Android gaining on Apple iOS in mobile web market share



  • Reply 261 of 348
    davegeedavegee Posts: 2,765member
    Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

    Apple does not build a smartphone all by themselves. Indeed, they build no smartphones at all, given that they own no production facilities, no chip fabrication plants, no plastic molding companies, no PCB manufacturing facilities nor anything else necessary to build a smartphone. They design stuff with help from the ChiComs. They build nothing.

    Someone needs to grow up... but even going by your twisted logic then neither do most of the other cell phone makers. Oh and finally, you are still wrong!

    Apple does build things, they build their brand along with their stockpile of cash reserves! Oh and yes, they happen to be exceptional at it.
  • Reply 262 of 348
    1st1st Posts: 392member
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

    Android's share of U.S. mobile web traffic climbed to 25% in August in its best one month gain since Nov. 2009.


    Web traffic? based on how many bytes used? Does that mean yahoo mobile is better than BBC? does that mean poor compression is better (used more bytes than highly compressed data)? got headache to just think about it. Google map with 3D will improve traffic at least for 2X right the way if you compare to the map. Any info gain by that? (besides you can see your kids forgot to clean the yard after birthday party). Reward to the "inefficient" (some related to bad bad mobile web design, such as 300 to 400 just down load the front page) if it is used as bench mark.
  • Reply 263 of 348
    Originally Posted by Murphster View Post

    You are missing the real dark horse in all of these assumptions on business use.

    Cisco -

    Their upcoming tablet is based on Android, and you can be sure that Cisco are not the only Business Communications provider who are releasing a tablet device over the coming year, most if not all of these will be android based.

    With companies like Cisco, who already own the telephony, messaging and video at a very large proportion of companies worldwide bringing out android based devices then there is going to be little room, and no incentive to go with Apple in the future.

    So in business we are going to be left with a straight fight between Android devices and Windows devices. Just like the future of business communications (telepphony and video) is now a straight fight between Microsoft and the likes of Cisco/Avaya/NEC etc..

    Unless Apple can license IOS to selected vendors like this that i just cannot see any room for them in the corporate space in the future. So no, Apples future will always lie in the consumer space and for them Android might actually start to provide them with their first real competition (that is assuming of course that Microsoft have never really been any competition to Apple, despite what Microsoft ever thought).

    But while it terms of just OS market share then Apple will off course be blown away by Android devices, this will always be by dozens of different vendors, hardware types and class of devices. There is no reason not to think that Apple devices will remain amongst the biggest selling of any competitor such as Samsung or Moto.

    I like the idea!

    Though, I do not think that Android (and the SDK) or the Cisco hardware is robust enough to deliver on the "promises" of the linked video.

    I suspect that Cisco will implement all these apps/functions, first. on the iPad-- it is a known, entity; it already exists; likely, it has a robust SDK; it will have business install-base advantage for several years.

    This ain't your father's Oldsmobile Tablet

  • Reply 264 of 348
    Originally Posted by davegee View Post

    more to the point their passion for design and the user experience is directly tied to their shareholder value.

    +++ qft

  • Reply 265 of 348
    Originally Posted by alexkhan2000 View Post

    Ahh, yes, the anonymous Internet know-it-alls here know a lot more about this industry than Jobs and his team of executives do. Yeah, we may work in a totally unrelated industry but we are all smarter and see all these things that they don't. Yes, Jobs and his lieutenants are reading all of your posts on AI to plan their next big move since all of you guys are so much smarter than they are.

    I notice a pattern here since I visit forums ranging from MLB baseball to high-end electric guitar gear (an industry in which I work) to world history to quantum mechanics and it's always the same: the forum posters and bloggers know a *LOT* more than the people who work in their respective industries to make a living.

    Yes, a guy working in a company making screws for auto parts knows more about baseball than the manager of the New York Yankees. A guy who works as a manager of a 7-11 store knows more about astrophysics than Stephen Hawking or a professor at Princeton. I mean, isn't that what the Internet is all about? I see that this place isn't any different. It always comes down to: "My penis is bigger than yours." or "My dad can beat up your dad."


    My dad's penis is bigger than your dad's penis!

  • Reply 266 of 348
    Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

    Indeed. We could be looking at 100 million iOS devices sold 2011. However are you assuming iPod nano will be considered an iOS device? I wonder if Apple will count it as an iOS device to boost iOS numbers. That would be naughty.


    Under no reality is the Nano an iOS device-- it just looks like one on TV!

  • Reply 267 of 348
    Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

    Those things are a means to an end. You confuse the tactic with the strategy.

    Hello!..... Is that you, Eric?..... Hello..... Eric?

  • Reply 268 of 348
    Originally Posted by Ochyming View Post

    He wrote that  is sooo non important because  is tiny.

    But  success annoys him/her. Which is a contradiction in itself.

    In the end what we are discussing here?

    Is it  business model or that  should die and that hegemony is supreme (software licensing by Google and Microsoft)?

    Be fair!

    Name one (or more) market leaders. innovators (if you will), that inspire to improve your life (even in a small way) by buying their products.

    Pretty soon, we'll identify successful companies by longevity, ability to adapt...

    MSoft is there, but failing... Never even heard of Dell, Google...

    I bet my investment $ on AAPL, and my computer CE $ on Apple.... Neat, that one stop shopping, thingie!

  • Reply 269 of 348
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

    I think you are wrong about Apple' interest in profits. What jobs changed when he return was the short term focus on profits that many CEOs do from quarter to quarter while looking for a more profitable position. He's looking at the longterm growth, but in that vision is profits, which is why Apple is in the position they are today.

    Hear! Hear!

  • Reply 270 of 348
    Originally Posted by grking View Post

    Look, I love my iPhone, MBP, and I particularly love my new 27" quad core i7 iMac, but people have to realize that people (a lot of them probably) knowingly and consciously choose an Android phone, not because they cannot get an iPhone, or because and iPhone is too expensive, but rather because it is what they want.

    Many only want Android because they want Verizon's network more than they want the iPhone, whether it be for reliability, 3G availability, or both.

    Originally Posted by sranger View Post

    1) Do you really think Android is doomed because a few older phones cannot be upgraded to the latest version?

    2) Do you really think all Android phones are crap because a few manufactures chose to release them without the latest OS installed?

    3) Do you really think the everyone will stop developing apps for the Android phones because they have to deal with different versions of the OS?

    1. I don't think that Android is "doomed" because of fragmentation. If Android is doomed, it's only because of the Oracle suit. (Actually, Windows Phone 7 may give Android a run in the consumer market, once it gets multitasking and cut/copy/paste, etc.)

    Most people don't care what version they use, or what version is out there, somewhere. They just want what they have to work well, and work with the apps they want.

    2. No.

    3. The most likely situation is that Android app makers keep making a single version that works with 1.6 and up, until a vast majority of Android devices work with 2.1 and up. Most phones these days aren't stuck on 2.0, so that's not a problem.

    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

    The examples of Android phones that aren’t being updated in a timely manner or at all goes to the heart of the matter of Android not being an ideal mobile OS for the average person, which will give Apple, RiM and others a very real and profitable segment of the market.

    Don't underestimate the ability for the average human to blame the wrong person for a problem.

    Take someone who wants to download a sports app for her Android phone. But what? It doesn't work with her Android 1.6-enabled phone? It must be the app maker's fault.

    However, the app maker noticed that to make the app work the way that is needed, he needed some APIs from the 2.1 SDK, but that means the app won't work with 1.6. But instead of blaming the cellphone maker for not upgrading her phone to a more modern version of Android, that person will blame the app maker because, "I have an Android phone. I want it to work with my phone." Well, it wasn't possible with 1.6. Upgrade to 2.1. "But I can't upgrade it. And what do you mean by 'it's not possible'? Fix the problem. "

    It's like a wife who blames her husband for picture quality issues on her favorite show, when the fault was with some faulty equipment at the TV station. It's completely illogical for her to blame someone who had no control over the problem, but she doesn't care.

    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

    There is some history to be learned-- Civil War and Major League Baseball:

    Sports, 1866-1944 - 1st Commissioner of Baseball

    "Regardless of the outcome of the juries, no player that throws a ball game, no man that entertains proposals or promises to throw a game, no player that sits in a conference with a bunch of crooked players where the ways and means of throwing games are discussed, and does not promptly tell his club about it, will ever again play professional baseball."

    - Judge Kenesaw Mountain Landis

    If you read Shoeless Joe's wikipedia profile, you'll find out that he may not have helped fix the World Series. Plus, his performance in the World Series was spectacular. He still got banned. He should absolutely be reinstated.
  • Reply 271 of 348
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

    That phone still has to be activated and that user still needs to be tied to that device so I took that statement to mean any iPhone or iPad with cellular chips in it. Note that the iPad doesn't need to be activated right away to be used, one can wait until they go on vacation or whatever.


    I took the SJ statement as meaning device IDs sent to Apple-- every iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch that needs to get "activated" blessed through iTunes.

  • Reply 272 of 348
    nkhmnkhm Posts: 928member
    Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

    The single biggest thing holding back Android adoption by Mac users is that there's no Android app to sync your phone with your Mac. And no, I don't want Google knowing everything about my phone any time I want to update my Calendar.

    RIM's had a hard time lately, but at least they have their own free desktop-based app for syncing Contacts, Calendar and iTunes with a Mac.

    I'd switch to Blackberry long before I ever consider an Android device.

    You haven't looked very hard. There's a great missing sync for android.
  • Reply 273 of 348
    Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

    That is not necessarily true. One of the biggest drawbacks of iOS devices is iTunes. One of the biggest drawbacks of iTunes is that it is so bloated.

    Out of the billions of people in the world, room exists for many different types of software. I often wish that I could sync with a quick and dirty music transfer program, for example, instead of going through all the rigamarole involved with using iTunes.

    And I sure as hell don't use it as a media player!

    What rigamarole? Plug it in and sync.
  • Reply 274 of 348
    Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

    Duh is right. Every manufacturer could like it, but that does not matter one bit.

    The reason why Android is gaining market share is because consumers are buying Android devices faster and faster, certainly at a much faster rate than iOS devices. Fewer relevant consumers are buying iOS devices compared to greater numbers of relevant consumers buying Android devices.

    These things are not mysterious. The rate of consumer purchases determines market share on a dynamic basis. The installed consumer base compared to competitors determines the static market share.

    The reasons for market share are consumer buying habits, and not what manufacturers "like".

    I just bought an iPhone. Two co-workers bought androids (motorola and samsung). Android looks pretty cool. Some neat widgets and keyboards. But the amount of times that the android screens didn't respond to input was amazing. Slow and buggy. Hmmmmm.

    Neither co-worker has music loaded. They haven't gotten to it. I was able to easily sync my music the first day. Along with contacts too.. Of course previously purchase apps (1st gen iPod touch) Also synced.
  • Reply 275 of 348
    Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

    Right. Nail on head. Why would a developer ( or his manager) target 2.2 which is only available to a few million android phones, when he could target all iDevices from the 3G up. The original iPhone sold 2 M, and I think we can assume that most people have upgraded. So effectively the iDevice market for 4.x is all of it, and the Android 2.2 market is a fraction of the total android market.

    Nail on head.

    Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

    Yeah, and Zune is the second most popular type of MP3 player IN THE WORLD.

    Do you really care? Both the Zune and the Mac are all but irrelevant in their respective markets.

    Man I'm glad apple products are irrelevant...... irrelevance must equal huge stock price gins.

  • Reply 276 of 348
    Originally Posted by Dorotea View Post

    What rigamarole? Plug it in and sync.

    Yeah, but... ya' gotta plug it in...

    ... as opposed to standin' on the corner waiting' for someone to fulfill your life's destiny...

  • Reply 277 of 348
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Originally Posted by striker_kk View Post

    Why do u think Apple is not a software company? Because Press said so? Because Steve said so? What is the prerequisite for a company to be called a software company?

    To create software for various hardware vendors..?
  • Reply 278 of 348
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Originally Posted by Thomas Gilling View Post

    No not really. But Apple should care as it's there achievement. And no the Zune is not irrelevant, and the Mac definitely isn't. No 1 in the Media and Arts, and people who buy comps over $1000, Apple has 91% of that Market. It isn't me with a single minded point of view.

    Though that 91% was back in 2009 (before Windows 7 was released?) and, much as I remember, was covering only retail units... which is a bit misleading. It could be different in USA, but living in NZ, I know only 1 person with high-end brand PC (Dell Studio XPS) and about 20 of them with custom built over US$1000 rigs.

    Regarding laptops, Apple was doing remarkably well, but then again, it was before Windows 7 came out... and new desirable units, like Toshiba Portege R700, followed.
  • Reply 279 of 348
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Originally Posted by nht View Post

    Maybe. This assumes that MS cannot recapture any share they lost to Android with WP7. Android CE makers have no overwhelming loyalty to the platform in the same way that Apple has with iOS, Nokia has with Symbian and RIM with Blackberry.

    LG, Samsung, HTC, Sony-Ericsson all are rumored to have WP7 phones in the pipeline. These aren't going to take share from iOS but Android and Symbian.

    What makes you think that? I personally know quite a few Windows PC users with iPhone that are considering to replace it with something else on their next phone refresh... me included. Hard core Apple users (with multiple Apple products) will stay in their ecosystem for ever, but for number of Windows users there is more dissadvantage than advantage in iTunes tie-up and number of other restrictions Apple has imposed to the iPhone.

    None of them hate iPhone - it is good product in general... but many will simply take other products into consideration (at least). How many of them will still find iPhone still best for their needs will depend on where Android, WP7, Nokia... heck, even HP with WebOS... will be compared to iPhone and iOS.
  • Reply 280 of 348
    hirohiro Posts: 2,663member
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

    I don't think it is "profits", "costs", or "availability of talent" -- though those are factors when deciding whether to undertake a project.

    Rather, I think Apple staffs [technical people] based on productivity. The biggest challenge is to balance staff size with productivity.

    Often, increasing staff to accelerate output or meet a deadline, has just the opposite effect.

    At IBM, we said: "Expediting... takes a little (or a lot) longer".

    There have been lots of studies on "optimal team size"

    Much of this boils down to "communication" as expressed in the communication formula-- the number of different communication paths (or interactions) within a group of a given size:

    (N * (N-1))/2

    Where N is the number of people in the group.

    For example. we have a team of 5 people working on a project -- there are 10 possible communication (interaction) paths

    (5 * (5-1))/2

    Now, we want to expedite the project so we add 2 members to the team (assume the new members are all up to speed). Now there 21 possible communication (interaction) paths.

    (7 * (7-1))/2

    By increasing the team size by 40%, we have more than doubled the complexity of communication (interaction).

    As the team grows, each member spends an increasing amount of his time "communicating" rather than "producing".

    Soon, there will be more meetings called to "get everyone on the same page" and "up to speed".

    Then, the final death rattle, when someone says: "let's have a pre-meeting, meeting-- so we can agree on a position to take to the full meeting".

    Jef Bezos of Amazon is credited with defining the "Two-Pizza Team Rule".

    "If a project team can eat more than two pizzas, it's too large."

    In my experience, 5 is the optimal team size!


    At least credit Fred Brooks if you are going to make his argument for him. But today even he says the numeric assumptions of team communications are wrong today in a properly run dev team that writes well incapsulated code and good interfaces. Technology and techniques have made those old equations way overstated... for the well run projects. The poorly run ones are still affected as you noted.

    Essentially you end up limiting many parts of your project to the Two Pizza Rule, but not the size of the entire project. It's not hard, but the lead has to know what they are doing and be a bit of a hardcase early on to keep the interface and encapsulation ground rules in place. It's only good dev practice in the first place, but it is amazing how much of that has been ignored over the years because of ego and not-invented-here syndrome.
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