Problem with MS, Ballmer, and Windows is that they don't have a consistent record on anything. Their OS is all over the board, and has major design changes with every release. This is problematic, as you constantly have a variety of strains of Windows across the spectrum, and they all have their inherent problems. Whereas Apple builds and improves upon the same platform over and over again which is great for increased stability and familiarity with every release for the end user. My company still uses XP due to being afraid of upgrading to anything else, and the performance is simply horrible....just horrible. We are looking to replace Blackberry with the iPhone though. Maybe this will lead to Apple laptops in the future. I can't imagine what we spend on tech support for these HP POS.
As far as the Windows phone, well, what a disaster. And I guess MS doesn't get it when it comes to the tablet industry, as it must have a subculture of apps/developers to compete. Coming to the party a couple years late sounds futile.
Not sure why shareholders keep Ballmer in place. He's taken the MS name from a market leader to just a ho hum, we'll believe it when we see it stereotype. He's also a pretty abysmal figurehead for Microsoft from a variety of perspectives.
Isn't MS doing the thing that Apple did with iOS? Apple derived iOS from OS X (Darwin & XNU kernel). Now, Microsoft is doing the same thing and deriving the NT subsystems for ARM. Anything that's not suitable for tablet touchscreen are removed. The UI is rewritten from scratch for touchscreen usage, like iOS. The ARM version of Windows 8 doesn't run any of the legacy Windows apps, but it'll use the new app model (called appx) that's portable for ARM and x86.
Maybe sort of, although we don't really have much information yet as to what, exactly, Windows 8 Tablet Edition (or whatever they end up calling it) will entail.
But MS also already has a mobile OS, WP 7, which carries forward some of the conventions of their other, cancelled mobile OS, Zune. Which means you'll be choosing among Windows, Windows Tablet, and WP 7, none of which are compatible.
If MS weren't so enslaved by the Windows brand, they would have actually done what Apple did and make the hard choices to create a phone/tablet friendly version of the NT code base, which they then would have called something other than Windows to avoid consumer confusion.
Instead, they're going to be running a version of "Windows" that isn't, at least in the the way people expect when they see the name. What's the point of that? Just to say that they got "Windows" running well on a touch device? And where does that leave WP 7? Apparently in an artificial phone ghetto that MS made up to defend their core business-- which is the exactly the kind of thing that has made them a shadow of their former selves.
Does it involve that stunningly creepy login screen?
If I'm not mistaken that little guy is from the Windows 7 charactrers theme. I'm guessing this just means they are allowing the user to customize the wallpaper on the logon screen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by djmikeo
Is it just me, or does anyone else think that having to hold the same ctrl-alt-delete keys that are used to force quit, end tasks etc are still being used after 20 plus years. It just seems that Microsoft can not break away from the past. Couldn't they just use the "Windows" key to log in?
Just one of the many examples of legacy and enterprise support that hold Microsoft back.
If Microsoft change something (even as simple as how to logon) then they risk pissing off their business customers. If they don't change they look stale to normal consumers.
However if the pattern logon screen is anything to go by they might be willing to strain the business relationship.
My guess is the Windows Slate will run a version of the Windows Phone OS modified for a larger screen whilst the Windows Tablet will run the full Windows 8 operating system.
My guess is the Windows Slate will run a version of the Windows Phone OS modified for a larger screen whilst the Windows Tablet will run the full Windows 8 operating system.
Maybe, but I don't think so. I made a some predictions a few months ago that I'm sticking to
I think they will eventually get rid of the WP7 codebase. Maybe by WP8, maybe WP9. It's based on WinCE which is pretty messy stuff compared to the modular nature of Windows 7/8.
The OS change should be transparent to the user though as applications are written to Dot Net, not to a specific OS or architecture.
Win Phone 8/9 - ARM/x86. All applications written to Silverlight/XNA.
Win Tab 8/ARM - Metro UI. Only supports Silverlight/XNA via Marketplace (although Office will have to be ARM native).
Win Tab 8/x86 - Dual UI. Standard Windows and Metro. Legacy as well as Silverlight/XNA support. Dock-able.
Win 8 - Standard Windows UI. Legacy as well as Silverlight/XNA support.
Xbox Next - I'm not sure. Support for Silverlight and the Marketplace has been rumored.
So I can get Microsoft Windows for ARM but it cannot run programs designed for Microsoft Windows. Hrm...What could go wrong?
My guess if we will never see standard desktop Windows running on an ARM processor. At least, not in retail available to normal consumers.
You've highlighted a long-running issue with Microsoft's product naming though. Basically, it sucks.
Why Microsoft called their new phone "Windows Phone" is beyond me. The only exposure a lot (most?) people have of Windows is at their work on a locked down version of a decade old OS on crappy underpowered hardware with enough bloat to sink the titanic.
That experience is not something any sane person would want on their phone.
Well, yes. Just the kind with a curated software library, consumer-oriented focus, and no Adobe Flash:
What I find ironic is that the XBox came out first between the Wii and the PS3, yet it's about to be surpassed by the PS3 and its nowhere near as popular as the Wii.
So I can get Microsoft Windows for ARM but it cannot run programs designed for Microsoft Windows.
Hrm...What could go wrong?
This:
Windows CE. It ran on ARM. It was optimized for keyboard-less touch screens and low-memory hardware. And it could not run programs designed for Microsoft Windows.
Think about it. Microsoft has been down the ARM road. What's different this time? That they're porting their legacy Windows code base to ARM? That it's going to be called "Windows 8" instead of "Windows That's Not Compatible with Real Windows 8"? At some point, Microsoft is going to wake up to the fact that they're just repainting the Titanic.
What I find ironic is that the XBox came out first between the Wii and the PS3, yet it's about to be surpassed by the PS3 and its nowhere near as popular as the Wii.
I don't know about saying "about to be". I suppose it depends on your definition of "about to be". At current sales rates it should happen in 18-24 months.
That's 8 years after the release of the X360 and will probably be after the release of the next generation Xbox.
In any case. How is it ironic?
Sales (millions) and market share from last gen:
Nintendo: 21.75 / 11%
Sony: 143.07 / 76%
Microsoft: 24.65 / 13%
Sales (millions) and market share so far from this gen:
That it's going to be called "Windows 8" instead of "Windows That's Not Compatible with Real Windows 8"?
Isn't that the entire point of "post pc"? Your digital life changes from being PC-centric to cloud-centric and you have a bunch of different devices that have had the user experience tailored to the form factor that can access your data?
Isn't that what we all want?
As long as there is code-compatibility across devices developers will be happy, and as long as you create a mesh of devices tied together through baked in access to cloud services then consumers will be happy.
Having access to the same applications across all devices is the "old" way of thinking.
Having access to the same data across all devices is the "new" way.
I'd put money on a majority of that 25% Windows 7 market share being new PC's that were purchased in the last 18 months.
I think a lot of people who got stuck with Windows Vista upgraded to Windows 7. IMO Vista was so bad that they should have offered free upgrade from Vista to Win 7.
Comments
As far as the Windows phone, well, what a disaster. And I guess MS doesn't get it when it comes to the tablet industry, as it must have a subculture of apps/developers to compete. Coming to the party a couple years late sounds futile.
Not sure why shareholders keep Ballmer in place. He's taken the MS name from a market leader to just a ho hum, we'll believe it when we see it stereotype. He's also a pretty abysmal figurehead for Microsoft from a variety of perspectives.
What exactly is creepy about it? I'm at a loss. It's not great, but creepy? Interesting choice of words. lol
Fine, not creepy. How about "stunningly hideous?"
Not just slates, not just tablets, but slates and tablets.
What the fuck is a slate?!
Isn't MS doing the thing that Apple did with iOS? Apple derived iOS from OS X (Darwin & XNU kernel). Now, Microsoft is doing the same thing and deriving the NT subsystems for ARM. Anything that's not suitable for tablet touchscreen are removed. The UI is rewritten from scratch for touchscreen usage, like iOS. The ARM version of Windows 8 doesn't run any of the legacy Windows apps, but it'll use the new app model (called appx) that's portable for ARM and x86.
Maybe sort of, although we don't really have much information yet as to what, exactly, Windows 8 Tablet Edition (or whatever they end up calling it) will entail.
But MS also already has a mobile OS, WP 7, which carries forward some of the conventions of their other, cancelled mobile OS, Zune. Which means you'll be choosing among Windows, Windows Tablet, and WP 7, none of which are compatible.
If MS weren't so enslaved by the Windows brand, they would have actually done what Apple did and make the hard choices to create a phone/tablet friendly version of the NT code base, which they then would have called something other than Windows to avoid consumer confusion.
Instead, they're going to be running a version of "Windows" that isn't, at least in the the way people expect when they see the name. What's the point of that? Just to say that they got "Windows" running well on a touch device? And where does that leave WP 7? Apparently in an artificial phone ghetto that MS made up to defend their core business-- which is the exactly the kind of thing that has made them a shadow of their former selves.
Does it involve that stunningly creepy login screen?
If I'm not mistaken that little guy is from the Windows 7 charactrers theme. I'm guessing this just means they are allowing the user to customize the wallpaper on the logon screen.
Is it just me, or does anyone else think that having to hold the same ctrl-alt-delete keys that are used to force quit, end tasks etc are still being used after 20 plus years. It just seems that Microsoft can not break away from the past. Couldn't they just use the "Windows" key to log in?
Just one of the many examples of legacy and enterprise support that hold Microsoft back.
If Microsoft change something (even as simple as how to logon) then they risk pissing off their business customers. If they don't change they look stale to normal consumers.
However if the pattern logon screen is anything to go by they might be willing to strain the business relationship.
What the fuck is a slate?!
My guess is the Windows Slate will run a version of the Windows Phone OS modified for a larger screen whilst the Windows Tablet will run the full Windows 8 operating system.
Hrm...What could go wrong?
My guess is the Windows Slate will run a version of the Windows Phone OS modified for a larger screen whilst the Windows Tablet will run the full Windows 8 operating system.
Maybe, but I don't think so. I made a some predictions a few months ago that I'm sticking to
I think they will eventually get rid of the WP7 codebase. Maybe by WP8, maybe WP9. It's based on WinCE which is pretty messy stuff compared to the modular nature of Windows 7/8.
The OS change should be transparent to the user though as applications are written to Dot Net, not to a specific OS or architecture.
So I can get Microsoft Windows for ARM but it cannot run programs designed for Microsoft Windows. Hrm...What could go wrong?
My guess if we will never see standard desktop Windows running on an ARM processor. At least, not in retail available to normal consumers.
You've highlighted a long-running issue with Microsoft's product naming though. Basically, it sucks.
Why Microsoft called their new phone "Windows Phone" is beyond me. The only exposure a lot (most?) people have of Windows is at their work on a locked down version of a decade old OS on crappy underpowered hardware with enough bloat to sink the titanic.
That experience is not something any sane person would want on their phone.
Well, yes. Just the kind with a curated software library, consumer-oriented focus, and no Adobe Flash:
What I find ironic is that the XBox came out first between the Wii and the PS3, yet it's about to be surpassed by the PS3 and its nowhere near as popular as the Wii.
So I can get Microsoft Windows for ARM but it cannot run programs designed for Microsoft Windows.
Hrm...What could go wrong?
This:
Windows CE. It ran on ARM. It was optimized for keyboard-less touch screens and low-memory hardware. And it could not run programs designed for Microsoft Windows.
Think about it. Microsoft has been down the ARM road. What's different this time? That they're porting their legacy Windows code base to ARM? That it's going to be called "Windows 8" instead of "Windows That's Not Compatible with Real Windows 8"? At some point, Microsoft is going to wake up to the fact that they're just repainting the Titanic.
What exactly is creepy about it? I'm at a loss. It's not great, but creepy? Interesting choice of words. lol
You don't find being told to press Ctrl-Alt-Delete creepy? Gives me the chills every time
i especially liked the flying turtle one.
He forgot the elephants
What I find ironic is that the XBox came out first between the Wii and the PS3, yet it's about to be surpassed by the PS3 and its nowhere near as popular as the Wii.
I don't know about saying "about to be". I suppose it depends on your definition of "about to be". At current sales rates it should happen in 18-24 months.
That's 8 years after the release of the X360 and will probably be after the release of the next generation Xbox.
In any case. How is it ironic?
Sales (millions) and market share from last gen:
Nintendo: 21.75 / 11%
Sony: 143.07 / 76%
Microsoft: 24.65 / 13%
Sales (millions) and market share so far from this gen:
Nintendo: 86.40 / 45%
Sony: 50.38 / 26%
Microsoft: 53.76 / 28%
Relative market share change:
Nintendo: +395%
Sony: -286%
Microsoft: +217%
What the fuck is a slate?!
You've never seen The Flintstones?
Windows XP\t 53.18%
Windows 7\t 25.11%
Windows Vista\t 10.22%
http://marketshare.hitslink.com/oper....aspx?qprid=10
Scary that XP's market share is still so high.
That it's going to be called "Windows 8" instead of "Windows That's Not Compatible with Real Windows 8"?
Isn't that the entire point of "post pc"? Your digital life changes from being PC-centric to cloud-centric and you have a bunch of different devices that have had the user experience tailored to the form factor that can access your data?
Isn't that what we all want?
As long as there is code-compatibility across devices developers will be happy, and as long as you create a mesh of devices tied together through baked in access to cloud services then consumers will be happy.
Having access to the same applications across all devices is the "old" way of thinking.
Having access to the same data across all devices is the "new" way.
Operating System Market Share
Windows XP\t 53.18%
Windows 7\t 25.11%
Windows Vista\t 10.22%
http://marketshare.hitslink.com/oper....aspx?qprid=10
Scary that XP's market share is still so high.
Microsoft have a problem that Apple seem to have avoided in that people don't tend to upgrade the OS.
I'd put money on a majority of that 25% Windows 7 market share being new PC's that were purchased in the last 18 months.
frigging
graphic.
WTF Microsoft? "Ugly is the new beautiful"?
According to Ballmer, Japan is Microsoft's second-largest subsidiary in the world.
So now the entire country of Japan is a subsidiary of Microsoft!? Goodness! They've come a long way!
I'd put money on a majority of that 25% Windows 7 market share being new PC's that were purchased in the last 18 months.
I think a lot of people who got stuck with Windows Vista upgraded to Windows 7. IMO Vista was so bad that they should have offered free upgrade from Vista to Win 7.