I did a spotlight search from the menubar for "apple" and in 3-4 seconds had 9000+ hits. A search "randy" (my name) gave me all results 300+ instantly.
this is my 20" iMac G5 with gig ram 10.4.1
I have no way of testing the msn or google search, but if they are faster than that then all is lost for apple
Well, Microsoft seems like they have come out with a good desktop searching competitor. While it may not be as powerful as Spotlight is capable of being, it is right on its tail. If Apple doesn't want to be overcome, they need to really work hard to make Spotlight the champion.
But personally, I am not worried so much about Spotlight vs. Windows Desktop Search. Why?
The guy working on Spotlight is the same guy who pretty much created the BeOS file system and is still praised today at the amazing work he did. With him working on Spotlight, I'm sure we can expect some similar amazing things.
What's important to note is that MSN Search is a copy of Spotlight - it's faster but doesn't allow saved searches or the integration. It's nowhere near as nice to use as Spotlight - so the same as many a Windows program - a copy of Apple but not quite as good. Apple do need o be careful though.
I did a spotlight search from the menubar for "apple" and in 3-4 seconds had 9000+ hits. A search "randy" (my name) gave me all results 300+ instantly.
this is my 20" iMac G5 with gig ram 10.4.1
I have no way of testing the msn or google search, but if they are faster than that then all is lost for apple
Hmmm. Wonder what I'd find on my computer if I searched on the word "randy"???
I've been playing around with indexed search engines on PCs for quite a while and I have found that Copernic works the best.
It's less taxing on system resources that MSN, indexes changes in realtime, looks in PDF, PPT, eudora, and outlook mail and just about any other type of a document, and has far better interface than google.
I've been running Tiger on 2 G4s so far spotlight seems to work pretty well. Sometimes it does take several minutes for the changes to show up.
Bitching that it take 2 -3 seconds to search the whole hard disk!!?! Yep I'm doing to dump my Mac now!?!
I've not used MSN search but from what I see it does not search half the things spotlight does. See a list here http://www.xvsxp.com
So MSN may be quicker (on the very unscientific tests mentioned here) but it's not searching as much content.
2-3 secs on vague search items that looks at the entire content on the computer is perfectly acceptable!
But the average user would probably benefit from less searching. Maybe if i turn off Fonts, Apps etc it will get faster. The reason I'm bitching is because MSN is INSTANT!
But the average user would probably benefit from less searching. Maybe if i turn off Fonts, Apps etc it will get faster. The reason I'm bitching is because MSN is INSTANT!
I have a packet of instant soup in my cupboard.. it's quick but real soup craps all over it
All I'm saying is 2-3 secs is not very long to wait is it!? if it was minutes then I'd be moaning..
I have a packet of instant soup in my cupboard.. it's quick but real soup craps all over it
All I'm saying is 2-3 secs is not very long to wait is it!? if it was minutes then I'd be moaning..
no but you could say that about everything - 2-3 secs for windows resizing isn't too bad... If Apple can make it faster they should because it's progress. Also Apple are advertising Spotlight as instant.
no but you could say that about everything - 2-3 secs for windows resizing isn't too bad... If Apple can make it faster they should because it's progress. Also Apple are advertising Spotlight as instant.
Can you make a movie of this instantaneousness? To some people, 2-3 seconds means instant.
Most of my Spotlight searches take 1-2 seconds with the top hit and most relevant finds coming up within the second. This is fine with me considering I take that long or more to find the file I really want out of a list.
Nothing is 'instant' per say. Even light has a finite speed. Instantaneousness is a perception...to some 1 second or half a second means 'instant'. To others 2-3 seconds means instant. And this varies according to context as well for the same person.
I know after running MSN on my PIII 700, which admittedly isn't the fastest, MSN search is far from instant for me.
While the endgame with GD, MSN Search and Spotlight are the same let's put our thinking caps on and realize that Spotlight is a little deeper in the system and talks directly with the filesystem. If Apple wanted absolute speed they wouldn't have linked Spotlight so deeply and created an API.
In fact there seems to be room to grow. If I've read John Siracusa's Tiger review properly there is a lot of hidden functionality in HFS+ for Uniform Type Identifiers that will combine with Spotlight for even more features. We're seeing Spotlight on training wheels right now. Will it every be "Instant" likely not as Quartz 2D and Composer seem to add their own slowdowns but I expect Spotlight to improve in speed and functionality over the life of 10.4.x.
I think Spotlight needs some integration with OS X labels so that I can mark some files as "hot" and have them rise to the top of my search results and show up ultra fast!
In terms of the testing methodology, it is not fair. You need to have the same files on both, then comparisons can be drawn between the two.
BUT the Mac should win from my tests - the specs certainly imply the Mac is faster - there are more files on the Mac. Basically I've got one of the new PowerBooks and Spotlight isn't instant - that's my problem. Obviously more thorough tests are needed.
BUT the Mac should win from my tests - the specs certainly imply the Mac is faster - there are more files on the Mac. Basically I've got one of the new PowerBooks and Spotlight isn't instant - that's my problem. Obviously more thorough tests are needed.
But how should the Mac win? The HD is slower by about a quarter, there are more files on the Mac, thus meaning the disk will have to search through a larger database.
FYI: Spotlight is far from instant on my machines - a dual-867, and a G4 iBook. It is relatively instant, but far from Steve Jobs' 'boom'
But how should the Mac win? The HD is slower by about a quarter, there are more files on the Mac, thus meaning the disk will have to search through a larger database.
FYI: Spotlight is far from instant on my machines - a dual-867, and a G4 iBook. It is relatively instant, but far from Steve Jobs' 'boom'
BUT it's a faster processor with more RAM in the Mac - the MSN search has finished as you type - no delay.
Comments
this is my 20" iMac G5 with gig ram 10.4.1
I have no way of testing the msn or google search, but if they are faster than that then all is lost for apple
But personally, I am not worried so much about Spotlight vs. Windows Desktop Search. Why?
The guy working on Spotlight is the same guy who pretty much created the BeOS file system and is still praised today at the amazing work he did. With him working on Spotlight, I'm sure we can expect some similar amazing things.
Originally posted by MagicFingers
I did a spotlight search from the menubar for "apple" and in 3-4 seconds had 9000+ hits. A search "randy" (my name) gave me all results 300+ instantly.
this is my 20" iMac G5 with gig ram 10.4.1
I have no way of testing the msn or google search, but if they are faster than that then all is lost for apple
Hmmm. Wonder what I'd find on my computer if I searched on the word "randy"???
It's less taxing on system resources that MSN, indexes changes in realtime, looks in PDF, PPT, eudora, and outlook mail and just about any other type of a document, and has far better interface than google.
I've been running Tiger on 2 G4s so far spotlight seems to work pretty well. Sometimes it does take several minutes for the changes to show up.
Bitching that it take 2 -3 seconds to search the whole hard disk!!?! Yep I'm doing to dump my Mac now!?!
I've not used MSN search but from what I see it does not search half the things spotlight does. See a list here http://www.xvsxp.com
So MSN may be quicker (on the very unscientific tests mentioned here) but it's not searching as much content.
2-3 secs on vague search items that looks at the entire content on the computer is perfectly acceptable!
Originally posted by tadunne
Oh my god whats wrong with you lot!?!
Bitching that it take 2 -3 seconds to search the whole hard disk!!?! Yep I'm doing to dump my Mac now!?!
I've not used MSN search but from what I see it does not search half the things spotlight does. See a list here http://www.xvsxp.com
So MSN may be quicker (on the very unscientific tests mentioned here) but it's not searching as much content.
2-3 secs on vague search items that looks at the entire content on the computer is perfectly acceptable!
But the average user would probably benefit from less searching. Maybe if i turn off Fonts, Apps etc it will get faster. The reason I'm bitching is because MSN is INSTANT!
Originally posted by MacCrazy
But the average user would probably benefit from less searching. Maybe if i turn off Fonts, Apps etc it will get faster. The reason I'm bitching is because MSN is INSTANT!
I have a packet of instant soup in my cupboard.. it's quick but real soup craps all over it
All I'm saying is 2-3 secs is not very long to wait is it!? if it was minutes then I'd be moaning..
Originally posted by tadunne
I have a packet of instant soup in my cupboard.. it's quick but real soup craps all over it
All I'm saying is 2-3 secs is not very long to wait is it!? if it was minutes then I'd be moaning..
no but you could say that about everything - 2-3 secs for windows resizing isn't too bad... If Apple can make it faster they should because it's progress. Also Apple are advertising Spotlight as instant.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
Also Apple are advertising Spotlight as instant.
They mean perhaps the dual 2.7 GHz Power Mac.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
no but you could say that about everything - 2-3 secs for windows resizing isn't too bad... If Apple can make it faster they should because it's progress. Also Apple are advertising Spotlight as instant.
Can you make a movie of this instantaneousness? To some people, 2-3 seconds means instant.
Most of my Spotlight searches take 1-2 seconds with the top hit and most relevant finds coming up within the second. This is fine with me considering I take that long or more to find the file I really want out of a list.
Nothing is 'instant' per say. Even light has a finite speed. Instantaneousness is a perception...to some 1 second or half a second means 'instant'. To others 2-3 seconds means instant. And this varies according to context as well for the same person.
While the endgame with GD, MSN Search and Spotlight are the same let's put our thinking caps on and realize that Spotlight is a little deeper in the system and talks directly with the filesystem. If Apple wanted absolute speed they wouldn't have linked Spotlight so deeply and created an API.
In fact there seems to be room to grow. If I've read John Siracusa's Tiger review properly there is a lot of hidden functionality in HFS+ for Uniform Type Identifiers that will combine with Spotlight for even more features. We're seeing Spotlight on training wheels right now. Will it every be "Instant" likely not as Quartz 2D and Composer seem to add their own slowdowns but I expect Spotlight to improve in speed and functionality over the life of 10.4.x.
I can spare the 2-4 seconds for this potential.
Originally posted by Bart Smastard
Hmmm. Wonder what I'd find on my computer if I searched on the word "randy"???
been feeling a little randy have we?
Originally posted by MagicFingers
been feeling a little randy have we?
Now stop there Mr. Pedophiliac.
Originally posted by low-fi
In terms of the testing methodology, it is not fair. You need to have the same files on both, then comparisons can be drawn between the two.
BUT the Mac should win from my tests - the specs certainly imply the Mac is faster - there are more files on the Mac. Basically I've got one of the new PowerBooks and Spotlight isn't instant - that's my problem. Obviously more thorough tests are needed.
Originally posted by MacCrazy
BUT the Mac should win from my tests - the specs certainly imply the Mac is faster - there are more files on the Mac. Basically I've got one of the new PowerBooks and Spotlight isn't instant - that's my problem. Obviously more thorough tests are needed.
But how should the Mac win? The HD is slower by about a quarter, there are more files on the Mac, thus meaning the disk will have to search through a larger database.
FYI: Spotlight is far from instant on my machines - a dual-867, and a G4 iBook. It is relatively instant, but far from Steve Jobs' 'boom'
Originally posted by low-fi
But how should the Mac win? The HD is slower by about a quarter, there are more files on the Mac, thus meaning the disk will have to search through a larger database.
FYI: Spotlight is far from instant on my machines - a dual-867, and a G4 iBook. It is relatively instant, but far from Steve Jobs' 'boom'
BUT it's a faster processor with more RAM in the Mac - the MSN search has finished as you type - no delay.