Apple working on device abuse detection technology
Apple has investigated a system where portable devices like iPods and iPhones would detect and store into memory "consumer abuse events" such as exposure to extreme cold, heat or moisture in void of warranty, a new patent application reveals.
The invention, entitled "Consumer Abuse Detection System and Method," was discovered by AppleInsider in a new patent application disclosure this week. Apple originally filed for the patent on Feb. 1, 2008. The concept aims to detect issues, like a dropped iPhone, that might void the warranty on the device.
Apple already includes liquid submersion indicators in its MacBook Pros, iPhones and iPods. They irreversibly change color once they come in contact with a liquid, thereby offering the company's retail store staff and authorized repair specialists an easy way to determine if a customer caused damage to their product with liquids -- incidents that aren't covered under Apple's standard warranties. Rather than the physical indicator, the new system would save information of damage digitally into memory.
"The system may include an interface by which a diagnostic device may access the memory to analyze the records and determine whether a consumer abuse event occurred, when the event occurred, and, in some embodiments, what type of abuse event occurred," the patent reads. "By providing the capability to quickly and easily detect whether consumer abuse occurred in an electronic device, a vendor or manufacturer diagnosing a returned product may be able to better determine whether or not to initiate a product return under a warranty policy."
In addition to warranty protection, the abuse detection circuitry could be used to disable the electronic device if an issue is detected, potentially reducing the risk of damage to the device. The system would aim protect a myriad of parts on devices, including the screen, processor, memory, and potentially inserted devices like SD or CompactFlash cards.
The system would recognize a number of incident types, with liquid and thermal sensors detecting the elements, a shock sensor for drops, and a continuity sensor to detect tampering with the device. Apple suggests that such a system could save money for product vendors and manufacturers who receive warranty returns on products that have been abused.
"A problem arises when a device has failed due to consumer abuse which may not be readily apparent upon a cursory inspection, but a consumer attempts to return the device for repair or replacement under the warranty," the patent reads. "Often, particularly at a point of sale, personnel receiving the returned device may be unqualified or untrained to determine whether or not a device has failed due to manufacturing defects or due to consumer abuse."
It continues: "Thus, personnel at the point of sale may often times exchange the returned product with a working replacement product regardless of the cause of failure in order to avoid potential conflicts with the customer. As a result, it is not uncommon for consumers to receive replacement products or repair services on abused products not covered under the terms of a warranty. Such erroneous replacements or repairs may be costly to the vendor and/or manufacturer of the product."
The invention, entitled "Consumer Abuse Detection System and Method," was discovered by AppleInsider in a new patent application disclosure this week. Apple originally filed for the patent on Feb. 1, 2008. The concept aims to detect issues, like a dropped iPhone, that might void the warranty on the device.
Apple already includes liquid submersion indicators in its MacBook Pros, iPhones and iPods. They irreversibly change color once they come in contact with a liquid, thereby offering the company's retail store staff and authorized repair specialists an easy way to determine if a customer caused damage to their product with liquids -- incidents that aren't covered under Apple's standard warranties. Rather than the physical indicator, the new system would save information of damage digitally into memory.
"The system may include an interface by which a diagnostic device may access the memory to analyze the records and determine whether a consumer abuse event occurred, when the event occurred, and, in some embodiments, what type of abuse event occurred," the patent reads. "By providing the capability to quickly and easily detect whether consumer abuse occurred in an electronic device, a vendor or manufacturer diagnosing a returned product may be able to better determine whether or not to initiate a product return under a warranty policy."
In addition to warranty protection, the abuse detection circuitry could be used to disable the electronic device if an issue is detected, potentially reducing the risk of damage to the device. The system would aim protect a myriad of parts on devices, including the screen, processor, memory, and potentially inserted devices like SD or CompactFlash cards.
The system would recognize a number of incident types, with liquid and thermal sensors detecting the elements, a shock sensor for drops, and a continuity sensor to detect tampering with the device. Apple suggests that such a system could save money for product vendors and manufacturers who receive warranty returns on products that have been abused.
"A problem arises when a device has failed due to consumer abuse which may not be readily apparent upon a cursory inspection, but a consumer attempts to return the device for repair or replacement under the warranty," the patent reads. "Often, particularly at a point of sale, personnel receiving the returned device may be unqualified or untrained to determine whether or not a device has failed due to manufacturing defects or due to consumer abuse."
It continues: "Thus, personnel at the point of sale may often times exchange the returned product with a working replacement product regardless of the cause of failure in order to avoid potential conflicts with the customer. As a result, it is not uncommon for consumers to receive replacement products or repair services on abused products not covered under the terms of a warranty. Such erroneous replacements or repairs may be costly to the vendor and/or manufacturer of the product."
Comments
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
Did you store it in your pants pocket after using the barthroom?
I appreciate that a manufacturer needs to be able to protect themselves from rampant abuse, but this type of thing can easily be abused. Consumer Electronics really isn't the right place for it.
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
The water detection systems in devices today do make mistakes though and they definitely are not fullproof. Same thing happened to me (but not with something as expensive as an ipod, sorry to hear that) but it was with a RAZR phone. The ONLY time the thing got near moisture is when it was in the bathroom with my while I took a shower and there was steam.
I don't take very hot showers, and I never picked the phone up and saw beeds of water on it or anything, but they insisted the water detector sticker had turned pink, indicating, as they called it, COMPLETE SUBMERSION.
Isn't there some kind of insurance you can buy so you can just get a replacement no matter what for ipods and iphones? Now that I'm with Sprint and have a far more expensive phone than the razr, I pay $7 a month to get a replacement if anything should happen, and it means ANYTHING. Well, maybe not anything. I don't know if "phone dropped in lava" is covered, but ether way just saying the phone was stolen will cover it lol.
They already use this
The patent is much more elaborate. I imagine that the sensors would be able to report back to the device’s OS, like S.M.A.R.T. for hard drives, which really aren’t that smart to begin with, but at least you can open Disk Utility and see if your drive is verified. This kind of thing could help phone-based tech support get a better handle on the what your problem is when, “the whatchamacallit isn’t working when I touch that one thingy.” isn’t quite as helpful as the caller thinks.
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
Call AppleCare or go to a different store. The Geniuses make mistakes and the moisture sensors are known to be extra sensitive. You can Google others having the same issue, perhaps you can find a resolution that matched your particular case and how you can get it resolved satisfactorily.
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
Go back and tell them that you are not claiming on the warranty for anything caused by water damage but for a manufacturing fault, i.e. a cracked case. They cannot disown liability for something that is NOT caused by water damage.
If companies are going to go down this route, the consumer need extra protection from abuse, e.g. a sensor going off only voids that part of the warranty for a limited time, long enough to ensure that the damage hasn't been done by that accident.
Go back and tell them that you are not claiming on the warranty for anything caused by water damage but for a manufacturing fault, i.e. a cracked case. They cannot disown liability for something that is NOT caused by water damage.
Yes they can. Once the sensor has changed color it voids all warranty claims whether or not they are Apple's fault. So, if your phone is malfunctioning and you've yet to bring it in for a Genius Bar appointment(never EVER try to get help without one), DO NOT GET IT WET OR LEAVE IT WHERE MOISTURE MAY CHANGE THE SENSOR! The Genius will have to void your warranty as it is not his job or worth losing his job to hand out free phones to those of us that can't understand that moisture+iPhones = VERY VERY BAD!
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
I had a friend that lost his new iPod nano (1st gen) due to placing it near his bedside, which was right above a humidifier. So it's not that far fetched that you can damage electronics due to condensation (i.e. without submerging it).
The patent is much more elaborate. I imagine that the sensors would be able to report back to the device’s OS, like S.M.A.R.T. for hard drives, which really aren’t that smart to begin with, but at least you can open Disk Utility and see if your drive is verified. This kind of thing could help phone-based tech support get a better handle on the what your problem is when, “the whatchamacallit isn’t working when I touch that one thingy.” isn’t quite as helpful as the caller thinks.
Call AppleCare or go to a different store. The Geniuses make mistakes and the moisture sensors are known to be extra sensitive. You can Google others having the same issue, perhaps you can find a resolution that matched your particular case and how you can get it resolved satisfactorily.
I think it's a good idea. The posters on this forum may be upstanding citizens, but I see a lot of chancers trying always to get something for free or get over on businesses by taking advantage of good customer service policies. Hurts us all when this happens.
FYI: You mentioned S.M.A.R.T. SmartReporter is a great little free utility for Apple computers that sits up in the menu bar (green HD icon) and when something starts going bad it turns red. Saved me once, turned red and warned before HD died. http://www.corecode.at/smartreporter/
I understand they are trying to weed out the people who bring in their devices that have obviously been abused and trying to get a new one, but this seems a little far. I hope it does not come to fruition. Already the water sensors are bad enough.
If Apple made dependable and rugged products (which I've not seen as of late), then there would be no real need for these sensors, right? I guess thin does come with a price.
(On a related note, my three month old iPod touch screen is starting to come up. Its as if a screw or glue or something didn't hold right. I was told "is within specifications". Yeah, right, when I can see the insides, that's not within specifications! Since the Intel switch, I'm now 4/4 in terms of faulty products from Apple. I bet if I try to bring back the iPod, they'll say its my fault somehow when I take good care of it. No more products from Apple for me.)
Go back and tell them that you are not claiming on the warranty for anything caused by water damage but for a manufacturing fault, i.e. a cracked case.
Maybe go back and tell them you are filing a warranty claim for a cracked case and faulty water sensors. Bring along a sworn affidavit that the device has never been submerged or subject to any other condition Apple says can activate them. At the very least the confusion you generate may be entertaining.
I went into an Apple store on Saturday to see about a crack in my iPhone near the bottom port. After running a quick test on it, they told me they couldn't do anything because my moisture sensor had been activated. I was told that both the warranty and Applecare were voided by this. Since I haven't submerged my phone, spilled a drink on it, or done any of the other things I was told would activate the sensor I question how well it works, but the Apple genius insisted the system didn't make mistakes.
I too had this happen with my iPod classic (bought in October '08). Same circumstances it was either carried in my purse (in a sleeve) or sitting next to my computer 100% of the time. I had lost 3 rastor lines on my screen. Verdict?
"Water damaged". R-I-G-H-T.....nice and convenient.
I would not be surprised if carrying an iPhone in your pocket would generate enough humidity to activate the sensor.
If Apple implement such electronic systems then the system can have a warning system if dangerous situations are being experienced. This can train the owner on how to take better care of the product.
There will be bound to be a lawsuit over the moisture sensor. If a lawyer demonstrates that the sensor is activated in humid climates then there will be trouble.
Maybe go back and tell them you are filing a warranty claim for a cracked case and faulty water sensors. Bring along a sworn affidavit that the device has never been submerged or subject to any other condition Apple says can activate them. At the very least the confusion you generate may be entertaining.
Good suggestion. This always works for me in this sort of situation. Very calmly, I say, "I know you get a lot of people taking advantage of your great customer service policy, but I can assure 'I did not get it wet.' I'm not lying." When you take it down to the level where the manage by disagreeing with you is essentially calling you a liar. They always give in. Especially if you do it politely.
Of course, my matinee idol good looks helps, too!
Sometimes you have to insist on service.
There will be bound to be a lawsuit over the moisture sensor. If a lawyer demonstrates that the sensor is activated in humid climates then there will be trouble.
Apple does list acceptable humidity, temperature and altitudes for their devices. That said, if they sell the item in areas that are outside those norms then they could be considered liable. I usually don?t agree with the lawsuits against Apple, but this is one that seems like it has a lot merit from what I?ve read about their moisture sensors.