Apple may extend antiglare display option to more Macs

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  • Reply 81 of 150
    mactrippermactripper Posts: 1,328member
    I've found some prices for this anti-reflective glass from a framers website to give some idea of the costs:



    Quote:

    Additional Cost For AR Reflection Free or Museum Glass



    Print Size \tAR Reflection-Free \tMuseum Glass\t

    11" x 14" \tadd $65.00 \tadd $80.00\t

    16" x 20" \tadd $105.00 \tadd $135.00\t

    20" x 25" \tadd $125.00 \tadd $150.00\t

    24" x 30" \tadd $125.00 \tadd $150.00\t

    30" x 38" \tadd $230.00 \tadd $295.00\t



    7" x 21" \tadd $65.00 \tadd $80.00 \t

    10" x 30" \tadd $105.00 \tadd $135.00\t

    14" x 42" \tadd $235.00 \tadd $295.00\t

    17" x 50" \tadd $245.00 \tadd $305.00




    Note these are retail prices, not wholesale or volume purchases. For Apple I'm sure they could get it considerably cheaper.



    So Apple can use anti-reflective glass, it's not cost prohibitive. They decided to use cheap reflective glass instead.









    Here are a whole bunch of links of industry providers of anti-reflective glass!!



    # American Computer Optics, Inc. (www.acoinc.net)

    # Eyes Off (www.eyesoff.com)

    # Field Optics (www.fieldoptics.com)

    # Hydrophobics (www.hydrophobics.com)

    # Plasma Guard (www.plasmaguard.com)

    # Port Window Glass (www.portwindowglass.com)

    # UV Filtering Glass (www.uvfilteringglass.com)

    # Water White Glass (www.waterwhiteglass.com)





    Shame on you for being so CHEAP Apple!!
  • Reply 82 of 150
    teckstudteckstud Posts: 6,476member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post


    So Apple can use anti-reflective glass, it's not cost prohibitive. They decided to use cheap reflective glass instead.







    They wanted a higher ennvironmental Gore rating (it use to be very poor) which they got at the expense of their long time users.
  • Reply 83 of 150
    jdwjdw Posts: 786member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MsNly View Post


    ...the option will be nice because people can finally stop complaining!



    Thank you for being partly open-minded enough to make such an admission. I say partly because seems were indirectly taking a mild swipe at matte screen proponents. But it is important to keep in mind that gloss-proponents complain just as much or more than matte proponents, as evidenced by these posts:

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by eldernorm View Post


    Sorry but glossy is better than matte... LOL )) hey, enjoy your dreams... And remember, if Apple pisses you off enough, you can always buy a Dell.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GMHut View Post


    Sorry, but matte is better than glossy.



    It's not about "better." It's all about "Apple offering a choice." That holds true whether you prefer glossy screens or not.





    Thank you, MacTripper, for the information on Museum glass. I've long wondered if that would be a realistic solution. If Apple ultimately refuses to offer choice, it would at least be better if they could select a non-reflective glass that could ultimately make both camps extremely happy. Just because other companies haven't been able to pull it off, doesn't mean Apple can't.
  • Reply 84 of 150
    mactrippermactripper Posts: 1,328member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by teckstud View Post


    They wanted a higher ennvironmental Gore rating (it use to be very poor) which they got at the expense of their long time users.





    Annoy your customers with glossy displays, so they won't buy and make what matte they have now last longer.
  • Reply 85 of 150
    mactrippermactripper Posts: 1,328member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JDW View Post


    It's not about "better." It's all about "Apple offering a choice." That holds true whether you prefer glossy screens or not.





    Thank you, MacTripper, for the information on Museum glass. I've long wondered if that would be a realistic solution. If Apple ultimately refuses to offer choice, it would at least be better if they could select a non-reflective glass that could ultimately make both camps extremely happy. Just because other companies haven't been able to pull it off, doesn't mean Apple can't.





    Anti-reflective glass is most likely the best solution, nobody would know the difference between regular glass.



    The reflections and glare will just disappear.
  • Reply 86 of 150
    mimacmimac Posts: 871member
    That Museum glass anti glare stuff looks promising. Wonder if Apple would entertain this idea? Suppose they would if the wholesale price was right.



    It could work. One way to have the best of both worlds... easy clean glass/no glare screen.
  • Reply 87 of 150
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by teckstud View Post


    A rumor who's time has been a long time coming.



    Its true . Apple friends of mine said short term and long term fixes were on the way .



    For me I love having a Glass screen . And the matte screens over time will fade is slowly fade in parts of the screen. All my matte screens are dismal compared to my new MBP glass screen.



    Yet Apple will retire matte once they fixed the anti glare. Apple will retire firewire once usb 3 or 4 is out for a while . Apple is moving to be mainstream with the other 80 percent of the world. I only pray that quick time survives.



    9
  • Reply 88 of 150
    gooddoggooddog Posts: 93member
    [QUOTE=AppleInsider;1448871]Apple made a bold move roughly two years ago to begin transitioning its entire Mac product line away from matte displays and towards glass-enclosed glossy ones, but the company may be nearing a concession that these shiny, highly-reflective screens may not be for everyone.



    The Cupertino-based company is currently mulling the possibility of extending antiglare display options to more of its Macs -- a feature now only available on the 17-inch MacBook Pro -- according to people who have proven familiar with the company's plans. Though speculative at this time, it would appear that the 13- and 15-inch MacBook Pros would be the most likely candidates to receive antiglare options.



    The transition towards glossy displays appears to have been sparked by the original iPhone, whose glass touchscreen and black border resonated well with customers. The reception was favorable enough that Apple, in a bid to push the envelope and standardize materials across its product families, gave similar treatment to its iMac line a few months later."



    *************************************

    I am posting from an original G4 Flat Panel Lamp Base iMac !!!!!!!!!



    I've been saving and waiting ever since !!!!!









    I have $8,000 in my iMac budget and THEY STILL DON'T GET IT !!!!!!!!





    People want to watch movies in the 24" iMac !!!!!!!!!!!!



    These movies often have DARK SCENES --- like NIGHT TIME and like INDOORS !!!!!!



    WE CAN NOT (NOT) ENJOY THESE DRAMATIC DARK SCENES IN A



    R E A R - V I E W i M a c !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



    WE DON'T WANT OUR FACES , LAMPS, WINDOWS, CLOCKS, ETC. REFLECTED INTO

    THE DIRECTOR'S INTENDED SCENERY !!!! DO YOU GET IT ?????????? !!!!!!!!



    I DO N-O-T WANT MY FACE NEXT TO MARLON BRANDO'S FACE IN THE CAVE ABODE SCENE

    OF "APOCALYPSE NOW" !!!!!!!!!!!!! DO YOU GET IT YET ?????????!!!!!!!!!!



    THE LAPTOP USERS ALREADY HAVE A MATTE OPTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



    IT IS THE FREAKIN' 24" iMac THAT NEEDS A MATTE SCREEN !!!!!!!!!!!





    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!





    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!

    THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!! THE 24-INCH iMac !!!!!!



    ---gooddog
  • Reply 89 of 150
    I'd hardly call Apple's selective deafness 'hearing the collective voice!'

    ? it looks more like pig-headed intransigence.

    The outcry over the glossy screens has been reverberating around the blogs since the gloss only idiocy was announced.

    This was a really dumb move by Apple and the dumbness has been compounded by its stubborn refusal to acknowledge ? and correct ? the mistake. It lends credence to the (usually fallacious) argument that Apple puts design ahead of function ? style over substance.
  • Reply 90 of 150
    mr. hmr. h Posts: 4,740member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gooddog View Post


    I have $8,000 in my iMac budget



    Dude, if you've got that much, just get a Mac Pro and a third-party screen.
  • Reply 91 of 150
    This is the best news I have heard from Apple in a long time, please give the 24" imac antiglare!

    I have a new 2009 17" MacBook Pro and would not trade it for the world. Go to this link to see my comparison video on YouTube...



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gY4aPbaw2YU
  • Reply 92 of 150
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,215member
    how about this solution.



    anti-glare for an additional $50 on a laptop, $100 on an imac or cinema display. online only.



    a lot of folks would go for that, the smaller stores aren't bogged down with double the stock to deal with. and from what I understand when I needed to change some bits on a recent order. if you place the order off a computer at an apple store, that store still gets credit for making the sale. so they aren't put out the dollars.



    seems to me to be a win/win (outside of the few extra days but if you know it going on)



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    I never quite understood why Apple, a company claiming to offer BTO (build to order) computers had too many missing options. At some point the BTO rings hollow if you're proverbially telling folks "you can have any color you want as long as it's Black"



    because they feel it in their best interests (in terms of servicing as well as dealing with parts suppliers) to restrict the options.



    otherwise, why not just restart the clone program



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SteveMinne View Post


    Apple's decision to drop matte screens was profit driven and pig headed. This never should have happened. Had they listened to their clients in the first place it never would have.



    who says they didn't. there was a time when they had the matte option avail in stores, for the same price on the 15 and 17. since we don't have access to the sales figures we can't say how they lined up. but it is possible that not that many anti-glare sold, particularly on the 15. thus Apple would have no reason to believe they needed the option on said model or any others.



    yes they might be wrong., but based on what they had, it could have been a solid judgment. we really can't say
  • Reply 93 of 150
    techboytechboy Posts: 183member
    I never understood Apple's logic on ignoring the design community to forgo matte screen. The day Apple bring back matte screen option will be the day I purchase another Mac...which is at least 3-yrs since my last one.
  • Reply 94 of 150
    abster2coreabster2core Posts: 2,501member
    It is obvious from the statements made here that not very many
    • Know the difference between "glare" and "reflection."

    • Have taken the new backlit LCDs outside on a bright sunny day

    • Know how to position their monitors to eliminate glare or virtually eliminate reflection

    • Know how to adjust room lighting or

    • Know that you can eliminate most reflections even in the most difficult cases by changing the screen background.

    Regardless what anybody says, Apple is cognisant about what the effects of using computers can, amongst other things, have on our eyes and vision. http://www.apple.com/about/ergonomics/vision.html



    As Apple states, their glossy LED display "… lets you view graphics, photos, and videos with richer color and deeper blacks…" and in comparison with a regular glossy LCDs or an antiglare display, the effect is significantly more dramatic, particularly when you view them from within a darkened room or outdoors on a bright sunny day.



    Now my position will not be taken well by most of you. Yes, I prefer Apples LED glossy displays. And I would highly suggest that you all should do so as well. Or at least consider the following.



    Any covering between you and the monitor, albeit using an anti-glare or anti-reflective glass or screen matting diminishes its true color or vibrancy. If reflection is still an issue, you can always temporarily place a anti-glare/reflective screen over the glossy glass and remove it at any time. Anybody remember those 'transition' lenses. No matter how well they helped you to climatize to the varying degrees of sunlight, they always looked gray, and everything you looked at was dull, no matter what time of day or night it was.



    More important, before you jump into the "matte" arena, it is extremely important that you understand that there are a number of screen types to choose from, and it id best that you consider the environment in which you will be using the computer. http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-an-a...ter-screen.htm



    No matter which format Apple chooses to offer if they do come out with a 'matte' option, there will still be a question of whether it was the right one. At least with the 'glossy' display, I have a multitude of relatively inexpensive options available, whereas, I can't go backwards with 'matte' without incurring significant costs.
  • Reply 95 of 150
    I have a glossy screen Macbook, and have never once had a problem with glare or reflection, but I guess options are always good. Offering both screens seems like a win for everyone.
  • Reply 96 of 150
    I don't own a glossy screen laptop but have been thinking of buying a MacBook Pro. Now I will wait to see what happens.



    Just wondering... Would a pair of polarising glasses let you see through the glare? Maybe Apple could issue these with every glossy MacBook. :-)
  • Reply 97 of 150
    I spent more than 35 years working in data processing, from a humble computer operator in the 1970?s to an IT manager when I retired due to ill-health. Throughout that period, the main request from operators and data entry clerks etc. was for some form of glare reduction for the CRTs that were the only available input devices for most of that time. We tried anti-glare polarising film for the windows behind the clerks, we tried venetian blinds? We had polarising glass screens that hung onto the front of the CRTs, we had a sort of nylon mesh device that worked in the same way. This applied to the majority of users too!



    Then, in the late 90?s, we started to get the first LCD screens, like the ones from IBM, 14 or 15 inches, I think? They were a beautiful thing, everybody loved them, even at £800!



    Less than ten years later, Sony started to produce their glossy screen laptops, and I remember seeing them in a computer store and thinking that they must be absolutely mad, they were reintroducing what had been a completely unavoidable problem with CRTs for no other reason than marketing glitter?



    Fortunately, when I finally bought myself an Apple machine, I inadvertantly bought the last matte 15 inch MacBook Pro in june 2008 from what was then a choice. I say inadvertantly, because I had debated for a few years about whether I needed a laptop or not, and when I finally jumped, I did not realise that this was the last one that Apple were to make.



    Now, I am thinking of replacing my desktop PC, and would love to get an Apple, but my choices are REALLY limited. I have to choose either a MacMini and suffer the inconvenience of the thing grinding to halt when more than three applications are opened, or a MacPro, which is brilliant, but far more power than I really need. Funnily enough, I went to an Apple store yesterday and tested the MacMini to see how soon (according to my theory) it would take to crap out, and it was indeed not long.



    So? Apple? We either need a midrange desktop (without a screen (MacMidi?)) or we need an anti-glare option on your otherwise excellent iMac, and we need it NOW!



    PS If you want me to upgrade my laptop for another Mac at some point in the future, you need to offer a choice on those too!
  • Reply 98 of 150
    mactrippermactripper Posts: 1,328member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    It is obvious from the statements made here that not very man.....etc.etc.







    Dude, take a look at the "Example" link in my signature below.



    The "Museum Glass®" is a type of processed glass that is over 99% anti-reflective, I have seen it in person once at a frame shop. It has all the clarity of regular glass, but no reflections, thus no glare. It costs a bit more, but not a whole lot to be prohibitive.



    The way anti-reflective glass works is by not reflecting light waves coming from the front side while letting light pass uneffected from the other side and through it. This is better than matte which distorts the light in both directions.



    So it's not a "matte vs glossy" debate anymore, it's more like "how can we eliminate the reflections and glare from the new glass type screens?



    A better type of glass is the solution and everyone, including glossy lovers, would be happy, it's because Apple is using a cheap form of glass that's why we got reflections/glare.
  • Reply 99 of 150
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,229moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    It is obvious from the statements made here that not very many
    • Know the difference between "glare" and "reflection."

    • Have taken the new backlit LCDs outside on a bright sunny day

    • Know how to position their monitors to eliminate glare or virtually eliminate reflection

    • Know how to adjust room lighting or

    • Know that you can eliminate most reflections even in the most difficult cases by changing the screen background.




    I don't think the issues with glossy displays are anything to do with a consumer's lack of knowledge of anything. You don't have to adjust anything for matte, you do for glossy - that is a problem regardless of knowing how to deal with it.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    Any covering between you and the monitor, albeit using an anti-glare or anti-reflective glass or screen matting diminishes its true color or vibrancy.



    I've never had a problem with that using matte. People say it blurs output, reduces contrast and all sorts but I think it looks fine. My matte screens are sharp and the colors are great. The deepness of the blacks is not to do with glossy or matte but the panel quality.



    Where's the lack of vibrancy in these matte displays:



    http://juryan.com/mastagenie/attach/1/955288.jpg



    Those are Apple's original matte IPS Cinema displays - no reflections despite the varied angles of the screens and yet vivid colors all round.



    Someone took pictures of the anti-glare MBP, the glossy MBP and the old matte one:



    new anti-glare



    new glossy



    old matte (might be old glossy)





    The old model MBP looks washed out and the colors aren't so bright. The new anti-glare model has the same if not better black levels, just without the reflection.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    No matter which format Apple chooses to offer if they do come out with a 'matte' option, there will still be a question of whether it was the right one.



    I find that hard to believe considering they've sold them for years without any complaints.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    At least with the 'glossy' display, I have a multitude of relatively inexpensive options available, whereas, I can't go backwards with 'matte' without incurring significant costs.



    Again the question arises, when have you ever heard someone complain about a mate screen? A matte screen has no issues to work around. Any lack of vibrancy or sharpness is severely over-hyped. It's simply not a problem.
  • Reply 100 of 150
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    The market is tight so they are starting to listen. When the $ are flowing again we will be ignored as before...
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