Its not quite the G5 or Dual Core everyone was hoping for, but hey...it ain't bad.
If you already own a recent powerbook, it probably doesn't pay to update. But if you have a really outdated pb or don't have one at all, its a good deal.
1) Nice price drop
2) 512 megs of ram across the board.(Finally! Maybe this will be a new trend!)
3) Faster Super Drive!
4) Faster HD across the board!
5) Scroll track pad
6) Sudden motion sensor
7) Built in Airport & enhanced Bluetooth
Yes its still a G4...but all in all, a great deal. Let apple do the G5 right. My guess it won't be announced until WWDC this summer at the very earliest. If you can wait, wait. But If you really need a new powerbook now, get one of these babies. Then if they come out with the G5 pbs by the end of the year, and there are no major bugs or heat/battery issues, sell your recently purchased G4 powerbook for a miimum loss, and trade up for a G5 pb.
Really simple.
But all the complaining in the world is pointless in my mind. Apple will release the G5 pb when its ready. It'll be worth the wait. Although you just know that when it does come out, there will be some who will complain that it doesn't have this or that! Some people are just never satisfied.
Dell laptops suck. That Inspiron 9200 starts at 7.7lbs before you add in battery and optical drive. That's damn near a 9lb laptop.
N
I second that. I was looking at my friend's laptop in class the other day. The bottom plastic on the base is a different color than the top part and I asked him, "Why do you have it hooked up to a dock?" He said, what dock? The laptop is as thick as a brick.
Getting my first mac tomorrow. PB 17" (I'll be the only one in my class with a mac ;-(
anyone know what the previous pricepoints were for the powerbooks, just to see if they've gone down any?
plus, i'll bet steve et al. thought "well, they're not going to like us not cramming a g5 in a case for them, let's throw an additional 256 MB Ram in all the units to throw them a bone."
It seems like the incremental update everyone was expecting it to be. (opinion though). If they work for you, great, if not, hold out for the G5.
The Sudden Motion Sensor is a really cool feature, though, IBM ThinkPad's (i suppose the luxury lines in the win laptop market) have had a feature like that for awhile now, and from what I hear, its rather impressive.
Any word on whether or not the screen's were updated? Thats the one major sticking point outside of the 167mhz bus, that is stopping me from buying a PB. I've compared the Rev C's with other laptops, and its horrible, IMO.
Its not quite the G5 or Dual Core everyone was hoping for, but hey...it ain't bad.
If you already own a recent powerbook, it probably doesn't pay to update. But if you have a really outdated pb or don't have one at all, its a good deal.
Windows laptops tend to be big and thick and heavy, OR sacrifice features (things like an optical drive!) to be thin. The PowerBook line manages to be both ultra-portable AND full-featured. Apple also has THE best reliability record for laptops in the industry, consistently year after year (see large-scale surveys by Consumer Reports). And regardless, Windows laptops aren't remotely competitive unless you find Windows to be a suitable alternative to Mac OS X. Given those factors, today we have better laptops available than we did yesterday, for better prices. And even my "lowly" 1.25 GHz PowerBook is enough to run my whole business well, from 3D rendering to video editing... and is fun for UT2004 besides.
HOWEVER: A Pentium M laptop is definitely a smarter choice for render farms.
Choose the right tool for the job. Sometimes raw GHz matters more than connectivity, size, weight, ease-of-use, excellent bundled software, quality components, and freedom from viruses and spyware.
Fiber Optic In/Out is only available on the 17" model. No 128MB graphics option on the 1.5 GHz model anymore. What good are price cuts if you are forced to pick from the more expensive options? Damn you Apple.
128 is available on the faster 15" though. Making a zillion variations, like putting the top video board with the lowest CPU, wouldn't help sales that much and would increase the cost--to Apple, and to us. More different boards to design, test, predict demand for, build, and stock. Not worth it unless it will be widely needed.
Quote:
Originally posted by IIDX
The Sudden Motion Sensor is a really cool feature, though, IBM ThinkPad's (i suppose the luxury lines in the win laptop market) have had a feature like that for awhile now, and from what I hear, its rather impressive.
right click does display the open option, which does not autorun, it opens the explore window. There is also an "explore" option, but it does the same thing.
But on the right click menu there is an "autoplay" entry which will launch the autorun.
I have not tweaked any settings after a clean install. This is the way it has always worked. So I have no idea why it would be any different for you.
Guys, This is an APPLE message board. Take your WINDOWS discussions elsewhere. I switched to Mac so I would never have to hear about that crappy interface ever again.
Mac users seem to think that viruses and spyware run rampant on windows machines. And I suppose if you don't know what you are doing then yes, it does happen. Just don't use IE, run a spyware scanner on occasion and don't open email attachments. Problem solved.
Are you saying viruses and spyware don't run rampant on the Windows platform?
Are you saying everyone using Windows platform are computer savvy and 'knows what they are doing'?
Do most users know not to use Internet Explorer?
Most Windows users know 'not to open email attachments'?
C'mon. They've had nearly two years to figure out how to put a G5 chip into the Powerbook. I'm not buying one of these latest G4 models. No thanks, I'll wait--like a lot of us.
Mac users seem to think that viruses and spyware run rampant on windows machines. And I suppose if you don't know what you are doing then yes, it does happen.
Agreed. Windows is a non-option unless you are properly qualified, and willing to put the effort into keeping on top of security.
I don't want to have to "know what I'm doing" about anything other than what I want to DO with my computer It serves me, I don't serve it.
Fiber Optic In/Out is only available on the 17" model. No 128MB graphics option on the 1.5 GHz model anymore. What good are price cuts if you are forced to pick from the more expensive options? Damn you Apple.
I am annoyed at the optical in/out on the 17" However, the graphics hasn't changed, last time the 15" super and 17" could have 128MB as build to order. Now the 17" is standard. My only complaint is apple's wording. They say all computers come with ... 8X Superdrive - a bit misleading don;t you think? Anyway I've ordered my PowerBook 15" 1.67 GHz 1 GB RAm and 128 MB GPU - now I have to wait, Apple say it should arrive Monday (although I'm away that week damn it)!!!!
The advantage of Dothan-based sonoma PC latops over these "Power"Books.
Lets not use too much hyperbole.
Quote:
2MB L2 cache versus 512 KB L2 cache
For cache resident code, Pentium M systems will be faster by the clock rate difference and some additional 5 to 10% due to increased cache size.
Quote:
2.13 GHz versus 1.67 GHz with 1.4-2x better performance than the G4, per clock.
At best, the Pentium M performs about the same per clock as the G4. It (P-M) has 2 integer units and 1 FPU unit. The G4 has 4 integer units and 1 FPU unit. On the whole, the G4 should be a little better clock for clock than the Pentium-M per clock. Where the G4 loses is in not-as-mature compiler optimizations.
Quote:
90nm versus 130 nm technology.
True. But the G4 was up against 90 nm Dothan systems with 2 MB on-die cache and 400 FSB for about a year. The Sonoma improvements are incremental.
Quote:
Advanced realtime clock/voltage throlling versus very primitive step-down throlling on the G4 (it's so pathetic, people have to say "set CPU performance to max in the ES control panel" when doing benchmarks)
True. Apple could simply use more powerful batteries to increase usage times, but they are too cheap to do it.
Quote:
533 MHz system bus (effective) versus 167 MHz
This really translate to about a 5% improvement compared to the 400 MHz FSB Dothan systems. It won't be the performance ringer that the numbers suggests. Apple G4 systems need more FSB bandwidth certainly though.
Quote:
DDR2-5400 memory versus un-utilized DDR2700 memory
This hurts. Hurting for a long time now though.
Quote:
PCI Express graphics versus AGP graphics (Important for CoreImage/CoreVideo/DirectX9 shader applications, ie. using the GPU as a coprocessor)
Since Apple doesn't support GPU upgrades in their laptops, PCIe is fairly irrelevant. The current graphics chip selection won't stress the AGP architecture.
Quote:
Express card slots versus regular PCMCIA cardbus slots (slow!!!)
Slow for what? Unless your hooking a RAID or a graphics card into the cardbus slots, the PCMCIA cardbus slot will be fine for a while.
Quote:
I'm really amazed Apple even bothered updating the PowerBooks. They are beyond embarrassing.
At least they lowered the prices and updated the features at the same time.
Comments
Its not quite the G5 or Dual Core everyone was hoping for, but hey...it ain't bad.
If you already own a recent powerbook, it probably doesn't pay to update. But if you have a really outdated pb or don't have one at all, its a good deal.
1) Nice price drop
2) 512 megs of ram across the board.(Finally! Maybe this will be a new trend!)
3) Faster Super Drive!
4) Faster HD across the board!
5) Scroll track pad
6) Sudden motion sensor
7) Built in Airport & enhanced Bluetooth
Yes its still a G4...but all in all, a great deal. Let apple do the G5 right. My guess it won't be announced until WWDC this summer at the very earliest. If you can wait, wait. But If you really need a new powerbook now, get one of these babies. Then if they come out with the G5 pbs by the end of the year, and there are no major bugs or heat/battery issues, sell your recently purchased G4 powerbook for a miimum loss, and trade up for a G5 pb.
Really simple.
But all the complaining in the world is pointless in my mind. Apple will release the G5 pb when its ready. It'll be worth the wait. Although you just know that when it does come out, there will be some who will complain that it doesn't have this or that! Some people are just never satisfied.
Originally posted by hmurchison
No you guys don't have to backtrack.
Dell laptops suck. That Inspiron 9200 starts at 7.7lbs before you add in battery and optical drive. That's damn near a 9lb laptop.
N
I second that. I was looking at my friend's laptop in class the other day. The bottom plastic on the base is a different color than the top part and I asked him, "Why do you have it hooked up to a dock?" He said, what dock? The laptop is as thick as a brick.
Getting my first mac tomorrow. PB 17" (I'll be the only one in my class with a mac ;-(
plus, i'll bet steve et al. thought "well, they're not going to like us not cramming a g5 in a case for them, let's throw an additional 256 MB Ram in all the units to throw them a bone."
The Sudden Motion Sensor is a really cool feature, though, IBM ThinkPad's (i suppose the luxury lines in the win laptop market) have had a feature like that for awhile now, and from what I hear, its rather impressive.
DX
Originally posted by regan
Hey hey hey! Relax people.
Its not quite the G5 or Dual Core everyone was hoping for, but hey...it ain't bad.
If you already own a recent powerbook, it probably doesn't pay to update. But if you have a really outdated pb or don't have one at all, its a good deal.
...snip...
Well said!
HOWEVER: A Pentium M laptop is definitely a smarter choice for render farms.
Choose the right tool for the job. Sometimes raw GHz matters more than connectivity, size, weight, ease-of-use, excellent bundled software, quality components, and freedom from viruses and spyware.
Originally posted by 1984
Fiber Optic In/Out is only available on the 17" model. No 128MB graphics option on the 1.5 GHz model anymore. What good are price cuts if you are forced to pick from the more expensive options? Damn you Apple.
128 is available on the faster 15" though. Making a zillion variations, like putting the top video board with the lowest CPU, wouldn't help sales that much and would increase the cost--to Apple, and to us. More different boards to design, test, predict demand for, build, and stock. Not worth it unless it will be widely needed.
Originally posted by IIDX
The Sudden Motion Sensor is a really cool feature, though, IBM ThinkPad's (i suppose the luxury lines in the win laptop market) have had a feature like that for awhile now, and from what I hear, its rather impressive.
I can't wait to try it out
Originally posted by Placebo
If it works, yes. It's like airbags for your laptop.
Um well, drop your PowerBook, dent the case, break the screen, but at least your data will be ok.
Originally posted by archer75
right click does display the open option, which does not autorun, it opens the explore window. There is also an "explore" option, but it does the same thing.
But on the right click menu there is an "autoplay" entry which will launch the autorun.
I have not tweaked any settings after a clean install. This is the way it has always worked. So I have no idea why it would be any different for you.
Guys, This is an APPLE message board. Take your WINDOWS discussions elsewhere. I switched to Mac so I would never have to hear about that crappy interface ever again.
No AppleWorks OK
NO iWork
Why?
Originally posted by iDave
Um well, drop your PowerBook, dent the case, break the screen, but at least your data will be ok.
for some people, that's all that matters... plus, the drop would be covered under applecare for repairs.
Originally posted by rok
for some people, that's all that matters... plus, the drop would be covered under applecare for repairs.
I think you're only dreaming about Applecare covering dropped PowerBooks. You're right though, the data is the most important thing.
Originally posted by iDave
I think you're only dreaming about Applecare covering dropped PowerBooks.
um ya. been there, done that, still have a dent b/c i refuse to pay 600 bucks. (even w/ applecare)
Originally posted by archer75
Mac users seem to think that viruses and spyware run rampant on windows machines. And I suppose if you don't know what you are doing then yes, it does happen. Just don't use IE, run a spyware scanner on occasion and don't open email attachments. Problem solved.
Are you saying viruses and spyware don't run rampant on the Windows platform?
Are you saying everyone using Windows platform are computer savvy and 'knows what they are doing'?
Do most users know not to use Internet Explorer?
Most Windows users know 'not to open email attachments'?
etc. etc. etc.
Originally posted by archer75
Mac users seem to think that viruses and spyware run rampant on windows machines. And I suppose if you don't know what you are doing then yes, it does happen.
Agreed. Windows is a non-option unless you are properly qualified, and willing to put the effort into keeping on top of security.
I don't want to have to "know what I'm doing" about anything other than what I want to DO with my computer
Originally posted by 1984
Fiber Optic In/Out is only available on the 17" model. No 128MB graphics option on the 1.5 GHz model anymore. What good are price cuts if you are forced to pick from the more expensive options? Damn you Apple.
I am annoyed at the optical in/out on the 17" However, the graphics hasn't changed, last time the 15" super and 17" could have 128MB as build to order. Now the 17" is standard. My only complaint is apple's wording. They say all computers come with ... 8X Superdrive - a bit misleading don;t you think? Anyway I've ordered my PowerBook 15" 1.67 GHz 1 GB RAm and 128 MB GPU - now I have to wait, Apple say it should arrive Monday (although I'm away that week damn it)!!!!
Originally posted by Existence
The advantage of Dothan-based sonoma PC latops over these "Power"Books.
Lets not use too much hyperbole.
2MB L2 cache versus 512 KB L2 cache
For cache resident code, Pentium M systems will be faster by the clock rate difference and some additional 5 to 10% due to increased cache size.
2.13 GHz versus 1.67 GHz with 1.4-2x better performance than the G4, per clock.
At best, the Pentium M performs about the same per clock as the G4. It (P-M) has 2 integer units and 1 FPU unit. The G4 has 4 integer units and 1 FPU unit. On the whole, the G4 should be a little better clock for clock than the Pentium-M per clock. Where the G4 loses is in not-as-mature compiler optimizations.
90nm versus 130 nm technology.
True. But the G4 was up against 90 nm Dothan systems with 2 MB on-die cache and 400 FSB for about a year. The Sonoma improvements are incremental.
Advanced realtime clock/voltage throlling versus very primitive step-down throlling on the G4 (it's so pathetic, people have to say "set CPU performance to max in the ES control panel" when doing benchmarks)
True. Apple could simply use more powerful batteries to increase usage times, but they are too cheap to do it.
533 MHz system bus (effective) versus 167 MHz
This really translate to about a 5% improvement compared to the 400 MHz FSB Dothan systems. It won't be the performance ringer that the numbers suggests. Apple G4 systems need more FSB bandwidth certainly though.
DDR2-5400 memory versus un-utilized DDR2700 memory
This hurts. Hurting for a long time now though.
PCI Express graphics versus AGP graphics (Important for CoreImage/CoreVideo/DirectX9 shader applications, ie. using the GPU as a coprocessor)
Since Apple doesn't support GPU upgrades in their laptops, PCIe is fairly irrelevant. The current graphics chip selection won't stress the AGP architecture.
Express card slots versus regular PCMCIA cardbus slots (slow!!!)
Slow for what? Unless your hooking a RAID or a graphics card into the cardbus slots, the PCMCIA cardbus slot will be fine for a while.
I'm really amazed Apple even bothered updating the PowerBooks. They are beyond embarrassing.
At least they lowered the prices and updated the features at the same time.