SOMEONE was bound to predict some problem... just because the antenna was visible, someone was bound to explain how this will be a problem. And the man is a scientist, so I'm not going to doubt what he's said, however, he doesn't explain how/why the symptoms are able to be duplicated on the iPhone 3G, where the antenna is NOT touching skin.
That's not science. You don't understand what a hypothesis is. That's not an experiment that means anything. There is no control.
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
That's an experiment.
Was the finger wet? Did he lick it first? Was it hot in the room, causing him to sweat? What was underneath the phone? Did he have a paper clip taped to his finger? You get the idea. YouTube is not an authoritative source for news and what folks are doing is hardly scientific. I'm not saying they aren't experiencing issues (they obviously are), but the cause has not been determined yet and everyone is just guessing (or assuming) it's the antennas when earlier models exhibiting the same symptoms would seem to indicate something else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by endgadget
"One iPhone 4 demonstrated the issue everytime it was held in our left hand (as a right-handed person is apt to do) so that our palm was essentially bridging the two antennas. You can see that in the video after the break. Bridging the two with a finger tip, however, didn't cause any issues with the reported reception. If we had to guess, we'd say that our conductive skin was acting to detune the antenna -- in fact, we've already managed to slowly kill two calls that way so it's not just an issue with the software erroneously reporting an incorrect signal strength. That said, we had no issues when Apple's $29 rubber bumper accessory (given to us free for standing in line) was attached, creating a buffer between our palm and the antennas. Our second UK-purchased iPhone 4 was fine, showing none of these handling symptoms. See the video evidence after the break including Insanely Great Mac's version which got us to worrying in the first place."
There is obviously more going on here than just the external physical location of the antennas. The phones don't look physically different, yet some iPhone 4's exhibit symptoms and some do not (including 3G and 3GS), which don't have external antennas..
SOMEONE was bound to predict some problem... just because the antenna was visible, someone was bound to explain how this will be a problem. And the man is a scientist, so I'm not going to doubt what he's said, however, he doesn't explain how/why the symptoms are able to be duplicated on the iPhone 3G, where the antenna is NOT touching skin.
Skin touching is a separate issue, as he did say. Engadget even mentioned that. You're talking about attenuation of reception, like Steve said. They are two separate issues.
The videos shown it being reproduced on older iPhones, and i can do it on mine, require abnormal crowding of the phone. You can bring the iPhone 4 to it's knees with the touch of one finger on the side of the phone. Which just so happens to be where the phone is naturally held.
Interesting. People are reporting that if you disable the 3G radio, the signal strength issues disappear regardless of what you do with your hands on the phone.
Does it fucking matter? He put his finger on the side of the phone and we could no longer hear his voice. That's a fucked up phone.
And how do we know he's not an android fan faking the results? It's youtube, not a reputable source. I believe that's the point Chillin is trying to make.
Engadget is reporting a single finger doesn't interfere in any significant way. Who's to be believed?
Skin touching is a separate issue, as he did say. Engadget even mentioned that. You're talking about attenuation of reception, like Steve said. They are two separate issues.
The videos shown it being reproduced on older iPhones, and i can do it on mine, require abnormal crowding of the phone. You can bring the iPhone 4 to it's knees with the touch of one finger on the side of the phone. Which just so happens to be where the phone is naturally held.
Now do you get it?
Ah, yes, I thank you, I see it now. The iPhone 4 is not defective. It merely has inferior reception. Well, I see now why everyone is pissed off at Apple.
No, I really don't see. I see them as precisely the same issue, with a slight difference of measure. Touching with the skin causes the attenuation issue, I know. But it's the same attenuation issue that is created when you are crowding the phone. The iPhone 4 isn't doing anything new in this regard. It's the same, with a difference of degree, that can be demonstrated on all cell phones, even if you can't actually touch the antenna.
Interesting. People are reporting that if you disable the 3G radio, the signal strength issues disappear regardless of what you do with your hands on the phone.
Does it fucking matter? He put his finger on the side of the phone and we could no longer hear his voice. That's a fucked up phone.
And how do we know he's not an android fan faking the results? It's youtube, not a reputable source. I believe that's the point Chillin is trying to make.
Engadget is reporting a single finger bridging the gap doesn't interfere in any significant way. Who's to be believed?
Touching with the skin causes the attenuation issue, I know. But it's the same attenuation issue that is created when you are crowding the phone. The iPhone 4 isn't doing anything new in this regard. It's the same, with a difference of degree, that can be demonstrated on all cell phones, even if you can't actually touch the antenna.
Touching a tiny sliver of the phone with a single finger is not "crowding the phone".
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
That's an experiment.
nice try. But that isn't a control. Are you testing the phone, or your hand? With a single phone you can not do any science that says anything about any other individual phone. With one phone you are isolated and can only make statements about that one single phone.
Touching a tiny sliver of the phone with a single finger is not "crowding the phone".
right... it's touching with the skin... causing the attenuation issue. Think you can avoid touching that spot with your single finger when you're making calls in areas of weak cell reception? I'm not usually a betting man... but I bet you can.
Another interesting story. It claims that iOS4 changed the antenna priority behavior from the 'Strongest Possible Signal' to the 'Most Reliable Signal'.
A software origin for the hand position bug, nicknamed the "death grip" for its tendency to kill the cellular signal if the antennas are bridged, would explain how some have replicated the problem on the iPhone 3G and the 3GS. As iOS 4 changed the antenna's priority from the strongest possible signal to the most reliable, it may have changed that behavior for all phones, not just the iPhone 4.
Owners of the 3G MicroCell also support this through their lack of trouble; since the femtocell is always the most powerful cellular signal when nearby, iPhones always stay connected. The same behavior may likewise explain why some without MicroCells haven't had success replicating the problem, as any attenuation of the signal might not be enough to confuse the phone if the user is close to a good cell site.
Anyone with a high school education should know that is a proper control in this experiment.
The experiment, and I use the word loosely, won't tell you much. No matter how rigorously you test with one phone, you still have one phone, and can say nothing about any other phone. The experiment is a sham. It tells us nothing useful.
Interesting. People are reporting that if you disable the 3G radio, the signal strength issues disappear regardless of what you do with your hands on the phone.
I haven't read the link yet but I switched off 3G (I'm not actually in a 3G area) and went from 3 bars, with internet, to "no service" in about 5 seconds. I then put the phone down on my desk, just 2 or 3 inches from where I had just held it, and signal returned fully in 5-10 seconds. I then repeated it and exactly the same happened.
Comments
From Engadget:
iPhone 4 antenna problems were predicted on June 10 by Danish professor
SOMEONE was bound to predict some problem... just because the antenna was visible, someone was bound to explain how this will be a problem. And the man is a scientist, so I'm not going to doubt what he's said, however, he doesn't explain how/why the symptoms are able to be duplicated on the iPhone 3G, where the antenna is NOT touching skin.
via slashdot:
http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...ntenna_problem
I like this article better.
From Engadget:
iPhone 4 antenna problems were predicted on June 10 by Danish professor
The good professor has identified what we knew all along:
Exposing more of the antenna to the external environment including the hand will wreak havoc on signal quality and strength.
That's not science. You don't understand what a hypothesis is. That's not an experiment that means anything. There is no control.
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
That's an experiment.
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
That's an experiment.
Was the finger wet? Did he lick it first? Was it hot in the room, causing him to sweat? What was underneath the phone? Did he have a paper clip taped to his finger? You get the idea. YouTube is not an authoritative source for news and what folks are doing is hardly scientific. I'm not saying they aren't experiencing issues (they obviously are), but the cause has not been determined yet and everyone is just guessing (or assuming) it's the antennas when earlier models exhibiting the same symptoms would seem to indicate something else.
"One iPhone 4 demonstrated the issue everytime it was held in our left hand (as a right-handed person is apt to do) so that our palm was essentially bridging the two antennas. You can see that in the video after the break. Bridging the two with a finger tip, however, didn't cause any issues with the reported reception. If we had to guess, we'd say that our conductive skin was acting to detune the antenna -- in fact, we've already managed to slowly kill two calls that way so it's not just an issue with the software erroneously reporting an incorrect signal strength. That said, we had no issues when Apple's $29 rubber bumper accessory (given to us free for standing in line) was attached, creating a buffer between our palm and the antennas. Our second UK-purchased iPhone 4 was fine, showing none of these handling symptoms. See the video evidence after the break including Insanely Great Mac's version which got us to worrying in the first place."
[Source]
There is obviously more going on here than just the external physical location of the antennas. The phones don't look physically different, yet some iPhone 4's exhibit symptoms and some do not (including 3G and 3GS), which don't have external antennas..
SOMEONE was bound to predict some problem... just because the antenna was visible, someone was bound to explain how this will be a problem. And the man is a scientist, so I'm not going to doubt what he's said, however, he doesn't explain how/why the symptoms are able to be duplicated on the iPhone 3G, where the antenna is NOT touching skin.
Skin touching is a separate issue, as he did say. Engadget even mentioned that. You're talking about attenuation of reception, like Steve said. They are two separate issues.
The videos shown it being reproduced on older iPhones, and i can do it on mine, require abnormal crowding of the phone. You can bring the iPhone 4 to it's knees with the touch of one finger on the side of the phone. Which just so happens to be where the phone is naturally held.
Now do you get it?
Was the finger wet? Did he lick it first? Was it hot in the room, causing him to sweat?
Does it fucking matter? He put his finger on the side of the phone and we could no longer hear his voice. That's a fucked up phone.
http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/.../t-948900.html
Does it fucking matter? He put his finger on the side of the phone and we could no longer hear his voice. That's a fucked up phone.
And how do we know he's not an android fan faking the results? It's youtube, not a reputable source. I believe that's the point Chillin is trying to make.
Engadget is reporting a single finger doesn't interfere in any significant way. Who's to be believed?
Skin touching is a separate issue, as he did say. Engadget even mentioned that. You're talking about attenuation of reception, like Steve said. They are two separate issues.
The videos shown it being reproduced on older iPhones, and i can do it on mine, require abnormal crowding of the phone. You can bring the iPhone 4 to it's knees with the touch of one finger on the side of the phone. Which just so happens to be where the phone is naturally held.
Now do you get it?
Ah, yes, I thank you, I see it now. The iPhone 4 is not defective. It merely has inferior reception. Well, I see now why everyone is pissed off at Apple.
No, I really don't see. I see them as precisely the same issue, with a slight difference of measure. Touching with the skin causes the attenuation issue, I know. But it's the same attenuation issue that is created when you are crowding the phone. The iPhone 4 isn't doing anything new in this regard. It's the same, with a difference of degree, that can be demonstrated on all cell phones, even if you can't actually touch the antenna.
Interesting. People are reporting that if you disable the 3G radio, the signal strength issues disappear regardless of what you do with your hands on the phone.
http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/.../t-948900.html
But what if you want to use the Nation's Fastest 3G Network?
Actually, this phone is really good at that with this extra feature:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIXDW...layer_embedded
Does it fucking matter? He put his finger on the side of the phone and we could no longer hear his voice. That's a fucked up phone.
And how do we know he's not an android fan faking the results? It's youtube, not a reputable source. I believe that's the point Chillin is trying to make.
Engadget is reporting a single finger bridging the gap doesn't interfere in any significant way. Who's to be believed?
Touching with the skin causes the attenuation issue, I know. But it's the same attenuation issue that is created when you are crowding the phone. The iPhone 4 isn't doing anything new in this regard. It's the same, with a difference of degree, that can be demonstrated on all cell phones, even if you can't actually touch the antenna.
Touching a tiny sliver of the phone with a single finger is not "crowding the phone".
The control was in the hand placement which stayed constant throughout the entire experiment, which showed intact voice quality. The variable was the extra finger moving down the side until it came into contact with the insulator portion. The observation was that once the finger progressed to the insulator portion, the reception/transmission was cut.
That's an experiment.
nice try. But that isn't a control. Are you testing the phone, or your hand? With a single phone you can not do any science that says anything about any other individual phone. With one phone you are isolated and can only make statements about that one single phone.
Touching a tiny sliver of the phone with a single finger is not "crowding the phone".
right... it's touching with the skin... causing the attenuation issue. Think you can avoid touching that spot with your single finger when you're making calls in areas of weak cell reception? I'm not usually a betting man... but I bet you can.
nice try. But that isn't a control. Are you testing the phone, or your hand?
Anyone with a high school education should know that is a proper control in this experiment.
http://www.electronista.com/articles...rly.next.week/
Anyone with a high school education should know that is a proper control in this experiment.
The experiment, and I use the word loosely, won't tell you much. No matter how rigorously you test with one phone, you still have one phone, and can say nothing about any other phone. The experiment is a sham. It tells us nothing useful.
Interesting. People are reporting that if you disable the 3G radio, the signal strength issues disappear regardless of what you do with your hands on the phone.
http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/.../t-948900.html
I haven't read the link yet but I switched off 3G (I'm not actually in a 3G area) and went from 3 bars, with internet, to "no service" in about 5 seconds. I then put the phone down on my desk, just 2 or 3 inches from where I had just held it, and signal returned fully in 5-10 seconds. I then repeated it and exactly the same happened.
Engadget is reporting a single finger doesn't interfere in any significant way. Who's to be believed?
A single finger on mine, that definitely has death grip, makes no discernible difference whatsoever.