Sensational lawsuit accuses Apple of turning iPhone 3G into "iBrick"

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Comments

  • Reply 121 of 176
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Eriamjh View Post


    Shame on apple. This is embarrassing. They should have done better.



    There is no excuse for the 4.0 sw making the 3G worse.



    Right. We should also sue Apple for not making Snow Leopard compatible with PowerMacs.
  • Reply 122 of 176
    grkinggrking Posts: 533member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I wholeheartedly agree that Apple should allow some downgrade of iOS if a version isn?t working out, but these users could have gotten a phone that worked simply by taking their complaint to someone that could help them. I can?t feel sorry for people that chose to complain on the internet instead of getting Apple to get them a new phone after this happened.



    PS: Doesn?t MS charge for a downgrade option to XP from Windows 7? Imagine if Apple charged for that option.



    The problem is there is no one to help them, and Apple was not going to give out new phones. I went to 2 Apple stores after I upgraded to iOS 4. Both stores told me that there was no way to revert back to iOS 3, and I should buy a new phone. Never mind that I was not yet due for an upgrade, and a new phone would have cost me $400.



    I think the suit is BS, but the situation, along with others (e.g., logic boards in the new Airs), tells me that Apple is having some QC issues as they have grown.



    When Apple said that iOS 4 would run on the 3G, with certain features excluded, the clear implication of the statement is that Apple tested the software, and that there would be no significant performance deficits, which was not the case for a large number of users.
  • Reply 123 of 176
    grkinggrking Posts: 533member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post


    Right. We should also sue Apple for not making Snow Leopard compatible with PowerMacs.



    No, but Apple should not have allowed the upgrade.
  • Reply 124 of 176
    ruel24ruel24 Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ChiA View Post


    for the record this is the link to the iPhone software licence:

    http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf



    Section 7 is the disclaimer of warranties, which states you use the software "at your own risk" which I understand is the case for most consumer software including OS X and Windows.



    It's intriguing that the same section in the iPhone 4 licence states makes the same statements but also acknowledges the disclaimers may not be valid in certain regions and countries.



    http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone4.pdf



    You can make a disclaimer or put into your EULA about anything, but it doesn't mean it'll hold up in a court of law. Just because you put up a sign that says you're not responsible, doesn't mean you're not responsible.
  • Reply 125 of 176
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,076member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MuncyWeb View Post


    In the old days, we bought a product, hoped it worked well and recommended it (or not) to all our friends or family. A company's success was based upon just that.



    Today, we sue the livin' crap out of anything that doesn't make us happy.





    It takes two to tango. Lawyers actually think this crap up and then place ads in newspapers and the like to troll people in. You see it all the time on TV and elsewhere concerning drugs, asbestos, baby cribs, etc. The lawyers don't have to actually win the lawsuit to make money. Most companies find it easier and cheaper to pay the lawyers off than fight the lawsuit. For a company like Apple it becomes a matter of the easiest, cheapest route to make it go away.



    We'll never about this lawsuit again until, a year or two from now, a settlement is announced with both parties agreeing to non-disclosure of the terms. And that's the facts, Jack.
  • Reply 126 of 176
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Steve-J View Post


    From the story:



    "Wofford contends that Apple disallowed the downgrading of the iPhone 3G from iOS 4 back to iOS 3.x "



    I think Apple was upgrading the firmware to prevent jailbreaking. Once the firmware was upgraded, there was no roll back possible.
  • Reply 127 of 176
    Classy.
  • Reply 128 of 176
    paul94544paul94544 Posts: 1,027member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by grking View Post


    No, but Apple should not have allowed the upgrade.



    so the next iPhone comes out with an new iOS5



    and Apple claims it works great with the iPhone4 ! oh yeah



    will you believe them and all you friends are laughing at you cos you haven't upgraded



    ah yes peer pressure . luv it



    The Matrix has you Neo
  • Reply 129 of 176
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FurbiesAndBeans View Post


    For those saying "its a 2 year old device get over it", does that mean that the 3-year Apple Care I bought is useless after 2 years?



    No, but the two year AppleCare purchasable with an iPhone 3G would be.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Eriamjh View Post


    Shame on apple. This is embarrassing. They should have done better.



    There is no excuse for the 4.0 sw making the 3G worse.



    You haven't even read the article, much less the rest of this thread.
  • Reply 130 of 176
    paul94544paul94544 Posts: 1,027member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I think Apple was upgrading the firmware to prevent jailbreaking. Once the firmware was upgraded, there was no roll back possible.



    and tell em what I really think if I can't go back
  • Reply 131 of 176
    ifailifail Posts: 463member
    iOS 4.1 still doesnt run exactly fantastic on the 3G but its miles better than 4.0. I think if anything this lawsuit should bring is an option to simply roll back on your firmware without it being a pain in the ass (to revert back to 3.1 you had to use all different kinds of tools since it couldnt be done via iTunes).
  • Reply 132 of 176
    chiachia Posts: 698member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Captain J View Post


    Is Apple obligated to provide new OS's for older devices (or indeed any devices), of course not. They could have released iOS 4 for only the iPhone 4.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    Apple should have only let 3GS user uppgrade, then this lawsuit wouldn't be needed



    Actually, Apple was obligated to offer the next major iOS as an upgrade. Look at the final paragraph in Section 1, General, of the iPhone licence.



    It's notable there's no obligation for providing an update to the next major iOS in the iPhone 4 licence.



    Wow, I've made a 100 already!
  • Reply 133 of 176
    ruel24ruel24 Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ChiA View Post


    You may not have said Apple is required to provide software upgrades but you strongly imply it and other manufacturers should provide them.



    Not for 5 years I didn't. I said that, in my opinion Apple, and others, should be required to provide support, meaning not obsolete the product, for a minimum of 3 years from the initial release of the product, and I gave the reasons why in the other posts made. There is a huge difference. By obsolescence, I'm saying that they should not post an OS upgrade that renders it useless. Putting out iOS 4 guarantees that in a certain amount of time, the majority of apps on the App Store will require iOS 4. If you bought a 3G last year, you should still be able to have the latest OS and get apps for it.



    Now, I also said that Android is in the same boat. They are still selling Android devices that have Android 1.6 on the market. It's impossible to even get apps for it. This is ridiculous. It should be held to the same standard.



    Again, from the initial release of a smartphone, there should be a minimum of 3 years support, meaning able to keep current on software and OS updates. This will allow a phone to be useful the entire life of a 2 year contract, even if it was bought the day before they released a newer product. It's not right that people who purchase the old product right before a new one is released to replace it, should be left out in the cold so fast. They paid just as much money as those that bought the newer one.



    Now, of course, that doesn't mean it needs to have all the features. Obviously, newer phones have faster processors, new features put on them, etc. That's different. However, you shouldn't be in a situation where one week before they released iPhone 4, you bought a 3G, which was still available, with the promise that iOS 4 would work with the phone, only to find out it doesn't really work well at all.



    I'm not making any claims that Apple has or has not done wrong here. I'm simply stating my stance on the subject, in general. It's for the courts to decide, and not for the public to decide without any facts or evidence presented to them. That's what courts are for.
  • Reply 134 of 176
    grkinggrking Posts: 533member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    so the next iPhone comes out with an new iOS5



    and Apple claims it works great with the iPhone4 ! oh yeah



    will you believe them and all you friends are laughing at you cos you haven't upgraded



    ah yes peer pressure . luv it



    The Matrix has you Neo



    No I will not believe them.



    I am way too old for "peer pressure" to be any sort of factor.
  • Reply 135 of 176
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    and tell em what I really think if I can't go back



    Bring someone along to take pictures of security escorting you out of the mall. ^_^
  • Reply 136 of 176
    matrix07matrix07 Posts: 1,993member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Steve-J View Post


    It is not true.



    And even if it were, saying that "everybody else was doing it!" is seldom a defense beyond grammar school.



    Eh? I think you have comprehension problem. It's not to say "everybody was doing it" it counter the claim that "Apple disallowed the downgrading of the iPhone 3G from iOS 4 back to iOS 3.x "
  • Reply 137 of 176
    rob55rob55 Posts: 1,255member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    The reason why I bought Apple computers , ipod's and iPhone the last 10 years is preciseley to avoid having to spend whole weekends rolling back, re-installing and generally fiddling with software and hardware. The last thing I want to do is waste my valuable time at the weekend tweaking a damed phoned! GET IT



    It certainly wouldn't take an entire weekend to roll back an iPhone 3G to 3.1.3. You got all your apps, music, videos, etc. in iTunes. Your pics are in iPhoto and your contacts in your address book. When I did mine, it took 2 hours max and everything was back where it was supposed to be.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    I tried rolling back to OS 3.1 and it would NOT let me ! Of course if I really wanted to I could go an waste an entire weekend finding how to do it and do it. BUT THAT IS NOT THE POINT. hey I used to install Windows 2000 server on PC's years ago. I'm SO glad I no longer have to put up with buggy MS installs! But thats beside the point.



    See above. You want a link? I posted one on page 2 in this thread.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    Were you formerly a PC geek and used to this kind of procedure?



    What about all the HYPE



    It just works.. that Apple so prouldy trumpets



    Yes, but rolling back my iPhone was a lot easier than trying to work my way through some stupid PC problem. As for the hype about Apple stuff "just working", most of the time it does. To expect it to be perfect 100% of the time is unreasonable.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul94544 View Post


    its 2 years old , and worked fine and fast until this crappy iOS4

    One thing I'm definately considering is getting a Droid 2 . it has HDMI and I can skype over 3G with it and there are other things too. I don't really wnat to go to Android if I can avoid it, but as far as I can tell its not going to be that great a switch and I have far more control over it's interface than with Apple's iPhone and if this experience is going to keep happening I'm losing nothing.



    This espisode has caused me to question getting an iPhone4 because I feel that Apple cannot be trusted any more



    Hey, you gotta do what you gotta do. No one is putting a gun to your head forcing you to buy another iPhone.
  • Reply 138 of 176
    chiachia Posts: 698member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ruel24 View Post


    You can make a disclaimer or put into your EULA about anything, but it doesn't mean it'll hold up in a court of law. Just because you put up a sign that says you're not responsible, doesn't mean you're not responsible.



    Well, that all depends on context and juristriction, the Appleinsider has a global reach, I'm sitting in the United Kingdom, even within this one country we have three different juidicial systems: England and Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland.



    I presume you're in the US where you have at least fifty one different systems - state laws plus the federal laws.



    EULA are a contractual obligation between the person who uses the software and the licensor of that software. A court can examine whether each party meets its contractual obligations and whether terms within that contract are unfair or illegal. I believe Psystar where the most recent challengers of Apple's EULA.



    As for responsibility, if you've committed a criminal act then nothing you say or display changes that reality; this lawsuit is a civil and not criminal matter, the issue is whether Apple was responsible for causing damages to the plaintiff which could have been reasonably and foreseeably avoided.
  • Reply 139 of 176
    rob55rob55 Posts: 1,255member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Steve-J View Post


    From the story:



    "Wofford contends that Apple disallowed the downgrading of the iPhone 3G from iOS 4 back to iOS 3.x "



    See my post here.
  • Reply 140 of 176
    chronsterchronster Posts: 1,894member
    this is the scrutiny you get when you tout yourself as #1
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