To many people are focused Apple kneecapping competitors with this acquisition. When did
paranoia rule the day in Tech land?
Apple is far more methodical. If they purchased ARM they'd license the cores out business as usual. Apple knows they are not beating companies on hardware they're beating companies on integration.
There's no harm in licensing the cores as freely as possible because what makes Apple special isn't hardware but a keen eye for product aesthetic and differentiation couple with savvy marketing. You can't buy that in a core folks. That's company DNA.
While I sometimes disagree with you, you make sense in your arguments, even if you look at it differently than I do.
But sheesh, too many people aren't even bothering to think this through. We're getting stream of consciousness posting. Whatever comes to mind is typed out without editing.
I think RichL is well aware that Snapdragon is ARM based. He was responding to my incorrect assumption that all Cortex A8 other than the Hummingbird run at 650Mhz or less. I misread an article which basically stated that extra tweaks are needed to go above the 650Mhz A8 as designed by ARM.
I'm reading a lot of posts stating that if Apple bought ARM, and discontinued sales, that there would always be Intel and Qualcomm. This struck me as one of the same.
Intriguing idea, but i have to agree with the posters who state that there could be anti-trust issues that would prevent ARM being controlled by Apple.
Quite possibly. They'd become suppliers to their competitors.
Quote:
PS: If Apple was allowed to dish out $8 Billion for ARM Holdings we'd at least end some of the talk about Apple hoarding money for no good reason.
I assume that was put in for me.
If the takeover price was $8b, about half would be a stock swap, meaning that the due bill would be around $4b. Check my math, but Apple doesn't need $40b to make that deal work.
Not that I think buying ARM makes much more sense than buying Adobe.
I'm reading a lot of posts stating that if Apple bought ARM, and discontinued sales, that there would always be Intel and Qualcomm. This struck me as one of the same.
I've heard the same confusion about Tegra. ARM has dominant marketshare. I'm not sure Apple's looking to acquire them but they could certainly do worse on the acquisition front.
The AI report says: "After noting that shares in ARM had "shot up 8.1p to 251.1p...... [and] ....traders reckon a bid would come in at around 400p a share, valuing ARM at more than £5.2 billion [$8 billion US]."
I dont understand. Someone with more knowledge on ARM financial can tell me more about it.
If its Run Rate as a previous Poster post is 5 billion USD. Then the current price is extremely attractive. However Financial Highlight show it is only 500M. Not 5 Billion.
2. It makes 150M USD Profits per Year. So P/E is quite high. I suspect when they announce their results on 27th things will look better.
3. Google Finance information are incorrect? It is making as PE with 80. But currently ARM is at 4.5B, 150M Profits fit into 30 PE. Which is very acceptable for its Growth.
4. It is trading like crazy. The amount of Shared trade in one day is more then the total amount of shares issued. Did some one just brought ARM outright? I dont think it make sense.
According to their web site, "ARM has an innovative business model. Instead of bearing the costs associated with manufacturing, we license our technology to a network of Partners, mainly leading semiconductor manufacturers and OEMs (Original Equipment Manufacturers). These Partners incorporate our designs alongside their own technology to create smart, low energy chips suitable for modern electronic devices."
I admit I know nothing about ARM Holdings, but it sounds like they basically do the same thing as PA Semi. Design, file for patents, then license their IP to others.
According to their web site, "ARM has an innovative business model. Instead of bearing the costs associated with manufacturing, we license our technology to a network of Partners, mainly leading semiconductor manufacturers and OEMs (Original Equipment Manufacturers). These Partners incorporate our designs alongside their own technology to create smart, low energy chips suitable for modern electronic devices."
I admit I know nothing about ARM Holdings, but it sounds like they basically do the same thing as PA Semi. Design, file for patents, then license their IP to others.
Sorta. PA Semi was good at working with existing PPC and ARM cores but naturally ARM is creating these new designs from scratch. While PA Semi could get buy with a few hundred talented engineers and others ARM has something like 1700 employees.
Orion is an 800-MHz Cortex-A9 dual-core processor due to sample in 3Q10 and enter mass production in 1Q11.
Pegasus is a 1-GHz Cortex-A9, single-core sampling in 2Q11 and entering mass production in 4Q11.
Hercules is a 1-GHz dual-core Cortex-A9 sampling in 3Q11 and set for mass production in 1Q12.
Mercury is a 600-MHz single-core Cortex-A5 (Sparrow) due in 2010/11.
Venus is a 600-MHz Cortex-A5 dual-core processor due in 2012/13.
Draco is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 dual-core slated to arrive 2012/13.
And Aquila is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 quad-core also expected in 2012/13.
ARM is rapidly entering a speed zone that's going to allow them to get into bigger and bigger boxes. Amazing
And Apple can get any of those chip reference designs, as can anyone. They can now improve them any way they want without having features they don't need that are put into them so that many manufacturers with varying needs will buy them.
No need to buy ARM for that.
Apple still has an advantage because of their unified hardware and software. They get ONE chip design across their device lines. It makes it much easier to optimize than what Google can manage to do. Or anyone else that gives their OS to different manufacturers, or has many differing lines of phones such as Nokia.
MS is learning this, which is why Win Phone 7 is spec'ed much more tightly as to hardware than was before, or than what Google is doing. Google's big mistake, among others.
And Apple can get any of those chip reference designs, as can anyone. They can now improve them any way they want without having features they don't need that are put into them so that many manufacturers with varying needs will buy them.
No need to buy ARM for that.
True but I'm reminded of a Thomas Edison quote about opportunity here.
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.
Apple doesn't have to buy ARM but they always have to be pushing the envelope. That's what good companies do.
Comments
Exactly.
To many people are focused Apple kneecapping competitors with this acquisition. When did
paranoia rule the day in Tech land?
Apple is far more methodical. If they purchased ARM they'd license the cores out business as usual. Apple knows they are not beating companies on hardware they're beating companies on integration.
There's no harm in licensing the cores as freely as possible because what makes Apple special isn't hardware but a keen eye for product aesthetic and differentiation couple with savvy marketing. You can't buy that in a core folks. That's company DNA.
While I sometimes disagree with you, you make sense in your arguments, even if you look at it differently than I do.
But sheesh, too many people aren't even bothering to think this through. We're getting stream of consciousness posting. Whatever comes to mind is typed out without editing.
Yes but Adobe isn't the sole reason why people buy Mac Pro. I'm sure there are plenty of iMacs running Creative Suite.
Most pros use iMacs.
Melgross
I think RichL is well aware that Snapdragon is ARM based. He was responding to my incorrect assumption that all Cortex A8 other than the Hummingbird run at 650Mhz or less. I misread an article which basically stated that extra tweaks are needed to go above the 650Mhz A8 as designed by ARM.
I'm reading a lot of posts stating that if Apple bought ARM, and discontinued sales, that there would always be Intel and Qualcomm. This struck me as one of the same.
Intriguing idea, but i have to agree with the posters who state that there could be anti-trust issues that would prevent ARM being controlled by Apple.
Quite possibly. They'd become suppliers to their competitors.
PS: If Apple was allowed to dish out $8 Billion for ARM Holdings we'd at least end some of the talk about Apple hoarding money for no good reason.
I assume that was put in for me.
If the takeover price was $8b, about half would be a stock swap, meaning that the due bill would be around $4b. Check my math, but Apple doesn't need $40b to make that deal work.
Not that I think buying ARM makes much more sense than buying Adobe.
I'm reading a lot of posts stating that if Apple bought ARM, and discontinued sales, that there would always be Intel and Qualcomm. This struck me as one of the same.
I've heard the same confusion about Tegra. ARM has dominant marketshare. I'm not sure Apple's looking to acquire them but they could certainly do worse on the acquisition front.
The AI report says: "After noting that shares in ARM had "shot up 8.1p to 251.1p...... [and] ....traders reckon a bid would come in at around 400p a share, valuing ARM at more than £5.2 billion [$8 billion US]."
That implies the current valuation must be $8B*(251/400) = US$5B. Yet, Google Finance shows the company's market cap (it is traded as an ADR on NASDAQ: http://www.google.com/finance?client=ob&q=NASDAQ:ARMH), including todays price runup, to be slightly less than US$2B. (Reuters data confirms this: http://www.reuters.com/finance/stock...?symbol=ARMH.O).
What gives? The numbers reported by AI seem really badly off!?
I believe the ADR only represents the value of the stock traded on the NASDAQ.
I believe the ADR only represents the value of the stock traded on the NASDAQ.
I believe you are correct. The ADR doesn't "match" the foreign market value, although it may often times appear to be in the same neighborhood.
If its Run Rate as a previous Poster post is 5 billion USD. Then the current price is extremely attractive. However Financial Highlight show it is only 500M. Not 5 Billion.
http://www.arm.com/annualreport09/ov...ighlights.html
2. It makes 150M USD Profits per Year. So P/E is quite high. I suspect when they announce their results on 27th things will look better.
3. Google Finance information are incorrect? It is making as PE with 80. But currently ARM is at 4.5B, 150M Profits fit into 30 PE. Which is very acceptable for its Growth.
4. It is trading like crazy. The amount of Shared trade in one day is more then the total amount of shares issued. Did some one just brought ARM outright? I dont think it make sense.
I admit I know nothing about ARM Holdings, but it sounds like they basically do the same thing as PA Semi. Design, file for patents, then license their IP to others.
According to their web site, "ARM has an innovative business model. Instead of bearing the costs associated with manufacturing, we license our technology to a network of Partners, mainly leading semiconductor manufacturers and OEMs (Original Equipment Manufacturers). These Partners incorporate our designs alongside their own technology to create smart, low energy chips suitable for modern electronic devices."
I admit I know nothing about ARM Holdings, but it sounds like they basically do the same thing as PA Semi. Design, file for patents, then license their IP to others.
Sorta. PA Semi was good at working with existing PPC and ARM cores but naturally ARM is creating these new designs from scratch. While PA Semi could get buy with a few hundred talented engineers and others ARM has something like 1700 employees.
ARM is about to get sick with the speeds
- Orion is an 800-MHz Cortex-A9 dual-core processor due to sample in 3Q10 and enter mass production in 1Q11.
- Pegasus is a 1-GHz Cortex-A9, single-core sampling in 2Q11 and entering mass production in 4Q11.
- Hercules is a 1-GHz dual-core Cortex-A9 sampling in 3Q11 and set for mass production in 1Q12.
- Mercury is a 600-MHz single-core Cortex-A5 (Sparrow) due in 2010/11.
- Venus is a 600-MHz Cortex-A5 dual-core processor due in 2012/13.
- Draco is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 dual-core slated to arrive 2012/13.
- And Aquila is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 quad-core also expected in 2012/13.
ARM is rapidly entering a speed zone that's going to allow them to get into bigger and bigger boxes. AmazingOne of the reasons why I think that Apple could be interested in ARM is the sheer speed that we're going to see coming from ARM cores.
ARM is about to get sick with the speeds
- Orion is an 800-MHz Cortex-A9 dual-core processor due to sample in 3Q10 and enter mass production in 1Q11.
- Pegasus is a 1-GHz Cortex-A9, single-core sampling in 2Q11 and entering mass production in 4Q11.
- Hercules is a 1-GHz dual-core Cortex-A9 sampling in 3Q11 and set for mass production in 1Q12.
- Mercury is a 600-MHz single-core Cortex-A5 (Sparrow) due in 2010/11.
- Venus is a 600-MHz Cortex-A5 dual-core processor due in 2012/13.
- Draco is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 dual-core slated to arrive 2012/13.
- And Aquila is a 1.2-GHz Cortex-A9 quad-core also expected in 2012/13.
ARM is rapidly entering a speed zone that's going to allow them to get into bigger and bigger boxes. AmazingAnd Apple can get any of those chip reference designs, as can anyone. They can now improve them any way they want without having features they don't need that are put into them so that many manufacturers with varying needs will buy them.
No need to buy ARM for that.
Apple still has an advantage because of their unified hardware and software. They get ONE chip design across their device lines. It makes it much easier to optimize than what Google can manage to do. Or anyone else that gives their OS to different manufacturers, or has many differing lines of phones such as Nokia.
MS is learning this, which is why Win Phone 7 is spec'ed much more tightly as to hardware than was before, or than what Google is doing. Google's big mistake, among others.
And Apple can get any of those chip reference designs, as can anyone. They can now improve them any way they want without having features they don't need that are put into them so that many manufacturers with varying needs will buy them.
No need to buy ARM for that.
True but I'm reminded of a Thomas Edison quote about opportunity here.
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.
Apple doesn't have to buy ARM but they always have to be pushing the envelope. That's what good companies do.
True but I'm reminded of a Thomas Edison quote about opportunity here.
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.
Apple doesn't have to buy ARM but they always have to be pushing the envelope. That's what good companies do.
That's why they bought PA Semi and intrinsity.