I have my own opinion but you must remember that not that long ago, I was just a normal member like you. With great power comes great responsibility and all that...
Good point. It's easy (for me at least) to forget that mods aren't brains in vitrines.
Anyway, let's get down to cases:
iGenius/iLuv/AppleRulez has settled on a fatuous fan boy persona which I guess he imagines serves as an ongoing shaming device to all the real fan boys. Personally, I think anyone who's willing to spend that much time playing at being the kind of person he loathes among those very people should be banned just for being deeply, deeply fucked up, but whatever. The more general point is that he doesn't contribute anything, at all, except this kind of needling "This is how stupid you people are" dreck. I mean, come on. We can all see it for what it is. I'm astonished he's still bothering. Can you imagine? Getting up in the morning and thinking, "Welp, I guess I better go over to AI and post stuff like "Apple is never wrong. You should leave if you think that." It makes me kind of tired and depressed just to imagine it.
And then he's taken to reproaching other posters for being trolls, and for being off topic if they call him out, and, fuck it, just ban him for excessive meta-ness, or something. Really. It should be a pretty cut and dried case.
Now, as to an example of the kind of grey area stuff we've been talking about, let's take AngusYoung (just for example).
Go ahead and scan a list of his posts, I'll wait. OK? So you'll notice he never posts anything but irritable push back against anyone talking up Apple or dissing MS. It almost always is at this kind of implicit "filthy Apple moron you make me sick" pitch, you'll notice, which leads to a very short fuse and a readiness to call people stupid or ignorant or wrong, to characterize what they say as "spew", and just general unpleasantness.
Now, does all of this rise to the level of "troll"? I would say, not exactly, because the poster in question seems less about deliberately inciting anger and more about just genuinely kinda hating Apple and its users. But I'm wondering why a site such as this, ostensibly for Apple enthusiasts (last time I checked, maybe that characterization is inoperative?), needs to tolerate such people in our midsts.
I think AngusYoung is a good example of a type. Maybe the mods think "Well, we need some people that don't worship at the alter of Jobs" (although I have to say the emphasis on tamping down fan boyism worries me a bit, I mean if fan boys can't high five each other on an Apple enthusiast site, WTF?), but really it's a matter of tone. That poster is one of several who seem bitter about the very idea that Apple people are free to enjoy their devices without being a steady drum beat of abuse, and have appointed themselves as hector-ers in chief to make sure this particular parade gets plenty of rain.
That doesn't counterbalance excessive enthusiasm, it just adds a surly note of pointless argumentativeness. There are plenty of generally satisfied Apple users that are happy to take Apple to task for its perceived blunders without having to tolerate angry, dismissive, sarcastic, belittling, and just generally unpleasant people who seem to have no other agenda than to remind Apple users that they are wrong, deluded, koolaid drinkers, sheep, morons, idiots, babies, can't use real computers, can't think for themselves and don't deserve courtesy or respect on account of their crippling emotional disorder, i.e. don't hate Apple.
Occasional indulgence in such rhetoric? Whatever. Have literally nothing else to contribute? Ban.
That honestly doesn't seem that controversial to me, this being an Apple site and all, but it does require of the mods taking the time to get an idea of the overall tone of a given member, rather that just looking at a flagged post in isolation.
If someone reports an insult post I will always give the user involved an infraction, and usually edit the post in question as well. Not all insults warrant an instant ban (of any duration), so sometimes you won't be able to tell a user has been sanctioned (are normal users able to see other user's infraction lists on the other's info page?).
Sometimes people (not necessarily you) report posts as insulting and I do not agree. In those cases I take no action and other moderators may or may not take action.
I agree that sometimes a thread can do with a bit of mod intervention and I have on a few occasions done one or more of the following:
split out off-topic bickering to other threads
deleted off-topic posts
told people to stop arguing about something if it's a matter of fact rather than opinion and the facts have been established beyond doubt
Folk need to remember that mods can't read all the threads so threads that have been, or look like they are in the process of being, derailed should be reported as such (with a comment along the lines of - "this thread is being derailed, please split out the off-topic comments", providing a numbered list of the off-topic comments (post numbers are in the top-right of posts))
I realize that you are speaking for yourself, which is perhaps a large part of the issue. The mods really do need to agree to some sort of consistency in the interpretation and enforcement of these rules. I don't think anyone is asking for perfection, but surely when someone posts a response which is literally nothing more than "you are an idiot" and this post is reported, it should be a clear case of a rule violation, irrespective of context, and irrespective of which mod processes the report. I've reported several of this type of post, but have yet to find that it results in a deletion. So my feeling is, why bother?
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
I realize that you are speaking for yourself, which is perhaps a large part of the issue. The mods really do need to agree to some sort of consistency in the interpretation and enforcement of these rules. I don't think anyone is asking for perfection, but surely when someone posts a response which is literally nothing more than "you are an idiot" and this post is reported, it should be a clear case of a rule violation, irrespective of context, and irrespective of which mod processes the report. I've reported several of this type of post, but have yet to find that it results in a deletion. So my feeling is, why bother?
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
I would add to this that posts that contain nothing but general invective about Apple users in general should get the same treatment. There's a fun little way to game the "no personal insults" standard, by just using the "stupid fan boys don't know any better" or "idiot Apple users" construction, when very clearly everyone posting in the vicinity is being smeared.
I get that the mods seem very concerned about constraining contrarian thought for fear of a Fan Boy Planet, but constantly insulting the very idea of Apple or its users is not contrarian thought. It's trolling. There is no earthly reason why discussion of what Apple is doing wrong can't be done sans any talk of Our Lord and Master or Koolaid or any of that shit. It just makes threads into attack and counterattack.
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
Could you provide a link to any of the posts in question please? I will deal with them.
I would add to this that posts that contain nothing but general invective about Apple users in general should get the same treatment. There's a fun little way to game the "no personal insults" standard, by just using the "stupid fan boys don't know any better" or "idiot Apple users" construction, when very clearly everyone posting in the vicinity is being smeared.
I get that the mods seem very concerned about constraining contrarian thought for fear of a Fan Boy Planet, but constantly insulting the very idea of Apple or its users is not contrarian thought. It's trolling. There is no earthly reason why discussion of what Apple is doing wrong can't be done sans any talk of Our Lord and Master or Koolaid or any of that shit. It just makes threads into attack and counterattack.
Right. It's not about enforcing thought control, seeking uniformity of opinion, sterility, or even achieving some lofty goal of uniformly high-minded debate. It's about preserving space for at least some amount of moderately civil discussion that does not always get sucked right down the porcelain receptacle by those who are either not interested or capable of it. AI has the power to decide what sort of place this is, and what kind of people who they would like to feel comfortable inhabiting it.
Right. It's not about enforcing thought control, seeking uniformity of opinion, sterility, or even achieving some lofty goal of uniformly high-minded debate. It's about preserving space for at least some amount of moderately civil discussion that does not always get sucked right down the porcelain receptacle by those who are either not interested or capable of it. AI has the power to decide what sort of place this is, and what kind of people who they would like to feel comfortable inhabiting it.
Precisely. I think it's particularly important that such standards be applied here, because for whatever reasons Apple seems to inspire a particular animosity around the very idea of its users being allowed to believe that their choice in computing hardware is a good one. To the point that there seems to a fair number of people willing to sign up for the grim task of dissuading us.
I mean, some of these folks have been pretty overt in their motivations, posting things like "Someone has to put you losers in your place." In general, I think anyone who regards the majority of people posting here as losers or fools probably shouldn't be posting here.
hmmm, looks like iGenius was perma-banned whilst I wasn't looking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox
That'll teach you to ask for input.
not at all. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox
We can all see it for what it is. I'm astonished he's still bothering. Can you imagine? Getting up in the morning and thinking, "Welp, I guess I better go over to AI and post stuff like "Apple is never wrong. You should leave if you think that." It makes me kind of tired and depressed just to imagine it.
It is weird. I don't really get the motivation for it either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox
AngusYoung…
…is a dick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox
Now, does all of this rise to the level of "troll"? I would say, not exactly, because the poster in question seems less about deliberately inciting anger and more about just genuinely kinda hating Apple and its users. But I'm wondering why a site such as this, ostensibly for Apple enthusiasts (last time I checked, maybe that characterization is inoperative?), needs to tolerate such people in our midsts.
I think AngusYoung is a good example of a type. Maybe the mods think "Well, we need some people that don't worship at the alter of Jobs" (although I have to say the emphasis on tamping down fan boyism worries me a bit, I mean if fan boys can't high five each other on an Apple enthusiast site, WTF?), but really it's a matter of tone. That poster is one of several who seem bitter about the very idea that Apple people are free to enjoy their devices without being a steady drum beat of abuse, and have appointed themselves as hector-ers in chief to make sure this particular parade gets plenty of rain.
That doesn't counterbalance excessive enthusiasm, it just adds a surly note of pointless argumentativeness. There are plenty of generally satisfied Apple users that are happy to take Apple to task for its perceived blunders without having to tolerate angry, dismissive, sarcastic, belittling, and just generally unpleasant people who seem to have no other agenda than to remind Apple users that they are wrong, deluded, koolaid drinkers, sheep, morons, idiots, babies, can't use real computers, can't think for themselves and don't deserve courtesy or respect on account of their crippling emotional disorder, i.e. don't hate Apple.
Occasional indulgence in such rhetoric? Whatever. Have literally nothing else to contribute? Ban.
All well said. It definitely should depend on tone. If people can't be critical of Apple without simultaneously being condescending and rude about Apple's users/fans, they should be out of here, well, at least at first they should be given a temporary ban and told to tone it down, and if they don't, then they should be perma-banned.
In review: AppleRulez is outta here.
AngusYoung is getting a temporary ban and being told to not be so rude and condescending when he's back.
It would be good to see some of the repeated offenders banned, but as addabox mentioned Apple is a pretty polarising company. Most iPad articles on Engadget and other blogs are filled with useless banter from both Apple fans and 'Apple haters'. With all that Apple is doing these days, how not "over the top" can you expect things not to be on such a forum? One only has to look at the topics concerning lawsuits and standards wars to know what to expect - it's like tabloids for geeks.
I do enjoy the odd conversation I do get from some of the users. Maybe with fewer trolls, the actual fans wouldn't be on the defensive all the time. Good luck on cleaning up. Apart from the usual suspects already mentioned, there's no one that comes to mind.
Vinea, you need to rewind and read the thread again. I was the first person to actually name any potentially problematic posters. Like I said, I'm busy and don't follow all the threads, I wanted to know who exactly people were referring to.
And yes, having a list and seeing if everyone agrees that they're trolls would form part of a healthy debate on what constitutes a troll and what action should be taken.
If people think that all they have to do is start a poll and posters they don't like will be banned as a result, they are sorely mistaken. I want to see some proper discussion on this issue before action is taken.
A poll gives everyone a clearer picture of how people around here feel about this matter.
hmmm, looks like iGenius was perma-banned whilst I wasn't looking.
not at all. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.
It is weird. I don't really get the motivation for it either.
…is a dick.
All well said. It definitely should depend on tone. If people can't be critical of Apple without simultaneously being condescending and rude about Apple's users/fans, they should be out of here, well, at least at first they should be given a temporary ban and told to tone it down, and if they don't, then they should be perma-banned.
In review: AppleRulez is outta here.
AngusYoung is getting a temporary ban and being told to not be so rude and condescending when he's back.
Holy shit! I honestly didn't expect that kind of response! Really, really appreciated, and I have new hope for making the forums a better place for all.
Honestly, my heartfelt thanks.
Now, let me get to work on my list of Those That Must Die! (laughs maniacally)
Not sure about iGenius and AppleRulez as they seem to be unique posters. Are they trolls? Discuss.
They seem to me like they are here to distract. It's not like they have said opinion and they are expressing it, but more like they are seeing how far they could take it before they get banned. Why are the coming up in this thread? Because they are a problem and a distraction.
I'm not such a big poster here, but I do read almost everything, as I do many forums. I have to say it's the same everywhere. Trolls are here to stay. And every method of dealing with them is either ineffective or becomes just as bad, if not worse, than the trolls themselves. It's like, Digg being the worst possible example, everything is approaching that level of over-moderation slowly but surely. Slashdot, Ars, all the Gawker sites, anything with modding, ignore, status, promoting or whatever- it all becomes power trippy and high school. You can't be democratic. You can't be totalitarian. The only thing you can do is live with the anarchy and try to actively ignore (not by means of auto-ignoring users) what the trolls and flamers say. Keep the discussions in line and just pretend they don't exist. Seriously, it's the best way. They actually go away if you don't react to them. Just like in high school
I voted #1, but I don't think anything can be done about it without compromising the good qualities of AI.
Comments
Anyway, let's get down to cases:
iGenius/iLuv/AppleRulez has settled on a fatuous fan boy persona which I guess he imagines serves as an ongoing shaming device to all the real fan boys. Personally, I think anyone who's willing to spend that much time playing at being the kind of person he loathes among those very people should be banned just for being deeply, deeply fucked up, but whatever. The more general point is that he doesn't contribute anything, at all, except this kind of needling "This is how stupid you people are" dreck. I mean, come on. We can all see it for what it is. I'm astonished he's still bothering. Can you imagine? Getting up in the morning and thinking, "Welp, I guess I better go over to AI and post stuff like "Apple is never wrong. You should leave if you think that." It makes me kind of tired and depressed just to imagine it.
And then he's taken to reproaching other posters for being trolls, and for being off topic if they call him out, and, fuck it, just ban him for excessive meta-ness, or something. Really. It should be a pretty cut and dried case.
Now, as to an example of the kind of grey area stuff we've been talking about, let's take AngusYoung (just for example).
Go ahead and scan a list of his posts, I'll wait. OK? So you'll notice he never posts anything but irritable push back against anyone talking up Apple or dissing MS. It almost always is at this kind of implicit "filthy Apple moron you make me sick" pitch, you'll notice, which leads to a very short fuse and a readiness to call people stupid or ignorant or wrong, to characterize what they say as "spew", and just general unpleasantness.
Now, does all of this rise to the level of "troll"? I would say, not exactly, because the poster in question seems less about deliberately inciting anger and more about just genuinely kinda hating Apple and its users. But I'm wondering why a site such as this, ostensibly for Apple enthusiasts (last time I checked, maybe that characterization is inoperative?), needs to tolerate such people in our midsts.
I think AngusYoung is a good example of a type. Maybe the mods think "Well, we need some people that don't worship at the alter of Jobs" (although I have to say the emphasis on tamping down fan boyism worries me a bit, I mean if fan boys can't high five each other on an Apple enthusiast site, WTF?), but really it's a matter of tone. That poster is one of several who seem bitter about the very idea that Apple people are free to enjoy their devices without being a steady drum beat of abuse, and have appointed themselves as hector-ers in chief to make sure this particular parade gets plenty of rain.
That doesn't counterbalance excessive enthusiasm, it just adds a surly note of pointless argumentativeness. There are plenty of generally satisfied Apple users that are happy to take Apple to task for its perceived blunders without having to tolerate angry, dismissive, sarcastic, belittling, and just generally unpleasant people who seem to have no other agenda than to remind Apple users that they are wrong, deluded, koolaid drinkers, sheep, morons, idiots, babies, can't use real computers, can't think for themselves and don't deserve courtesy or respect on account of their crippling emotional disorder, i.e. don't hate Apple.
Occasional indulgence in such rhetoric? Whatever. Have literally nothing else to contribute? Ban.
That honestly doesn't seem that controversial to me, this being an Apple site and all, but it does require of the mods taking the time to get an idea of the overall tone of a given member, rather that just looking at a flagged post in isolation.
That'll teach you to ask for input.
If someone reports an insult post I will always give the user involved an infraction, and usually edit the post in question as well. Not all insults warrant an instant ban (of any duration), so sometimes you won't be able to tell a user has been sanctioned (are normal users able to see other user's infraction lists on the other's info page?).
Sometimes people (not necessarily you) report posts as insulting and I do not agree. In those cases I take no action and other moderators may or may not take action.
I agree that sometimes a thread can do with a bit of mod intervention and I have on a few occasions done one or more of the following:
- split out off-topic bickering to other threads
- deleted off-topic posts
- told people to stop arguing about something if it's a matter of fact rather than opinion and the facts have been established beyond doubt
Folk need to remember that mods can't read all the threads so threads that have been, or look like they are in the process of being, derailed should be reported as such (with a comment along the lines of - "this thread is being derailed, please split out the off-topic comments", providing a numbered list of the off-topic comments (post numbers are in the top-right of posts))I realize that you are speaking for yourself, which is perhaps a large part of the issue. The mods really do need to agree to some sort of consistency in the interpretation and enforcement of these rules. I don't think anyone is asking for perfection, but surely when someone posts a response which is literally nothing more than "you are an idiot" and this post is reported, it should be a clear case of a rule violation, irrespective of context, and irrespective of which mod processes the report. I've reported several of this type of post, but have yet to find that it results in a deletion. So my feeling is, why bother?
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
I realize that you are speaking for yourself, which is perhaps a large part of the issue. The mods really do need to agree to some sort of consistency in the interpretation and enforcement of these rules. I don't think anyone is asking for perfection, but surely when someone posts a response which is literally nothing more than "you are an idiot" and this post is reported, it should be a clear case of a rule violation, irrespective of context, and irrespective of which mod processes the report. I've reported several of this type of post, but have yet to find that it results in a deletion. So my feeling is, why bother?
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
I would add to this that posts that contain nothing but general invective about Apple users in general should get the same treatment. There's a fun little way to game the "no personal insults" standard, by just using the "stupid fan boys don't know any better" or "idiot Apple users" construction, when very clearly everyone posting in the vicinity is being smeared.
I get that the mods seem very concerned about constraining contrarian thought for fear of a Fan Boy Planet, but constantly insulting the very idea of Apple or its users is not contrarian thought. It's trolling. There is no earthly reason why discussion of what Apple is doing wrong can't be done sans any talk of Our Lord and Master or Koolaid or any of that shit. It just makes threads into attack and counterattack.
I don't care whether the poster is issued an "infraction" (another subject), but make that post go away so maybe the poster gets the idea that this sort of behavior is not tolerated. Hurling insults on boards like this is lot like tagging or graffiti. It's self-reinforcing behavior. You'll never get a handle on either one unless swift and sure action to clean up is taken.
Could you provide a link to any of the posts in question please? I will deal with them.
I would add to this that posts that contain nothing but general invective about Apple users in general should get the same treatment. There's a fun little way to game the "no personal insults" standard, by just using the "stupid fan boys don't know any better" or "idiot Apple users" construction, when very clearly everyone posting in the vicinity is being smeared.
I get that the mods seem very concerned about constraining contrarian thought for fear of a Fan Boy Planet, but constantly insulting the very idea of Apple or its users is not contrarian thought. It's trolling. There is no earthly reason why discussion of what Apple is doing wrong can't be done sans any talk of Our Lord and Master or Koolaid or any of that shit. It just makes threads into attack and counterattack.
Right. It's not about enforcing thought control, seeking uniformity of opinion, sterility, or even achieving some lofty goal of uniformly high-minded debate. It's about preserving space for at least some amount of moderately civil discussion that does not always get sucked right down the porcelain receptacle by those who are either not interested or capable of it. AI has the power to decide what sort of place this is, and what kind of people who they would like to feel comfortable inhabiting it.
Could you provide a link to any of the posts in question please? I will deal with them.
I appreciate the gesture, but it was weeks ago now. I gave up reporting posts after that.
Right. It's not about enforcing thought control, seeking uniformity of opinion, sterility, or even achieving some lofty goal of uniformly high-minded debate. It's about preserving space for at least some amount of moderately civil discussion that does not always get sucked right down the porcelain receptacle by those who are either not interested or capable of it. AI has the power to decide what sort of place this is, and what kind of people who they would like to feel comfortable inhabiting it.
Precisely. I think it's particularly important that such standards be applied here, because for whatever reasons Apple seems to inspire a particular animosity around the very idea of its users being allowed to believe that their choice in computing hardware is a good one. To the point that there seems to a fair number of people willing to sign up for the grim task of dissuading us.
I mean, some of these folks have been pretty overt in their motivations, posting things like "Someone has to put you losers in your place." In general, I think anyone who regards the majority of people posting here as losers or fools probably shouldn't be posting here.
You voted three times. How convenient.
If you could count, which you clearly cannot - you'd notice I voted twice. And yes, multiple choice voting is turned on.
Good job I didn't design vBulliten our you'd think it was me who coded that in just for this thread.
That'll teach you to ask for input.
We can all see it for what it is. I'm astonished he's still bothering. Can you imagine? Getting up in the morning and thinking, "Welp, I guess I better go over to AI and post stuff like "Apple is never wrong. You should leave if you think that." It makes me kind of tired and depressed just to imagine it.
It is weird. I don't really get the motivation for it either.
AngusYoung…
…is a dick.
Now, does all of this rise to the level of "troll"? I would say, not exactly, because the poster in question seems less about deliberately inciting anger and more about just genuinely kinda hating Apple and its users. But I'm wondering why a site such as this, ostensibly for Apple enthusiasts (last time I checked, maybe that characterization is inoperative?), needs to tolerate such people in our midsts.
I think AngusYoung is a good example of a type. Maybe the mods think "Well, we need some people that don't worship at the alter of Jobs" (although I have to say the emphasis on tamping down fan boyism worries me a bit, I mean if fan boys can't high five each other on an Apple enthusiast site, WTF?), but really it's a matter of tone. That poster is one of several who seem bitter about the very idea that Apple people are free to enjoy their devices without being a steady drum beat of abuse, and have appointed themselves as hector-ers in chief to make sure this particular parade gets plenty of rain.
That doesn't counterbalance excessive enthusiasm, it just adds a surly note of pointless argumentativeness. There are plenty of generally satisfied Apple users that are happy to take Apple to task for its perceived blunders without having to tolerate angry, dismissive, sarcastic, belittling, and just generally unpleasant people who seem to have no other agenda than to remind Apple users that they are wrong, deluded, koolaid drinkers, sheep, morons, idiots, babies, can't use real computers, can't think for themselves and don't deserve courtesy or respect on account of their crippling emotional disorder, i.e. don't hate Apple.
Occasional indulgence in such rhetoric? Whatever. Have literally nothing else to contribute? Ban.
All well said. It definitely should depend on tone. If people can't be critical of Apple without simultaneously being condescending and rude about Apple's users/fans, they should be out of here, well, at least at first they should be given a temporary ban and told to tone it down, and if they don't, then they should be perma-banned.
In review: AppleRulez is outta here.
AngusYoung is getting a temporary ban and being told to not be so rude and condescending when he's back.
I appreciate the gesture, but it was weeks ago now. I gave up reporting posts after that.
Well, please don't give up! Weeding-out personal insults and stopping the derailing of threads relies on mods being aware that it is happening.
I do enjoy the odd conversation I do get from some of the users. Maybe with fewer trolls, the actual fans wouldn't be on the defensive all the time. Good luck on cleaning up. Apart from the usual suspects already mentioned, there's no one that comes to mind.
Vinea voted multiple times as well. The software used around here is pathetic.
You're digging your own hole.
Vinea, you need to rewind and read the thread again. I was the first person to actually name any potentially problematic posters. Like I said, I'm busy and don't follow all the threads, I wanted to know who exactly people were referring to.
And yes, having a list and seeing if everyone agrees that they're trolls would form part of a healthy debate on what constitutes a troll and what action should be taken.
If people think that all they have to do is start a poll and posters they don't like will be banned as a result, they are sorely mistaken. I want to see some proper discussion on this issue before action is taken.
A poll gives everyone a clearer picture of how people around here feel about this matter.
hmmm, looks like iGenius was perma-banned whilst I wasn't looking.
It is weird. I don't really get the motivation for it either.
…is a dick.
All well said. It definitely should depend on tone. If people can't be critical of Apple without simultaneously being condescending and rude about Apple's users/fans, they should be out of here, well, at least at first they should be given a temporary ban and told to tone it down, and if they don't, then they should be perma-banned.
In review: AppleRulez is outta here.
AngusYoung is getting a temporary ban and being told to not be so rude and condescending when he's back.
Holy shit! I honestly didn't expect that kind of response! Really, really appreciated, and I have new hope for making the forums a better place for all.
Honestly, my heartfelt thanks.
Now, let me get to work on my list of Those That Must Die! (laughs maniacally)
Not sure about iGenius and AppleRulez as they seem to be unique posters. Are they trolls? Discuss.
They seem to me like they are here to distract. It's not like they have said opinion and they are expressing it, but more like they are seeing how far they could take it before they get banned. Why are the coming up in this thread? Because they are a problem and a distraction.
Well, please don't give up! Weeding-out personal insults and stopping the derailing of threads relies on mods being aware that it is happening.
If I'd seen it has ever made any difference. You see my dilemma?
I hate censorship, but something's got to be done.
(
Hmmmmmm...........
AngusYoung
AppleSux
DaHarder
extremeskater
g3pro
gFiz
ifail
iGenius
iLad
kotatsu
lowededwookie
MacTripper
Moloch
RBR
SpotOn
TECHSTUD
TEKSTUD
Zuriel
In review: AppleRulez is outta here.
You guys do good work around here!
I voted #1, but I don't think anything can be done about it without compromising the good qualities of AI.
Rob