JustSomeGuy1
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How we ended up with the 'Pregnant Man' Emoji
addison huy said:Males can’t get pregnant so I don’t know why such an emoji would exist. It seems pointless. If your sex is male then you can’t have children this can’t be pregnant. All these gender and sex methods that are used to describe people now are so confusing. I remember when non of this really existed before and there were only men and women.Dear lazy person:If you can't be bothered to read what other people have written, why should we read what you wrote?This has been extensively covered here already. You are, for certain meanings of the word "male" which are used by a large portion of the population (though not, apparently, you), simply wrong.Lots of people remember when blacks had to sit in the back of the bus. And put up with getting killed for looking at whites the wrong way. Your memory of a simpler time doesn't make that time better, or more just. Also, what you remember amounts to a conspiracy of silence. These things existed. They were just concealed.
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How we ended up with the 'Pregnant Man' Emoji
GeorgeBMac said:
I would think there is far less reason to think it is related to transsexualism.JustSomeGuy1 said:GeorgeBMac said:waveparticle said:
Not just in principle. Any successful case?StrangeDays said:
Absolutely.waveparticle said:
Can trans man become pregnant?darkvader said:"Pregnant man" and "pregnant nonbinary person" are actual real-world things that happen. They exist. Sure, they're uncommon, but they are absolutely 100% real world people.To not intentionally not include them would be incredibly bigoted.Trans women are women. Trans men are men. Right wing nutjobs are easily offended snowflakes.You are conflating gender with sexual characteristics.And, saying a 'trans man' typically would mean a female who transitioned to living as a male. So yeh, unless the person had sex reassignment surgery or the hormonal therapy disrupted her cycles, then he could become pregnant.But all of that, I think is separate from this emoji question which suggests a biologic male becoming pregnant -- which is ridiculous.There is no reason to assume that the Emoji suggests "a biologic male becoming pregnant". ...Typically, when people see "guy" they think "guy".But yeh, put the emoji in the right context, and it could point to trans. But even then it would be shaky -- even an insult -- because the only way it could happen would be if a biologic female who went through all the steps of transitioning to a male became pregnant -- thus undoing everything he worked for and hoped for. It would far worse than they typical insult of using the wrong gender when addressing the person.You are simply mistaken about that. Some trans men have made that choice and have become pregnant, on purpose (use google, it's not hard to find). I think they're better equipped than you to decide what is an insult to them.I will admit that this seemed a bit strange to me too. But then I grew up in a culture that was extremely binary. When you absorb on a deeper level what it means to be nonbinary, it makes more sense. I'm sure some trans men feel entirely male, in every sense, and would be upset at the notion of getting pregnant. But there are, obviously, some who are comfortable with an in-between state, that is more male in appearance and behavior in general, but still capable of being pregnant and bearing a child. It seems weird to me, but why should anyone else give a crap about what seems weird to me? (Why, even, should I?) It's a big world and there's room in it for everyone... as long as they don't try to run other peoples' lives. -
How we ended up with the 'Pregnant Man' Emoji
waveparticle said:
Well, my question should be 'can trans woman become pregnant?'. Isn' pregnant one of the words in the hotly discussed emoji?GeorgeBMac said:waveparticle said:
Not just in principle. Any successful case?StrangeDays said:
Absolutely.waveparticle said:
Can trans man become pregnant?darkvader said:"Pregnant man" and "pregnant nonbinary person" are actual real-world things that happen. They exist. Sure, they're uncommon, but they are absolutely 100% real world people.To not intentionally not include them would be incredibly bigoted.Trans women are women. Trans men are men. Right wing nutjobs are easily offended snowflakes.You are conflating gender with sexual characteristics.And, saying a 'trans man' typically would mean a female who transitioned to living as a male. So yeh, unless the person had sex reassignment surgery or the hormonal therapy disrupted her cycles, then he could become pregnant.But all of that, I think is separate from this emoji question which suggests a biologic male becoming pregnant -- which is ridiculous.I think you've finally asked the question you expect to hear a "no" to. And indeed, to the best of my knowledge, it's not yet medically possible for a trans woman to become pregnant. Don't assume that that's going to be true forever though (I wrote about that earlier).However... how is that even relevant to the emoji everyone's discussing? A trans woman *looks like* a woman. The emoji is of someone who *looks like a man*. So, that would be a trans man, and some such people do indeed get pregnant....and again, why is reality relevant to emoji, which are replete with fantastical things like unicorns? -
How we ended up with the 'Pregnant Man' Emoji
GeorgeBMac said:waveparticle said:
Not just in principle. Any successful case?StrangeDays said:
Absolutely.waveparticle said:
Can trans man become pregnant?darkvader said:"Pregnant man" and "pregnant nonbinary person" are actual real-world things that happen. They exist. Sure, they're uncommon, but they are absolutely 100% real world people.To not intentionally not include them would be incredibly bigoted.Trans women are women. Trans men are men. Right wing nutjobs are easily offended snowflakes.You are conflating gender with sexual characteristics.And, saying a 'trans man' typically would mean a female who transitioned to living as a male. So yeh, unless the person had sex reassignment surgery or the hormonal therapy disrupted her cycles, then he could become pregnant.But all of that, I think is separate from this emoji question which suggests a biologic male becoming pregnant -- which is ridiculous.I'm fine with everything you've said (though I think it's odd that you think that you get to have the last word on what words mean)... up until this assumption. You're so far out on a ledge that Wile E. Coyote is looking at you dubiously.There is no reason to assume that the Emoji suggests "a biologic male becoming pregnant". In fact, since it's just a glyph, you get to decide what you think it is... and so does everyone else. Most people will say "it looks like a man, but pregnant". And that's the point. It *looks* like a man, just like a typical trans man. It says nothing about genetics, epigenetics, and antenatal development.The name of the glyph gives you no support either. "Man" or "male", you don't get to decide if it's referring to gender or sex. -
How we ended up with the 'Pregnant Man' Emoji
GeorgeBMac said:Pregnancy has nothing to do with gender -- so that makes this especially ludicrous.That is:Gender is a mental constuct. It's how a person perceives and feels about themself.Sex is a wide ranging set of physical characteristics from the pitch of the voice to the width of the hips (and of course what resides between the legs and on the chest).Efforts to eliminate gender distinctions are mostly all good and constructive.Efforts to eliminate distinctions of physical sex are mostly misguided.[While a transsexual can have a penis replaced with a vagina (and vice versa) and have breasts added or removed, those are mostly superficial rather than real change. While they can and do provide much needed comfort to the person (because it's hard to feel feminine if you look more like Donald than Ivanka), they did not actually change the inherent sex because the inherent sex is created by decades of sex hormones that produce permanent changes in almost every part of the body -- from the brain to the feet]In short:Efforts to erase gender distinctions are good.Efforts (like this one) to erase sexual distinctions are silly (like this one).George, say I mostly agree with you about use of language (for now, as I said the future's coming really really fast).You still haven't explained why any of that matters. After all, there are cases where people with male gender (using your nomenclature) still are of female sex (again, using your nomenclature), and become pregnant. There's your emoji.You also haven't explained why it matters if something is real or not. Unicorn emoji...
