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Apple rockets up Fortune 500 list, still trails HP

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
Apple placed 17th in Fortune's annual ratings of the 500 largest corporations in America, leaping 18 spots from last year's 35th place finish.

Pushing Apple into the top 20 was strong year-over-year revenue growth which saw earnings per share nearly double in 2011 compared to 2010, which allowed the company to offer a dividend for the first time since 1995.

According to Fortune, the iPhone maker's performance in the "Computers, Office Equipment" industry was topped only by Hewlett-Packard, which finished 10th overall. HP's revenue totaled over $127 billion compared to Apple's $108 billion, however the percent of change from 2010 was a stark contrast between the two companies which grew 1 percent and 66 percent, respectively. Apple's profit skyrocketed to nearly $26 billion representing an 85 percent change from 2010, while HP saw negative growth of 19 percent with a little over $7 billion in profits.

When evaluating strictly on profit, Apple's earnings gave it a third place finish overall, outdone by Chevron's $26.8 billion and list-leader Exxon Mobil's $41 billion on revenue of almost $453 billion. The Cupertino, Calif., company placed 7th, 4th and 2nd in revenue growth over the past year, 5 years and 10 years, respectively.

In its recent late-April earnings call, Apple announced its best second quarter ever with $11.6 billion in profit on revenue of $39.19 billion, representing a 94 percent growth year-to-year. Almost all of the company's product lines saw positive growth during the quarter led by 35.1 million iPhones sales representing an 88 percent unit growth. Apple sold 11.8 million iPads and 4 million Macs that accounted for 151 percent and 7 percent unit growth, respectively. iPods sales declined 15 percent from the year ago quarter with 7.7 million sold.

During a following earnings conference call, Apple Chief Financial Officer Peter Oppenheimer noted that one of Apple's most important products, the iPhone, was making headway in enterprise and cited certain U.S. government agencies that are also making the switch to iOS.

Fortune 500
Apple ranks No. 17 on the 2012 Fortune 500 list. | Source: Fortune


Over the past five years Apple has become the world's largest company by market cap, a leader in the smartphone market and one of the top PC vendors worldwide.

Apple is looking to continue its run as demand for the company's devices in emerging markets like China is expected to fuel sales in the coming quarters.
post #2 of 22

The Fortune 500 is such an anachronism, with its focus on revenue. Has nothing necessarily to do with who's creating value.

post #3 of 22

HP? That dinosaur? Useless list.

post #4 of 22

Yeah, well Apple will topple HP within the next year at the rate Apple and HP are going.  They just a little ways to go in terms of being Number 1.  This time next year, they'll probably be number 4.  And then it will take a while to take over Exxon, but they'll surpass Exxon for Net Profits without too much problems.

post #5 of 22
I don't know Tim Cook.
I've never met Tim Cook.

But I know he doesn't give a damn about this.
Smoke me a kipper. I'll be back for breakfast.
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Smoke me a kipper. I'll be back for breakfast.
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post #6 of 22
Ain't that the truth. He does seem to get excited by what he sees ahead in China, though.
post #7 of 22

Apple seem to knock off a major revenue competitor every year and will do so again this year. With Apple's FY ending in September, the $108Bn is not really CY2011 which would include the insane holiday quarter (which was about $20Bn more than the same one the year before). Amusingly, that would put Apple at or slightly above HP's 2011.

 

Just using the Apple FY

 

FY09 - $43Bn - not sure who they were gunning for? Still about $10Bn behind Nokia in 2009

FY10 - $65Bn - edges MS

FY11 - $108Bn - edges IBM - and the iPhone represents a business almost as large as all of MS

FY12 - $170Bn (est.) - crucifies HP, edges Samsung Electronics (maybe/just) - slightly ahead so far in FY12

FY13 - Anyone wanna bet against $250Bn?
 

post #8 of 22

Wow, I had no idea HP could have $127 billion in revenue.
 

post #9 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Wow, I had no idea HP could have $127 billion in revenue.
 

Well, let's see now:  HP ... 127 billion revenue, 7 billion in profits. ..... Apple, 108 billion in revenue, 26 billion in profits. In Texas they would say that HP is "all hat ... no cattle".

Apple, bigger than Google, ..... bigger than Microsoft,   The universe is unfolding as it should. Thanks, Apple.
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Apple, bigger than Google, ..... bigger than Microsoft,   The universe is unfolding as it should. Thanks, Apple.
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post #10 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

Well, let's see now:  HP ... 127 billion revenue, 7 billion in profits. ..... Apple, 108 billion in revenue, 26 billion in profits. In Texas they would say that HP is "all hat ... no cattle".

 

I'd say HP has a profit problem.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #11 of 22

Revenue? What an idiotic list. 

post #12 of 22

Exxon makes 41 BILLION PROFIT?????????

 

How can they justify those gas prices? They must be making even more of a margin that Apple is. And people say Apple gouges its customers.

 

I say its time for some regulation in this oil industry. People are suffering just so the CEOs at exxon can buy another priivate jet. There is a huge difference between apple margin and exxon margin

 

Apple margin is on products that are not NEEDS but WANTS. 

Exxon products on the other hand are factored into EVERYTHING you buy. Your gas in your car, the cost of delivery of the food you buy cause guess what, its came on a truck. The cost of the clothes you wear cause guess what, it came on a truck. If your power plant uses natural gas, they got you there again. 

 

This is disgusting.

 

OT though, good job apple. This should be lesson to all companies. Apple came back from the brink to be No.3. If that isn't a 'never say die, anything is possible' attitude then what is? 

post #13 of 22

We know Apple's just stockpiling cash.

 

Where exactly does Exxon's $41,000,000,000 go?

post #14 of 22

How exactly do you quantify "value" ?
 

post #15 of 22

Very interesting set of data.

 

Apple: $26bn profit on $108bn revenue

 

Microsoft: $23bn profit on $70bn revenue

 

Yet if you listen to people on here MS is all but dead. I'm not a fan of MS but it just shows how ill informed this forum is.

 

Also 17th place is a lot lower than I thought they were given all the hoopla regarding how supposedly under valued the share price is. It just reminds me never to take notice of any financial advice/predictions posted here.

post #16 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

Very interesting set of data.

 

Apple: $26bn profit on $108bn revenue

 

Microsoft: $23bn profit on $70bn revenue

 

Yet if you listen to people on here MS is all but dead. I'm not a fan of MS but it just shows how ill informed this forum is. ...

 

Microsoft isn't all but dead, they just aren't really relevant in determining the direction of the tech industry any longer. They'll continue to rake in profits for years to come, just as IBM does with their legacy systems.

 

This is what tends to happen to companies that want to, "take over the world." Eventually, they overreach, they get smacked down, they lose focus, and someone comes along to eat their lunch. Microsoft did it to IBM, Google did it to Microsoft. Google is also a "take over the world" kind of company and seems to be making the same mistakes. Eventually, they'll fade into irrelevance, too.

 

Fortunately, Apple has, so far, avoided the temptation to try to take over the world. Let's hope they keep it that way and just keep focusing on creating great products, not on cutting off everyone else's air supply.


Edited by anonymouse - 5/8/12 at 10:28am
post #17 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

Very interesting set of data.

 

Apple: $26bn profit on $108bn revenue

 

Microsoft: $23bn profit on $70bn revenue

 

Yet if you listen to people on here MS is all but dead. I'm not a fan of MS but it just shows how ill informed this forum is.

 

Also 17th place is a lot lower than I thought they were given all the hoopla regarding how supposedly under valued the share price is. It just reminds me never to take notice of any financial advice/predictions posted here.


The hoopla for Apple is all about growth... and things move on very quickly in the Apple world.

 

$108Bn was to September last year. To September this year we are looking at $170Bn. Adding $62Bn in one year is almost the entire size of MS... IN ONE YEAR. Apple has already turned $86Bn in 2Q since last September.

 

As to margins... This last quarter, Apple's % operating margin was actually higher than MS (41% vs 40%). HIGHER - for a hardware company - that has a high Cost of Goods Sold for physical devices (rather than just shipping a CD/DVD or a download). That is phenomenal.

 

As to MS's long term prognosis. People are saying that MS can't find a way to grow more than 5-8% per year because its cash cows are stagnant and threatened by decline since they don't address the high growth areas of the market - Mobile. 80%+ of revenue and profit comes from Windows & Office - Office is bigger than Windows now and Windows is barely growing. Windows is powered by a market being pummeled by tablets and paid largely by OEMs who can't make more than 1-3% profit on their entire business. How long can MS continue to charge what they do for Windows under those conditions? Office is also under threat from Apple, Google, the falling price of consumer software, (as mobile App Stores, and Apple lower the perceived value of software), etc. When Google give GDocs away, Apple charges $29 for a major OS upgrade and $10 per "Office" App on tablets - $200-400 for Office which is full of features most users never use seems like a lot.

Why is MS throwing so much money at WP7? Because they know that they are seriously under threat from market trends they no longer have any control over.

MS are nowhere near dead yet but they are in a lot more trouble than a large revenue and profit would suggest.

post #18 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy3 View Post

Exxon makes 41 BILLION PROFIT?????????

 

How can they justify those gas prices?

 

I agree that it is a bit of a disgrace but that is $41Bn on $453Bn of revenue - less than 10% margin. Apple makes $26Bn on $108Bn.

 

Also Exxon has to drill for oil/gas in increasingly difficult and expensive locations which does cost Billions (and can lose billions if the test drilling doesn't pan out) plus it doesn't set the price of oil or gasoline, though it massively benefits and can influence to some degree it by messing with refining capacity etc. But overall global demand (esp. China), OPEC decisions, etc. are more meaningful influences.

 

Not a fan of big oil but just saying...

post #19 of 22

When a corporation wins, its customers lose. 

post #20 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbryanh View Post

When a corporation wins, its customers lose. 

 

Explain. Or do you want great products but financially sick corporations? You want your hot-sh*t Apple gear but you begrudge Apple making money from that desire?

 

Were Apple customers "winning" when the company was floundering before they got smart and bought NeXT?

post #21 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy3 View Post

Exxon makes 41 BILLION PROFIT?????????

How can they justify those gas prices? They must be making even more of a margin that Apple is. And people say Apple gouges its customers.

I say its time for some regulation in this oil industry. People are suffering just so the CEOs at exxon can buy another priivate jet. There is a huge difference between apple margin and exxon margin

Apple margin is on products that are not NEEDS but WANTS. 
Exxon products on the other hand are factored into EVERYTHING you buy. Your gas in your car, the cost of delivery of the food you buy cause guess what, its came on a truck. The cost of the clothes you wear cause guess what, it came on a truck. If your power plant uses natural gas, they got you there again. 

This is disgusting.

OT though, good job apple. This should be lesson to all companies. Apple came back from the brink to be No.3. If that isn't a 'never say die, anything is possible' attitude then what is? 


What we need are FEWER regulations and MORE competition. Besides, these "high prices" are partly a side effect of the dropping value of the dollar. Thank Ben Bernanke, Tim Geithner and Congress and the president for this.
Edited by SpamSandwich - 5/8/12 at 7:25pm

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #22 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy3 View Post

 

Exxon products on the other hand are factored into EVERYTHING you buy. Your gas in your car, the cost of delivery of the food you buy cause guess what, its came on a truck. The cost of the clothes you wear cause guess what, it came on a truck. If your power plant uses natural gas, they got you there again.

You are simply taking onto account the fuel used.

How about all the petrochemical byproducts used in just about everything?

Clothing, food, medicine, plastic, detergents, fertilizers, pesticides (and on and on).

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