1) I think, like many , that the next gen Cinema Displays will have built-in iSight Cameras AS WELL As IR sensors. The USB ports are already built into current CInema Displays and every other Mac offering has a built-in IR sensor and, save for the Mac Mini, has an iSight.
2) This new iChat offers many new possibilities. It is the main reason, for me, why a stable version of Leopard can't get here soon enough.
The ability to take control of user's system via iChat will allow me to install programs, adjust settings, and demonstrate the beauty of OS X without having to instruct a switcher blindly of anything mroe than setting up iChat.
I'm thinking of using this new iChat for remote viewing--and downloading-- of my home media by using commands in iChat. I'm hoping to use this in leu of using VNC or turning on Apache to access my home media and files, though this depends on the iPhone's implementation of iChat.
Tip of the iceberg I bet. I can't wait to see all the secret stuff
And no negative comments yet ... come on Trolls you are slow today
Users expectations of Leopard are way too high. It's my opinion this is not the tip of the iceberg but on par with the average upgrades we can expect.
An overhaul of Finder would be nice, ichat working correctly would be nice, iDVD not having an encoding bug would be nice.
Not making the same mistake Microsoft made by making their new OS a total resource hog will also be nice.
New isn't always better, Tiger is a very good version of Macs OS and I expect many will stay with it for a while because they will find there is very little reason to upgrade to Leopard. Unless you really feel the need to switch from a brushed metal to a plain metal backround which is about all we have seen to this point.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
No, it's not a joke. However, you are interpreting it wrong.
It's not that we want the camera in the frickin tower, that is a dumb idea, but we want an option for an iSight... period. Apple kinda stopped selling them externally so those of us who bought a nice shiny Mac Pro can't do video conferencing like the cheapo MacBooks can.
We also got shafted out of the Apple remote, which makes for an awesome presentation tool for showing photo proofs or even for using iTunes while you work.
The pro customers got shafted. I had to scour eBay for an Apple product since they don't sell any form of external iSight anymore.
Of course, we know about the "solution" question. But it really is a question about the displays, we all know that too.
We can only wonder why Apple decided to discontinue the isight camera itself. Perhaps it was no longer selling well enough to keep in the line. Perhaps the new displays are unexpectedly delayed, and we should have seen new ones already.
But this isn't such a big deal. There are plenty of other small cameras out there that will work. You really don't need an Apple solution.
Besides, buying an Apple display may be too expensive for most purposes, if it's mostly being justified on the basis of having a built-in camera.
Unless, of course, they have figured out how to make that display camera work, and we're waiting for the bugs in that to be quashed. That would be worth waiting for, if it worked well.
There are other remotes available for the Mac as well.
How about iChat for Windows bundled into iTunes, activated with your AppleID (same as on iTunes purchase) and ability to make iChat <-> iPhone calls [iPhone via WiFi]?
Why not establish your own IM network when you have such big beachheads in place already?
Because the bigger beachhead is the MS Network. Plus, we already have MS Network (now called "Windows Live"), ICQ, Yahoo, AOL, Jabber am I missing any?? It's a mess, and the world doesn't need ANOTHER network, imho
Also, I am always nervous of Apple giving away ANY crown jewels to the Windows platform. Yes, they gave iTunes to the Windows base, but that supports iPod sales to a huge market. But there is no financial benefit that I can see for them to release iChat for Windows AND support a new network that they'd have to try and draw people over to.
Windows Live is THRUST down PC users with every OEM licence out there, and it's probably #1 as a result. Let's just get iChat plugged in there with rock solid video capabilities and be done with it.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
Apple has a very major contractual commitment to ATT/Cingular with the iPhone and meeting this commitment is more important than delivering Leopard in June. The last thing that Apple needs is a problem with the iPhone when first released and that is why they would be allocating all resources necessary. After these resources finishes working 15/7 to get the iPhone out they will get the weekend off and return to 15/7 for Leopard.
Keep remembering that contractual commitment to ATT and a lot of things will fall into place.
Apple needs to either find a way of making iChat work with all/most other IM clients around, or make a Win version of iChat. Personally I hope they do both. They also need to make iChat a top-up VoiP client too.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenaustus
Apple has a very major contractual commitment to ATT/Cingular with the iPhone and meeting this commitment is more important than delivering Leopard in June. The last thing that Apple needs is a problem with the iPhone when first released and that is why they would be allocating all resources necessary. After these resources finishes working 15/7 to get the iPhone out they will get the weekend off and return to 15/7 for Leopard.
Keep remembering that contractual commitment to ATT and a lot of things will fall into place.
I totally agree. Any opinion that believes Apple doesn't care about the Mac or Leopard because of the iPhone is very short-sighted. Apple has a major joint responsibility to fulfil for this INAUGURAL launch, and it is responsible business practice to make sure the iPhone gets to market, properly.
Apple needs to either find a way of making iChat work with all/most other IM clients around, or make a Win version of iChat. Personally I hope they do both.
I choose your option A.
Don't give away a jewel for no profit. And yet, getting iChat to tie into MSN perfectly would further show how fluent the Mac platform is. Like, it's an EMBARRASSMENT how poor the Windows Live messaging support is on the Mac platform! EVERYBODY on the the PC side uses it (for better or for worse). When I'm counselling potential "switchers" it's unfortunately one of the things I feel obliged to point out. And the options where shareware developers are TRYING to make MSN Messenger cam support work (that would be Mercury Messenger and aMSN), the results are choppy... and silent.
This doesn't sound very safe. A spyware program on your computer could get all your friends address details from address book and mail them to a spam company.
It could then open a chat with them that looks like it comes from you that says "Hey, double click this!" and it sends them an infected file.
I agree, it sounds pretty risky. Let's hope they keep it safe.
Perhaps, if people would actually start using iChat one day.. then Apple would become more careful with features like this. I like iChat, but I have like 2-4 percent ichat friends and the rest are on MSN or ICQ even... this won't change overnight.. at least not when iChat isn't available on Windows..
I fear that too many people are dismissing Leopard out of hand. The number of bullet points on the spine of a box does not accurately convey the depth of an upgrade. People are not taking into account the possibility that there are significant enhancements in the system's foundation. Changes like these are rarely noticed, but constantly felt.
Apple's transition to Intel occurred against the backdrop of a larger shift in the industry. In the Leopard timeframe we are going to see a lot of hardware advances. For example, Leopard will need to run well on machines with many more processor cores than we have now. To exploit the power of these systems, certain assumptions and familiar patterns must be rethought. The task can be daunting for even moderately complex applications. For an operating system and set of bundled applications, vastly more so.
I suspect Leopard will not disappoint when paired with the technology that is on the horizon. But, that is just my opinion.
On a side note, quite glad to see that you can now point iChat Theater to any NSView, rather than having to render to a CoreVideo buffer.
She-who-must-be-obeyed (the wife) has a brief video visit with her brother in Australia almost daily via Skype - he won a very nice PC rig and won't buy a Mac for a while so iChat is currently out for them. I would love to see Apple work with Skype, or deliver an iSight camera that includes Windows software - like they did with iTunes. The video on Skype is very choppy and the audio gets that way far too often. It's a fraction of what you get with video iChats. I'll buy Leopard in a heartbeat if they solve this problem. Actually, I'll buy Leopard in a heartbeat anyway!
Universal Plug-in IM Architecture with MSN and a few other "must-haves" and example documentation would be a nice "Leopard only" feature and shut some people up.
Why no iSight? Because where would you put it? The Mac towers are just freaking big most people have them down on the floor under a desk (I'm afraid my desk would collapse under the weight of my G5 tower). On an apple monitor, possibly (then again, who wants to spend that kind of money after forking over $2500+ for a macpro?)
I can one use for an iSight enabled macpro. Maybe if you've got a foot fetish
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
Why are people still asking this question?
Most Mac Pro's are not kept on the desk. My machines are under the desk.
Even in the rare desk mounted situation, the computer is well to the side of the person. That's not exactly useful.
I'm hoping the question was just a joke, but as so many people ask it, I wonder...
.../reads many other replys
Okay Okay... so I mis-labeled my post, and I understand the multiple smacks in the head I got for it. What I meant was I don't want to buy a MacPro until they release new ACDs with builtin iSights.
Why? Because there's no reason to buy a new rig when I know they are going to update both relatively soon. Especially when the ati R600 is rumored for MacPro. Furthermore, why would I buy an over-priced under-specced display that doesn't include iSight when it had been made clear that iChat is a core feature in Leapord (to developers) and apple coincidentially sp? discontinues iSight / drops prices on ACDs. And no I don't want a Dell or BenQ with a 3rd party camera or a discontinued iSight (as a graphic artist I like my workspace neat with clean lines).
She-who-must-be-obeyed (the wife) has a brief video visit with her brother in Australia almost daily via Skype - he won a very nice PC rig and won't buy a Mac for a while so iChat is currently out for them. I would love to see Apple work with Skype, or deliver an iSight camera that includes Windows software - like they did with iTunes. The video on Skype is very choppy and the audio gets that way far too often. It's a fraction of what you get with video iChats.
iChat is compatible with AIM. Can't you do video chat that way?
What's the best way to build the exciting new possibilities of Mac OS X Leopard into your application? The Apple Worldwide Developers Conference is a great place to start. That's where developers like Mark Swanson of Renaissance Learning will be able to work with Apple engineers like Peter Westen to turn an iChat video conference into an educational experience.
iChat Theater is just one of the powerful new technologies taking center stage at this year's conference. Explore the WWDC 2007 website and see what else is in store.
I have used it through AIM and that works fine. When using it with the iChat server on Mac Server, it is pretty unreliable. IM works, but video and audio chat are not reliable enough to support work-at-home folks through our firewall.
I use both. I even use one that will tunnel through a VPN or a VLAN, or both. I just open all the relevant ports up on my firewall. Ports are your worst nightmare if you don't know what they are off the top of the hand, trust me.
If you can use it on localhost fine, your issue is your firewall.
Comments
I would love to see iChat have the support for Skype and MSN (without using Jabber)
So why no iSight on MacPro?
Because I would think not many people would like to hunch down under their desk just to video chat with someone.
2) This new iChat offers many new possibilities. It is the main reason, for me, why a stable version of Leopard can't get here soon enough.
The ability to take control of user's system via iChat will allow me to install programs, adjust settings, and demonstrate the beauty of OS X without having to instruct a switcher blindly of anything mroe than setting up iChat.
I'm thinking of using this new iChat for remote viewing--and downloading-- of my home media by using commands in iChat. I'm hoping to use this in leu of using VNC or turning on Apache to access my home media and files, though this depends on the iPhone's implementation of iChat.
Tip of the iceberg I bet. I can't wait to see all the secret stuff
And no negative comments yet ... come on Trolls you are slow today
Users expectations of Leopard are way too high. It's my opinion this is not the tip of the iceberg but on par with the average upgrades we can expect.
An overhaul of Finder would be nice, ichat working correctly would be nice, iDVD not having an encoding bug would be nice.
Not making the same mistake Microsoft made by making their new OS a total resource hog will also be nice.
New isn't always better, Tiger is a very good version of Macs OS and I expect many will stay with it for a while because they will find there is very little reason to upgrade to Leopard. Unless you really feel the need to switch from a brushed metal to a plain metal backround which is about all we have seen to this point.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
No, it's not a joke. However, you are interpreting it wrong.
It's not that we want the camera in the frickin tower, that is a dumb idea, but we want an option for an iSight... period. Apple kinda stopped selling them externally so those of us who bought a nice shiny Mac Pro can't do video conferencing like the cheapo MacBooks can.
We also got shafted out of the Apple remote, which makes for an awesome presentation tool for showing photo proofs or even for using iTunes while you work.
The pro customers got shafted. I had to scour eBay for an Apple product since they don't sell any form of external iSight anymore.
Of course, we know about the "solution" question. But it really is a question about the displays, we all know that too.
We can only wonder why Apple decided to discontinue the isight camera itself. Perhaps it was no longer selling well enough to keep in the line. Perhaps the new displays are unexpectedly delayed, and we should have seen new ones already.
But this isn't such a big deal. There are plenty of other small cameras out there that will work. You really don't need an Apple solution.
Besides, buying an Apple display may be too expensive for most purposes, if it's mostly being justified on the basis of having a built-in camera.
Unless, of course, they have figured out how to make that display camera work, and we're waiting for the bugs in that to be quashed. That would be worth waiting for, if it worked well.
There are other remotes available for the Mac as well.
How about iChat for Windows bundled into iTunes, activated with your AppleID (same as on iTunes purchase) and ability to make iChat <-> iPhone calls [iPhone via WiFi]?
Why not establish your own IM network when you have such big beachheads in place already?
Because the bigger beachhead is the MS Network. Plus, we already have MS Network (now called "Windows Live"), ICQ, Yahoo, AOL, Jabber am I missing any?? It's a mess, and the world doesn't need ANOTHER network, imho
Also, I am always nervous of Apple giving away ANY crown jewels to the Windows platform. Yes, they gave iTunes to the Windows base, but that supports iPod sales to a huge market. But there is no financial benefit that I can see for them to release iChat for Windows AND support a new network that they'd have to try and draw people over to.
Windows Live is THRUST down PC users with every OEM licence out there, and it's probably #1 as a result. Let's just get iChat plugged in there with rock solid video capabilities and be done with it.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
Apple has a very major contractual commitment to ATT/Cingular with the iPhone and meeting this commitment is more important than delivering Leopard in June. The last thing that Apple needs is a problem with the iPhone when first released and that is why they would be allocating all resources necessary. After these resources finishes working 15/7 to get the iPhone out they will get the weekend off and return to 15/7 for Leopard.
Keep remembering that contractual commitment to ATT and a lot of things will fall into place.
It is very clear that Apple does not see Leopard as a big money maker if they did they wouldn't have pulled resources off Leopard to work on iphone, its clear they see iphone far more as a make or break product over Leopard.
Apple has a very major contractual commitment to ATT/Cingular with the iPhone and meeting this commitment is more important than delivering Leopard in June. The last thing that Apple needs is a problem with the iPhone when first released and that is why they would be allocating all resources necessary. After these resources finishes working 15/7 to get the iPhone out they will get the weekend off and return to 15/7 for Leopard.
Keep remembering that contractual commitment to ATT and a lot of things will fall into place.
I totally agree. Any opinion that believes Apple doesn't care about the Mac or Leopard because of the iPhone is very short-sighted. Apple has a major joint responsibility to fulfil for this INAUGURAL launch, and it is responsible business practice to make sure the iPhone gets to market, properly.
Apple needs to either find a way of making iChat work with all/most other IM clients around, or make a Win version of iChat. Personally I hope they do both.
I choose your option A.
Don't give away a jewel for no profit. And yet, getting iChat to tie into MSN perfectly would further show how fluent the Mac platform is. Like, it's an EMBARRASSMENT how poor the Windows Live messaging support is on the Mac platform! EVERYBODY on the the PC side uses it (for better or for worse). When I'm counselling potential "switchers" it's unfortunately one of the things I feel obliged to point out. And the options where shareware developers are TRYING to make MSN Messenger cam support work (that would be Mercury Messenger and aMSN), the results are choppy... and silent.
This doesn't sound very safe. A spyware program on your computer could get all your friends address details from address book and mail them to a spam company.
It could then open a chat with them that looks like it comes from you that says "Hey, double click this!" and it sends them an infected file.
I agree, it sounds pretty risky. Let's hope they keep it safe.
Perhaps, if people would actually start using iChat one day.. then Apple would become more careful with features like this. I like iChat, but I have like 2-4 percent ichat friends and the rest are on MSN or ICQ even... this won't change overnight.. at least not when iChat isn't available on Windows..
Apple's transition to Intel occurred against the backdrop of a larger shift in the industry. In the Leopard timeframe we are going to see a lot of hardware advances. For example, Leopard will need to run well on machines with many more processor cores than we have now. To exploit the power of these systems, certain assumptions and familiar patterns must be rethought. The task can be daunting for even moderately complex applications. For an operating system and set of bundled applications, vastly more so.
I suspect Leopard will not disappoint when paired with the technology that is on the horizon. But, that is just my opinion.
On a side note, quite glad to see that you can now point iChat Theater to any NSView, rather than having to render to a CoreVideo buffer.
Why no iSight? Because where would you put it? The Mac towers are just freaking big most people have them down on the floor under a desk (I'm afraid my desk would collapse under the weight of my G5 tower). On an apple monitor, possibly (then again, who wants to spend that kind of money after forking over $2500+ for a macpro?)
I can one use for an iSight enabled macpro. Maybe if you've got a foot fetish
Why are people still asking this question?
Most Mac Pro's are not kept on the desk. My machines are under the desk.
Even in the rare desk mounted situation, the computer is well to the side of the person. That's not exactly useful.
I'm hoping the question was just a joke, but as so many people ask it, I wonder...
.../reads many other replys
Okay Okay... so I mis-labeled my post, and I understand the multiple smacks in the head I got for it. What I meant was I don't want to buy a MacPro until they release new ACDs with builtin iSights.
Why? Because there's no reason to buy a new rig when I know they are going to update both relatively soon. Especially when the ati R600 is rumored for MacPro. Furthermore, why would I buy an over-priced under-specced display that doesn't include iSight when it had been made clear that iChat is a core feature in Leapord (to developers) and apple coincidentially sp? discontinues iSight / drops prices on ACDs. And no I don't want a Dell or BenQ with a 3rd party camera or a discontinued iSight (as a graphic artist I like my workspace neat with clean lines).
Sorry I was so vague earlier
She-who-must-be-obeyed (the wife) has a brief video visit with her brother in Australia almost daily via Skype - he won a very nice PC rig and won't buy a Mac for a while so iChat is currently out for them. I would love to see Apple work with Skype, or deliver an iSight camera that includes Windows software - like they did with iTunes. The video on Skype is very choppy and the audio gets that way far too often. It's a fraction of what you get with video iChats.
iChat is compatible with AIM. Can't you do video chat that way?
What's the best way to build the exciting new possibilities of Mac OS X Leopard into your application? The Apple Worldwide Developers Conference is a great place to start. That's where developers like Mark Swanson of Renaissance Learning will be able to work with Apple engineers like Peter Westen to turn an iChat video conference into an educational experience.
iChat Theater is just one of the powerful new technologies taking center stage at this year's conference. Explore the WWDC 2007 website and see what else is in store.
iChat is compatible with AIM. Can't you do video chat that way?
I haven't managed to get it working, the only way i have found to do mac -> windows video chat is skype
I have used it through AIM and that works fine. When using it with the iChat server on Mac Server, it is pretty unreliable. IM works, but video and audio chat are not reliable enough to support work-at-home folks through our firewall.
I use both. I even use one that will tunnel through a VPN or a VLAN, or both. I just open all the relevant ports up on my firewall. Ports are your worst nightmare if you don't know what they are off the top of the hand, trust me.
If you can use it on localhost fine, your issue is your firewall.