Not that I think Hulu is central to the success of this Google project, but how would Hulu block this?
Presumably, you would just use the Chrome browser that's built into the OS to access Hulu and play content. How would they distinguish whether you're using Chrome on a laptop or Chrome on a GTV box?
I could be wrong. Just asking....
Every browser must send an html header telling the site which browser just accessed. Hulu can and does block based on browser type. For example engadget today says hulu does not work with the new google mobile os announced today.
The thing that will sell this, imho, is not the Google brand or the features or what have you. It's the distribution network. Unless Apple revamps Apple TV and starts selling the box through the cable co. it'll be largely restricted to die-hard Apple fans. After all, when people think cable box, they aren't very likely to think Apple Store. But GTV is an operating system that'll be baked into your HDTV or the box your cable co is leasing to you. In a couple of years, Android powered cable boxes and tv will be ubequitous.
I for one welcome this... I do not consider Google evil....yet! at least not anything like Microsoft. Sadly, Apple hasn't really done much with the AppleTV. Sure, they upgraded the interface but not really much else. There is so much potential there and lots of room for innovation but either Apple lost interest in it or just couldn't really grasp the whole potential of the product and innovate it out.
I tried an AppleTV once and thought it was cool but realized that a Mac Mini would serve me better for a media device since it's a full computer, I can still Web Browse on it, Play DVD's, and so much more than what the AppleTV does.
If you think Google is just out to steal ideas, you are sorely wrong. Google Chrome was made for simplicity and speed. Same thing with Android. It may or may not be the best in any ones opinion but it surely is not crap nor bloatware like some other companies out there. I say great, let them innnovate in an area that Apple has left to the dust.
Look at what happend when Microsoft owned the whole browser market, they let it sit there and do nothing. Same thing what Apple is doing with the AppleTV. I look forward to see where Apple leads the AppleTV next. Competition is a good thing. It creates innovation. Yeahhh!
Every browser must send an html header telling the site which browser just accessed. Hulu can and does block based on browser type. For example engadget today says hulu does not work with the new google mobile os announced today.
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
Yeah, the Google TV box (if not integrated into the tv like the Sony Bravia) will connect to the TV using HDMI. Also looks like the cable signal will go through the Google TV box so you won't have to switch signals to use Google TV. This allows for the seamless integration that they showed. So for example when you want to search for something (upcoming show, movies that are on, what ever) a single search bar shows up at the top of the screen over-layed over the show you are watching and you can type or say your search query. The results are also overlayed over your current programming so you can continue to watch your show while your are using these features. Another example they showed was browsing the web while having your programming show in an in-picture window. Another feature was using google translate to translate the close-caption in realtime while your watching your show. Looked pretty nice. Lol, yup. Fully agree with you. That's one reason Google TV looks very promising.
Yea after watching it for a 3rd time I did notice that type of behavior... but I'm still left to wonder if that 'pop-over-video' behavior was good for content coming from the cable box OR if it could only happen with video content provided by internet sources.
My reason for wondering this is as follows....
HDMI is supposed to be an encrypted signal and only the TV/Display will have the ability to remove the encryption and display the full resolution of whatever was being pushed out of the cable box. If that is true and I think it is... then how would a 3rd party box have the ability to 'de-encrypt' the HDMI signal and then 'overlay the google menus, etc' re-encrypt and push the final signal onto the HDTV?
I'm getting VERY far away from my comfort zone as I bring these issues up since I know just about enough HDMI protocols and the encryption to fill an index card (on one side - double spaced with wide margins).
There may be provisions in the protocols that allow for this (for all I know) but to me it might be an issue, knowing how ANAL the content owners are over hamstringing its CUSTOMERS from doing what they want in the most ANNOYING way possible.
Presumably, you would just use the Chrome browser that's built into the OS to access Hulu and play content. How would they distinguish whether you're using Chrome on a laptop or Chrome on a GTV box?
That's a surprising question coming from a former worker in the "security and intelligence sector."
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
Riiiight. Seriously? Cause before Apple TV even existed their was MSN TV. Which, if MSN TV had succeeded, would be better competition for Google then Apple's with the browser alone. Regardless there is such thing as competition. I mean, its not like Apple invented the MP3 player either.
Stupid followup if you will. Are version numbers always different from platform to platform? Is it a must that the GTV version would be different from the desktop version?
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
Browsers send user agent identifaction to webservers. For example: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_6_3; en-US) AppleWebKit/533.4 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/5.0.375.38 Safari/533.4"
I don't think it should be doubted. While they may have planned to use it for other things if the hobby ever became mature enough, the design of the box does need a way to access the system without ripping it apart, as stevetim states.
Personally, it's not even worth discussing that much. They tried something and movie studios didn't play ball in the timeframe and way Apple wanted. Now we have a plethora of devices that have fairly decent internet and network capabilities. All I see Google doing here is offering their OS as the basis for all these appliances. Apple needs to come in with an entirely revamped AppleTV, letting go of Mac OS and x86 to harness the efficiency of their iPhone OS on ARM, sans CocoaTouch of course. But they also need to have deals set up and offer services and features that only Apple can excel in, the way they are doing with the iPad.
Stupid followup if you will. Are version numbers always different from platform to platform? Is it a must that the GTV version would be different from the desktop version?
Here is a good example that will answer your question. These are actual headers caught on a web server log file.
First is iphone safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5F136 Safari/525.20"
Second is regular mac safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_5_5; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Safari/525.20.1"
So a programmer can use this header info and direct accordingly.
Looks very interesting and given the tragic nature of virtually all cable company provided set top boxes. very welcome.
As for Apple TV, I own one and use it to rent movies and watch stuff in my iTunes library. It's moderately useful but compared to what Google TV could potentially do, laughably dated.
It's really too bad Apple don't think the living room is worthy of their full attention, or even any attention at all. Apple TV needs a radical overhaul.
Here is a good example that will answer your question. These are actual headers caught on a web server log file.
First is iphone safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5F136 Safari/525.20"
Second is regular mac safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_5_5; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Safari/525.20.1"
So a programmer can use this header info and direct accordingly.
This begs the question of whether or not a browser manufacturer could in fact make it send whatever they liked (i.e. could you make a browser for desktop that sends the same header as the iPhone does)? What I'm getting at is, could you trick the server into doing what you want and hence, stop someone like Hulu being able to block you?
I like Apple, but to me this is good news - competition is good for everyone. This will hopefully push Apple to put more money and development into Apple TV and stop them from being lazy with it and move it out of "hobby" status. Welcome, Google.
Comments
Not that I think Hulu is central to the success of this Google project, but how would Hulu block this?
Presumably, you would just use the Chrome browser that's built into the OS to access Hulu and play content. How would they distinguish whether you're using Chrome on a laptop or Chrome on a GTV box?
I could be wrong. Just asking....
Every browser must send an html header telling the site which browser just accessed. Hulu can and does block based on browser type. For example engadget today says hulu does not work with the new google mobile os announced today.
Not that I know of.
Can you say more?
MacBook Air SuperDrive ?
USB sync to mac/pc?
Usb speakers?
charging stuff?
I tried an AppleTV once and thought it was cool but realized that a Mac Mini would serve me better for a media device since it's a full computer, I can still Web Browse on it, Play DVD's, and so much more than what the AppleTV does.
If you think Google is just out to steal ideas, you are sorely wrong. Google Chrome was made for simplicity and speed. Same thing with Android. It may or may not be the best in any ones opinion but it surely is not crap nor bloatware like some other companies out there. I say great, let them innnovate in an area that Apple has left to the dust.
Look at what happend when Microsoft owned the whole browser market, they let it sit there and do nothing. Same thing what Apple is doing with the AppleTV. I look forward to see where Apple leads the AppleTV next. Competition is a good thing. It creates innovation. Yeahhh!
Every browser must send an html header telling the site which browser just accessed. Hulu can and does block based on browser type. For example engadget today says hulu does not work with the new google mobile os announced today.
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
Not that I know of.
Can you say more?
It's a diagnostic port.
Yeah, the Google TV box (if not integrated into the tv like the Sony Bravia) will connect to the TV using HDMI. Also looks like the cable signal will go through the Google TV box so you won't have to switch signals to use Google TV. This allows for the seamless integration that they showed. So for example when you want to search for something (upcoming show, movies that are on, what ever) a single search bar shows up at the top of the screen over-layed over the show you are watching and you can type or say your search query. The results are also overlayed over your current programming so you can continue to watch your show while your are using these features. Another example they showed was browsing the web while having your programming show in an in-picture window. Another feature was using google translate to translate the close-caption in realtime while your watching your show. Looked pretty nice. Lol, yup. Fully agree with you. That's one reason Google TV looks very promising.
Yea after watching it for a 3rd time I did notice that type of behavior... but I'm still left to wonder if that 'pop-over-video' behavior was good for content coming from the cable box OR if it could only happen with video content provided by internet sources.
My reason for wondering this is as follows....
HDMI is supposed to be an encrypted signal and only the TV/Display will have the ability to remove the encryption and display the full resolution of whatever was being pushed out of the cable box. If that is true and I think it is... then how would a 3rd party box have the ability to 'de-encrypt' the HDMI signal and then 'overlay the google menus, etc' re-encrypt and push the final signal onto the HDTV?
I'm getting VERY far away from my comfort zone as I bring these issues up since I know just about enough HDMI protocols and the encryption to fill an index card (on one side - double spaced with wide margins).
There may be provisions in the protocols that allow for this (for all I know) but to me it might be an issue, knowing how ANAL the content owners are over hamstringing its CUSTOMERS from doing what they want in the most ANNOYING way possible.
I guess time will tell...
It's a diagnostic port.
Yes the only way to get to the harddrive on apple tv is rip the GLUED case apart. So they had to get access to the hardrive.
Presumably, you would just use the Chrome browser that's built into the OS to access Hulu and play content. How would they distinguish whether you're using Chrome on a laptop or Chrome on a GTV box?
That's a surprising question coming from a former worker in the "security and intelligence sector."
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
They do it with browser version numbers.
Google is becoming a ravenous rat.
the "Me Too" company.
pathetic.
Riiiight. Seriously? Cause before Apple TV even existed their was MSN TV. Which, if MSN TV had succeeded, would be better competition for Google then Apple's with the browser alone. Regardless there is such thing as competition. I mean, its not like Apple invented the MP3 player either.
They do it with browser version numbers.
Stupid followup if you will. Are version numbers always different from platform to platform? Is it a must that the GTV version would be different from the desktop version?
It's a diagnostic port.
That's what Apple says. I wonder, though......
Does that mean they'd block out all Chrome visitors? That's what I'm asking. How would they distinguish between a laptop Chrome visitor and a GTV chrome visitor?
It's easy on a phone because the browser in Android isn't a full Chrome browser. But, I would presume the browser that's baked into the GTV OS would be the same as any laptop, right? Why distinguish them?
Browsers send user agent identifaction to webservers. For example: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_6_3; en-US) AppleWebKit/533.4 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/5.0.375.38 Safari/533.4"
go to http://kluge.in-chemnitz.de/tools/browser.php and you can see what your browser is telling the server.
That's what Apple says. I wonder, though......
I don't think it should be doubted. While they may have planned to use it for other things if the hobby ever became mature enough, the design of the box does need a way to access the system without ripping it apart, as stevetim states.
Personally, it's not even worth discussing that much. They tried something and movie studios didn't play ball in the timeframe and way Apple wanted. Now we have a plethora of devices that have fairly decent internet and network capabilities. All I see Google doing here is offering their OS as the basis for all these appliances. Apple needs to come in with an entirely revamped AppleTV, letting go of Mac OS and x86 to harness the efficiency of their iPhone OS on ARM, sans CocoaTouch of course. But they also need to have deals set up and offer services and features that only Apple can excel in, the way they are doing with the iPad.
Stupid followup if you will. Are version numbers always different from platform to platform? Is it a must that the GTV version would be different from the desktop version?
Here is a good example that will answer your question. These are actual headers caught on a web server log file.
First is iphone safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5F136 Safari/525.20"
Second is regular mac safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_5_5; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Safari/525.20.1"
So a programmer can use this header info and direct accordingly.
As for Apple TV, I own one and use it to rent movies and watch stuff in my iTunes library. It's moderately useful but compared to what Google TV could potentially do, laughably dated.
It's really too bad Apple don't think the living room is worthy of their full attention, or even any attention at all. Apple TV needs a radical overhaul.
Here is a good example that will answer your question. These are actual headers caught on a web server log file.
First is iphone safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5F136 Safari/525.20"
Second is regular mac safari hit: "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10_5_5; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Safari/525.20.1"
So a programmer can use this header info and direct accordingly.
This begs the question of whether or not a browser manufacturer could in fact make it send whatever they liked (i.e. could you make a browser for desktop that sends the same header as the iPhone does)? What I'm getting at is, could you trick the server into doing what you want and hence, stop someone like Hulu being able to block you?