dick applebaum
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Google ships first beta of Flutter framework for developing both iOS and Android apps
^^^ThisStrangeDays said:If Flutter is like the other middlewares, only when Flutter is updated to support the new APIs and hardware features will you be able to utilize them. It’s never been instant as the middleware platform itself must be updated to support the target platform features.Good one. I’ve been a Fortune 100 enterprise developer for almost twenty years and a Webby-winning dotcom webdev before that. We went thru all of this back when it was Java, with the same claims and the same complaints in the end. Native is better and will always be better than cross-platform-kit apps.^^^ This, too
Yes!dewme said:
I've never found a one-size-fits-all technology that is without compromises that ultimately limit its appeal. In fact, I've never seen a single language or toolset, much less a big conglomeration of things like Xamarin, .NET, or the many similar tools that resemble what Google is offering, that lives up to all of it's promises. This technology changes so often and is ultimately so huge and complex that developers struggle to reach proficiency in any one area, much less the 5 or 6 areas that a cross platform framework require. The promises always reach far beyond what most development organizations are able to achieve, and in the midst of these struggles, yet another cluster of technology arrives that promises even more. I've seen this pattern repeating constantly since at least the early 1990s with frameworks that offered cross platform GUI compatibility from a single (app) source code base for DOS, OS2, Windows, MFC, Borland (Windows), and Turbo Pascal.
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Google ships first beta of Flutter framework for developing both iOS and Android apps
Mmm... Been down that path (High-Level Code Generation) many times before don't care to go down it again.gatorguy said:
Dick. I offered you a partial answer in Post 18. The rest of the documentation which probably answers any other questions you have at the moment is here:dick applebaum said:
What version of Xcode? The latest release of Xcode is 9.3 Beta 3... Prolly, new release in next month.Mike Wuerthele said:
You still have to use Xcode. Flutter generates Xcode-compatible code.philboogie said:Is that even allowed, for iOS? I thought one needs to develop with Xcode/Swift for iOS - no porting. I must be missing something.
What about Swift? Latest version of Swift is Version 4. Swift Version 4, likely, will see quite a few dot releases this year as the language implementors focus on ABI Stability.
Even Swift 3 is evolving as certain dot releases are no longer supported and many language constructs are changed or deprecated.
What about evolving APIs -- ARKit, Airplay 2, for example?
My point here, is that just generating Xcode-compatible code is not and end result -- rather it is a starting point for making a Flutter App run on iOS. If you want anything but an outdated, vanilla iOS app, you will have to exploit the latest, hardware, languages, APIs...
If you do that then you will have created a separate codebase customized/optimized for iOS and iDevice hardware... With no way to push that codebase up the chain to Flutter. It is unlikely that you would update your customized/optimized app with Flutter -- as you'd just generate more outdated, vanilla code and have to repeat the customization/optimization.
https://flutter.io/
...and note that this is still in beta anyway and no doubt there are improvements and optimizations still coming.
For example in 1960, I went to work for a Lockheed subsidiary as the only programmer for an IBM 1401 Punched Card Computer. IBM provided several high-level code generators: Faster; RPG; CoBOL -- as well as a low-level symbolic programming language.
I vividly remember when IBM dropped 1401 CoBOL, because it had a square root function that was needed for an upcoming app... So I gave it ago...
Long story short, the app compiled fine, but wouldn't run... The high-level CoBOL generated square root subroutine took over 3K of memory... our 1401 had only 2K of memory.
To solidify the significance of this -- I was able to adapt an iterative square root process form a [punched card] calculator that did the job. It was simple, straight-forward and, AIR, took about 100 characters of memory.
FWIW, the link you provided was mostly Java (or Android) cod)... Never did like the language for [client] computer apps (OK for servers)... And I don't (won't) type semicolons anymore. The syntax of both Java (Android) and Objectve-C is too verbose -- difficult to write, read and maintain. With all its evolutionary changes, I prefer Swift! -
Google ships first beta of Flutter framework for developing both iOS and Android apps
I don't see Flutter or any cross-platform language dominating...asdasd said:Apple should be careful here. If a google controlled cross platform language starts to dominate a few things will happen.
Firstly the design language will be android first or only. Secondly if it predominates then new iOS features may lag. It depends on the Dart language bothering to implement them.
Thirdly general mobile devs are less likely to care about how god their iOS skills are and won’t necessarily be watching WWDC for the next big thing. Instead it will be the dart conference where google will tell them they can now use that iOS 12 feature, 3 months later.
Theres a push to conformity in mobile dev already which is unsatisfying and could harm
iOS as a pre dominant platform.
First, quality developers will write platform-specific apps using the best tools, languages, APIs, etc for the target platform.
Second, more mediocre developers will use the higher level cross-platform language to create LCD apps for multiple platforms that are (or maybe) just good enough -- but won't run well on either platform.
Third, the maybe just good enough apps won't sell, or if free -- won't be used.
There are too many good iOS apps to waste time trying to use an LCD app.
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Google ships first beta of Flutter framework for developing both iOS and Android apps
LOL... guess we'll have to amend the phrase again!auxio said:
And feel right nowhere.dick applebaum said:
"Write once, run anywhere!" they said...StrangeDays said:"Write once, run anywhere!" they said...
yeah still no. If anybody remembers cross-platform apps like PayPal (I haven't used it in years) they're always weird-feeling, because they don't use all the native motifs. I beta tested one for some friends and it was clearly designed by Android guys who just didn't get how apps should look & feel on iOS, re-inventing new ways of working that weren't needed, ignoring 3D touch, still no X support, etc.. Just alien imposters.
AIR, that phrase was later amended to "Write once, debug everywhere!" That says it all...
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Google ships first beta of Flutter framework for developing both iOS and Android apps
What version of Xcode? The latest release of Xcode is 9.3 Beta 3... Prolly, new release in next month.Mike Wuerthele said:
You still have to use Xcode. Flutter generates Xcode-compatible code.philboogie said:Is that even allowed, for iOS? I thought one needs to develop with Xcode/Swift for iOS - no porting. I must be missing something.
What about Swift? Latest version of Swift is Version 4. Swift Version 4, likely, will see quite a few dot releases this year as the language implementors focus on ABI Stability.
Even Swift 3 is evolving as certain dot releases are no longer supported and many language constructs are changed or deprecated.
What about evolving APIs -- ARKit, Airplay 2, for example?
My point here, is that just generating Xcode-compatible code is not and end result -- rather it is a starting point for making a Flutter App run on iOS. If you want anything but an outdated, vanilla iOS app, you will have to exploit the latest, hardware, languages, APIs...
If you do that then you will have created a separate codebase customized/optimized for iOS and iDevice hardware... With no way to push that codebase up the chain to Flutter. It is unlikely that you would update your customized/optimized app with Flutter -- as you'd just generate more outdated, vanilla code and have to repeat the customization/optimization.
