  • Reply 7 of 17
    JinTechJinTech Posts: 1,055member
    So because of a third party's developing procedures and lack of backups to older code, and best practices, Apple is at fault? 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 8 of 17
    I have used Sonos speakers for 20 years.  Made the switch from Sonos 1 to Sonos 2 with minimal headaches.  I have rarely had problems with my system.  But, I am afraid that the bad publicity being given by groups like "appleinsider" and "ZDNET" are going to kill the company.  It almost sounds like a conspiracy. 

    I can recommend the Sonos system to anyone looking for a good distributed sound system in their home or office.  Setup problems are massively exaggerated.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 9 of 17
    boboliciousbobolicious Posts: 1,168member
    Any system dependent on proprietary software is potentially vulnerable.
    Libratone had similar issues cutting a much loved equalizer feature and forcing users to sign in - it seemed all about data mining...
    I still enjoy my analogue amps, speakers and airport expresses, the latter of which I understand have excellent DACs and analogue outputs thanks to Steve Jobs interest in audio...

    VictorMortimerwatto_cobra
  • Reply 10 of 17
    neilmneilm Posts: 995member
    jorjitop said:
    I have used Sonos speakers for 20 years.  Made the switch from Sonos 1 to Sonos 2 with minimal headaches.  I have rarely had problems with my system.  But, I am afraid that the bad publicity being given by groups like "appleinsider" and "ZDNET" are going to kill the company.  It almost sounds like a conspiracy. 

    I can recommend the Sonos system to anyone looking for a good distributed sound system in their home or office.  Setup problems are massively exaggerated.
    Yeah, so in your mind, just because you have no problems with Sonos, that means everyone else is imagining theirs.

    Sonos's wounds are entirely self-inflicted (not for the first time), and furthermore they admit that.
    VictorMortimerwilliamlondonmuthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobramelgross
  • Reply 11 of 17
    jorjitop said:
    I have used Sonos speakers for 20 years.  Made the switch from Sonos 1 to Sonos 2 with minimal headaches.  I have rarely had problems with my system.  But, I am afraid that the bad publicity being given by groups like "appleinsider" and "ZDNET" are going to kill the company.  It almost sounds like a conspiracy. 
    GOOD.  I hope they drop dead ASAP.  Horrible company, and their CEO and software 'engineers' are clearly utter fools.
    I can recommend the Sonos system to anyone looking for a good distributed sound system in their home or office.  Setup problems are massively exaggerated.
    You do that.  I'll continue strongly recommending that Sonos be avoided like the plague they are.  Setup problems are massively understated.  Sonos has been junk for decades.  The hardware isn't awful, but it isn't great either.  The software is and has always been abysmal.

    The best distributed music system I've found has been AirPort Express boxes (they're dirt cheap on ebay) connected via TOSLINK to amplifiers and speakers.  I can throw audio at any room in the house, and since people tend to hand me their old technology, the whole setup was almost free.
    edited August 22
  • Reply 12 of 17
    charlesncharlesn Posts: 1,081member
    thrang said:
    This is fatal-blow level error IMO for a company - you do one thing, and you bork it so severely, They could not have tested the app extensively, OR AT ALL, given the number of problems. How poorly run can a company be that this gets anywhere near the App Store for release?
    Fatal blow? Suggest you get out of the tech website echosphere, where the sky is always falling over something, and actually research the company. Third quarter earnings that were just reported on August 8th--which reflected the months since the botched rollout of the new app--beat analyst estimates across the board. So any thought that sales are cratering because of the app issue are wildly overstated. As is the case almost 100% of the time, average consumers are blissfully unaware of whatever the tech echosphere is losing its mind over at any given time. 

    But... and it's a big one... this is not to say that all is fine in Sonos land. The real damage inflicted by the botched app rollout will probably be reflected in Q4 sales to be released in early November. Why? Because the release of two major new products, which should be out and selling already, are being held up because of the app. One is the long overdue Arc 2... not sure what the other one is. Sonos really has no choice--they can't afford to take any chance of damaging the consumer experience and thus future sales of these new products because of the app. They can't release these products until certain that the app issues are fixed. But the shortfall in projected sales will probably be painful. How bad? The analyst with the best track record who currently covers Sonos has just slashed his estimates for year-over-year sales from +30% to -20%. Yes, a 50% swing to the downside. He also slashed his target price for the stock from $25--which seemed perfectly reasonable when Sonos was near $20 back in March--to $10. But if Sonos can get the app fixed and products released in time for holiday shopping, it should be able to recover pretty quickly.

    I do think your question about how this botched app got out the door is a valid one. (fwiw, I've read that the pressure to get the Ace headphones released, which required the new app, was the reason.) But still... Sonos is selling a very premium-priced product relative to the competition, with the consumer experience of those products largely hinging on the app. So to rush a new version of that app out the door with (clearly) insufficient testing is corporate malpractice on an epic scale that has definitely dealt a blow to the company and its reputation, but one from which it still has the ability to recover. 


    edited August 22 muthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobra
  • Reply 13 of 17
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,604member
    jorjitop said:
    I have used Sonos speakers for 20 years.  Made the switch from Sonos 1 to Sonos 2 with minimal headaches.  I have rarely had problems with my system.  But, I am afraid that the bad publicity being given by groups like "appleinsider" and "ZDNET" are going to kill the company.  It almost sounds like a conspiracy. 

    I can recommend the Sonos system to anyone looking for a good distributed sound system in their home or office.  Setup problems are massively exaggerated.
    Many news sources are writing about this snafu. Sonos themselves have stated that it is a major problem that is difficult for them to fix. It isn’t a made up issue at all.
  • Reply 14 of 17
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,604member

    charlesn said:
    thrang said:
    This is fatal-blow level error IMO for a company - you do one thing, and you bork it so severely, They could not have tested the app extensively, OR AT ALL, given the number of problems. How poorly run can a company be that this gets anywhere near the App Store for release?
    Fatal blow? Suggest you get out of the tech website echosphere, where the sky is always falling over something, and actually research the company. Third quarter earnings that were just reported on August 8th--which reflected the months since the botched rollout of the new app--beat analyst estimates across the board. So any thought that sales are cratering because of the app issue are wildly overstated. As is the case almost 100% of the time, average consumers are blissfully unaware of whatever the tech echosphere is losing its mind over at any given time. 

    But... and it's a big one... this is not to say that all is fine in Sonos land. The real damage inflicted by the botched app rollout will probably be reflected in Q4 sales to be released in early November. Why? Because the release of two major new products, which should be out and selling already, are being held up because of the app. One is the long overdue Arc 2... not sure what the other one is. Sonos really has no choice--they can't afford to take any chance of damaging the consumer experience and thus future sales of these new products because of the app. They can't release these products until certain that the app issues are fixed. But the shortfall in projected sales will probably be painful. How bad? The analyst with the best track record who currently covers Sonos has just slashed his estimates for year-over-year sales from +30% to -20%. Yes, a 50% swing to the downside. He also slashed his target price for the stock from $25--which seemed perfectly reasonable when Sonos was near $20 back in March--to $10. But if Sonos can get the app fixed and products released in time for holiday shopping, it should be able to recover pretty quickly.

    I do think your question about how this botched app got out the door is a valid one. (fwiw, I've read that the pressure to get the Ace headphones released, which required the new app, was the reason.) But still... Sonos is selling a very premium-priced product relative to the competition, with the consumer experience of those products largely hinging on the app. So to rush a new version of that app out the door with (clearly) insufficient testing is corporate malpractice on an epic scale that has definitely dealt a blow to the company and its reputation, but one from which it still has the ability to recover. 


    You have to be careful when you mention analysts expectations. If they already accounted for the problem in their estimates, then they would have been lower than otherwise. Beating these low expectations may seem good, but what would it have been otherwise? You don’t know that.
  • Reply 15 of 17
    charlesncharlesn Posts: 1,081member
    melgross said:
    You have to be careful when you mention analysts expectations. If they already accounted for the problem in their estimates, then they would have been lower than otherwise. Beating these low expectations may seem good, but what would it have been otherwise? You don’t know that.
    Actually, I do know that because I research and read, which you clearly haven't done and I'm not here to do remedial reading on the 3Q report. Suffice to say it not only beat expectations for the quarter, it was a solid YOY beat across the board. But as I also made clear, the delayed release of two major new products because of the app screw-up continues to weigh on Wall Street, which is why the stock has essentially treaded water in the wake of a decent report. No one yet knows when the app will be fixed with sufficient confidence to release those new products to market. 
    gatorguy
  • Reply 16 of 17
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,604member
    charlesn said:
    melgross said:
    You have to be careful when you mention analysts expectations. If they already accounted for the problem in their estimates, then they would have been lower than otherwise. Beating these low expectations may seem good, but what would it have been otherwise? You don’t know that.
    Actually, I do know that because I research and read, which you clearly haven't done and I'm not here to do remedial reading on the 3Q report. Suffice to say it not only beat expectations for the quarter, it was a solid YOY beat across the board. But as I also made clear, the delayed release of two major new products because of the app screw-up continues to weigh on Wall Street, which is why the stock has essentially treaded water in the wake of a decent report. No one yet knows when the app will be fixed with sufficient confidence to release those new products to market. 
    Oh, I know what happened and what you say is still wrong.
  • Reply 17 of 17
    925925 Posts: 1member

            Sonos users will have to continue using the current and hugely disliked iOS app, with the company's CEO making it clear that           it's not possible to roll back to the older app any longer.

    Spence is WRONG.  Spence is saying it isn't good for Sonos to allow users to use the old app, not that it can't be done!  Sonos upgraded all of my iOS devices (WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!) except for one.  I still use an iPhone 7 Plus.  And the iPhone 7 Plus is too old for Sonos to want to upgrade it.  The old app WORKS JUST FINE, like it always has!  Now I am guessing that it doesn't have support for Sonos ACE, and perhaps other devices, but for the 13 Sonos devices I have installed, IT WORKS LIKE A CHAMP!  All they have to do is put it back in the App Store!

    I used to do most of my Sonos app interaction with my iPads.  But what do I reach for now?  The clunker iPhone 7 Plus in my pocket!  

    Spence - You are lying!  The old app might not be for everybody - and it may not fit your vision of the future - but for those of us that don't upgrade every 10 minutes - GIVE YOUR USERS THE OPTION to switch to the old way of doing thing!  And stop lying.  And stop destroying the SONOS we USED to love!  

    You aren't smart enough to fix the Sonos you personally have been screwing up.  Why don't you resign!  






    Read on AppleInsider


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