The amount of books they give out in Australian high schools is ridiculous.
They can't all fit in the locker, so have to be lugged home then to school next day. Which genius decided this ?
When I was at high school we hardly had any books.
I am all for the iPad, yes, there is an issue with looking at the screen for long durations, I don't have an answer for this.
Invest in one of those rolling backpacks.
Regarding staring at bright lcd screens-I agree with you. I just bought a ipod touch and started reading on it. It hurt my eyes. I so much prefer my old Palm PDA.
How do you know that carrying some books around as an adolescent will cause life-long back problems?
Again, have you ever heard of backbacks with wheels? Besides, how many kids still lug their books home while walking. Parents need to keep an eye on their kids and pick them up in a car.
This has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. So, your state as well as many other states is in a financial crisis and you want to spend crazy amounts of money to give all the middle schoolers iPads.
...
So I am to take it that you have never actually purchased a paper textbook. Well, they are expensive. There is also an entire physical infrastructure required to support paper textbooks after the sale. This includes transport, warehousing, and distribution. Textbooks must be replaced because their context must be updated. However, many current textbooks must also be replaced because they are physically worn-out.
The point is that textbooks have many costs associated with them that the iPad does not have. What is more, I believe that it is safe to say that many people see the iPad as a replacement for not only the pack-load of textbooks that each child must carry but also the laptop and even the desktop computers that many school systems provide.
Several posters before this have pointed out a significant issue that the iPad will [hopefully] address. That is the hijacking of the curriculum by the Forces of Ignorance. Teaching the religious beliefs of certain sects in science classes is one thing. Wanting to teach more than the official story about certain national tragedies is another thing. However, the Forces of Ignorance have now voted to change history that has heretofore not been controversial. Specifically, the Forces in the State of Texas have recently voted to remove the word slave from American history textbooks.
Backwards politicians in a single state should not have the power to dictate the curricula for the rest of the Union. This is what we have today. With the iPad, I don't see how this system can long stand.
I think you are confusing Intelligent Design with Hebrew/Christian accounts in their writings found in the bible, with the actual creation of the universe by an entity that is currently unknown.
Then replace 'God' in my post with 'unknown entity'. It doesn't change the fact that the concept that the world was created in its current form a few thousand years ago (which is being pushed by the ID people) is inconsistent with reality.
Book publishers will always price their products to maximize their profits. While an iPad with multiple books is easy to carry and access, I do not think it will save any money. I fail to understand why school districts continue to buy new history and math books every year. This just hands out money to the publishers at taxpayer expense. Has pre-1970 history or math changed that much that the schools need NEW books every year? Why not republish an 'OLD' history book and use a newer post-1970 smaller update? The article states paper books last 7 years. I just cannot believe how inefficiently schools are operated.
Another problem. Kids will get robbed of their iPads. This endangers the kids. When was the last time a kid was robbed for that science textbook?
I have a PhD in science. I understand how to observe the world and reach conclusions.
There are two possibilities:
1. Intelligent design is wrong
2. Intelligent design is right. However, for that to be true, God would have had to have created the world:
- with exactly the right fraction of radioactive isotopes decayed in exactly the percentage to look like the universe is 10 billion years old
- created distant quasars and galaxies - with photons already on there way here looking like they were billions of light years away
- intentionally distorted the photons to look like the galaxies are moving away from us at high speed
- created all the different species with DNA that is so much alike - and with all the different species falling onto a tree where each branch shares most of its DNA with the branch below it
- created a fossil record of dinosaurs and other animals that never could have existed (according to Genesis, the written record is almost equal to the amount of time that Man has been on earth - and there has never, ever been a record of anyone seeing a dinosaur)
- and literally millions of other data points where God must have created the world to look like evolution exists and the planetary systems developed over billions of years
That leads to one of the following conclusions:
1. There is no God
2. There is a God, but the biblical stories are not historically accurate in any way
3. God exists and created the world in 7 days as in the bible - BUT HE INTENTIONALLY SET OUT TO TRICK US. This requires a God who gives us human intelligence - but wants to punish us for using it. But that's counter to everything in the bible about God loving us
Your option just doesn't make any sense to anyone with even a shred of rationality. The scientific facts are readily observable to anyone who cares to take the time to learn something. You can't simply wave your hand and say 'science is wrong' - which is what 'Intelligent Design' attempts to do.
I like it, jragosta....I have a daughter (5'11'' All American Volley Ball) with a degree in Molecular Biology in her 3rd year of Med school! (Got her mother's brains!)
My proof there is no God, is simply, every religion looks at women as "second class citizens!" In the Bible, Koran women are described as inferior.
My daughter is not inferior! But supposedly the word of God says she is.
That is the proof it is not the word of God but of old men trying to get everyone else to do what they want them to do!
I think it's a great idea. Less paper will be used. Less books need to be carry in their backpacks. Most books are being published online anyways for easy access. Books are being made every year for kids, and they do get damaged or lost. As for ipads, I'm pretty sure they'll have an application that will locate any iPads, similar to the iPhone application, Find my iPhone. However, iPads are very expensive.
I think it's a great idea. Less paper will be used. Less books need to be carry in their backpacks. Most books are being published online anyways for easy access. Books are being made every year for kids, and they do get damaged or lost. As for ipads, I'm pretty sure they'll have an application that will locate any iPads, similar to the iPhone application, Find my iPhone. However, iPads are very expensive.
I agree Maly. Everything you said is true and I wold like to add....they will be used in colleges and in the work place. Get the kids using them now. Maybe some of them will design the next "killer app" in the near future!
Also along with the trees used in the making of books is the amount water needed for bleaching not to mention the toxic inks used. All this adds to pollution. Shipping, gas and oil, etc.
Apple technology is completely vertical: schools would get the technology stack from a single vendor who has a long history of selling to the educational markets. With Android, you don't even have a single OS (if Google's going to count those incompatible Chinese forks as "Android"): it's fragmented by different companies. And these companies aren't interested in the education market: most are mobile handset makers who are scrambling to compete with Apple when the iPhone turned the smartphone market upside down. I mean, when was the last time Samsung's or Motorola's mobile divisions went after schools?
This was true until Apple discontinued the XServe. I am hopeful they have some other plan beyond running OS X Server on Mac Minis or Mac Pros.
Then replace 'God' in my post with 'unknown entity'. It doesn't change the fact that the concept that the world was created in its current form a few thousand years ago (which is being pushed by the ID people) is inconsistent with reality.
I'm not taking a position for or against ID people, more so against the equally argumentative atheists. You cannot disprove the existence of god any more than they can prove the existence of god. The one thing I think we can agree on is that the bible should not be part of science class, but I don't think the possibly false assumption that there is no creator should be taught in science either.
Get the kids using them now. Maybe some of them will design the next "killer app" in the near future!
Exactly. Technologies like iPads make learning fun for kids and get them to embrace technology. My kids will do just about anything if they can do it on the iPad. By exposing them to the technology they aren't afraid of it.
My local school district has been deploying iPad's in limited quantities for use in the classroom side by side with interactive whiteboard technology from Hitachi http://www.hitachi-soft.com/starboard/ . Unfortunately they don't really work that well together and could be seen as competing technologies. I found a good summary of the competition here http://techinmusiced.wordpress.com/2...-smart-boards/
Now that Airvideo is coming to 3rd party developers. Can you imagine a teacher with an ipad running education applications wirelessly connected to an AppleTV hooked up to a projector? Imagine if these applications used the wifi network to allow for interaction with kids using ipod touches or ipads? Imagine all the cool stuff they could do using iTunes U. These technological improvements are so amazing in my opinion.
Exactly. Technologies like iPads make learning fun for kids and get them to embrace technology. My kids will do just about anything if they can do it on the iPad. By exposing them to the technology they aren't afraid of it.
My local school district has been deploying iPad's in limited quantities for use in the classroom side by side with interactive whiteboard technology from Hitachi http://www.hitachi-soft.com/starboard/ . Unfortunately they don't really work that well together and could be seen as competing technologies. I found a good summary of the competition here http://techinmusiced.wordpress.com/2...-smart-boards/
Now that Airvideo is coming to 3rd party developers. Can you imagine a teacher with an ipad running education applications wirelessly connected to an AppleTV hooked up to a projector? Imagine if these applications used the wifi network to allow for interaction with kids using ipod touches or ipads? Imagine all the cool stuff they could do using iTunes U. These technological improvements are so amazing in my opinion.
Interesting you mentioned the smart boards, veblen...my GF is a teacher at the middle school and, of course, is used to our macs at home. The school has the smart boards and windows PC's. The PC's she "detests" (and no that is not too strong a word). She finds them extremely frustrating when working with the students for freezes, restarting, losing work, start over, etc., etc.
The smart boards she is relatively impressed with but still they seem to have clumsy interfaces when compared to the macs. Not sure what brand they are...she does see the advantage of having them. Also, she noted there is different levels of proficiency on part of the teachers from being able to use them close to the smart boards potential to some teachers barely able to use them.
Certainly, accessing the internet, video, current events, etc., has a lot of advantages, but again she says for seemingly simple tasks one has to "drill-down" the menu options too much. Having Apple in the classroom can only be positive. Again, look at the college students and they sure do carry a lot of Apple laptops!
Anyway, enjoyed your comments and thanks for the links!
PS. I watch some of the lectures from MIT and they are fascinating on a wide range of topics!
Ok guys and girls enjoyed the conversation...going over to a friend's house for a Super Bowl party.
He just got a new big flat screen TV. He said the picture is so good it will be like Ben Rothlesberger is actually in your living room....groping your sister! Great
Interesting you mentioned the smart boards, veblen...my GF is a teacher at the middle school and, of course, is used to our macs at home. The school has the smart boards and windows PC's. The PC's she "detests" (and no that is not too strong a word). She finds them extremely frustrating when working with the students for freezes, restarting, losing work, start over, etc., etc.
The smart boards she is relatively impressed with but still they seem to have clumsy interfaces when compared to the macs. Not sure what brand they are...she does see the advantage of having them. Also, she noted there is different levels of proficiency on part of the teachers from being able to use them close to the smart boards potential to some teachers barely able to use them.
Certainly, accessing the internet, video, current events, etc., has a lot of advantages, but again she says for seemingly simple tasks one has to "drill-down" the menu options too much. Having Apple in the classroom can only be positive. Again, look at the college students and they sure do carry a lot of Apple laptops!
Anyway, enjoyed your comments!
PS. I watch some of the lectures from MIT and they are fascinating on a wide range of topics!
My wife has been working the last few years to raise funding for our school district's smart board initiative. They are planning on a significant amount of the cost involved in deploying the technology being training for the teachers because some of the interaction with the device is counter intuitive. I relayed your girlfriend's experience to her. As of now the boards have only been deployed to a few tech savvy teachers who want to push the bounds and are willing to overlook any difficulties so it hasn't been much of an issue. These ipad's could be a real viable alternative because of how intuitive the interface is. Especially with the explosion of educational software for the device. I'm kind of geek'd about this now as she said she's going to talk to the district about using the iPad's they have a bit differently. Currently they just lock them down install a few applications on them then give them to the kids to interact with under their supervision. Using iPads to drive content for instruction is a new possibility for them to explore.
I think this ridiculous iPad fetish is really going too far now. Come on people, it's not some god-like device that's good for everything! It's more prone to breaking than a normal laptop, less usable because of the lack of a keyboard and a decent-sized screen, the screen is lit so it's not nice to read books from, and it will cause a lot of wrist- and other pains for many children because of the bad ergenomics. Please think a bit further before you give children these toys for learning.
Again, have you ever heard of backbacks with wheels? Besides, how many kids still lug their books home while walking. Parents need to keep an eye on their kids and pick them up in a car.
Many kids can take the bike to school. And there are backpacks with wheels! I got one once as a gift from the university where I worked.
Not all content is equal and not all speech is protected. Your second example in particular is "hate speech" which has been illegal in most western countries (outside of the USA of course) for about 20 years now. Most countries consider that free speech rights end, where incitement to hatred begins.
The Manhattan Declaration is hardly hate speech. I'm certainly not endorsing its content (I'm a liberal gay atheist), but it does not advocate violence or demonize a group of people. Apple is within their rights not to sell it, but this form of political censorship should concern folks.
Comments
No, those poor children's backs.
The amount of books they give out in Australian high schools is ridiculous.
They can't all fit in the locker, so have to be lugged home then to school next day. Which genius decided this ?
When I was at high school we hardly had any books.
I am all for the iPad, yes, there is an issue with looking at the screen for long durations, I don't have an answer for this.
Invest in one of those rolling backpacks.
Regarding staring at bright lcd screens-I agree with you. I just bought a ipod touch and started reading on it. It hurt my eyes. I so much prefer my old Palm PDA.
How do you go about deploying iPads into the school system across thousands (or even millions) of students?
How do you handle new app installations, app updates, security patches, iOS updates etc?
How do you lock them down, prevent app installation, app deletion, changes to settings, and make them less attractive to steal?
Many of these kinds of criticisms were only relevant before IOS 4.2.
http://www.apple.com/ipad/business/software-update/
IOS 4.2 already supports centralized profiles to lock down the device.
http://developer.apple.com/library/i...roduction.html
You can create them using this utility.
http://developer.apple.com/library/i...roduction.html
You can house your own personal App Store to distribute your own applications within your organization.
http://developer.apple.com/library/i...roduction.html
How do you know that carrying some books around as an adolescent will cause life-long back problems?
Again, have you ever heard of backbacks with wheels? Besides, how many kids still lug their books home while walking. Parents need to keep an eye on their kids and pick them up in a car.
This has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. So, your state as well as many other states is in a financial crisis and you want to spend crazy amounts of money to give all the middle schoolers iPads.
...
So I am to take it that you have never actually purchased a paper textbook. Well, they are expensive. There is also an entire physical infrastructure required to support paper textbooks after the sale. This includes transport, warehousing, and distribution. Textbooks must be replaced because their context must be updated. However, many current textbooks must also be replaced because they are physically worn-out.
The point is that textbooks have many costs associated with them that the iPad does not have. What is more, I believe that it is safe to say that many people see the iPad as a replacement for not only the pack-load of textbooks that each child must carry but also the laptop and even the desktop computers that many school systems provide.
Several posters before this have pointed out a significant issue that the iPad will [hopefully] address. That is the hijacking of the curriculum by the Forces of Ignorance. Teaching the religious beliefs of certain sects in science classes is one thing. Wanting to teach more than the official story about certain national tragedies is another thing. However, the Forces of Ignorance have now voted to change history that has heretofore not been controversial. Specifically, the Forces in the State of Texas have recently voted to remove the word slave from American history textbooks.
Backwards politicians in a single state should not have the power to dictate the curricula for the rest of the Union. This is what we have today. With the iPad, I don't see how this system can long stand.
I think you are confusing Intelligent Design with Hebrew/Christian accounts in their writings found in the bible, with the actual creation of the universe by an entity that is currently unknown.
Then replace 'God' in my post with 'unknown entity'. It doesn't change the fact that the concept that the world was created in its current form a few thousand years ago (which is being pushed by the ID people) is inconsistent with reality.
Another problem. Kids will get robbed of their iPads. This endangers the kids. When was the last time a kid was robbed for that science textbook?
Sorry, but you're just plain wrong.
I have a PhD in science. I understand how to observe the world and reach conclusions.
There are two possibilities:
1. Intelligent design is wrong
2. Intelligent design is right. However, for that to be true, God would have had to have created the world:
- with exactly the right fraction of radioactive isotopes decayed in exactly the percentage to look like the universe is 10 billion years old
- created distant quasars and galaxies - with photons already on there way here looking like they were billions of light years away
- intentionally distorted the photons to look like the galaxies are moving away from us at high speed
- created all the different species with DNA that is so much alike - and with all the different species falling onto a tree where each branch shares most of its DNA with the branch below it
- created a fossil record of dinosaurs and other animals that never could have existed (according to Genesis, the written record is almost equal to the amount of time that Man has been on earth - and there has never, ever been a record of anyone seeing a dinosaur)
- and literally millions of other data points where God must have created the world to look like evolution exists and the planetary systems developed over billions of years
That leads to one of the following conclusions:
1. There is no God
2. There is a God, but the biblical stories are not historically accurate in any way
3. God exists and created the world in 7 days as in the bible - BUT HE INTENTIONALLY SET OUT TO TRICK US. This requires a God who gives us human intelligence - but wants to punish us for using it. But that's counter to everything in the bible about God loving us
Your option just doesn't make any sense to anyone with even a shred of rationality. The scientific facts are readily observable to anyone who cares to take the time to learn something. You can't simply wave your hand and say 'science is wrong' - which is what 'Intelligent Design' attempts to do.
I like it, jragosta....I have a daughter (5'11'' All American Volley Ball) with a degree in Molecular Biology in her 3rd year of Med school! (Got her mother's brains!)
My proof there is no God, is simply, every religion looks at women as "second class citizens!" In the Bible, Koran women are described as inferior.
My daughter is not inferior! But supposedly the word of God says she is.
That is the proof it is not the word of God but of old men trying to get everyone else to do what they want them to do!
Best
I think it's a great idea. Less paper will be used. Less books need to be carry in their backpacks. Most books are being published online anyways for easy access. Books are being made every year for kids, and they do get damaged or lost. As for ipads, I'm pretty sure they'll have an application that will locate any iPads, similar to the iPhone application, Find my iPhone. However, iPads are very expensive.
I agree Maly. Everything you said is true and I wold like to add....they will be used in colleges and in the work place. Get the kids using them now. Maybe some of them will design the next "killer app" in the near future!
Also along with the trees used in the making of books is the amount water needed for bleaching not to mention the toxic inks used. All this adds to pollution. Shipping, gas and oil, etc.
Best
Apple technology is completely vertical: schools would get the technology stack from a single vendor who has a long history of selling to the educational markets. With Android, you don't even have a single OS (if Google's going to count those incompatible Chinese forks as "Android"): it's fragmented by different companies. And these companies aren't interested in the education market: most are mobile handset makers who are scrambling to compete with Apple when the iPhone turned the smartphone market upside down. I mean, when was the last time Samsung's or Motorola's mobile divisions went after schools?
This was true until Apple discontinued the XServe. I am hopeful they have some other plan beyond running OS X Server on Mac Minis or Mac Pros.
Then replace 'God' in my post with 'unknown entity'. It doesn't change the fact that the concept that the world was created in its current form a few thousand years ago (which is being pushed by the ID people) is inconsistent with reality.
I'm not taking a position for or against ID people, more so against the equally argumentative atheists. You cannot disprove the existence of god any more than they can prove the existence of god. The one thing I think we can agree on is that the bible should not be part of science class, but I don't think the possibly false assumption that there is no creator should be taught in science either.
Get the kids using them now. Maybe some of them will design the next "killer app" in the near future!
Exactly. Technologies like iPads make learning fun for kids and get them to embrace technology. My kids will do just about anything if they can do it on the iPad. By exposing them to the technology they aren't afraid of it.
My local school district has been deploying iPad's in limited quantities for use in the classroom side by side with interactive whiteboard technology from Hitachi http://www.hitachi-soft.com/starboard/ . Unfortunately they don't really work that well together and could be seen as competing technologies. I found a good summary of the competition here http://techinmusiced.wordpress.com/2...-smart-boards/
Now that Airvideo is coming to 3rd party developers. Can you imagine a teacher with an ipad running education applications wirelessly connected to an AppleTV hooked up to a projector? Imagine if these applications used the wifi network to allow for interaction with kids using ipod touches or ipads? Imagine all the cool stuff they could do using iTunes U. These technological improvements are so amazing in my opinion.
Exactly. Technologies like iPads make learning fun for kids and get them to embrace technology. My kids will do just about anything if they can do it on the iPad. By exposing them to the technology they aren't afraid of it.
My local school district has been deploying iPad's in limited quantities for use in the classroom side by side with interactive whiteboard technology from Hitachi http://www.hitachi-soft.com/starboard/ . Unfortunately they don't really work that well together and could be seen as competing technologies. I found a good summary of the competition here http://techinmusiced.wordpress.com/2...-smart-boards/
Now that Airvideo is coming to 3rd party developers. Can you imagine a teacher with an ipad running education applications wirelessly connected to an AppleTV hooked up to a projector? Imagine if these applications used the wifi network to allow for interaction with kids using ipod touches or ipads? Imagine all the cool stuff they could do using iTunes U. These technological improvements are so amazing in my opinion.
Interesting you mentioned the smart boards, veblen...my GF is a teacher at the middle school and, of course, is used to our macs at home. The school has the smart boards and windows PC's. The PC's she "detests" (and no that is not too strong a word). She finds them extremely frustrating when working with the students for freezes, restarting, losing work, start over, etc., etc.
The smart boards she is relatively impressed with but still they seem to have clumsy interfaces when compared to the macs. Not sure what brand they are...she does see the advantage of having them. Also, she noted there is different levels of proficiency on part of the teachers from being able to use them close to the smart boards potential to some teachers barely able to use them.
Certainly, accessing the internet, video, current events, etc., has a lot of advantages, but again she says for seemingly simple tasks one has to "drill-down" the menu options too much. Having Apple in the classroom can only be positive. Again, look at the college students and they sure do carry a lot of Apple laptops!
Anyway, enjoyed your comments and thanks for the links!
PS. I watch some of the lectures from MIT and they are fascinating on a wide range of topics!
He just got a new big flat screen TV. He said the picture is so good it will be like Ben Rothlesberger is actually in your living room....groping your sister! Great
Best
Chris
Interesting you mentioned the smart boards, veblen...my GF is a teacher at the middle school and, of course, is used to our macs at home. The school has the smart boards and windows PC's. The PC's she "detests" (and no that is not too strong a word). She finds them extremely frustrating when working with the students for freezes, restarting, losing work, start over, etc., etc.
The smart boards she is relatively impressed with but still they seem to have clumsy interfaces when compared to the macs. Not sure what brand they are...she does see the advantage of having them. Also, she noted there is different levels of proficiency on part of the teachers from being able to use them close to the smart boards potential to some teachers barely able to use them.
Certainly, accessing the internet, video, current events, etc., has a lot of advantages, but again she says for seemingly simple tasks one has to "drill-down" the menu options too much. Having Apple in the classroom can only be positive. Again, look at the college students and they sure do carry a lot of Apple laptops!
Anyway, enjoyed your comments!
PS. I watch some of the lectures from MIT and they are fascinating on a wide range of topics!
My wife has been working the last few years to raise funding for our school district's smart board initiative. They are planning on a significant amount of the cost involved in deploying the technology being training for the teachers because some of the interaction with the device is counter intuitive. I relayed your girlfriend's experience to her. As of now the boards have only been deployed to a few tech savvy teachers who want to push the bounds and are willing to overlook any difficulties so it hasn't been much of an issue. These ipad's could be a real viable alternative because of how intuitive the interface is. Especially with the explosion of educational software for the device. I'm kind of geek'd about this now as she said she's going to talk to the district about using the iPad's they have a bit differently. Currently they just lock them down install a few applications on them then give them to the kids to interact with under their supervision. Using iPads to drive content for instruction is a new possibility for them to explore.
Again, have you ever heard of backbacks with wheels? Besides, how many kids still lug their books home while walking. Parents need to keep an eye on their kids and pick them up in a car.
Many kids can take the bike to school. And there are backpacks with wheels! I got one once as a gift from the university where I worked.
Not all content is equal and not all speech is protected. Your second example in particular is "hate speech" which has been illegal in most western countries (outside of the USA of course) for about 20 years now. Most countries consider that free speech rights end, where incitement to hatred begins.
The Manhattan Declaration is hardly hate speech. I'm certainly not endorsing its content (I'm a liberal gay atheist), but it does not advocate violence or demonize a group of people. Apple is within their rights not to sell it, but this form of political censorship should concern folks.
Ae you a child?
No I'm a programmer,