bowling for columbine

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  • Reply 21 of 27
    Then why American death rates - caused by guns are much higher in American than in Europe and Japan?



    Because of access to the guns.



    Difficult to get access to guns means low death rate, low volience rate.



    It seems they often hate to each other but all is they need to be more love, more freindly, more care and in the end the rate of deaths cause by volience will be much lower.



    Think Japan.
  • Reply 22 of 27
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,403member
    [quote]Originally posted by Funky:

    <strong>Then why American death rates - caused by guns are much higher in American than in Europe and Japan?



    Because of access to the guns.



    Difficult to get access to guns means low death rate, low volience rate.



    It seems they often hate to each other but all is they need to be more love, more freindly, more care and in the end the rate of deaths cause by volience will be much lower.



    Think Japan.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Bullshiza! America's violence stems from the fact that we're a nation of immigrants who don't always get along. You can also chart a rise in violence in many European nations that follows a rise in immigration. Xenophobia is alive and well. Japan is of course dominated by Japanese but ask a Korean(40+ yrs old) how fond they are of Japanese people and imagine them cohabitating the same country.



    I totally agree that violence higher than what it should be but it's often very much exagerated and skewered.
  • Reply 23 of 27
    xionjaxionja Posts: 504member
    [quote]Originally posted by finboy:

    <strong>



    The question should be "when am I going to thank the self-defenders for making my life safer."



    Because I own a gun, you're less likely to be assaulted, car-jacked, or murdered. Because you live in a state of denial and think that guns are "evil" I end up bearing some of the cost of your safety. By owning a gun, I end up enabling people who live in deep denial about their relative safety in society.



    You're welcome.



    [ 11-24-2002: Message edited by: finboy ]</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Though I might be safer becuase of all the good doing finboys out there owning guns and bearing the cost of my safty, when they breakdown and get mad and have access to their own safty impletmenting guns and go on shooting sprees and kill people, i don't feel so safe. Though people might be of right mind most of the time owning a gun and use it only for selfdefence, people change, and they still have guns.
  • Reply 24 of 27
    "Do you think it's safe to give out guns at a bank?"



    <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> Priceless!
  • Reply 25 of 27
    [quote]Originally posted by iBeni:

    <strong>

    well the question of the film is:

    why are in the US so many people killed by murder ?

    Moore 's answer is not so clear. He says it's the media and the politics who pushes the fear ( of the bad, black guy). So almost everybody has a gun, and use it without hesistate when they come in a conflict they can't handle.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    I don't believe this is his answer. I don't believe he actually stated an answer in the film. He explored a lot of the things, issues, and people that are commonly blamed as being the "problem". He was making a point by doing this...

    [quote]Originally posted by BRussell:

    <strong>

    To me, this sums up the problem. If there had been no guns present, no one would have been shot. They would have had a fight, maybe a bruised face, knuckles, and ego, but no one shot. The widespread presence of guns makes this kind of shooting more likely.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    I disagree. Even in the film, Moore points out that other countries have just as many guns as the United States. If the kid didn't have a gun then, he would find one. Someone once said, "I will find a way or I will make one!" You can't rid the country of guns or weapons manufacturers, and on the street, people will always be able to get a firearm if they really want one. Just like if someone really wants to break into my apartment, they will. The solution isn't in removing all firearms, it is in teaching people that firearms are not the means to a solution.



    Furthermore, and as evidenced in the film, people seem to want to be able to blame a single thing as the problem.



    "Bad Gun laws are the real problem!"

    "No they aren't!"

    "Then what is?"



    The truth is that there isn't a single thing that is the problem, rather, and I think this is the point Moore was trying to drive home, it is a combination of issues that have contributed to the problem as it exists today.



    Example: The other day I was watching a movie in the theater. There was this group of kids in the lower right of the theater, and another group in the upper middle. They wouldn't shut up throughout the whole film. Whenever we got to an important or tense part of the film, they would yell something. This is a *big* pet peeve of mine, especially when they have been asked, repeatedly, to stfu.



    My very first thought, and I said this to Roo was, :'God, these people should be shot. No trial, just shot upon exit of the theater.'



    Would I ever shoot somebody? I hope not. so you could argue that coming from me, that statement doesn't mean much. I'm not the only person that thinks this way though. There are people who do think that way that also carry firearms and are quite willing to use them as evidenced by the story quoted above about the shooting on a basketball court.



    The issue that we are faced with is that of violence. Why is violence one of the first methods that comes to mind when we want to solve a problem like this? I guarantee you in that basketball game, just like the kids that commit school shootings, the shooter was tired of being picked on and got really frustrated... knew he had access to a weapon, and felt it the appropriate way to solve the situation.



    Who do we blame? Well, for starters, we don't blame just one person, thing, or event. Second, we shouldn't get stuck playing this blame game either. There are a lot of reasons why things are the way they are. The media doesn't help, the neighborhoods some of these kids are brough up in don't help. The family life in some of these households aren't helping either. The things some forms of music talk about and promote aren't helping (because yes, it's quite obvious it has played a role in kids being more violent).



    More gun laws aren't going to stop it. Silencing music groups won't stop it. Cleaning up the 11 'o Clock news isn't going to stop it either. Getting rid of the NRA won't either.



    I don't have a good answer as to the solution, and to come full circle, I don't believe that Michael Moore does either. He simply points out a lot of contributing factors to the issue, and debunks some of the more common myths. I think what we can conclude is that Americans think in violent ways, and also believe it is ok to act in violent ways. Not all of us do act, but most of us at least think in violent terms. And that means something; there is something to that. I don't believe it is a Good Thing? that my first instinct to solve the problem of noisy patrons in a movie theater is to shoot them.



    But that solves the prblem quickly, and as long as I don't want to think ahead beyond solving the current problem, that falls in line with the traditional american attitude of "Gotta have it done right now don't need to think ahead just gotta have it now".



    It's too deep in our culture now, like a plague. How do you solve that? It will take time, and that isn't something americans are good with.



    [Last freaking edit...]



    [ 12-01-2002: Message edited by: M3D Jack ]</p>
  • Reply 26 of 27
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    amen.
  • Reply 27 of 27
    funkyfunky Posts: 27member
    [quote]Originally posted by M3D Jack:

    <strong>



    It's too deep in our culture now, like a plague. How do you solve that? It will take time, and that isn't something americans are good with.



    [ 12-01-2002: Message edited by: M3D Jack ]



    [ 12-01-2002: Message edited by: M3D Jack ]</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Oh yes! Rememeber the New York City, during the late 1990s before Sept 11th, the NYC mayor - Rudy Giuliani , NYPD and the zero teroence campigan?

    NYPD and Rudy Giuliani the NYC mayor lead the zero teroence campigan and it has transfered the once highest crime rate city in the USA to much lower crime rate plus the lower rate of gun crime, and in the end it is not the highest crime rate in the USA anymore.



    See that? Yes that could be happening, as I am British and I strong belive one day Americans will get rid of gun culture but it maybe won't happen in our lifetime.



    If they managed to bring down of the once higher crime rate in NYC to lower crime rate and that zero teroence policy has worked then why don't the USA-nationwide adopt that policy?



    [ 12-01-2002: Message edited by: Funky ]



    [ 12-01-2002: Message edited by: Funky ]</p>
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