Nokia ditches Symbian, embraces Microsoft Windows Phone for new handsets



  • Reply 261 of 266
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,390member
    Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

    You said "Intel entered into MeeGo knowing that all the previous Maemo devices, and a tonne of other Nokia phones ran ARM, they weren't going to get their chips on the phones..."

    I called you on and so did Mel. That they don't currently have a chip suitable for smart phones is another issue. They had every intention of selling Atom chips to Nokia for cell phones that would run MeeGo.

    Yes I did say that, I didn't deny that. Intel can have every intention they want to sell a cellphone based processor, they have to be able to make them first.
  • Reply 262 of 266
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,390member
    Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

    I would have them misled too, by clever use of all those tables and charts I keep including.


    You only included the image after I pointed out your original mistake.
  • Reply 263 of 266
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post

    ...unless they ... dump the UI for Windows 8...the two OS's are way too disparate.

    The rumours are certainly point to two separate UI's for Windows 8.

    The idea of multiple Windows flavours that support tablet only UIs or dockable dual UIs is just me putting together a bunch of information, applying a bit of logic and a bit of guesswork.

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post

    So they don't want to dump anything from the OS when on a tablet.

    I think they would certainly want the ability to support that option, yes.

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post

    If they dump much from Windows, the way Apple did for iOS, and somehow make available the WP7 apps, then they will have a plan.

    They have already started on that path in a way. Windows on ARM break all non-DotNet legacy software. Combine that with the dual interface rumour and you have something along the lines of an iPad competitor.

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post

    I call it the uOS; Universal Operating System.

    It's interesting to see you and Carniphage, both avid Apple uses, have two totally different and conflicting idea on the direction of tablets! I find that is the case in day to day conversations as well.

    Microsoft I think will try to cover all their bases and I've convinced myself (no information at all, just a gut feeling) that Google will make all Android phones dual UI dockable with Chrome OS.

    I'm honestly not sure which direction Apple will go.
  • Reply 264 of 266
    Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

    It's interesting to see you and Carniphage, both avid Apple uses, have two totally different and conflicting idea on the direction of tablets! I find that is the case in day to day conversations as well.

    It's clear that Apple will take ideas from iOS and move them into the desktop. That's a given.

    But the notion that the two operating systems should be converged in some way seems counter productive.

    What would be the benefit of converging the two into a single API? Who would it benefit? Users or Programmers?

    As a programmer, it's not hard to take Cocoa written for an app on iOS and port it to Cocoa on Mac OS X. It just requires entirely re-thinking the interface and the performance issues. The actual code is very similar. They share a lot of DNA.

    But having the exact same code run on both platforms would simply increase the likelihood that the app wasn't very well designed for the platform it was running on.

    Nokia invested in a technology called Qt. The idea was that a single app could run on every smartphone (regardless of screen size or input method) as well as tablets, desktops and the mainframe in the USS Enterprise. I don't think it worked out. Engineers love this kind of time-saving, write-once, deploy-many solution. But that type of solution results in apps that suck equally on all platforms.

    I think that Apple have abandoned that type of "engineer think". Instead they assume that the best quality apps are created when the programmer is targeting a specific platform, and knows the platform form-factor, the input method, the likely performance and so on.

    I happen agree with that thinking.

  • Reply 265 of 266
    Originally Posted by nht View Post

    There is nothing particularly weak about winCE from an embedded os perspective. IMHO it probably is better than embedded linux as a starting point. That said, compact .net sucked for a long while and may still be missing big pieces. Haven't done much .net in the last three years.

    You keep stating this as fact. On what basis do you judge WinCE weak?

    Don't think of it as being "weak", think of it as being "weaker" than something like Windows 7.

    Windows 7 is designed to be modular. A lot of components can be added/removed/replaced without any effect on other components. The entire UI can be switched out or removed without breaking the core functionality.

    Windows CE is a totally different code base. I'm sure it still has some level of modularity, but nothing like Windows 7. The result is that components and features are all intermingled and tangled with each other.

    This means you can't have one team working on improving the phone UI whilst another team works on a totally separate tablet UI because they share and rely on too much of the same code.

    Essentially the time required grows exponentially as the OS complexity increases. Windows 7 doesn't have this issue and its time vs complexity is far more linear.

    The real life result is that updates and modifications are slow to arrive, it's expensive to maintain for Microsoft and finding bugs becomes an endless chore.

    When you put all this together along with the benefits of sharing the same code base, the potential for the mobile operating systems to continually get more complex, and that fact that Windows 7 wasn't even designed to be a mobile OS and Windows 8 will be, it's easy to see why it's a better idea for Microsoft to scale down full Windows for mobile rather than scale up Windows CE.

    All that said I think that the WP7 UI and the mobile computing paradigms it introduces would translate fantastically to a tablet.

    I also think the development environment (except the App Store submission process!) Microsoft have built around WP7 is class leading and one of its biggest assets.

    Hopefully the team working on the tablet UX for Windows 8 is taking their cues from the WP7 team.
  • Reply 266 of 266
    iPhone Topic in this forum explains about the iphone products they are selling to the public.

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