iTunes is not system software as far as I am aware. It's just an application.
Oh right, so it wasn't shipped with Snow Leopard then?
Fact is, any Mac user is going to be using iTunes to manage their audio library, and probably their entire media library (podcasts, audio, video, etc). Third party apps like the EyeTV put recordings into iTunes.
Blocking media sync with third party devices from iTunes is just disingenuous. I feel it is counter to the aims of such software., now that iTunes has gotten to this position. I'm quite happy for Apple to limit third party hardware compatibility to the Mac version of iTunes only, but quite simply having more iTunes users means more iTunes marketshare, and higher possibilities of future iPhone / iPod purchase and usage. I think it's a clear win-win for Apple and consumers.
Yes, it is leeching, and for a reason most everyone on here is forgetting. Palm is making iTunes recognize the Pre as " "mass storage device manufactured by Apple" called an iPod." Palm is blatantly ripping off Apple in this regard. I have no problem with other devices being able to sync to iTunes (example: RIM developed their own software to interface with iTunes), but I don't see how what Palm is doing is even legal! Calling a Palm Pre an iPod that is manufactured by Apple? Tell me how that is not sketchy in the slightest.
Does the RIM sync from within iTunes when you plug it in?
That's why Palm did what they did. It's reverse engineering for interoperability. It makes the legal situation quite murky. It wouldn't have happened if Apple had a documented third-party media sync protocol within iTunes.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Not Palm. They are despisable by also following the "One more thing" thing.
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
Hello?? APPLE MADE iTunes and Safari FOR PC USERS WHO REQUIRE THEM. What has that got to do with Microsoft locking down on Apple's software? With your suggestion, they are just going to screw themselves, MS users and not Apple, wisecrack. Palm is violating regulations by doing that.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirq and eat my happy meal there without ordering anything from Le Cirq?
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirque and eat my happy meal there without paying Le Cirque?
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Since when has Apple ever open up anything? My ATV sits locked in their BS.
if microsoft would have killed itunes from the get go with this tactic that apple is using on palm (why should apple get a free ride on MS marketshare?) then you would see a lot more zunes in use.
if microsoft would have killed itunes from the get go with this tactic that apple is using on palm (why should apple get a free ride on MS marketshare?) then you would see a lot more zunes in use.
Or Miscrosoft could have killed off Macs running Windows by disabling Boot Camp or Paralells. Don't be surprised if it happens. Then we'll see who cries foul. MS could simply enable this as part of their users contract on Windows 7.
if microsoft would have killed itunes from the get go with this tactic that apple is using on palm (why should apple get a free ride on MS marketshare?) then you would see a lot more zunes in use.
I must've missed that chapter of the iPod's history where Apple head-faked Windows Media Player so that the iPod could dominate the .mp3 player market.
Oh right, so it wasn't shipped with Snow Leopard then?
You answer it yourself. iTunes is shipped WITH Snow Leopard, not PART OF Snow Leopard. You can delete iTunes, and your computer will run quite happily. Until the EU stepped in, you couldn't delete IE from Windows and not have problems. IE was system software, iTunes never has been.
The reason most people running a Mac use iTunes is because there's not a lot else out there. And the analogy of iPhoto is ridiculous. The whole point of iPhoto is to manage your photographs. As such, if Apple did disable downloading from a camera, all you would have to do is copy to the photos straight into your library from the flash card, much like you can do with iTunes and some media players.
The timing of Palm's announcement has once again seen the company overshadowed by Apple, with the iPod maker announced new media players this week. Earlier this summer, the Pre launched just as Apple announced the iPhone 3GS.
Palm didn't release media devices, all they did was announce (not release) a new phone. I wouldn't call it "overshadowing" by any stretch.
As for the Apple blocking others from iTunes is very childish in my mind. If they keep touting the iTunes store, then a Palm Pre/Pixi or RIM device, or even (gasp!) a Zune / WinMo device syncing with it means revenue for Apple through the store. I would think that having more devices and more people buying from your iTunes store (which could turn into a possible hardware sale when the device eventually dies or becomes obsolete) would help business. I'm not saying Apple should support these devices, but the should not lock them out!
Nope. Gotta make sure its only Apple products on Apples.
Now, what would happen if Microsoft all the sudden made patches for its OS that stopped the functionality of iTunes? I'm sure MANY people would be having a fit with the same arguments.
Anyhow, I ditched iTunes a long time ago. Bloatware if you ask me, and never has the features I want. This latest update is no different. If it weren't for my iPod touch, I'd have removed it from my Mac too.
I must've missed that chapter of the iPod's history where Apple head-faked Windows Media Player so that the iPod could dominate the .mp3 player market.
if you couldn't run itunes, and ipod wouldn't be allowed to work with media player (sort of like palm pre and itunes) then zune.
Or Miscrosoft could have killed off Macs running Windows by disabling Boot Camp or Paralells. Don't be surprised if it happens. Then will see who cries foul. MS could simply enable this as part of their users contract on Windows 7.
MS would shoot themselves in the foot doing this and for that, we will never see it happen. When someone buys Parallels (or Fusion, or downloads VMWare) to run Windows, they HAVE to buy (unless they have one) a licence for Windows too. Typically at full price. This means more money for MS. MS, aside from the Zune and XBox, is not a hardware company. They really couldn't care less who is running Windows, as long as people are running it. Mac or PC. It does not matter.
MS will not lock out Apple computers from their OS. They are reaping the benefits from all these "switchers" too... ironically.
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirq and eat my happy meal there without ordering anything from Le Cirq?
I've brought a Ford into a Toyota shop before, and they fixed up my fiance's car without any issue or complaints. On a flight that was cancelled back when TWA was around, I had to fly on United who were nice enough to all those TWA people (yes, on TWA's dollar I believe). I've seen folks bring in McDonalds into other restaurants (mainly for their children) and usually the restaurant was fine with it as long as they bought stuff there.
My point is really this: By allowing iTunes to be opened to Palm/RIM/MS/etc... means that people with these devices could BUY from the iTunes store (which is the main reason the software is free in the first place). They may not be Apple products, but Apple would be getting revenue, even taking it away from Rhapsody (ugh how I loathe them). On top of that, they would draw in customers to their eco-chain instead of pushing them away like they are now.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Yes, open standards are good. The problem is that, as stated many times by Apple, and proven by the relatively small profit they make from it, iTunes is not designed as a profit area. Instead, it's designed to sell iPods. Now, with that in mind, why would they, then, open the iTunes store to anyone?
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
I don't remember reading somewhere that Apple wrote iTunes et al. for Windows through a hack and pretend these apps are written by Microsoft.
So? Who really gives a sweet f about any third party wanting to use iTunes? They can either license rights from Apple, create their own iTunes knockoff, or just shut up.
I don't understand how someone can get upset over this. I for one don't care if Pre users are locked out, nor will I care if Palm and all of its products go up in smoke tomorrow.
Apple locking out the Pre has absolutely no impact on the iTunes user base.
Comments
iTunes is not system software as far as I am aware. It's just an application.
Oh right, so it wasn't shipped with Snow Leopard then?
Fact is, any Mac user is going to be using iTunes to manage their audio library, and probably their entire media library (podcasts, audio, video, etc). Third party apps like the EyeTV put recordings into iTunes.
Blocking media sync with third party devices from iTunes is just disingenuous. I feel it is counter to the aims of such software., now that iTunes has gotten to this position. I'm quite happy for Apple to limit third party hardware compatibility to the Mac version of iTunes only, but quite simply having more iTunes users means more iTunes marketshare, and higher possibilities of future iPhone / iPod purchase and usage. I think it's a clear win-win for Apple and consumers.
Yes, it is leeching, and for a reason most everyone on here is forgetting. Palm is making iTunes recognize the Pre as " "mass storage device manufactured by Apple" called an iPod." Palm is blatantly ripping off Apple in this regard. I have no problem with other devices being able to sync to iTunes (example: RIM developed their own software to interface with iTunes), but I don't see how what Palm is doing is even legal! Calling a Palm Pre an iPod that is manufactured by Apple? Tell me how that is not sketchy in the slightest.
Does the RIM sync from within iTunes when you plug it in?
That's why Palm did what they did. It's reverse engineering for interoperability. It makes the legal situation quite murky. It wouldn't have happened if Apple had a documented third-party media sync protocol within iTunes.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Open standards = poor.
And I don't want that as a shareholder.
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Not Palm. They are despisable by also following the "One more thing" thing.
apple has every right to do this?
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
Hello?? APPLE MADE iTunes and Safari FOR PC USERS WHO REQUIRE THEM. What has that got to do with Microsoft locking down on Apple's software? With your suggestion, they are just going to screw themselves, MS users and not Apple, wisecrack.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirq and eat my happy meal there without ordering anything from Le Cirq?
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirque and eat my happy meal there without paying Le Cirque?
+1! Nice examples BTW.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Since when has Apple ever open up anything? My ATV sits locked in their BS.
if microsoft would have killed itunes from the get go with this tactic that apple is using on palm (why should apple get a free ride on MS marketshare?) then you would see a lot more zunes in use.
Or Miscrosoft could have killed off Macs running Windows by disabling Boot Camp or Paralells. Don't be surprised if it happens. Then we'll see who cries foul. MS could simply enable this as part of their users contract on Windows 7.
if microsoft would have killed itunes from the get go with this tactic that apple is using on palm (why should apple get a free ride on MS marketshare?) then you would see a lot more zunes in use.
I must've missed that chapter of the iPod's history where Apple head-faked Windows Media Player so that the iPod could dominate the .mp3 player market.
Oh right, so it wasn't shipped with Snow Leopard then?
You answer it yourself. iTunes is shipped WITH Snow Leopard, not PART OF Snow Leopard. You can delete iTunes, and your computer will run quite happily. Until the EU stepped in, you couldn't delete IE from Windows and not have problems. IE was system software, iTunes never has been.
The reason most people running a Mac use iTunes is because there's not a lot else out there. And the analogy of iPhoto is ridiculous. The whole point of iPhoto is to manage your photographs. As such, if Apple did disable downloading from a camera, all you would have to do is copy to the photos straight into your library from the flash card, much like you can do with iTunes and some media players.
The timing of Palm's announcement has once again seen the company overshadowed by Apple, with the iPod maker announced new media players this week. Earlier this summer, the Pre launched just as Apple announced the iPhone 3GS.
[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ]
Palm didn't release media devices, all they did was announce (not release) a new phone. I wouldn't call it "overshadowing" by any stretch.
As for the Apple blocking others from iTunes is very childish in my mind. If they keep touting the iTunes store, then a Palm Pre/Pixi or RIM device, or even (gasp!) a Zune / WinMo device syncing with it means revenue for Apple through the store. I would think that having more devices and more people buying from your iTunes store (which could turn into a possible hardware sale when the device eventually dies or becomes obsolete) would help business. I'm not saying Apple should support these devices, but the should not lock them out!
Nope. Gotta make sure its only Apple products on Apples.
Now, what would happen if Microsoft all the sudden made patches for its OS that stopped the functionality of iTunes? I'm sure MANY people would be having a fit with the same arguments.
Anyhow, I ditched iTunes a long time ago. Bloatware if you ask me, and never has the features I want. This latest update is no different. If it weren't for my iPod touch, I'd have removed it from my Mac too.
I must've missed that chapter of the iPod's history where Apple head-faked Windows Media Player so that the iPod could dominate the .mp3 player market.
if you couldn't run itunes, and ipod wouldn't be allowed to work with media player (sort of like palm pre and itunes) then zune.
Or Miscrosoft could have killed off Macs running Windows by disabling Boot Camp or Paralells. Don't be surprised if it happens. Then will see who cries foul. MS could simply enable this as part of their users contract on Windows 7.
MS would shoot themselves in the foot doing this and for that, we will never see it happen. When someone buys Parallels (or Fusion, or downloads VMWare) to run Windows, they HAVE to buy (unless they have one) a licence for Windows too. Typically at full price. This means more money for MS. MS, aside from the Zune and XBox, is not a hardware company. They really couldn't care less who is running Windows, as long as people are running it. Mac or PC. It does not matter.
MS will not lock out Apple computers from their OS. They are reaping the benefits from all these "switchers" too... ironically.
It's called the free-rider problem and if you believe in the free enterprise system then you should recognize the free-rider problem as a problem. Or shall we now force Ford to compel their dealers to accept GM cars for servicing even if Ford doesn't want to? Or shall we force the ground crew of American Airlines to assist United Airlines passengers even though American Airlines doesn't want to? Or shall I now be allowed to buy a meal at McDonalds and then get a table at Le Cirq and eat my happy meal there without ordering anything from Le Cirq?
I've brought a Ford into a Toyota shop before, and they fixed up my fiance's car without any issue or complaints. On a flight that was cancelled back when TWA was around, I had to fly on United who were nice enough to all those TWA people (yes, on TWA's dollar I believe). I've seen folks bring in McDonalds into other restaurants (mainly for their children) and usually the restaurant was fine with it as long as they bought stuff there.
My point is really this: By allowing iTunes to be opened to Palm/RIM/MS/etc... means that people with these devices could BUY from the iTunes store (which is the main reason the software is free in the first place). They may not be Apple products, but Apple would be getting revenue, even taking it away from Rhapsody (ugh how I loathe them). On top of that, they would draw in customers to their eco-chain instead of pushing them away like they are now.
Very poor Apple. Would it really dent your ego so much to open iTunes up to any device through an API? You're behaving like Mircosoft from the bad old days, and that's just not cool.
Open standards = good.
Yes, open standards are good. The problem is that, as stated many times by Apple, and proven by the relatively small profit they make from it, iTunes is not designed as a profit area. Instead, it's designed to sell iPods. Now, with that in mind, why would they, then, open the iTunes store to anyone?
apple has every right to do this?
so microsoft should make changes with every update and patch to break itunes, safari, and anything else it doesn't want and that is perfectly okay too?
wise up 'yes boys' and see these companies for what they are. their business practices are not something to be praised...
I don't remember reading somewhere that Apple wrote iTunes et al. for Windows through a hack and pretend these apps are written by Microsoft.
So? Who really gives a sweet f about any third party wanting to use iTunes? They can either license rights from Apple, create their own iTunes knockoff, or just shut up.
I don't understand how someone can get upset over this. I for one don't care if Pre users are locked out, nor will I care if Palm and all of its products go up in smoke tomorrow.
Apple locking out the Pre has absolutely no impact on the iTunes user base.