Madtiger

Seth2015 said:

@tmay ... no that's not it.

I think perhaps we're the only two that have actually used both phones?
I mean with all respect - you haven't even seen one in real life?

So we have a bunch of unknowledgable iPhone fans that don't know anything about the competition, trying their hardest to argue a point which has already been proven over and over again. 

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

Seth2015 said:

@tmay People use different devices. I have both an iPhone X (standby phone every 2 weeks) and Huawei. You want a real world opinion? You can't see the difference in speed in actual using the phones. There's no jitter or judder, despite what Strangedays thinks he knows.

Anyhow - but based on the comments here slating Androids, it'd be interesting to see which the people have used (or even read about;). There's a great world out there of mobile phones! @Madtiger wasn't even aware that Huawei phones be bought anywhere in the world - yet they're the second largest manufacture behind Samsung? So, it's very interesting how he (and others) can be that opinionated on something he has zero idea about.  

Huawei...BANNED.  Sorry.  They sell a lot in countries where it is not banned or thru 3rd party.  Oh look, its CFO got arrested...must be because they do honest business.  Oh wait...they support terrorist nations.  Good job there kid for supporting Huawei.

Huawei handsets have not been banned. Much less 'BANNED'.

Check out Amazon US.

There are limitations on use in some areas (US military personnel for example) but that is applicable to many brands all over the world.

I've known people in the 'intelligence' realm who can fly using civil aviation but not use aeroflot. The are restrictions for people in certain jobs.

Honest Q...you support Huawei 100%?  Even though they are sending OUR technology to IRAN?  The country that literally produces some of the worst terrorist networks and are responsible for killing your so many countrymen and our soldiers???!!!!  

You our want to keep defending Huawei?  If so, then you’re pathetic. 

Honest answer: I support facts.

The facts are the Huawei and ZTE resold U.S. technology into Iran at a time that Iran was sanctioned. ZTE has already paid for their mistake.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/12/06/us-probe-into-huawei-includes-accusations-of-bank-fraud-and-sanctions-violations-reuters.html

So, off with her head then! LOL. Why bother with the paperwork!

An accusation is just that, an accusation.

The fact is that there is nothing proven until the case is heard. Painting an accusation as proof of guilt is more than a little worrying.

In the case of ZTE, they accepted the situation. As of today, that isn't the case of Huawei. The fact is they have denied the accusations.

You are getting ahead of yourself. Let's repond to facts as they are presented, not beforehand.

Yeah USA arresting the CFO in Canada by Canadian authorities and then transporting her to USA and literally creating international crisis was all done without any proof....

seriously, stop acting like a fool man.  

What? She's not having a stopover in Guantanamo first?

Please try to understand what is happening. First, there is the request for extradition to be resolved before any 'transporting' to the US?

There is a thread specifically on this issue right here on AI, why not take this aspect over there if you want to continue?

So, Canadian officials arrested her for no reason?  They just want to piss of China?  Who asked Canada to arrest her?  Again, you think that Huawei is innocent??  LOL

I don't know if she was cherry picked or if an alert popped up on a screen due to boarding pass or passport control. Either way there was a reason.

The Canadians are applying protocol. It would be crazy to do otherwise. Move this debate to the other thread, this one is on QC.

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

Seth2015 said:

Madtiger said:

Seth2015 said:

I wonder how much Apple paid for this?

Zero.  Apple is not Android OEMs.  (BTW, DPreview is very authoritative in camera world.)

Don't you then find it interesting that when they run a blind test with 5,000,000+ votes - the iPhone doesn't come anywhere?
And when DXOMark (also a leader in optical tests) does their reviews, the iPhone comes 3 or 4 ?
And that any other review generally ends with the conclusion that although the iPhone is exceptional, it cannot match the Huawei?
Seen the night pictures between the two? They can't even really be compared.

Anyway - it seems really odd that although iPhone hasn't had a winning camera for 2 or 3 years, this crops up. Beating the Pixel is one - but beating the Huawei?

For the record, the XS is currently second behind the Huawei P20 Pro, 109 to 105, at DXOmark. That's not a huge lead by any stretch, and given the limitations of the Huawei in usability, there isn't going to be much, if any, iPhone buyers scurrying off to pick up a Mate 20 Pro. Mostly though, people are a lot less interested in high end camera features simply because the current systems are "good enough".

Obviously, DPReview found that the Mate 20 Pro didn't best the iPhone XS, because the finalists were only the Pixel 3 and the iPhone XS.

Oh btw, a blind, online test isn't really a test of image quality; it's actually a test of viewing conditions, and bias.

I'm not sure what you mean by usability.

The Huawei camera app has always had a full on Pro mode which is often praised by photographers precisely for its usability.

One of the major criticisms of iPhones is the very limited options out of the box. Also, the insistence of the phone to have absolute control of if you can even take a picture or not while in certain modes. The last one I read was regarding the HDR mode. Before that it was low light portrait mode.

The lead of the P20 Pro over the XS at DX0 is quite big. The surprising thing is that Apple's latest, and best iPhones ever, are sitting behind a phone that was released in March.

It's strange that the Mate 20 Pro has not been listed but there is speculation that Huawei is actually holding the results back for marketing reasons. To leave the P20 Pro in the spotlight for as long as possible and maximise sales (the P20 Pro is currently part of a marketing push). The same sources claim that the minute the P20 Pro sees a challenger, Huawei will release the Mate 20 Pro results which are supposedly in the 115 ball park (pure rumours of course but they came out of a huge packet of rumours and all the rest were correct).

comment on DXOMark P20 Pro review from Huawei P20 Pro user:

"I'm a photographer and have to agree with the below comment. This is a terrible cellphone. Bought it and completly regret it. This review doesnt take into consideration a lot of factors. On 40mp, the picture is so slow that it's only reliable for completly static pictures. You also cant zoom on 40mp. The camera also takes forever processing the picture and sometimes the picture isnt taken at all, if yoy move the camera to fast after pressing the shutter. It has a terrible timelapse, and slow motion videos are uselless, they are 5secs videos, you cant make them last longer. Soooooo disapointed, im aelling it and buying note9 a much more reliable phone."

Sounds like some older Nokia's, horrible usability, but you could get good images if you waited around long enough. Few bought them.

DXOMark doesn't test video at 4K, and frankly, DXOMark isn't a standard that I would use to choose any phone.

DPReview has earned its credibility over many years of solid reviews.

I've stated it before, and I'll state it again; there isn't a big market for smartphones with bleeding edge cameras, simply because most everything available is "good enough". Still, Huawei caters to people like you, who don't actually buy the high end devices, but love to proselytize Huawei specs. 

Just differentiation in the Android OS device world.

Don't you find it strange that since its release in March and having sold millions of them, this type of issue hasn't been picked up on en masse. Even with the phone included in untold reviews and used - side by side - with direct competitors?

You should be doubting he is a photographer and doubting he has a P20 Pro.

DX0 Mark is what it is. It is used throughout the smartphone industry and those that can (those that top the leaderboard) use often use it to market phones. Logical.

As has been shown time and time again 4K is rarely a selling point for a phone. How else would the P20 Series have been able to break records for Huawei and then follow through with the Mate 20 series so far off to a record start.

Most people buy phones that have 4K, not because of it.

There is a huge market for cameras with bleeding edge cameras. Millions sold support this idea and the camera IS a major selling point to those who buy them. 4K isn't.

Ask yourself how much time your average user spends recording 4K video and photos. 4K is a bonus for most users, nothing more. Go ahead and ask all your friends and colleagues. It is actually HIGHLY likely that if they are even recording videos they are doing so at non-4K resolution due to storage issues.

Actually, for me, i use 4k30 exclusively.  And i use video MORE than pictures.  I have found that memories of my kids are better captured on video because you're able to visualize the scene/event better thru video.

P20P is selling well within Huawei.  But Huawei got to #2 because it sells a lot of cheap phones!  This is why its ASP is around $200-250...same as Samsung.  Let's not get ahead of ourselves and thinking that P20P sales are even remotely close to iPhones...or even Samsung flagships.

Remember, that newer iPhones have HEVC/HEIF...so, storage is lesser of an issue.  You be surprise at how many people know about 4k.  Think about it.  Look at GoPro or any other camera segment...4k is highly marketed by everyone, from DSLR to GoPro to smartphones.  The fact that you think 4K is some niche thing shows your ignorance.

People buy Go Pro with 4K precisely as a big selling point. People do not do the same with smartphones. Ask your friends and colleagues for their use cases.

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

avon b7 said:

Madtiger said:

Seth2015 said:

@tmay People use different devices. I have both an iPhone X (standby phone every 2 weeks) and Huawei. You want a real world opinion? You can't see the difference in speed in actual using the phones. There's no jitter or judder, despite what Strangedays thinks he knows.

Anyhow - but based on the comments here slating Androids, it'd be interesting to see which the people have used (or even read about;). There's a great world out there of mobile phones! @Madtiger wasn't even aware that Huawei phones be bought anywhere in the world - yet they're the second largest manufacture behind Samsung? So, it's very interesting how he (and others) can be that opinionated on something he has zero idea about.  

Huawei...BANNED.  Sorry.  They sell a lot in countries where it is not banned or thru 3rd party.  Oh look, its CFO got arrested...must be because they do honest business.  Oh wait...they support terrorist nations.  Good job there kid for supporting Huawei.

Huawei handsets have not been banned. Much less 'BANNED'.

Check out Amazon US.

There are limitations on use in some areas (US military personnel for example) but that is applicable to many brands all over the world.

I've known people in the 'intelligence' realm who can fly using civil aviation but not use aeroflot. The are restrictions for people in certain jobs.

Honest Q...you support Huawei 100%?  Even though they are sending OUR technology to IRAN?  The country that literally produces some of the worst terrorist networks and are responsible for killing your so many countrymen and our soldiers???!!!!  

You our want to keep defending Huawei?  If so, then you’re pathetic. 

Honest answer: I support facts.

The facts are the Huawei and ZTE resold U.S. technology into Iran at a time that Iran was sanctioned. ZTE has already paid for their mistake.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/12/06/us-probe-into-huawei-includes-accusations-of-bank-fraud-and-sanctions-violations-reuters.html

So, off with her head then! LOL. Why bother with the paperwork!

An accusation is just that, an accusation.

The fact is that there is nothing proven until the case is heard. Painting an accusation as proof of guilt is more than a little worrying.

In the case of ZTE, they accepted the situation. As of today, that isn't the case of Huawei. The fact is they have denied the accusations.

You are getting ahead of yourself. Let's repond to facts as they are presented, not beforehand.

Yeah USA arresting the CFO in Canada by Canadian authorities and then transporting her to USA and literally creating international crisis was all done without any proof....

seriously, stop acting like a fool man.  

What? She's not having a stopover in Guantanamo first?

Please try to understand what is happening. First, there is the request for extradition to be resolved before any 'transporting' to the US?

There is a thread specifically on this issue right here on AI, why not take this aspect over there if you want to continue?

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

avon b7 said:

tmay said:

Seth2015 said:

Madtiger said:

Seth2015 said:

I wonder how much Apple paid for this?

Zero.  Apple is not Android OEMs.  (BTW, DPreview is very authoritative in camera world.)

Don't you then find it interesting that when they run a blind test with 5,000,000+ votes - the iPhone doesn't come anywhere?
And when DXOMark (also a leader in optical tests) does their reviews, the iPhone comes 3 or 4 ?
And that any other review generally ends with the conclusion that although the iPhone is exceptional, it cannot match the Huawei?
Seen the night pictures between the two? They can't even really be compared.

Anyway - it seems really odd that although iPhone hasn't had a winning camera for 2 or 3 years, this crops up. Beating the Pixel is one - but beating the Huawei?

For the record, the XS is currently second behind the Huawei P20 Pro, 109 to 105, at DXOmark. That's not a huge lead by any stretch, and given the limitations of the Huawei in usability, there isn't going to be much, if any, iPhone buyers scurrying off to pick up a Mate 20 Pro. Mostly though, people are a lot less interested in high end camera features simply because the current systems are "good enough".

Obviously, DPReview found that the Mate 20 Pro didn't best the iPhone XS, because the finalists were only the Pixel 3 and the iPhone XS.

Oh btw, a blind, online test isn't really a test of image quality; it's actually a test of viewing conditions, and bias.

I'm not sure what you mean by usability.

The Huawei camera app has always had a full on Pro mode which is often praised by photographers precisely for its usability.

One of the major criticisms of iPhones is the very limited options out of the box. Also, the insistence of the phone to have absolute control of if you can even take a picture or not while in certain modes. The last one I read was regarding the HDR mode. Before that it was low light portrait mode.

The lead of the P20 Pro over the XS at DX0 is quite big. The surprising thing is that Apple's latest, and best iPhones ever, are sitting behind a phone that was released in March.

It's strange that the Mate 20 Pro has not been listed but there is speculation that Huawei is actually holding the results back for marketing reasons. To leave the P20 Pro in the spotlight for as long as possible and maximise sales (the P20 Pro is currently part of a marketing push). The same sources claim that the minute the P20 Pro sees a challenger, Huawei will release the Mate 20 Pro results which are supposedly in the 115 ball park (pure rumours of course but they came out of a huge packet of rumours and all the rest were correct).

comment on DXOMark P20 Pro review from Huawei P20 Pro user:

"I'm a photographer and have to agree with the below comment. This is a terrible cellphone. Bought it and completly regret it. This review doesnt take into consideration a lot of factors. On 40mp, the picture is so slow that it's only reliable for completly static pictures. You also cant zoom on 40mp. The camera also takes forever processing the picture and sometimes the picture isnt taken at all, if yoy move the camera to fast after pressing the shutter. It has a terrible timelapse, and slow motion videos are uselless, they are 5secs videos, you cant make them last longer. Soooooo disapointed, im aelling it and buying note9 a much more reliable phone."

Sounds like some older Nokia's, horrible usability, but you could get good images if you waited around long enough. Few bought them.

DXOMark doesn't test video at 4K, and frankly, DXOMark isn't a standard that I would use to choose any phone.

DPReview has earned its credibility over many years of solid reviews.

I've stated it before, and I'll state it again; there isn't a big market for smartphones with bleeding edge cameras, simply because most everything available is "good enough". Still, Huawei caters to people like you, who don't actually buy the high end devices, but love to proselytize Huawei specs. 

Just differentiation in the Android OS device world.

Don't you find it strange that since its release in March and having sold millions of them, this type of issue hasn't been picked up on en masse. Even with the phone included in untold reviews and used - side by side - with direct competitors?

You should be doubting he is a photographer and doubting he has a P20 Pro.

DX0 Mark is what it is. It is used throughout the smartphone industry and those that can (those that top the leaderboard) use often use it to market phones. Logical.

As has been shown time and time again 4K is rarely a selling point for a phone. How else would the P20 Series have been able to break records for Huawei and then follow through with the Mate 20 series so far off to a record start.

Most people buy phones that have 4K, not because of it.

There is a huge market for cameras with bleeding edge cameras. Millions sold support this idea and the camera IS a major selling point to those who buy them. 4K isn't.

Ask yourself how much time your average user spends recording 4K video and photos. 4K is a bonus for most users, nothing more. Go ahead and ask all your friends and colleagues. It is actually HIGHLY likely that if they are even recording videos they are doing so at non-4K resolution due to storage issues.