Actually, MOSR has a logical article for once. The next PowerBooks may run at 667 Mhz and 800 Mhz. The current high-end model could become the entry-level model minus Airport (keeping the current chip at 667 Mhz) and the new high-end model will get the new 7445/0.18 G4 at 800 Mhz. Then, later this summer or fall, they could get to 1Ghz or more with the 7460/0.15 G4. Hmmmm...
majority of the time they are silent. when doing something like playing a movie or just working the system a little the first fan will come on, this is hardly loud and barely noticebale. but if you do any serious crunching or gaming then the 4 fans come on and they are loud.
depends on what you are doing but its no where near all the time</strong><hr></blockquote>
applenut, my 667's fan is on a LOT. the second stage fan comes on for long periods of time. this is with it on a coolpad in a fairly cool environment. if you've tried driving another monitor with it (i have an 18" sony lcd) and the fan goes on when i'm just surfing the web. very annoying actually.
You might get your 600s but I don't see Apple clocking ibooks faster than the PBs if they're using the same processor. Differentiation problem.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Unless I'm mistaken, didn't Apple overlap performance with the iBooks (366 - 466) and the Pismo PBG3's (400 - 500) some time ago? Different bus speeds, I know, but the iBook was clocked higher than the entry-level PB.
applenut, my 667's fan is on a LOT. the second stage fan comes on for long periods of time. this is with it on a coolpad in a fairly cool environment. if you've tried driving another monitor with it (i have an 18" sony lcd) and the fan goes on when i'm just surfing the web. very annoying actually.</strong><hr></blockquote>
the fans seem to be triggered by the "activitity" of the radeon chip and/or if the CPU is maxxed. You're taxxing the radeon more by using the external display and therefore the fans come on. sucks.
[quote] <hr></blockquote> It's all about the screen resolution, people! That's the TiBooks primary weakness, IMO.
- Pook
I'm with PookJR folks, let's talk screen resolution. My Pismo G3 has better resolution and sharpness and the Japanese iBook I got last summer beets the TiPB to pieces on resolution. Of course, the screen size is a charm and it makes DVD playing run. I was hoping for a real reason to upgrade last year but was able to resist quite easily. That is not a good sign.
<strong>Will they sacrifice form factor like they did the 14 inch monster-ibook?
The TiBook has the 1 inch thick, 15.2 inch screen reputation, that would be hard to beat or hard to try and sell something heavier.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I'm sure there is an lcd that has the same glass size the TiBook's but has a bigger resolution.
I also have used a second monitor (Viewsonic PT770) on mine and the fan never comes on just surfing the web or any time. Now I ask you what is your browser? What is your browsing habits? Do you click and hold the scroll bar for long periods of time? If you do and use mozilla your cpu is using about 80 to 95 percent of its power just to do that. Omniweb does not seem to have this problem. Best advice I have for TiBook owners is open CPU Monitor (if you use OS X) and learn about your computer and what you are doing that makes it so hot.
<strong>the fans seem to be triggered by the "activitity" of the radeon chip and/or if the CPU is maxxed. You're taxxing the radeon more by using the external display and therefore the fans come on. sucks.</strong><hr></blockquote>
interesting, thanks. it's on pretty often. i hope they can fix this issue in the future. the level one fan is on almost all the time now. as soon as i wake the machine from sleep the fan's on. oh well, i'll wait to see if they get quieter in newer revisions.
<strong>I also have used a second monitor on mine and the fan never comes on just surfing the web or any time. Now I ask you what is your browser? What is your browsing habits? Do you click and hold the scroll bar for long periods of time? If you do and use mozilla your cpu is using about 80 to 95 percent of its power just to do that. Omniweb does not seem to have this problem. Best advice I have for TiBook owners is open CPU Monitor (if you use OS X) and learn about your computer and what you are doing that makes it so hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
my browser is omniweb. my browsing habit is to generally have about four or five windows open. fire, drop drawers and entourage running. i don't run mozilla often (love anti-aliased text of omni ) but i don't hold the scroll bar often. in fact, i have a scroll wheel mouse. i'm not doing anything to make it so hot, it just runs that way. if yours isn't, more power to you. but it's not like i'm letting photoshop filters and quicktime movies run in the background when i'm browsing. i'd switch with ya if you wanted to. haha.
<strong>my browser is omniweb. my browsing habit is to generally have about four or five windows open. fire, drop drawers and entourage running. i don't run mozilla often (love anti-aliased text of omni ) but i don't hold the scroll bar often. in fact, i have a scroll wheel mouse. i'm not doing anything to make it so hot, it just runs that way. if yours isn't, more power to you. but it's not like i'm letting photoshop filters and quicktime movies run in the background when i'm browsing. i'd switch with ya if you wanted to. haha.</strong><hr></blockquote>
haha thats ok, tell me about the anti alisas it looks so sweet. It makes it hard to go back to mozilla but cocoazilla is moving right along im sure that will be there soon. I think all you can do is see what kind of power all your programs are running. type "top" in your terminal to get an even better idea of what's going on, hehe marvin gaye came into my mind after I typed that and I had to let you all know that, so strange.
Hmm, anyone feel loke digging into the darwin sources to find out whether Darwin could tell different chips of the same family from each other at all (i.e. 7400 from 7410 and 745x from 744x), or like just taking his PowerBook apart and read the serial number from the chip?
I just fail to understand why Apple would not use the low-power version here...
Hmm, anyone feel loke digging into the darwin sources to find out whether Darwin could tell different chips of the same family from each other at all (i.e. 7400 from 7410 and 745x from 744x), or like just taking his PowerBook apart and read the serial number from the chip?
Specifically, there's no constant defined for either the 7410, 744x.
While this of course doesn't rule out the possibility that Darwin can tell one series from another nonetheless (dunno if the PPC ISA has something like the x86's "cpuid" instruction), it might also mean that any 7450-class processor (i.e. 744x and 745x) will be shown as "PowerPC 7450".
Comments
<strong>According to Moto the 7445 is available at 600, 733, and 800.
So I predict 600, 733 and 800 Pbooks.
Radical, eh?
SdA, aka SdC</strong><hr></blockquote>
I predict PowerBooks at 667 and 800 plus iBooks at 600 and 733. All G4s. Way beyond radical.
<strong>
I predict PowerBooks at 667 and 800 plus iBooks at 600 and 733. All G4s. Way beyond radical.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You might get your 600s but I don't see Apple clocking ibooks faster than the PBs if they're using the same processor. Differentiation problem.
<strong>
I own one of the rev Bs and you are wrong.
majority of the time they are silent. when doing something like playing a movie or just working the system a little the first fan will come on, this is hardly loud and barely noticebale. but if you do any serious crunching or gaming then the 4 fans come on and they are loud.
depends on what you are doing but its no where near all the time</strong><hr></blockquote>
applenut, my 667's fan is on a LOT. the second stage fan comes on for long periods of time. this is with it on a coolpad in a fairly cool environment. if you've tried driving another monitor with it (i have an 18" sony lcd) and the fan goes on when i'm just surfing the web. very annoying actually.
<strong>Apple will probably go with 733/867</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have a Pismo 400 but it's feeling sluggish under X (highly usable, but not snappy). I'd love a TiPB but if 667 is the low end I'll have to pass.
My upgrade rule is 2x current performance, so 733/867 would be very tempting. 800/933 would be irrisistable!
The new PowerMacs use Apollo, so 800/933 seems a good bet.
<strong>
You might get your 600s but I don't see Apple clocking ibooks faster than the PBs if they're using the same processor. Differentiation problem.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Unless I'm mistaken, didn't Apple overlap performance with the iBooks (366 - 466) and the Pismo PBG3's (400 - 500) some time ago? Different bus speeds, I know, but the iBook was clocked higher than the entry-level PB.
I think the next revision we'll see:
1. $1999 - $2199
G4 800
512MB RAM
Combo Drive
30GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
2. $2499 -$2999
G4 933
512MB RAM
Combo Drive
48GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
3. $3399 - $3599
G4 933
1GB RAM
SUPERDRIVE
60GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
<strong>I've said this many many times here, the powerbook is an iMac in titanium. If you want to see what will be in Powerbook, look at the iMac.
I think the next revision we'll see:
3. $3399 - $3599
G4 933
1GB RAM
SUPERDRIVE
60GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip</strong><hr></blockquote>
Except for there's no evidence whatsoever that anyone's made a DVD-R that would fit in that enclosure.
I think the next revision we'll see:
1. $1999 - $2199
G4 800
256MB RAM
Combo Drive
20GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
2. $2499 -$2999
G4 933
512MB RAM
Combo Drive
30GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
3. $3399 - $3599
G4 933
1GB RAM
SUPERDRIVE
48GB
Ati Radeon mobility 7500 or Nvidia chip
A Superdrive would be a nice addition to the line, maybe...
[ 01-30-2002: Message edited by: Macintosh ]</p>
<strong>
applenut, my 667's fan is on a LOT. the second stage fan comes on for long periods of time. this is with it on a coolpad in a fairly cool environment. if you've tried driving another monitor with it (i have an 18" sony lcd) and the fan goes on when i'm just surfing the web. very annoying actually.</strong><hr></blockquote>
the fans seem to be triggered by the "activitity" of the radeon chip and/or if the CPU is maxxed. You're taxxing the radeon more by using the external display and therefore the fans come on. sucks.
- Pook
I'm with PookJR folks, let's talk screen resolution. My Pismo G3 has better resolution and sharpness and the Japanese iBook I got last summer beets the TiPB to pieces on resolution. Of course, the screen size is a charm and it makes DVD playing run. I was hoping for a real reason to upgrade last year but was able to resist quite easily. That is not a good sign.
The TiBook has the 1 inch thick, 15.2 inch screen reputation, that would be hard to beat or hard to try and sell something heavier.
<strong>Will they sacrifice form factor like they did the 14 inch monster-ibook?
The TiBook has the 1 inch thick, 15.2 inch screen reputation, that would be hard to beat or hard to try and sell something heavier.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I'm sure there is an lcd that has the same glass size the TiBook's but has a bigger resolution.
<strong>Has it been verified that the PB uses a 7441? I've heard it both ways. Any courageous TiPB owners care to comment?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Fresh off the terminal of a TiBook 667:
Mach kernel version:
Darwin Kernel Version 5.2:
Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001; root:xnu/xnu-201.14.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC
Kernel configured for up to 2 processors.
1 processor is physically available.
Processor type: ppc7450 (PowerPC 7450)
Processor active: 0
Primary memory available: 512.00 megabytes.
Default processor set: 40 tasks, 117 threads, 1 processors
Load average: 0.00, Mach factor: 0.99
On the heat issue:
I also have used a second monitor (Viewsonic PT770) on mine and the fan never comes on just surfing the web or any time. Now I ask you what is your browser? What is your browsing habits? Do you click and hold the scroll bar for long periods of time? If you do and use mozilla your cpu is using about 80 to 95 percent of its power just to do that. Omniweb does not seem to have this problem. Best advice I have for TiBook owners is open CPU Monitor (if you use OS X) and learn about your computer and what you are doing that makes it so hot.
[ 01-31-2002: Message edited by: KrazyFool ]</p>
<strong>the fans seem to be triggered by the "activitity" of the radeon chip and/or if the CPU is maxxed. You're taxxing the radeon more by using the external display and therefore the fans come on. sucks.</strong><hr></blockquote>
interesting, thanks. it's on pretty often. i hope they can fix this issue in the future. the level one fan is on almost all the time now. as soon as i wake the machine from sleep the fan's on. oh well, i'll wait to see if they get quieter in newer revisions.
<strong>I also have used a second monitor on mine and the fan never comes on just surfing the web or any time. Now I ask you what is your browser? What is your browsing habits? Do you click and hold the scroll bar for long periods of time? If you do and use mozilla your cpu is using about 80 to 95 percent of its power just to do that. Omniweb does not seem to have this problem. Best advice I have for TiBook owners is open CPU Monitor (if you use OS X) and learn about your computer and what you are doing that makes it so hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
my browser is omniweb. my browsing habit is to generally have about four or five windows open. fire, drop drawers and entourage running. i don't run mozilla often (love anti-aliased text of omni
<strong>my browser is omniweb. my browsing habit is to generally have about four or five windows open. fire, drop drawers and entourage running. i don't run mozilla often (love anti-aliased text of omni
haha thats ok, tell me about the anti alisas it looks so sweet. It makes it hard to go back to mozilla but cocoazilla is moving right along im sure that will be there soon. I think all you can do is see what kind of power all your programs are running. type "top" in your terminal to get an even better idea of what's going on, hehe marvin gaye came into my mind after I typed that and I had to let you all know that, so strange.
<strong>The hard drive in my iBook is the loudest I have ever seen in a laptop.
or heard for that matter!
<strong>Kernel configured for up to 2 processors.
1 processor is physically available.
Processor type: ppc7450 (PowerPC 7450)
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hmm, anyone feel loke digging into the darwin sources to find out whether Darwin could tell different chips of the same family from each other at all (i.e. 7400 from 7410 and 745x from 744x), or like just taking his PowerBook apart and read the serial number from the chip?
I just fail to understand why Apple would not use the low-power version here...
Bye,
RazzFazz
<strong>
Hmm, anyone feel loke digging into the darwin sources to find out whether Darwin could tell different chips of the same family from each other at all (i.e. 7400 from 7410 and 745x from 744x), or like just taking his PowerBook apart and read the serial number from the chip?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
From Darwin, System/xnu/osfmk/mach/machine.h :
[quote]
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_ALL\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 0)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_601\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 1)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_602\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 2)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_603\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 3)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_603e\t((cpu_subtype_t) 4)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_603ev\t((cpu_subtype_t) 5)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_604\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 6)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_604e\t((cpu_subtype_t) 7)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_620\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 8)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_750\t\t((cpu_subtype_t) 9)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_7400\t((cpu_subtype_t) 10)
#define CPU_SUBTYPE_POWERPC_7450\t((cpu_subtype_t) 11)
<hr></blockquote>
Specifically, there's no constant defined for either the 7410, 744x.
While this of course doesn't rule out the possibility that Darwin can tell one series from another nonetheless (dunno if the PPC ISA has something like the x86's "cpuid" instruction), it might also mean that any 7450-class processor (i.e. 744x and 745x) will be shown as "PowerPC 7450".
Bye,
RazzFazz