The thing I really like about apple going intel is it will impossible to prevent processor upgrades (from within the same family of CPU's) in the towers. Who knows, Apple might themselves offer upgrades down the line?
The thing I really like about apple going intel is it will impossible to prevent processor upgrades (from within the same family of CPU's) in the towers. Who knows, Apple might themselves offer upgrades down the line?
Oh trust me...Apple can and may solder the CPU to the board. In fact, they may do this now just to spite you. I'll blame you if it happens.
I can't see Apple starting Mac Pro prices at more than $1999. That would leave a huge gap between it and the iMac. It'd make more sense to have a lineup split between Core 2 Duos and Xeon 5100s: two of each kind occupying the lower and upper spectrums. As an example:
$1799: 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo
$2299: 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo
$2999: Dual 2.66 GHz Xeon
$3999: Dual 3 GHz Xeon
You'd thus have workstations for regular users who just want more flexibility and power than an iMac, and serious iron for the people who need to render 2K video or otherwise handle very scary tasks.
As Apple began development of the Mac Pro last October, it turned to Intel's Oregon division for the expertise in constructing a logicboard capable of housing a dual-processor Woodcrest configuration (or in other words, a graphics powerhouse sporting a total of four cores of processing power). Initially, it appeared that the two companies had aspirations of developing a radically compact board design, but they later settled on one approximately the same size as those found in Apple's current Power Mac G5 systems.
If this same-size thing is true, then
Unless it's the same size with lots more options, then
Yes, you can build a computer cheaper yourself. That's not the point. Apple makes about 22-26% on a computer from a gross margin perspective.
I haven't forgotten anything. Let me repeat for you...Apple is up against Dell and other computer manufacturers now.
Apple can get the 2.66 chips for 650 each...1300...plus board and 1GB RAM: 500...plus video card: 200...plus everything else: 400. 2400*1.25=3000
3500/2400 = 1.46!!! Are you going to pay that much premium?
I'm being extremely fucking modest with these prices. I'd be fuckin' suprised if Apple didn't get much better prices on the chips and board.
Remember that the board dev is outsourced. I think the software dev is covered quite well with the 129 bucks Apple is charging every 18 months. Don't forget the poor suckers that buy .mac for 99. The rest can be covered by ridiculously marked up products such as the Cinema Displays.
Whole different ball game now that Apple is with Intel...remember that.
Whole different ball game now that Apple is with Intel...remember that.
Often claimed and always proved wrong.
They said all consumer Macs would get cheaper with the Intel switch. They didn't. Now you're saying the pro desktop will get cheaper with the Intel switch. It won't.
They said all consumer Macs would get cheaper with the Intel switch. They didn't. Now you're saying the pro desktop will get cheaper with the Intel switch. It won't.
I never said they'd get cheaper. I said Apple would become more competitive. Here's a yes or no question for you...is Apple competitive with its iMac Core Duo and MacBooks?
I haven't forgotten anything. Let me repeat for you...Apple is up against Dell and other computer manufacturers now.
Apple can get the 2.66 chips for 650 each...1300...plus board and 1GB RAM: 500...plus video card: 200...plus everything else: 400. 2400*1.25=3000
3500/2400 = 1.46!!! Are you going to pay that much premium?
BUT ...... Apple customers already pay these prices. The current PowerMac configurations are priced at $1999, $2499, and $3299. I added $200 on top of that for improved components like better processors and more memory ...
Oh trust me...Apple can and may solder the CPU to the board. In fact, they may do this now just to spite you. I'll blame you if it happens.
They could get away with that when they were PPC machines, although they haven't ever done it.
However, now as a "PC" manufacturer (applies 'anti-flame?') I am not sure this would be a good move, if ever.
Soldering a CPU to a pro-level machine can have severe impact on warranty and service costs. You don't solder your 2 most expensive components together if you can help it.
A.) My plans to buy a MacBook Pro seem to keep getting pushed back further and further...
B.) Apple's 20" LCDs are definately going to need to be reduced in price. Viewsonic and Dell both have competative 20" wide screen monitors selling for between $300-400. I'm hoping Apple a % off all of their LCD monitors. They aren't the only ones with 30" LCDs now. Time for them to get more competative.
A.) My plans to buy a MacBook Pro seem to keep getting pushed back further and further...
You buy a computer when you need it. Not before, not after. Thinking that there will be a point where you will be completely satisfied with its specs, and where it couldn't possibly get better, is fooling yourself, plain and simple.
Apple has a nice chance here to not screw users over, and here's how:
make it so every Mac Pro ships with two CPU sockets, and so that the end user can add a CPU or change out the CPU chips, as their needs, wallet and schedule dictate.
It wasn't possible with G5 due to the exotic and delicate cooling mechanism.
But the average Joe can pop Woodcrest CPU's into a socket on a PC motherboard.
If Apple deliberately leaves the second socket off of the low-end or midrange model's logic board - preventing a later upgrade of adding a matching processor or putting in two brand new processors - that's going to look bad.
Unrelated comment:
if I'm not mistaken, Woodcrest processors require FB-DIMM memory, which could push up system pricing a bit, but could also really raise the roof on RAM capacity in the box:
The new intels are cheaper than older ppc macs, if u take in consideration that almost all models are dual processor, lots more power, faster ddr ram and about the same prices....
And if u load a dell with all the bang and wisthles an Apple have, it will cost u the same or a bit more.
Not to mention the OX X and iLive by far the best software u can get out there.
Macs arent expensive. that's a fact.
Dells are inexpensive but they got damaged soon and the parts are not cheap.
unless u buy complete care that is extra $$$$$$$$$$.
Comments
Originally posted by Thereubster
The thing I really like about apple going intel is it will impossible to prevent processor upgrades (from within the same family of CPU's) in the towers. Who knows, Apple might themselves offer upgrades down the line?
Oh trust me...Apple can and may solder the CPU to the board. In fact, they may do this now just to spite you. I'll blame you if it happens.
$1799: 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo
$2299: 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo
$2999: Dual 2.66 GHz Xeon
$3999: Dual 3 GHz Xeon
You'd thus have workstations for regular users who just want more flexibility and power than an iMac, and serious iron for the people who need to render 2K video or otherwise handle very scary tasks.
Originally posted by AppleInsider
As Apple began development of the Mac Pro last October, it turned to Intel's Oregon division for the expertise in constructing a logicboard capable of housing a dual-processor Woodcrest configuration (or in other words, a graphics powerhouse sporting a total of four cores of processing power). Initially, it appeared that the two companies had aspirations of developing a radically compact board design, but they later settled on one approximately the same size as those found in Apple's current Power Mac G5 systems.
If this same-size thing is true, then
Unless it's the same size with lots more options, then
Originally posted by mugwump
Funny how some of you set yourselves up for high prices. For the record, I originally expected quads across the entire line...
Forget 2.0 ghz anything. That number is older than dirt, back with the original G5. Get that outta here.
Quad 2.3 Woodcrest $1999.
Quad 2.6 Woodcrest $2499
Quad 3 ghz Woodcrest $3299
This will finally get the ProMac sales above 100K per quarter -- Enjoy!
PS -- Maybe a single 2.3 in there for $1599.
I really hope Apple goes for marketshare and for moving as many folks on the legacy PPC platform over to Intel ASAP.
These prices are fair and reasonable, but similar to the power of the MacBook for a great price, I hope Apple follows suit.
Specifically, I hope we see:
$1999
$2399
$2999
Getting the top of the line below 3 grand does a lot psychologically for folks who will spend more, but not a lot more.
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Ouch...nobody's gonna buy a products from a lineup with those price tags.
2x2.33 for 2700?
2x2.67 for 3500? sheeesh.
2x2.33 costs Apple at most $1000.
2x2.67 costs Apple at most $1350.
With the other components, these things wouldn't be cost Apple more than $2000 and $2350 at *most*.
The markup would be ridiculous. Nobody would buy these machines. Remember that Apple now competes with other PC manufacturers.
What's more ridiculous is you're forgetting:
Manufacturing Costs
Sales
Marketing
Company Overhead
Software Development
Testing
etc, etc, etc.
Yes, you can build a computer cheaper yourself. That's not the point. Apple makes about 22-26% on a computer from a gross margin perspective.
Originally posted by BWhaler
What's more ridiculous is you're forgetting:
Manufacturing Costs
Sales
Marketing
Company Overhead
Software Development
Testing
etc, etc, etc.
Yes, you can build a computer cheaper yourself. That's not the point. Apple makes about 22-26% on a computer from a gross margin perspective.
I haven't forgotten anything. Let me repeat for you...Apple is up against Dell and other computer manufacturers now.
Apple can get the 2.66 chips for 650 each...1300...plus board and 1GB RAM: 500...plus video card: 200...plus everything else: 400. 2400*1.25=3000
3500/2400 = 1.46!!! Are you going to pay that much premium?
I'm being extremely fucking modest with these prices. I'd be fuckin' suprised if Apple didn't get much better prices on the chips and board.
Remember that the board dev is outsourced. I think the software dev is covered quite well with the 129 bucks Apple is charging every 18 months. Don't forget the poor suckers that buy .mac for 99. The rest can be covered by ridiculously marked up products such as the Cinema Displays.
Whole different ball game now that Apple is with Intel...remember that.
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Whole different ball game now that Apple is with Intel...remember that.
Often claimed and always proved wrong.
They said all consumer Macs would get cheaper with the Intel switch. They didn't. Now you're saying the pro desktop will get cheaper with the Intel switch. It won't.
Originally posted by Chucker
Often claimed and always proved wrong.
They said all consumer Macs would get cheaper with the Intel switch. They didn't. Now you're saying the pro desktop will get cheaper with the Intel switch. It won't.
I never said they'd get cheaper. I said Apple would become more competitive. Here's a yes or no question for you...is Apple competitive with its iMac Core Duo and MacBooks?
Originally posted by kim kap sol
is Apple competitive with its iMac Core Duo and MacBooks?
Yes, just as competitive as they have been with the iMac G5 and iBooks and PowerBooks.
Originally posted by kim kap sol
I haven't forgotten anything. Let me repeat for you...Apple is up against Dell and other computer manufacturers now.
Apple can get the 2.66 chips for 650 each...1300...plus board and 1GB RAM: 500...plus video card: 200...plus everything else: 400. 2400*1.25=3000
3500/2400 = 1.46!!! Are you going to pay that much premium?
BUT ...... Apple customers already pay these prices. The current PowerMac configurations are priced at $1999, $2499, and $3299. I added $200 on top of that for improved components like better processors and more memory ...
Desktop All in one
iMac Integrated Graphics (merom)-low end consumer
iMac dedicated graphics (merom)-high end consumer
Desktop headless
Mac Mini (merom) low end consumer
Mac/Mac Media (conroe) prosumer
Mac Pro (Woodcrest) professional
Server
xserve (woodcrest)
Notebook (all merom)
Macbook 13.4
Macbook Pro 15"
Macbook pro 17"
Displays:
Apple Cinema with iSight
17" $349
20" $599
24" $899
30" $2099
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Oh trust me...Apple can and may solder the CPU to the board. In fact, they may do this now just to spite you. I'll blame you if it happens.
They could get away with that when they were PPC machines, although they haven't ever done it.
However, now as a "PC" manufacturer (applies 'anti-flame?') I am not sure this would be a good move, if ever.
Soldering a CPU to a pro-level machine can have severe impact on warranty and service costs. You don't solder your 2 most expensive components together if you can help it.
Z
Desktops
Mac mini (Merom) $499
SuperDrive Mac mini (Merom) $699
17-inch iMac integrated (Conroe) $899 edu / $999 regular
20-inch iMac dedicated (Conroe) $1399
23-inch iMac dedicated (Conroe) $1899
Dual Mac Pro (Woodcrest) $2099
Dual 2 GB Mac Pro (Woodcrest) $2499
Quad Mac Pro (Woodcrest) $2999
Laptops
MacBook mini in 2007 (Merom) $799
White MacBook (Merom) $1099
White SuperDrive MacBook (Merom) $1299
Black SuperDrive MacBook (Merom) $1499
15-inch MacBook Pro (Merom) $1899
15-inch MacBook Pro (Merom) $2299
17-inch MacBook Pro (Merom) $2599
Servers
Dual Xserve (Woodcrest) $1999
Quad Xserve (Woodcrest) $2999
Quad Xserve Cluster Node (Woodcrest) $2499
Xserve RAID $4999
Cinema Displays with iSight
20" $599
23" $899
30" $1799
B.) Apple's 20" LCDs are definately going to need to be reduced in price. Viewsonic and Dell both have competative 20" wide screen monitors selling for between $300-400. I'm hoping Apple a % off all of their LCD monitors. They aren't the only ones with 30" LCDs now. Time for them to get more competative.
Originally posted by Kerrum
A.) My plans to buy a MacBook Pro seem to keep getting pushed back further and further...
You buy a computer when you need it. Not before, not after. Thinking that there will be a point where you will be completely satisfied with its specs, and where it couldn't possibly get better, is fooling yourself, plain and simple.
make it so every Mac Pro ships with two CPU sockets, and so that the end user can add a CPU or change out the CPU chips, as their needs, wallet and schedule dictate.
It wasn't possible with G5 due to the exotic and delicate cooling mechanism.
But the average Joe can pop Woodcrest CPU's into a socket on a PC motherboard.
If Apple deliberately leaves the second socket off of the low-end or midrange model's logic board - preventing a later upgrade of adding a matching processor or putting in two brand new processors - that's going to look bad.
Unrelated comment:
if I'm not mistaken, Woodcrest processors require FB-DIMM memory, which could push up system pricing a bit, but could also really raise the roof on RAM capacity in the box:
http://www.crucial.com/promo/index.a...p_intel_fbdimm
Conroe doesn't require FB-DIMM but Conroe doesn't do dual socket either.
The new intels are cheaper than older ppc macs, if u take in consideration that almost all models are dual processor, lots more power, faster ddr ram and about the same prices....
And if u load a dell with all the bang and wisthles an Apple have, it will cost u the same or a bit more.
Not to mention the OX X and iLive by far the best software u can get out there.
Macs arent expensive. that's a fact.
Dells are inexpensive but they got damaged soon and the parts are not cheap.
unless u buy complete care that is extra $$$$$$$$$$.
try to use proper English.