Google introduces Android-powered Apple TV competitor

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  • Reply 181 of 285
    stevetimstevetim Posts: 482member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    I've read the article and the first 100, or so, comments.



    good analysis I would add some important items.



    after 8, add general web browsing. for example if your kids like pbskids.org flash games. Want to browse and shop and buy on internet, this will work.



    the issue of the remote is valid, but i solved it easily with the wonderful logitek programmables.



    your point of apple tv being part of the aggregate is excellent and probably what I would do until apple figures something else out.



    i think a more likley processor would be intel core whatever as mobility and power consumption is not an issue for a set top box. good graphic acceration cards can be included as well.



    and yes i totally agree that if apple wants to get something out there to improve the apple tv, they could blow google out of the water. I don't think they (apple) see the revenue potential so this will remain a hobby, perhaps until the industry kicks off with the google box. this is a big if because the ny times is reporting that the intel processor alone that google is using will cost $100. So this thing will probably be priced much higher.
  • Reply 182 of 285
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    [forgive me if this point has been made already]



    the fatal flaw of all the existing computer/media-on-TV-screen boxes and software to date is their universal and archaic cursor-based UI. you move it with some remote left/right, up/down, and click. AppleTV uses it, BluRay interactive uses it, everyone uses it. it was invented, if i remember right, for the first VCR and TV menu on-screen controls. it sucks. it has always sucked. it will always suck. and if you add a keyboard, it sucks even more, adding one more clunky thing to fiddle with. this is why the great majority of consumers have never embraced any of these devices beyond their minimum essential functions of playback/record.



    the Google TV UI is this same ol' thing. so it will suck too. and that is all Sony, Logitech, and the rest of that gang know how to do anyway.



    the real breakthrough would be an all-touch (plus accelerometer) UI remote instead. an AppleTV running the iPhone OS with the iPhone/touch/iPad as the remote that mirrored your TV screen. that would be sweet. let's hope Jobs has vision enough to bring the iPhone OS to your TV.
  • Reply 183 of 285
    orlandoorlando Posts: 601member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post


    the real breakthrough would be an all-touch (plus accelerometer) UI remote instead. an AppleTV running the iPhone OS with the iPhone/touch/iPad as the remote that mirrored your TV screen. that would be sweet. let's hope Jobs has vision enough to bring the iPhone OS to your TV.



    There is already a video posted showing the Logitech GoogleTV box being controlled using an iPhone. (There is also an Android app).





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    I think that, done soon, and done right Apple could have a 6-month lead over the competition.



    Unfortunately I don't think 6 months is enough. Apple should have upgraded the specs on the AppleTV and added Apps and a web browser ages ago. With multiple hardware partners I think GoogleTV can catch up fast.
  • Reply 184 of 285
    stevetimstevetim Posts: 482member
    i would add that the times even thinks apple might take the competition a step further by offering a line of hd widescreen televisions with apple tv and better built in. this would certainly hurt sony. i've read some speculation about this from analysts such as munster.



    it would be like ipod blowing away walkman version 2.0.
  • Reply 185 of 285
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Orlando View Post


    There is already a video posted showing the Logitech GoogleTV box being controlled using an iPhone. (There is also an Android app).



    you can control ATV with your iPhone now. but it's just a cursor remote substitute. a little better, but still trapped in the on screen cursor menu format.
  • Reply 186 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    Well, as someone who loves his Apple TV I have to say, this looks like it could well beat it.



    I don't understand the need for a browser on the TV (my PS3's got that and I never use it), but something that would pull everything together into one nice, unified interface would be great.



    The stance Apple have taken with Apple TV seems a bit odd to me. It's fine to call it a hobby, but when I take on a project as a hobby I tend to be continually evolving it and changing it, but Apple TV seems to be the same now as it was when they first introduced movie rentals on it (with a couple of UI tweaks). I do think it could be a lot more, but it would be enough if they could figure out a way to have "rental" of individual TV episodes, either backed by advertising or something that you pay a sensible amount to watch something once. I don't want to have to buy a TV episode (unlike films, I'm never going to watch a TV episode more than once), so some form of rental would make Apple TV a much more useful proposition, for me at least.



    The one thing that bothers me about the Google TV is that I've found a lot of what they have done, excluding their search, seems a little "half-baked" somehow. I'm not sure exactly what makes me think that, but it's a nagging issue.......



    Yeah, their product specs all seem to contain the requirement: "Good enough".



    The question that needs to be asked/answered is: "Good enough for what? For whom?".



    .
  • Reply 187 of 285
    sheffsheff Posts: 1,407member
    Dude that is exactly what I've been waiting for.



    First some background: I run an old desktop connected to my TV with Boxee, Hulu Desktop and firefox. I have a wireless keyboard with a trackball on it that replaces the mouse as well. This allows me to not watch cable (which sucks anyways) and watch what I want, when I want, mostly for free.



    I took a look at apple TV, and it does not allow me to do this. It only has iTunes movie rentals and that's about it. Honestly I may consider buying google TV when it comes out, as long as it is not overpriced. Apple better get on their game and improve apple TV before this thing steals the market share and becomes the name for internet TVs much like iPhone became the name for a smartphone.
  • Reply 188 of 285
    rayinhourayinhou Posts: 18member
    If I wanted a browser on my TV, I can just connect my computer to my TV via hdmi... I mean, google's argument is there is a lot of great content that you can view on your computer... I say, just save the money and connect your computer to the TV. I for one like AppleTV and the interface. I just hope Apple is able to make it a DVR.
  • Reply 189 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Joe hs View Post


    what would they call it spotlight.com?



    Actually, YES!



    .
  • Reply 190 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    I hope so. That would be, indeed, a killer.



    I am still wondering/puzzled: What the heck is that USB slot for, in @tv?! Does anyone know?



    So you can JailBreak it with a thumb drive



    .
  • Reply 191 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nofear1az View Post


    I for one welcome this... I do not consider Google evil....yet! at least not anything like Microsoft. Sadly, Apple hasn't really done much with the AppleTV. Sure, they upgraded the interface but not really much else. There is so much potential there and lots of room for innovation but either Apple lost interest in it or just couldn't really grasp the whole potential of the product and innovate it out.



    I tried an AppleTV once and thought it was cool but realized that a Mac Mini would serve me better for a media device since it's a full computer, I can still Web Browse on it, Play DVD's, and so much more than what the AppleTV does.



    If you think Google is just out to steal ideas, you are sorely wrong. Google Chrome was made for simplicity and speed. Same thing with Android. It may or may not be the best in any ones opinion but it surely is not crap nor bloatware like some other companies out there. I say great, let them innnovate in an area that Apple has left to the dust.



    Look at what happend when Microsoft owned the whole browser market, they let it sit there and do nothing. Same thing what Apple is doing with the AppleTV. I look forward to see where Apple leads the AppleTV next. Competition is a good thing. It creates innovation. Yeahhh!





    I suspect that we are going to see a giant game of snooker unfold... sit back and enjoy!



    .
  • Reply 192 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DaveGee View Post


    Yea after watching it for a 3rd time I did notice that type of behavior... but I'm still left to wonder if that 'pop-over-video' behavior was good for content coming from the cable box OR if it could only happen with video content provided by internet sources.



    My reason for wondering this is as follows....



    HDMI is supposed to be an encrypted signal and only the TV/Display will have the ability to remove the encryption and display the full resolution of whatever was being pushed out of the cable box. If that is true and I think it is... then how would a 3rd party box have the ability to 'de-encrypt' the HDMI signal and then 'overlay the google menus, etc' re-encrypt and push the final signal onto the HDTV?



    I'm getting VERY far away from my comfort zone as I bring these issues up since I know just about enough HDMI protocols and the encryption to fill an index card (on one side - double spaced with wide margins).



    There may be provisions in the protocols that allow for this (for all I know) but to me it might be an issue, knowing how ANAL the content owners are over hamstringing its CUSTOMERS from doing what they want in the most ANNOYING way possible.



    I guess time will tell...



    Just like government, there are a lot of suppliers interested in maintaining/expanding the status quo, and screw the user!



    .
  • Reply 193 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    This begs the question of whether or not a browser manufacturer could in fact make it send whatever they liked (i.e. could you make a browser for desktop that sends the same header as the iPhone does)? What I'm getting at is, could you trick the server into doing what you want and hence, stop someone like Hulu being able to block you?



    Yes, you can spoof the browser info. Google could disguise its browser as IE6.



    But every web server logs every request/response pair.



    Routine log analysis can easily determine when this happening.



    Then, they start blocking spoofers.



    Pretty soon, all of GTVs (in this case) customers are complaining 'cause they can't get their HuLu!





    Its an on-going cat and mouse game!





    .
  • Reply 194 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by r00fus View Post


    If it can interface with your cable box, why even have a Tivo anymore?

    This claims to basically provide a universal interface for Web, existing content, and cable content all together.



    I know someone who knows someone... etc, who just jumped from Tivo to Google, was supremely respected at Tivo, is probably part of this project, and I'm sure management at Tivo are sh**ing bricks right now.



    One *minor* showstopper: is Cable/Satellite on board?

    If not, this is DOA and will be as much a "hobby" as the AppleTV (at least AppleTV has a store).



    That, it the question!



    And the answer is No!



    As a cable provider would you help someone offer alternatives to your content?



    Yeah?



    .
  • Reply 195 of 285
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by WelshDog View Post


    Not a problem if you have a Tivo.



    Would it not be funny if Apple were to release some kickass new version of the Apple TV before Google can get their app out there?



    snooker 101



    .
  • Reply 196 of 285
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post


    You're wrong. The reason why it's a "hobby" is because the networks have refused to go along with a subscription service or $.99/show that Apple offered. You can already get a DVR for ont $10/month but the truth is that it's really not worth it. Networks already program their best shows to start a couple of minutes after you start your dvr so you miss the ending (ie American Idol). They want the ad paid equivalent to a live audience.



    The issue is the networks will not cave until there is a web revenue plan that equals what they get paid now. This is part of the reason why iAds exists.



    Make good points. My thinking is that AppleTV gave Apple some leverage and good faith with the networks in this way--> Apple creates a box to sell networks content, both make money. Or they could have pulled a Google and stuck in a DVR and Internet streaming from websites resulting in the networks to lose money. Apple & Networks would both suffer from iTunes sales, but networks hurt by live viewership for ad revenue, Apple would benefit by selling more devices. Especially if push out to iPods/iPads/etc. HOWEVER, Apple in the long-run would killing goose with the golden egg. If folks who are creating the content lose out, then you lose content. Without content it's hard to sell iPods/iPads/AppleTV etc. With AppleTV it's a starting point for working out deals, and a bookmark when content partners want to expand offerings. Among many other things.



    I guess it being said by everyone that GoogleTV is taking on Apple. Apple doesn't sell hardly any AppleTVs (50K/qtr) nor a whole whole lot of content. Google is f'ing the whole TV industry up. If cable companies lose out, kiss your high-speed internet good bye. Google will surely use it to sell viewer activity and personal data to marketers, and I bet will also try to step in and serve commercials on demand by displaying ads relevant to viewer profile.
  • Reply 197 of 285
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sheff View Post


    I run an old desktop connected to my TV with Boxee, Hulu Desktop and firefox. I have a wireless keyboard with a trackball on it that replaces the mouse as well. This allows me to not watch cable (which sucks anyways) and watch what I want, when I want, mostly for free.



    like many, i too have an Mac Mini HTPC hooked to the TV, and use the TouchMouse app on an iPhone for mouse pointer and keyboard controls. it works pretty good for a hobbyist like me. but not for the vast majority of consumers ... and it's one more computer to maintain. and it's just not as simple as iPhone apps. plus you are looking back and forth at two screens - your HTPC/TV where the content is displayed and the controls on your iPhone screen in a different layout. your brain has to readjust back and forth each time, so that can never be intuitive. it's ok for watching movies and so on, but tiring with any much more interactive activity like web browsing. an ideal UI would simply mirror the same image on both, at the appropriate resolution for each. the iPad's large 4:3 screen would be ideal for that.
  • Reply 198 of 285
    steviestevie Posts: 956member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    Google on Thursday announced Google TV, a new platform that aims to integrate both Web browsing and cable TV with one device running its Android operating system, set to arrive this fall.







    Wow. This sounds great!
  • Reply 199 of 285
    steviestevie Posts: 956member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post


    So......the keyboard just sits on the coffee table next to the remotes?



    Next to the iPad.



    Likely there will be cool keyboard/tv remote/etc. devices to go along with the STBs.
  • Reply 200 of 285
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    So you can JailBreak it with a thumb drive



    .



    AND IT KICKS ASS.



    AppleTV runs the Tiger. He is just a mini mini with Front Row interface laced over, but if you jail break it, you can reveal the finder. That was super weird when I saw it for the first time. However, it's worthless on a TV but you can add new menus and apps to the Front Row UI. Put the boxee and hulu on there.
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