or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Apple releases Mac OS X 10.3.8
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple releases Mac OS X 10.3.8 - Page 2

post #41 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by IonYz
Hmm, I thought it was universally known that Xbench results can't be trusted. I know once I upgraded from a Radeon 32MB to a Radeon 9800 and the OpenGL results went down something was up.

I think xBench's disk results can't be trusted, but I believe the rest were pretty OK (the disk tests would be all over the map sometimes, depending, apparently, on whether you were sitting or standing when you ran the test).

I'd like to thank the poster of the results for posting before and after settings. I hate it when people just post some results without any comparison piece (like "I got my mini, check these results out!" and then you spend a half an hour trying to figure out what a 123 on a CPU test really means, and how it compares to other things).

As for the update, don't waste your time repairing permissions before and after, and don't get the mega-combo update. Just let OS X do its thing. Its quicker and more fun. You can start up a pool. "Hey, $5 you get the spinning beachball on the Finder!" "$10 you get a flashing questionmark at startup!" "$20 that you'll see smoke coming from the top!"

But if you insist on posting the "You should follow these steps" steps, you should add "Do the full backup!" and the "Boot into single-user mode and run "/sbin/fsck -yf" before and after the update" as well. And maybe a disk defragmentation. Oh, and might as well run DiskAvenger and rebuild the directories. And, hell, if you're doing that much, why not just reformat the whole disk, reinstall 10.3.0, then do a straight update to 10.3.8.
post #42 of 106
Oh, crap, I forgot one. You should disconnect all external drives, devices, etc.
post #43 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Matthew64
Make this a standard proceedure when installing ANY Apple update:

1) Run Repair Permissions in the Disk Utility before installing

2) If it is a major OS update, download the combo update when it is available instead of using Software Update.

3) Run Repair Permissions again after the update is successfully installed.

That is, if you want to completely waste your time.

1. Running Repair Permissions before installing is not going to make one bit of difference. Software Update runs as root, and it does give a damn what the permissions are on the drive. This step literally does absolutely nothing for you.

2. All Repair Permissions does is make sure the permissions of files on your disk are the same as the permissions that are set in the packages in /Library/Receipts. Plus, there's no One True Way that the permissions need to be for most files. While running Repair Permissions after an update will turn up a list of files that got changed, just because the permissions for a file may be different in the software update you just installed does not necessarily mean that those permissions are wrong. So the permissions for /private/etc/slpsa.conf are -rwxr-xr-x in BSD.pkg but -rw-r--r-- in MacOSXUpdate10.3.8Patch.pkg. Does that mean the 10.3.8 package is wrong? Both sets of permissions work.

Repairing permissions after an Apple software update is only important if you think Apple would be incompetent enough to release an update with completely FUBARed permissions. I think Apple is better than this, people. In fact, I'd be more inclined to trust the permissions on their newer updates than their older ones, since they could have found a mistake and fixed it in a later version. For example, that slpsa.conf file I mentioned above, which incidentally was the only file that Repair Permissions found with changed permissions when I ran it. The 10.3.8 package says -rw-r--r--. Doesn't that make more sense than -rwxr-xr-x for a configuration file? Why does the executable bit have to be set on that file? It's not a binary or a shell script, it's just a configuration file! Seems to me that someone at Apple actually noticed this was wrong and fixed it, only to have Repair Permissions set it back to the way it came in 10.3.0 or whatever version of Panther the user originally installed. For this reason, I really with Repair Permissions would check the newer Apple packages first rather than the older ones. Of course, if they did that, there wouldn't be a long list of changed files to give people that don't understand what permissions are the sense that they did some mystical voodoo magic which will make their computer run better.

In short, I could kind of understand if people wanted to run Repair Permissions after installing a third-party package by a vendor you don't trust. And in a setting like a lab, you probably do want to run Repair Permissions every once in a while just to make sure that some file or folder didn't inadvertently become writable by users that shouldn't have write access. And if you want to run Repair Permissions after installing an Apple software update, it probably won't hurt anything, but proclaiming that you must do so is just plain ridiculous. And running Repair Permissions before running a software update is completely pointless, especially if you were going to run it after the update anyway. I guarantee you that there will be absolutely zero difference to any of your files whether you run Repair Permissions before the update or not if you were going to run it afterward. Guaranteed.

Why is this advice harmful, and why does it get my ire up so much when I hear people parroting it? Well, think about it. By telling newbies that they have to perform this voodoo ritual of running Repair Permissions twice every software update, you've turned a nice, convenient feature into a confusing, time-consuming process. While Software Update is a quick, easy, and painless thing to do when you can just get it started and then go have a cup of coffee and let it finish whenever it's ready, if you have to mess with Repair Permissions it becomes a chore. This is going to breed a generation of users who just don't bother with Software Update because it's a pain in the ass. So you'll end up with unapplied security updates, machines still running 10.3.1, and if someone ever finds a really nasty security hole, all these users will be wide open. You'll also generate a lot of bad press about Apple ("Mac OS X is so retarded, you have to repair permissions every time you do a simple Software Update!"), as we all know the effect these rumors have, whether informed or no.

In summary, don't listen to the members of the cargo cult of Repair Permissions. They don't understand what is really going on when they do this stuff, and they are out to waste your time.
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #44 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by CharlesS
That is, if you want to completely waste your time.

1. Running Repair Permissions before installing is not going to make one bit of difference. Software Update runs as root, and it does give a damn what the permissions are on the drive. This step literally does absolutely nothing for you.

Actually, repairing permissions may help things, but, like you said, it has nothing to do with software update. If you're permissions get wonked on some files, things may become unstable or not working properly because some files which should be readable aren't, or some program that should be runnable can't. Repairing these can fix some issues, but that has no bearing on the update. The only thing that repairing permissions before an update can help is if its the permissions of the Installer app (or one of its dependencies) is screwed up (you know, if it loses its 'executable' bit, it can't run!).

I've run repair permissions many times, and except for the incredibly annoying "cdrom" file system file, and now those stupid 'at' files, the only thing that's ever come up is the utmp/wtmp files, which aren't much use in the normal lives of people (last time I remember, these stored login details and fun stuff like that). So I stopped worrying about it on an update. I've never had a serious permission leak on my computers. Maybe lucky, I guess.

But look at the brightside, CharlesS. They wonks have stopped telling us to to a pre-bind after every update.
post #45 of 106
The guy at Daring Fireball agrees in a more subtle way than Charles. I quit this routine as well since it did seem tedious. I still use the combo updater though because I have the bandwidth and I can.
iPad2 16 GB Wifi

Who is worse? A TROLL or a person that feeds & quotes a TROLL? You're both idiots.....
Reply
iPad2 16 GB Wifi

Who is worse? A TROLL or a person that feeds & quotes a TROLL? You're both idiots.....
Reply
post #46 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by kcmac
The guy at Daring Fireball agrees in a more subtle way than Charles. I quit this routine as well since it did seem tedious. I still use the combo updater though because I have the bandwidth and I can.

What advantages does the Combo have?

--B
...


...
Reply
...


...
Reply
post #47 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by bergz
What advantages does the Combo have?

--B

If your computer dies and you didn't back up the OS then having a combo 10.3.8 allows you to go straight there in one step rather than running all eight incremental updates to get back to where you came from.

Of course, some people have so much bandwidth that it's faster to get an update from the net than it is from a backup CD.

-

On the startup issues, I believe that there was a solution posted in the 10.3.7 discussions. It has something to do with declaring to your computer that it's okay if it has an ethernet connection but can't actually get onto the internet at the moment.

Mendosi
Esse Quam Videri
Reply
Esse Quam Videri
Reply
post #48 of 106
CharleS, I never knew about the Cargo Cult thing. Fascinating (learn something new every day indeed)

Regarding using combo updater inetead of normal: Over the years, and even until the most recent updates, I have seen that a Combo update is sure to update everything properly. Also, as pointed out, its a must have thing when and if you have to do a full re-install. And... because Apple so kindlyy offers updates via the Akamai network, I download at 110% of my bandwidth speed. I downloaded the 107MB update in about 1 minute. Akamai is crazy fast
I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
post #49 of 106
Hi

Software Update offers me two 10.3.8 updates, one at 27.7 MB and the other at 16.4 MB

What's up with that?? Any difference? Should I install both or just one?

thanks
:-)
post #50 of 106
Thats weird.

I'd just chose Bob
I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
post #51 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by ZO
Thats weird.

I'd just chose Bob

"I'm never calling it Planet Bob..."

Also, there seem to be some issues with iShock X flooding the log file with thousands of entries until there is no more hard drive space left. See http://www.macaddict.com/forums/topic/52157 for a discussion.
(Not SPAM, just one of the other forums I visit and I thought it might be relevant.)
post #52 of 106
I have one HD with 10.3.3 installed, updated step by step to 3.8 and second HD with 10.3.3 installed, updated to 3.7 (combo) and now to 3.8.

Now for the second installation Software Update offers me security update 2004-09-16 which was for 10.3.4!
post #53 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Louzer
Actually, repairing permissions may help things, but, like you said, it has nothing to do with software update. If you're permissions get wonked on some files, things may become unstable or not working properly because some files which should be readable aren't, or some program that should be runnable can't. Repairing these can fix some issues, but that has no bearing on the update. The only thing that repairing permissions before an update can help is if its the permissions of the Installer app (or one of its dependencies) is screwed up (you know, if it loses its 'executable' bit, it can't run!).

Yes, but the point was that the guy was recommending running Repair Permission before and after every update! If he's going to run it afterward anyway, it's not going to make any difference that he ran it beforehand whatsoever (well, except for your example of Software Update losing its executable bit, but that's a reeeeally contrived example and not very likely to happen)! It's a classic example of cargo cult behavior - following a ritual that one doesn't really understand in order to obtain a goal that doesn't really have a lot to do with the ritual you're performing. It is not necessary to run Repair Permissions every time you do a software update.

Repair Permissions is a tool for you to use if you are experiencing some permissions-related problem. There's no need to use it if you aren't having any problems (except, possibly, in a lab setting, where you do want to make sure unprivileged users can't get into places they shouldn't).
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #54 of 106
well, i repaired permissions, ran the combo installer, and my internet browsing speed is back! yes! safari would take MINUTES to load pages under 10.3.7 (which is why i would not install it on my home computer), but now it's back to normal!
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
Reply
When you're lovers in a dangerous time,
You're made to feel as if your love's a crime.
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
Gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight.

-...
Reply
post #55 of 106
Thanks for the cargo cult link, that was a pretty interesting read. I wonder if any of that stuff got saved at all.

EDIT: theres a link at the bottom of that wiki page that points to a presentation on cargo cults, couple of good pictures in there.

Also Ill second not repairing permissions for no reason, Ive never had to repair permissions and would only do so if I was having a problem where the recommended solution was to repair permissions. Funnily enough I dont recall ever having so much as a problem where I would have to look up the solution. I guess thats why I switched to a mac three years ago, looking forward to the arrival of my mac mini... to be my second mac.

I wonder if repairing permissions would fix my three year old battery
post #56 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by male82uk
It seems to be that upon start up it tries to read too far into the network after signing on to the mac. However if i take out the network cable then it is as fast as it was before the update 10.3.7. any more ideas cos it's becoming a pain in the arse now as i either have to get to the network cable and unplug before start up or sign on and read the complete shakespeares work!! both seem like a load of hassle that shouldn't be nessesary!! \

Same problem here. Our DNS servers didn't work this morning for about two hours (the network itself was ok, I was able to print, connect to our database server, etc.). As long as the DNS was out of order the finder took about 2 min. to properly load, ActivityMonitor labeled it in red and as "Finder(Hung)". As soon as access to the internet was again enabled the machine booted as fast as always. Any idea what the Finder is looking up on the network [I never had this problem before 10.3.8]?
post #57 of 106
Hey, I just go by recommendations made to me by certified Mac OS dudes! Most of which is precautionary. Anyone who has had issues with updates because a system is having problems can relate. You guys can be as anal as you wish. I stay with the side of caution.
post #58 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by L'ermite
Same problem here. Our DNS servers didn't work this morning for about two hours (the network itself was ok, I was able to print, connect to our database server, etc.). As long as the DNS was out of order the finder took about 2 min. to properly load, ActivityMonitor labeled it in red and as "Finder(Hung)". As soon as access to the internet was again enabled the machine booted as fast as always. Any idea what the Finder is looking up on the network [I never had this problem before 10.3.8]?

This is a welcome surprise cos i found no other people who had problems like this.However the network hasn't had any changes around the time of 10.3.7 update. We do work primarily on a PC network running NT and smb server access to numerous servers however things haven't changed there still.
The fact that i can open up any other program while it is trying to load finder with no problems confuses things. Opening an internet browser would work but no page would load at all.
Does any one know how i can get around this hassle or if it is a problem that i will have to put up with and wait for tiger with the promise of improving smb and NT compatibility? Move fun comes when they upgrade the pc system which is in the pipeline too...!
I can see head aches coming on here!!1
post #59 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Matthew64
Hey, I just go by recommendations made to me by certifiable Mac OS dudes!

Fixed.

Quote:
Most of which is precautionary. Anyone who has had issues with updates because a system is having problems can relate. You guys can be as anal as you wish. I stay with the side of caution.

Well, I've already shown that one of your steps, running Repair Permissions before the update, accomplishes exactly nothing. So your position is on the side of superstition, not caution. And since Repair Permissions after an update isn't necessary 99% of the time, I think those that are rigidly following this voodoo ritual are better candidates for being "anal" than those who aren't.

But hey, here's a new precautionary measure for you! Always make sure you type 10 copies of the Hail Mary in TextEdit and save them in /tmp in each of RTF, .txt, and Word format before you apply a software update! And then after the update, be sure to do the same thing again! Because to do so is to stay on the side of caution! And if you don't, you're anal!

Now where's my voodoo chicken...
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #60 of 106
Did not realize this was the "prick" forum!!!

If there's a reason my procedure is not sound, state the reason, some technical reference from Apple and leave it at that.

No reason to be self-righteous pricks! It you people are in IT, your users must love you.
post #61 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Matthew64
Hey, I just go by recommendations made to me by certified Mac OS dudes! Most of which is precautionary. Anyone who has had issues with updates because a system is having problems can relate. You guys can be as anal as you wish. I stay with the side of caution.

Umm, actually following all the recommendations by a certified Mac OS dude is being 'anal' (you know, like people who must make their bed, wash their dishes, and clean the house before going to work, or those who insist on putting dishes in the dishwasher after meals, instead of just piling them in the sink until there's enough to warrant putting them in the dishwasher. I mean, do you know how much effort it is to open the door, put in a plate, and then close the door? But think of the savings when you put in 5 plates at once!).

Not giving a crap and just downloading is just being "spontaneous".

But if they were good certified mac dudes, I'm sure they have you doing complete backups before updating (because anyone who doesn't recommend that ain't much of a certified anything. Hell, it'd be like your doctor not telling you to quit smoking. Sure, you might not listen, but they should be telling you, anyway). Of all 'suggestions' I've heard, the only one that makes sense is 'make a full back-up before proceeding'.

BTW, if you believe repairing permissions before an update is 'sound thinking', you probably should just dump that idea and set up a cron job to repair permissions daily, because if you think there's going to be problems with them, then that's not just an issue with software update, but just running Mac OS X as well. Same goes for running fsck.

I've always equated the "I follow these steps and never had a problem" quotes to the 'bear patrol' episode of the Simpsons.

However, if you want to think of it differently, you could just forget the idea that it helps the update, and is just good computer maintenance practice, and what better time to remember to run maintenance tasks then when there's an update (sort of like the recommendations to change your smoke alarm batteries and test those things when you change your clocks, not because the clock change can affect them, but its a way to remember to do that).

[Oh crap, I forgot a couple of recommended steps! Don't forget to run all your maintenance scripts before and after updating as well! And clear those caches! Man, there's lots of 'suggested' things to do before and after applying an update. You'd think you were upgrading from OS 9 to OS X with the effort some would have you do!]
post #62 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Matthew64
Did not realize this was the "prick" forum!!!

If there's a reason my procedure is not sound, state the reason, some technical reference from Apple and leave it at that.

No reason to be self-righteous pricks! It you people are in IT, your users must love you.

Yes. you are right - this is not the "prick forum".

It is also *not* the "blind dumbasses leading the blind" forum.

When someone more experienced than yourself is kind enough to show a more enlightened and pragmatic solution or approach to a problem - be man enough to open your mind and consider the information. Then *kindly* thank that individual for taking the time to help.

I personally want to thank CharlesS for detailing the acutal purpose and use of "repair permissions". I *always* thought it very suspect that one had to
"repair permissions" after software update (wasn't Apple capable of building a software update that did *everything* it was supposed to do to improve the system?). But I did it because maybe there was some voodoo that it performed in relation to the software update.

Now I know what a laughable ritual it really is and *why*.

If *you* are in IT, your users must *HATE* you...
post #63 of 106
Sorry if I am being crass people but the response, or the way it was coming across, was one of arrogrance instead of solid, pro-active information.

We post questions in these forums to find answers. If my answer was wrong, I can surely deal with that. Being basically told I am an idiot, I can't let someone get away with that crap.

I happen to be in IT and manage 30-40 Macs and servers. And, my users love me, thank you very much, because I address there issues on their level and don't insult them.
post #64 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by cmatech
Yes. you are right - this is not the "prick forum".

It is also *not* the "blind dumbasses leading the blind" forum.

When someone more experienced than yourself is kind enough to show a more enlightened and pragmatic solution or approach to a problem - be man enough to open your mind and consider the information. Then *kindly* thank that individual for taking the time to help.

I personally want to thank CharlesS for detailing the acutal purpose and use of "repair permissions". I *always* thought it very suspect that one had to
"repair permissions" after software update (wasn't Apple capable of building a software update that did *everything* it was supposed to do to improve the system?). But I did it because maybe there was some voodoo that it performed in relation to the software update.

Now I know what a laughable ritual it really is and *why*.

If *you* are in IT, your users must *HATE* you...

OK OK Cool it guys. Right there's a difference of opinion. Just be mature adults and let it go.

Now group hug.

\
post #65 of 106
Well, I've learned a lesson about software updates: Check Apple forums BEFORE downloading.

I installed the OS X update and immediately noticed increased fan usage on my Powermac G5. So I visited the Apple website forums and there are numerous posts about strange fan behaviour. It seems to be a pervasive problem among Powermac G5 owners who have downloaded the latest OS update. The "general" consensus there is to set processor performance to high but that seems like a temporary solution at best. Anyone else out there having similar problems?

CDP
post #66 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Matthew64
Did not realize this was the "prick" forum!!!

If there's a reason my procedure is not sound, state the reason, some technical reference from Apple and leave it at that.

No reason to be self-righteous pricks! It you people are in IT, your users must love you.

I did state the reason:

1. All Repair Permissions does is reset the permissions of the OS files back to what they were when you originally installed the OS

2. Just because permissions are different does not necessarily mean they are wrong, but there can be more than one set of permissions that are valid for a file, and in fact, sometimes the permissions of files in the updates make more sense than the original permissions

3. The only way running Repair Permissions after an update would be necessary would be if Apple were distributing updates with severely FUBARed permissions

4. Running Repair Permissions before an update doesn't affect the install process at all because Software Update runs as root, and root doesn't give two squats what the permissions are on anything. Root does what root wants.

5. Given that you're running Repair Permissions after the update, running it before the update is just... why? You're just doing the same thing over again. It's a waste of time and accomplishes nothing.

You know, if you were able to get a full install of 10.3.8, either by getting it bundled on a new machine or if Apple put 10.3.8 on the newest Panther CDs, and then you installed it straight rather than installing an older version of Panther and updating to 10.3.8 via software update, guess what? I'd bet that running Repair Permissions would set the permissions on your files to what they were before you ran Repair Permissions after installing the 10.3.8 update.

If running Repair Permissions every software update were necessary, Apple would have built it into the install process like they did with prebinding (which itself is only marginally necessary).
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #67 of 106
After doing some *research* on old AI posts I think I have an idea of where this whole repair permissions thing came from.

Repair permissions was first introduced as a feature of OS 10.2 Jaguar. The first mention I saw of it was by Brad and he said something to the effect of...

Quote:
Disk Utility now has a "Repair Disk Permissions" which would seem to help novices who fool around with the Terminal or something and screw up their system's permissions.

Following the release of Jaguar it appears that some people had permissions problems related to doing an "upgrade" install of Jaguar rather than the "clean" install. Although I cant find any direct reference to this effect.

The first anecdotal reference to someone repairing permissions to improve system performance was made by GardenOfEarthlyDelights on 31 July 2002.

Quote:
It's been better since I ran Apple's fix permissions, but before that, I would have Mail and iTunes hang when I would quit them. Force quite would sometimes work, but I would invariably end up doing a forced restart after 10 minutes of the Beach Ball of Death?.

After that, somenoe claimed that repairing permissions significantly improved system performance and detailed a strange procedure for doing so...

Possible new optimizing trick

Anyway... I just felt like looking into this whole repair permissions thing, inspired by the cargo cults.
post #68 of 106
Thanks for all this clearing-up guys, esp. AsLan for looking up the origins of all this.

So, in summary: if you stuff around with your computer a lot *puts his hand up* then a repair permissions might be a good part of your maintenance routine - and a good way of remembering to do this is whenever Apple releases an update (or whenever your computer crashes inexplicably).
This may also be a good time to run the cron scripts that never run at night because there's no way that you'd leave your computer powered up all night just so that a few measly maintenance scripts can run.

Repair permissions will almost certainly have nothing to do with the actual update itself and this is why Apple does not either include it with the installation process or mention it in the read-me for each update.

Even better than any other concievable protection/repair method, is regularly backing up - and the updates are a good time to remember this too.

Hope we are all 100% up-to-date now and saving minutes each update.

Mendosi
Esse Quam Videri
Reply
Esse Quam Videri
Reply
post #69 of 106
ok ok you got me. I just do repair permissions because I observed some Apple employees do it once and Jobs appeared and now I have been trying to do the same...

But I fear if I keep "repairing" it it will fall apart and lose its magic, so, I guess I should limit myself to when there are too many splinters and the planets are properly aligned

I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before.
Reply
post #70 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Mendosi
So, in summary: if you stuff around with your computer a lot *puts his hand up* then a repair permissions might be a good part of your maintenance routine

I've got no problem with this. If you muck around with your system and fear that you might have messed some permissions up, Repair Permissions will certainly help you, as this is what it's designed for. Also, some poorly written third-party installers for crappy software might mess up the permissions on some files (although even in this case, running RP before would be a waste of time). In the case of OS updates from Apple, though, I just trust them to know what the permissions ought to be, since they make the OS. In any case, however, running Repair Permissions before the update does nothing! Don't waste your time doing this!

I dunno, the reason this issue gets my dander up is because of conversations like this one:

some_guy: Hi, I'm having this problem: <insert some problem that has absolutely nothing to do with permissions here> Anyone know how to fix it?

cargo_cultist: Did you repair permissions when you installed the last software update? If not, then it's YOUR FAULT!!! Next time, make sure you repair permissions before AND after you install the update!!
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #71 of 106
Just one thing: how did you join in 1990!?
"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
Reply
"Overpopulation and climate change are serious shit." Gilsch
"I was really curious how they had managed such fine granularity of alienation." addabox
Reply
post #72 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by Aquatic
Just one thing: how did you join in 1990!?

That's a bloody good point! How did he join in 1990????? I've had the interview a long time but I'm sure modems weren't available then.
post #73 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
That's a bloody good point! How did he join in 1990????? I've had the interview a long time but I'm sure modems weren't available then.

Well, that's one more of the world's mysteries solved...

Where am I?
In the Village.
Who are you?
The new Number Two.
Who is Number One?

"CharlesS is."

--B
...


...
Reply
...


...
Reply
post #74 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by ZO
Addresses an issue in which a PowerBook G4 computer would, on rare occasion, wake from sleep with a black screen and not respond to any keyboard, mouse, or trackpad input.

Now my RevB PMG5 dual 2GHz has this symtom which it never had before in previous versions of Panther Force restart on power button needed.

This is a fresh install from my install CD of 10.3.4 and using a combo to bring it up to speed to 10.3.8. I bought a new hard drive to software RAID, but later changed my mine and went back to a 'normal' multiple disk configuration.
PM G5 Dual 2.0GHz, 2GB RAM
PB G4 1.67GHz, 1.5GB RAM
Reply
PM G5 Dual 2.0GHz, 2GB RAM
PB G4 1.67GHz, 1.5GB RAM
Reply
post #75 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by ZO
Repair Permissions = Applications folder -> Utilities folder -> Disk Utility

Select your hard drive and then select "repair permissions"

Good to do once a month or so.

Frankly and seriously speaking, WTF is Apple doing that anyone ever needs to do any permissions repairs? Of all the Unix systems out there, I've never seen any upgrades require such a task. Either Apple incorporates the "repair permissions" step in with the upgrade installer so as to hide it from the user or they correct what's causing this repairing to start with.
post #76 of 106
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by DVD_Junkie
Frankly and seriously speaking, WTF is Apple doing that anyone ever needs to do any permissions repairs? Of all the Unix systems out there, I've never seen any upgrades require such a task. Either Apple incorporates the "repair permissions" step in with the upgrade installer so as to hide it from the user or they correct what's causing this repairing to start with.

ya i've never bothered doing that stuff when updating and and i've had absolutely no problems.
post #77 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by ipodandimac
ya i've never bothered doing that stuff when updating and and i've had absolutely no problems.

same
post #78 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by DVD_Junkie
Frankly and seriously speaking, WTF is Apple doing that anyone ever needs to do any permissions repairs? Of all the Unix systems out there, I've never seen any upgrades require such a task. Either Apple incorporates the "repair permissions" step in with the upgrade installer so as to hide it from the user or they correct what's causing this repairing to start with.

The difference is that, except for OS X, all the other Unix systems out there aren't meant for the dumb-ass desktop user who doesn't know what they're doing. In linux, if you go in and start mucking around with the system, and you screw up some permissions (you know, you mistakenly add a -R when chown or chmod to /etc or something), you fsck'd. How do you set it back? How do you fix doing something this stupid? Well, in OS X, because anyone can do this, they've stuck in an option to put back the main file and dir settings the way they were when it was installed.

Apple needed to add the 'feature' (as they do with a lot of things) just so normal users can fix things on their own if something gets muffed.
post #79 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
That's a bloody good point! How did he join in 1990????? I've had the interview a long time but I'm sure modems weren't available then.

Time travel.

Quote:
Originally posted by DVD_Junkie:
Frankly and seriously speaking, WTF is Apple doing that anyone ever needs to do any permissions repairs? Of all the Unix systems out there, I've never seen any upgrades require such a task. Either Apple incorporates the "repair permissions" step in with the upgrade installer so as to hide it from the user or they correct what's causing this repairing to start with.

That's the whole point - it's not necessary. It makes Apple look bad to suggest that it is.
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
Proud member of AppleInsider since before the World Wide Web existed.
Reply
post #80 of 106
Quote:
Originally posted by MacCrazy
That's a bloody good point! How did he join in 1990????? I've had the interview a long time but I'm sure modems weren't available then.

Modems have been around since the 60s. The Bell 103 (1962) was the first commercial one. 300baud. 300bps. It took until 1986 before a 56kbps modem was invented. (And actually, modems were first used by Air Civil Defense and the Air Force during the 50s to transmit data between crisis centers.)
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
My brain is hung like a HORSE!
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Mac OS X
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Apple releases Mac OS X 10.3.8