FCC to investigate markets where iPhone is not available

124

Comments

  • Reply 61 of 87
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    This is hilarious.

    After all the pissing and moaning from everyone about exclusivity, and how much greater it would be if Apple would just sell an unlocked phone, you all suddenly get all 'libertarian' about the 'free market' and choices.

    What a bunch of hypocrites.



    Really? You lump everyone of us together? In that case, I lump you in with all idiots.



    Quote:

    This is exactly what the FCC should be doing... busting up the collusion between handset makers and cell phone monopolies.

    Go get 'em.



    Patents provide a government-sanctioned form of monopoly--actually more of an exclusivity arrangement--in exchange for the development and dissemination of knowledge that is promoted by intellectual property laws. The FCC has no jurisdiction here. Perhaps the FCC is curious about what happened, but I really doubt the FCC has any legal basis for demanding the information that's reportedly been asked. Apple and AT&T might just tell the FCC to politely go away.
  • Reply 62 of 87
    thepixeldocthepixeldoc Posts: 2,257member
    I can't believe the short-sighted BS I'm reading for comments here(!)... specifically from bigMC6000. Yes... the iPhone is a luxury item TODAY. However, has it occured to you that 5 years from now (or shorter) ALL phones will be smart-phones?



    Cars, basic phones, electricity, et al were all at one time considered "luxury items"... even a computer for that matter. My first Mac setup cost close to 20K in '84.



    Also, you do realize that at some point in the not too distant future, you will not be able to buy "paper books", or CD/DVDs, or even the local newspaper and assorted national magazines in paper form. Due to the digital-revolution, many publishers are cutting back, or even going out of business. Many of your great "old" books will never see a reprint, and will only be available online for your kid's eReader app, or any other eInk device, computer, or even lowly TV... essentially only a computer moniter as we know it today. They will also be able to link to video demonstrations of complex mathematical, grammar, scientific problems and lessons. You don't want that for your kids(?).... and only want to rely on what you have available for teachers within your small community... good and bad?



    You also are tech-aware enough to see the advantages of having broadband access, for if nothing else, to keep you alive (literally). Many health care monitoring functions, such as diabetes, heart-disease, etc. will by monitored by your city-dwelling health care provider...how? Over broadband naturally, and more than likely connected to a "luxury item" like a smart-phone... or the iPhone as it is today. In addition to monitoring your vitals, you will also be able to have a short video conference with them if needed. You'd rather truck it 100 miles to town?... and possibly die at the wheel trying to get there?



    I would expect that someone commenting on an Apple tech site of all places, would be further along into processing in there heads, what we have today... will surely translate into a completely different world tomorrow.



    PS: I also believe that all people in general sit around too much and get fat these days. But to point to technological advances (the Internet) as the reason, is seriously stupid. Why not point to the car, or the TV, or the phone, or even electricity, or any other tech advance over the last 100 years.



    You may consider living in a cave, cool and healthy, and you're absolutely free to choose that route as an American. However, limiting other people to do the same, is undemocratic, as well as un-American. That is what the FCC is trying to determine: if limited choice is good, or bad for America and it's citizens... LOOKING FORWARD!



    PSS: Hey! I hit 50 posts as habitual "lurker" on most blogs and forums! I need to get off my fat @ss and quick!
  • Reply 63 of 87
    macgregormacgregor Posts: 1,434member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jimerl View Post




    i agree w the maestro there are lots of business practices that aren't in the best interest of the consumer ... in fact, ALL of them are, by design, in the best interest of the business!



    That is the most elegant argument for reasonable government regulation.



    There is more to the demand vs. supply equation than just giving businesses supply sided help all of the time.
  • Reply 64 of 87
    macgregormacgregor Posts: 1,434member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Foo2 View Post


    Patents provide a government-sanctioned form of monopoly--actually more of an exclusivity arrangement--in exchange for the development and dissemination of knowledge that is promoted by intellectual property laws. The FCC has no jurisdiction here. Perhaps the FCC is curious about what happened, but I really doubt the FCC has any legal basis for demanding the information that's reportedly been asked. Apple and AT&T might just tell the FCC to politely go away.



    And if everyone is honest about this, then that is how the system is supposed to work.



    I think you need to learn abit more about the FCC, though.
  • Reply 65 of 87
    nceencee Posts: 855member
    Hell I live in Central Maine, and there's a ton of shit we don't have, and don't get me started on how PORLY my Verizon cell works around here (and anywhere around northeast Maine, and just about anything northeast of Augusta or north of Waterville, or north of Bangor. Oh, let's not forget Northern NH (On my sales route).



    Hell my brother lives 12 miles outside of town and his cell phone may work ? sometimes. But he DOES have a land lie phone, if it's needed





    Skip
  • Reply 66 of 87
    robogoborobogobo Posts: 378member
    While I'm completely in favor of dissolving exclusivity contracts, this is not the way to do it. Equal Rights doesn't mean everyone gets to have everything. Shit, if you want an iPhone, buy one off eBay and cross your fingers.



    While the end goal is commendable, the rhetoric is lousy.
  • Reply 67 of 87
    kibitzerkibitzer Posts: 1,114member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


    I can't believe the short-sighted BS I'm reading for comments here(!)... specifically from bigMC6000.!



    Have to agree with you on that. Much of it appears to be trolling and expressions of obstinacy, bad humor and bad attitude. Makes me wonder what's really eating at him.



    Take that regressive argument to its conclusion and rural folk would still be communicating with tin cans and kitchen twine instead of phones. Rural folk in the Great Plains and mountain states would be mostly illiterate because there would be no in-state revenue distribution to fund their schools. Sound unreasonable? Probably, but no more unreasonable than bigMC6000's ill-tempered extremism.



    It's also shortsighted to view communications as a one-way street. We live in an urban area, but there are plenty of people I want to communicate with who live in New Mexico and Colorado. We travel those and other rural areas by car and I appreciate having iPhone web capability across the country.



    The availability and usefulness of iPhones and 3G service is being limited by an anti-competitive business agreement that works at odds with consumers. When the iPhone-carrier cartel in the U.S. is replaced by a more open and competitive market - which will happen eventually - we'll see broader service, better offerings and better value.
  • Reply 68 of 87
    mac voyermac voyer Posts: 1,291member
    It is hard to believe that just two short years ago, the iPhone didn't exist. Since that time, the iPhone has become something to be ridiculed by the industry, then shamelessly copied, called monopolistic, now getting the scrutiny of the government for being too successful. It has gone from niche gadget to basic human right in record time.



    In this thread, alone, it has been compared to the invention of the telephone, to electricity, to education, and so on. I remind you all, this is not about guaranteeing cell phone service to every area; this is about making the iPhone available to every person. Make no mistake about it, this has nothing to do with smartphones as a whole. No one ever suggested that everyone should have access to a BB Bold or G1 or Pre. Those phones might be mentioned in conjunction with the iPhone, but that is to just obscure the fact that the only phone that matters in America these days is the iPhone. No other handset has ever changed the game so thoroughly.



    Who knows where this new emphasis on consumer access to excellence might lead. Perhaps it will be mandated that every school room desk have a built-in Mac. Perhaps every television will have an ATV inside. Perhaps the government will subsidize the price of every iPhone so that they are free to all people who want them. Perhaps MBPs will come free in cereal boxes. I am starting to like the look of this brave new world where there is a government mandated Apple product in every pocket.



    Too bad for Palm. They were going to try to build a business on filling in the gaps left by the iPhone. Now, the government is going to force Apple into producing a perfect product that is available to everyone. So much for competition. That's OK. I'm not that fund of Palm these days anyway. If you thought Apple had no competition before, just wait till the smoke has cleared.
  • Reply 69 of 87
    thepixeldocthepixeldoc Posts: 2,257member
    Just wanted to say, that I hope it was clear that I was only supporting broadband access to all areas, and eventually cellular broadband. I was not stating that everyone should have a govt. subsidized or mandated iPhone... or any other gadget for that matter.



    Again I will emphasize that today's "luxury item", smart-phone, multi-gig computer and network.... will be passé, and tomorrows "under-powered-and-time-to-replace" old-tech.



    In fact, you just might see current-tech Nokias, Ericsons, Samsungs, etc. in your cereal box shortly, unless they get on the ball. A smart-phone today will be considered "just a phone" in a very short time.



    Just a short comment re: capitalism, history, and the present

    If it hasn't occured to any of you die-hard, old-style capitalists... the world is a COMPLETELY different place then it was just a short 20 years ago. The movement of information, technology and it's speed completely changes the game. Also consider that there are other countries that are gaining, or have overtaken America in many industries, as well as the quality of life they offer to their citizens. Part of the reason is that these countries have deemed fit to subsidize, or build out there tech infrastructure.... just as America has over the last 100 years many times.



    PS. Does "



    America is and has been well served by pure market-capitalism, but times change. As with a well managed, flexible, nimble small company... you will profit by adapting to change and the markets. The question is: is America too BIG to adapt? Is it too monolithic to compete with smaller nations? I would hope not. I do NOT like big-govt. in the least, and or central-planning styled govts. However "some times" it is necessary for a short period of time to make exceptions... to any rule. It has been said many times to the small people on this totem-pole: "adapt or die". It's about time that the same rules apply to the big guys, whether business or government.



    Read into that what you will.



    Peace.



    PS. Does "well managed, flexible, nimble small company" remind you of anybody?
  • Reply 70 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac Voyer View Post


    It is hard to believe that just two short years ago, the iPhone didn't exist. Since that time, the iPhone has become something to be ridiculed by the industry, then shamelessly copied, called monopolistic, now getting the scrutiny of the government for being too successful. It has gone from niche gadget to basic human right in record time.



    In this thread, alone, it has been compared to the invention of the telephone, to electricity, to education, and so on. I remind you all, this is not about guaranteeing cell phone service to every area; this is about making the iPhone available to every person. Make no mistake about it, this has nothing to do with smartphones as a whole. No one ever suggested that everyone should have access to a BB Bold or G1 or Pre. Those phones might be mentioned in conjunction with the iPhone, but that is to just obscure the fact that the only phone that matters in America these days is the iPhone. No other handset has ever changed the game so thoroughly.



    Who knows where this new emphasis on consumer access to excellence might lead. Perhaps it will be mandated that every school room desk have a built-in Mac. Perhaps every television will have an ATV inside. Perhaps the government will subsidize the price of every iPhone so that they are free to all people who want them. Perhaps MBPs will come free in cereal boxes. I am starting to like the look of this brave new world where there is a government mandated Apple product in every pocket.



    Too bad for Palm. They were going to try to build a business on filling in the gaps left by the iPhone. Now, the government is going to force Apple into producing a perfect product that is available to everyone. So much for competition. That's OK. I'm not that fund of Palm these days anyway. If you thought Apple had no competition before, just wait till the smoke has cleared.



    True. Apple has really revolutionised the way phones work and no phone has ever had that respect till now.
  • Reply 71 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ncee View Post


    Hell I live in Central Maine, and there's a ton of shit we don't have, and don't get me started on how PORLY my Verizon cell works around here (and anywhere around northeast Maine, and just about anything northeast of Augusta or north of Waterville, or north of Bangor. Oh, let's not forget Northern NH (On my sales route).



    Hell my brother lives 12 miles outside of town and his cell phone may work ? sometimes. But he DOES have a land lie phone, if it's needed





    Skip



    Landline phone right?
  • Reply 72 of 87
    bigmc6000bigmc6000 Posts: 767member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Kibitzer View Post


    Have to agree with you on that. Much of it appears to be trolling and expressions of obstinacy, bad humor and bad attitude. Makes me wonder what's really eating at him.



    Take that regressive argument to its conclusion and rural folk would still be communicating with tin cans and kitchen twine instead of phones. Rural folk in the Great Plains and mountain states would be mostly illiterate because there would be no in-state revenue distribution to fund their schools. Sound unreasonable? Probably, but no more unreasonable than bigMC6000's ill-tempered extremism.



    It's also shortsighted to view communications as a one-way street. We live in an urban area, but there are plenty of people I want to communicate with who live in New Mexico and Colorado. We travel those and other rural areas by car and I appreciate having iPhone web capability across the country.



    The availability and usefulness of iPhones and 3G service is being limited by an anti-competitive business agreement that works at odds with consumers. When the iPhone-carrier cartel in the U.S. is replaced by a more open and competitive market - which will happen eventually - we'll see broader service, better offerings and better value.



    Trolling because of bunch of elitist pricks seem to think they know what people living in rural areas need to survive? Yep, you got me there, I'm awful.



    Also, if you're so delusional to think you won't be able to buy paper back books in a matter of years you really, really don't understand how things work and for that I just feel sad for you. B!tch at me all you want but when it comes down to it I'm the one from the area that is supposedly being most hurt by this lack of smart phones (if there is such a thing).



    And no, every phone won't be a smart for, at least, 15-20 years (sure, go ahead and write that one down) and if you think the free-market won't have adjusted to that (in terms of what services they provide to BFE) then you really have little to no understanding of how capitalism works and has worked in this country.



    P.S. if you think having a smart phone is a quality of life issue I really have nothing to say to you - you're so lost in your delusion that rational thought is beyond your capability
  • Reply 73 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bigmc6000 View Post


    What are books anyway??? I mean, there's no possible way a kid could learn proper history or math or science or biology unless they are using a text that was updated just last week. I mean, history is changing all the time and math, wow, I mean, yesterday 2+1 = 4 tomorrow - who knows!! *sarcasm*



    LOL! Cant't believe you got such simple Math wrong. It's 5.
  • Reply 74 of 87
    bigmc6000bigmc6000 Posts: 767member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


    I can't believe the short-sighted BS I'm reading for comments here(!)... specifically from bigMC6000. Yes... the iPhone is a luxury item TODAY. However, has it occured to you that 5 years from now (or shorter) ALL phones will be smart-phones?



    Cars, basic phones, electricity, et al were all at one time considered "luxury items"... even a computer for that matter. My first Mac setup cost close to 20K in '84.



    Also, you do realize that at some point in the not too distant future, you will not be able to buy "paper books", or CD/DVDs, or even the local newspaper and assorted national magazines in paper form. Due to the digital-revolution, many publishers are cutting back, or even going out of business. Many of your great "old" books will never see a reprint, and will only be available online for your kid's eReader app, or any other eInk device, computer, or even lowly TV... essentially only a computer moniter as we know it today. They will also be able to link to video demonstrations of complex mathematical, grammar, scientific problems and lessons. You don't want that for your kids(?).... and only want to rely on what you have available for teachers within your small community... good and bad?



    You also are tech-aware enough to see the advantages of having broadband access, for if nothing else, to keep you alive (literally). Many health care monitoring functions, such as diabetes, heart-disease, etc. will by monitored by your city-dwelling health care provider...how? Over broadband naturally, and more than likely connected to a "luxury item" like a smart-phone... or the iPhone as it is today. In addition to monitoring your vitals, you will also be able to have a short video conference with them if needed. You'd rather truck it 100 miles to town?... and possibly die at the wheel trying to get there?



    I would expect that someone commenting on an Apple tech site of all places, would be further along into processing in there heads, what we have today... will surely translate into a completely different world tomorrow.



    PS: I also believe that all people in general sit around too much and get fat these days. But to point to technological advances (the Internet) as the reason, is seriously stupid. Why not point to the car, or the TV, or the phone, or even electricity, or any other tech advance over the last 100 years.



    You may consider living in a cave, cool and healthy, and you're absolutely free to choose that route as an American. However, limiting other people to do the same, is undemocratic, as well as un-American. That is what the FCC is trying to determine: if limited choice is good, or bad for America and it's citizens... LOOKING FORWARD!



    PSS: Hey! I hit 50 posts as habitual "lurker" on most blogs and forums! I need to get off my fat @ss and quick!



    You've been ready Orwell again haven't you?... You know it's fiction right? Or, wait, can you even read that since you seem to think books will soon not exist? Your blind ignorance in terms of how quickly things are progressing in technology is amazing - simply amazing. Please show me even 1, just 1, major college that has done away with text books. Please, just 1. Right, there aren't any. Why? Because this move to digital is going to take much, much, much longer than you think. (If for no other reason than the paper companies would be pissed and then they would need a bailout as well).



    You obviously don't have your sarcasm meter on if you think I was serious about banning technology because it makes people fat - I was pointing out the idiocy of the argument I was addressing (and similarly yours). You can't say, oh well rural folk would be using tin cans - that's commonly known as the slippery slope theory and doesn't hold an ounce of water.



    I'd agree that broadband is more important than smart phones but we're still talking about HD Radio and Satellite radio (for comparison purposes). Radio (aka, land lines, paper books, regular cell phones) is still the pre-eminent form of audio distribution and that isn't going to change for a very, very long time.



    Be mad at me all you want but at least I can see the forest for the trees - your so stuck on technology being the answer for everything your focus is the size of a dime.



    Also, I'm the one standing up for the rural folk - I'm the one saying they aren't second class citizens because they don't have smart phones, that they are just as intelligent even tho they learn from paper books - just because you think something is required for life doesn't mean other people do and to use their tax money for something they don't care about and would rather go to something else (although, admittedly I'd rather them waste the money on this than all the other retarded ideas they are throwing around right now) that would be more beneficial to them (farm subsidies anyone??)
  • Reply 75 of 87
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 4,941member
    how interesting this conversation has gone....



    People no one needs technology to live, and nowhere does it say that its the responsibility of government or the rest of us to ensure that everyone gets the technology they want. Yes it has been done in the past under the premise of the common good, but it has been all about companies making money. 20 years ago my technology bill was about $20 per month, for a phone, I'll leave out the other utilities, today that bill is well over $200, and I bet you all have the same bills, phone, cell phone, internet access, Cable TV and the list may go on for others. Whether you get new technology in you area depends on whether a company thinks it is worth it for them to supply it to you, unless our government step in and thinks for some reason the rest of us should pay for the limited few to get it since it is in the common good.



    Do you know there is entire groups of people living in PA without a single modern convenience they have no power or phones, so they have none of the other things I listed above. Oh guess what it is by choose, they want to live this way. Also, PA government protect their right to live this way, no company can place cell towels on their properties, power lines can not be run over their properties, even highways which was going to split their communities were stopped.



    Before you go off and said it is a god given right to have the latest and greatest everything, think again because I can show you a group of people who see it a different way and they like their lives.



    I am really tires of this entitlement attitude people have, Just because something exist and someone else has it does not mean your entitle to it too.



    PS, these people educate their kids in one room schools houses and use book, I highly doubt they plan to change any times soon. They also use horse and buggies to get around, so they are not dependent on foreign oil. Lastly, they take no government money and only pay taxes on business transaction they do out side their communities.
  • Reply 76 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


    Just wanted to say, that I hope it was clear that I was only supporting broadband access to all areas, and eventually cellular broadband. I was not stating that everyone should have a govt. subsidized or mandated iPhone... or any other gadget for that matter.



    Again I will emphasize that today's "luxury item", smart-phone, multi-gig computer and network.... will be passé, and tomorrows "under-powered-and-time-to-replace" old-tech.



    In fact, you just might see current-tech Nokias, Ericsons, Samsungs, etc. in your cereal box shortly, unless they get on the ball. A smart-phone today will be considered "just a phone" in a very short time.



    Just a short comment re: capitalism, history, and the present

    If it hasn't occured to any of you die-hard, old-style capitalists... the world is a COMPLETELY different place then it was just a short 20 years ago. The movement of information, technology and it's speed completely changes the game. Also consider that there are other countries that are gaining, or have overtaken America in many industries, as well as the quality of life they offer to their citizens. Part of the reason is that these countries have deemed fit to subsidize, or build out there tech infrastructure.... just as America has over the last 100 years many times.



    PS. Does "



    America is and has been well served by pure market-capitalism, but times change. As with a well managed, flexible, nimble small company... you will profit by adapting to change and the markets. The question is: is America too BIG to adapt? Is it too monolithic to compete with smaller nations? I would hope not. I do NOT like big-govt. in the least, and or central-planning styled govts. However "some times" it is necessary for a short period of time to make exceptions... to any rule. It has been said many times to the small people on this totem-pole: "adapt or die". It's about time that the same rules apply to the big guys, whether business or government.



    Read into that what you will.



    Peace.



    PS. Does "well managed, flexible, nimble small company" remind you of anybody?



    Yes. Apple. I suppose everybody here know the answer.
  • Reply 77 of 87
    kuthkuth Posts: 6member
    Obviously you don't live in a rural area. I had an iPhone and I live in a small town. It worked great at my house (granted I only had 2 bars and was on EDGE, but it worked). I moved 1 mile away and I couldn't use it. I had to sell my phone and go with a crap verizon phone because I can't live without a phone at my house (no land line).



    It is NOT reasonable for everyone to move to use a phone and the attitude that somehow people who live in rural areas have all the money in the world to move and the job opportunities grow from trees is plain ignorant.



    BTW I'm not a farmer just because I live in a small town away from a city (no disrespect to farmers, you guys rock, we love the food you provide). I'm a network admin and I used the iPhone daily for my job. My life will become more difficult without being able to VPN to work while traveling.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post


    oh come on, they do not get it since it does not make sense to wire the entire country with data services, why not go after every business that only has outlets in large city if you want be fair to consumers. hell why no go after getting high speed internet to every home in the country via fiber optics.



    Where does it say that ever person in the country has to have equal access to everything even if the choose to live in the middle of no where. they can move it call choice and trade offs



  • Reply 78 of 87
    macgregormacgregor Posts: 1,434member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Beauty of Bath View Post


    There are essentially two models for rights.



    1) You have the right to do anything you want unless prohibited.



    2) You have the right to do nothing other than that which is expressly permitted.



    Which system would you prefer?





    .



    There are essentially two types of people in the world:



    1) Those who simplistically spout dualist propaganda about rights



    2) Those who appreciate a more realistic and complex view of "rights"



    Which person are you?
  • Reply 79 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacGregor View Post


    There are essentially two types of people in the world:



    1) Those who simplistically spout dualist propaganda about rights



    2) Those who appreciate a more realistic and complex view of "rights"



    Which person are you?



    He'll say number 3.
  • Reply 80 of 87
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    Seriously. For large numbers of people in this country, their place of residence is to a large degree an accident of birth. And not only may they not be able, for whatever reason, to move so that they can have access to technology, or education, they should not have to. I'm sorry, but your attitude is elitist and in opposition to the best interests of this country's citizens.



    Now that's a stupid argument, as is the "I can get 3G in Bulgaria". Individually or collectively, do you know how the countries of Europe stack up in land mass against the US? The US is over 90 times as large as Bulgaria. If you choose to live in BFE, you have to balance what you gain in terms of space against what you give up in terms of convenience...and yes, high-speed Internet and high-speed mobile telephony are conveniences.
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