How many of us use dvorak?

amorya

I use Dvorak on my laptop and Palm keyboard, and QWERTY on the college computers.



Dvorak is much better, it's a big difference! When I was learning, it was in the summer, I just didn't use anything else for two months. After that, I had to relearn QWERTY, whilst switching often. That allowed me to master both layouts. Now I can switch easily, at a moment's notice



Amorya

ender

Well?



I'm just learning, but it seems very nice. Thoughts?



-Ender



(yeah, I'm still awfully slow, so I'm keeping this short.)

hmurchison

Where can I find the best Dvorak keyboard. I'm interested in giving it a try as QWERTY just plains sucks. How have you taken to it and how hard is it to go back and forth between Dvorak and QWERTY

ender

Well, I am using my existing keyboard, just with a different layout (found in the International CP in OS X). I'm on my Ti 667 most often, so a different keyboard would be of little use.



Having said that, however, I really like the layout. I've been at it for 2 days now and am up to ~20 wpm (I type ~60 wpm with 'qwerty'). 'Dvorak' is really quite intuitive.



Most people I've talked to say they have no problem switching back and forth, but do not suggest doing so until mastering dvorak, as it can really mess the learning up.



-Ender



[ 02-28-2002: Message edited by: Ender ]</p>

ender

*bumping because of the crazy time*

logan cale

I rearranged a keyboard in my lab to Dvorak (despite not knowing it yet) as a trick. I also changed it to Dvorak so it would actually work. Was rather amusing. For a few minutes.



At least it wasn't invented by Dvorak (John C.).

robo

I use Dvorak. I've actually kind of forgotten how to type QWERTY, which is annoying once in a while when i have to use a lab computer etc.



-robo

ghost_user_name

This thread has got me thinking about pulling the spare keyboard from my closet and rearranging it for Dvorak. Before I go and start re-thinking how I type, what is the advantage to Dvorak? Are the keys really arranged for better access to frequently used letters in English? I've been using QWERTY for some 17 years (aah, the first Macintosh!) and imagine that it'd probably be pretty difficult for me to untrain my memory muscle.



So, how easy/difficult was the change for any of the converts here?

matsu

I've always thought this a good idea but never got around to trying it. I type about 40-50 wpm but it's pure hunt and peck, looking at the keyboard most of the time, and only using about 4 fingers to boot. I'm like a really good handicapped typist! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> If the layout of keys made more sense, I'd probably type a whole lot faster.



Question, you all just re-arranged your keys by popping them out and re-seating them in the DVORAK layout? I think you'll probably have to be carefull which keyboard you use as some of the 'ergo' keyboards have different size/angled keys on the different rows; you could end up with a very funny feeling keyboard. Is this easy to do for laptop keyboards?

ender

Great links:

<a href="http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak/"; target="_blank">http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak/</a>;

<a href="http://www.cse.ogi.edu/~dylan/dvorak/dvorak.html"; target="_blank">http://www.cse.ogi.edu/~dylan/dvorak/dvorak.html</a>;

<a href="http://www.mit.edu:8001/people/jcb/Dvorak/"; target="_blank">http://www.mit.edu:8001/people/jcb/Dvorak/</a>;

<a href="http://www.karelia.com/abcd/abcd.html"; target="_blank">http://www.karelia.com/abcd/abcd.html</a>;



Those will explain the benefits very well.



Matsu: switching to dvorak may help you significantly.



All: don't rearrange your keyboards. Just memorize the key locations. That promotes the best typing habits (not ever looking at the keyboard).



I'm up to about 20 wpm now after 3 days, I think I'll be back to my normal speed of 60 wpm in about 3 weeks.



One interesting fact: 30% of the keystrokes you type with QWERTY are on the homerow. 71% of the keystrokes you type with DVORAK are on the homerow.



-Ender

sizzle chest

So if I already type 70-80 WPM on QWERTY, and don't have any ergonomic problems with it, and frequently have to change keyboards at worko, would you say I'm probably NOT a good candidate to try to learn Dvorak? That's my impression, but I'm open to being talked out of it.

ender

That's the general consensus, it seems. Though one of my professors writes C++ code at 180 wpm (yup, not a typo) with dvorak. So there's quite a bit of headroom.



And thats not to say that it won't be better for your hands in the long-run. Waiting until after you are injured to change isn't wise no matter what the injury. An ounce of prevention... and all that jazz.



Just from my short time using it, I can already tell that it is significantly more efficient.



-Ender

ghost_user_name

Could you just re-arrange the keys on your keyboard and then change it to dvorak in the Keyboard Control Panel? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" />

ghost_user_name

[quote]Though one of my professors writes C++ code at 180 wpm (yup, not a typo) with dvorak.<hr></blockquote> :eek:



Thanks for all the info. I'm definitely going to rearrange my spare keyboard and try dvorak for a while. Sorry, my memory isn't good enough just to simply memorize the key locations without something to look at! [quote]Originally posted by Nick:

<strong>Could you just re-arrange the keys on your keyboard and then change it to dvorak in the Keyboard Control Panel?</strong><hr></blockquote>Umm. Yeah. That was the whole point. <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

paul

C am gocbi ekrpak br,w C b..e b..e mrp. lpajycj.

robo

The problem with rearranging keyboards is that a lot of keyboards have keys that are shaped for the row that they belong in. Rearranging the keys might make for a very funny looking (and feeling) keyboard).



Personally, i just type on a regular keyboard with the Dvorak keyboard setting. I never look at the keys.



If you need to look at the keys to type, you probably won't benefit from Dvorak anyway, since you probably can't type very fast anyway.



-robo

cdhostage

180 Words Per Minute! Dear Lord!

ender

After some practice this weekend, I am typing somewhere around 35-40 wpm (at least in my estimation, I don't really have any way to measure for certain).



HTML is much easier to write in dvorak, I like where the "&lt;,&gt;" keys are. Haven't had a Java assignment since starting this whole thing though, so I don't know how that will go yet. The "{,}" keys seem to be a long way to reach on a regular basis.



And psantora, I think you should take a look at that last link I posted.



-Ender

paul

[quote]Originally posted by robo:

<strong>The problem with rearranging keyboards is that a lot of keyboards have keys that are shaped for the row that they belong in. Rearranging the keys might make for a very funny looking (and feeling) keyboard).</strong><hr></blockquote>

Using the usb pro keyboard works fine for re-aranging(sp?) the keys--i used to do that all the time to my little brother--boy was that fun!



[quote]Originally posted by robo:

<strong>Personally, i just type on a regular keyboard with the Dvorak keyboard setting. I never look at the keys.



If you need to look at the keys to type, you probably won't benefit from Dvorak anyway, since you probably can't type very fast anyway.



-robo</strong><hr></blockquote>



I would just loook @ the keys when I am learning... I mean it is a whole lot easyer for me to have a small pic of the keyboard layout on the screen itself so I dont need to glance down, but once I get better at it the less I will need it. The biggest problem for me is the fact that there are no orientation keys if I re-arrange the keys on the pro keyboard... also, the fact that I cant change the keyboard settings of the comps in school is a huge setback for me... maybe over the summer. What about laptop keyboards? can you switch the keys on those? I am planning on getting one...



For the hour or so I was using dvorak over this weekend I noticed a much easier time typing words... but I am so ingraned into qwerty--it will be hard to switch, but I can already see the benefits...

Ender thanks for the links, I will use that training one soon--it is actually quite good--i wouldnt have visited if you didnt bring it up...

-Paul



Edit: also, I find it hard to talk to people on AIM using DVORAK -- most of my abbreviations get screwed up--it is like speaking in a different language...



[ 03-04-2002: Message edited by: psantora ]</p>

ender

Well, I can say now that I am fully dvorakicized.



I have regained about 2/3 of my qwerty speed, but have far greater accuracy. I find all the most commonly used letters to be more accessible now, with the exception of the 'w' key. I use that one all the time, but it's a tough one to hit (where the ',' used to be). I think I'll have it down within the week though.



Qwerty is a pain in the butt now, but I can use it in a pinch if I have to. Now, though, I no longer *want* to use qwerty. I can still type close to my old speed with it, but I do have the tendency to revert to dvorak.



The last link I posted above was what really helped me learn dvorak, I strongly recommend using that site to aid in the transition. I made the transition in about 5 days. I usually learn things really fast, but I would bet that most people could do it in under a week of full-time use. Just pick a week where typing speed isn't of critical importance.



Anyway, off to take my calculus 2 midterm now.

-Ender

whee

I just started using dvorak last night because of this thread and <a href="http://www.acm.vt.edu/~jmaxwell/dvorak/keyboard.html"; target="_blank">this</a> page. I can only do around 10-20 wpm (down from 100+ heh), but it's comfortable. This is really trying my patience, but I figure it'll be worth it.



Less hand movement can never hurt.