Again, you don't know that. Nokia isn't the only company with essential patents in this area. As we found out recently, Nortel has a very large patent portfolio that includes essential patents in these areas, which is a major reason why the bidding is around $1 billion for them so far, and why it may go higher. Motorola also has patents in this area, and I wouldn't be surprised if others did as well.
What has to do that other companies have essential patents with HTC not having paying fees to Nokia?
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
Would you word that so it makes sense?
[/quote]
You said that nokia didn't denied some claims from Apple. What claims?
Please, provide any example of those much knowed fees and quantities paid by royalties on those license agreements.
What pays HTC, Motorola, Samsung, RIM, Apple or Palm (now HP) to Noki for the essential GSM technology?
If they are prety much known you can provide quantities, don't you?
Don't play dumb about this. None of us here are in the industry, and so we are not prospective licensees. If we were, then we could obtain the information. How about YOU getting it?
The issue was never Apple paying. Apple knew it had to pay. The issue was Nokia wanting Apple to pay discriminatory licensing fees. Nokia was trying to subject Apple to more in licensing fees then it did the other licensees and additional conditions. Since Nokia made those patents freely available to the standard's body, which Apple is a member, Nokia couldn't do that.
Don't play dumb about this. None of us here are in the industry, and so we are not prospective licensees. If we were, then we could obtain the information. How about YOU getting it?
This is a very good article about FRANd, and the telecommunications industry regarding IP in general. It shows ythat Nokia has sued before, though that's just a sideline. I believe that it does show how companies like Nokia use their patent portfolio, and it's directed towards the problems of that usage. Well worth a read.
Sure that is what Apple said. Nokia hasn't denied it either. It also is more believable then Apple just refusing to pay the licenses that everybody else has to pay. Apple pays other parties in the licensing body, why wouldn't Apple pay?
Apple thought it would strong arm Apple. Now that Nokia is going Windows it makes sense for Nokia to give Apple the licensing terms it should, and stop trying to get cross licensing agreements from Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwydion
That's what Apple said, do you know how much other companies pay and what Apple was asked to pay?
What has to do that other companies have essential patents with HTC not having paying fees to Nokia?
Because you don't know if Nokia actually does own essential patents, or whether other companies own patents that can work around that. That a major problem in these cases. If you read the link I just provided, you'll see that companies often CLAIM that their patents are essential, but sometimes are not. You'll also see that they bundle a large group of patents together that they claim are essential as a group, when only some of the patents may be essential, thereby attempting to get others to license all of them, rather than just the ones needed, at much greater cost.
It's possible that that's what Nokia attempted to do here, though without understanding exactly what each patent does, and how important it is, none of us here can make that determination.
Quote:
You said that nokia didn't denied some claims from Apple. What claims?
Ok, when using a word, such as you have with "deny", in the way you did, you don't change it to the past tense. The word is simply "deny". Or, you can say that Nokia denied some claims, but then don't use the word "didn't".
That was what was confusing.
Nokia didn't specifically deny Apples' claims as to what they were asking for the IP, they just said that they were fair. That doesn't actually say anything about the specific claims themselves. If I ask you to pay twice what I'm asking everyone else, I can say it's fair. But that doesn't say anything.
I guess apple aren?t always that innovative after all.
The big question now is will Nokia make more money in 2015 from the sale of windows phones or from royalties from iPhone / iPad sales?
And of course, which company will Nokia go after next. My guess is HTC because they are on track to sell over 40 million smartphones this calendar year.
Your misinformation defines you. This is a small technology patent dealing with communications - how the phone contacts with the carriers. It's nothing about the operating system or the innovations of the iPhone. It's also licensed by many other companies.
This all started when Nokia wanted to charge Apple much more in royalties than they charge any other company. Apple wouldn't pay the excessive amount, which led Nokia to start the lawsuits, which Apple then escalated. I'll bet you that this settlement is for Apple to pay the same amount of royalties as everyone else (that's a small amount per phone), with a payment to make up for past royalties. The actual amount might be adjusted (or not) for Nokia using any Apple patents.
You mean other then the Court documents supplied to the federal court that are filed under under oath? What more do you need blood? The Court documents are online. Apple makes that statement repeatedly in the documents (I read all of the filed documents).
Perhaps not, but they are supposed to be nondiscriminatory. You can't require cross licensing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwydion
No, F/RAND deals aren't fixed and equal for everybody
Can you provide any proof of Nokia demanding access to apple patents instead of money?
Apple always recognised that they needed to pay Nokia for these licenses (they are mainly to do with mobile phone technology Nokia developed with others well before Apple got into phones). The dispute was over the terms. Nokia were demanding larger royalties from Apple than from other manufacturers, so Apple threw their own patents back at Nokia. Now they've finally agreed terms, terms we'll probably never know.
This should be the first comment after the original post to put off trolls and misconceptions.
This should be the first comment after the original post to put off trolls and misconceptions.
Threw their patents back and got nowhere. It should be the first comment for those trying to put a pro-apple spin on a situation where they had to eat it. And make no mistake, eat it they have my son. The full length.
Comments
Again, you don't know that. Nokia isn't the only company with essential patents in this area. As we found out recently, Nortel has a very large patent portfolio that includes essential patents in these areas, which is a major reason why the bidding is around $1 billion for them so far, and why it may go higher. Motorola also has patents in this area, and I wouldn't be surprised if others did as well.
What has to do that other companies have essential patents with HTC not having paying fees to Nokia?
Would you word that so it makes sense?
[/quote]
You said that nokia didn't denied some claims from Apple. What claims?
Please, provide any example of those much knowed fees and quantities paid by royalties on those license agreements.
What pays HTC, Motorola, Samsung, RIM, Apple or Palm (now HP) to Noki for the essential GSM technology?
If they are prety much known you can provide quantities, don't you?
Don't play dumb about this. None of us here are in the industry, and so we are not prospective licensees. If we were, then we could obtain the information. How about YOU getting it?
Here, made it easy for you:
http://www.nokia.com/about-nokia/con...cense-requests
Don't play dumb about this. None of us here are in the industry, and so we are not prospective licensees. If we were, then we could obtain the information. How about YOU getting it?
Here, made it easy for you:
http://www.nokia.com/about-nokia/con...cense-requests
Ah, so you were only speculation and all that talk about it is know, etc was utterly wrong.
http://www.ipeg.com/_UPLOAD%20BLOG/C...OE_article.pdf
Apple thought it would strong arm Apple. Now that Nokia is going Windows it makes sense for Nokia to give Apple the licensing terms it should, and stop trying to get cross licensing agreements from Apple.
That's what Apple said, do you know how much other companies pay and what Apple was asked to pay?
What has to do that other companies have essential patents with HTC not having paying fees to Nokia?
Because you don't know if Nokia actually does own essential patents, or whether other companies own patents that can work around that. That a major problem in these cases. If you read the link I just provided, you'll see that companies often CLAIM that their patents are essential, but sometimes are not. You'll also see that they bundle a large group of patents together that they claim are essential as a group, when only some of the patents may be essential, thereby attempting to get others to license all of them, rather than just the ones needed, at much greater cost.
It's possible that that's what Nokia attempted to do here, though without understanding exactly what each patent does, and how important it is, none of us here can make that determination.
You said that nokia didn't denied some claims from Apple. What claims?
Ok, when using a word, such as you have with "deny", in the way you did, you don't change it to the past tense. The word is simply "deny". Or, you can say that Nokia denied some claims, but then don't use the word "didn't".
That was what was confusing.
Nokia didn't specifically deny Apples' claims as to what they were asking for the IP, they just said that they were fair. That doesn't actually say anything about the specific claims themselves. If I ask you to pay twice what I'm asking everyone else, I can say it's fair. But that doesn't say anything.
Ah, so you were only speculation and all that talk about it is know, etc was utterly wrong.
So you are going to play dumb. Too bad. Read the article I posted. It will give you some understanding of this issue.
Because you don't know if Nokia actually does own essential patents, or whether other companies own patents that can work around that.
Nokia does own essential patents to GSM. Go read through the ETSI mailing lists.
http://apps.americanbar.org/antitrus...ts-Dolmans.ppt
Nokia does own essential patents to GSM. Go read through the ETSI mailing lists.
Which ones?
Good news is always welcome.
I guess apple aren?t always that innovative after all.
The big question now is will Nokia make more money in 2015 from the sale of windows phones or from royalties from iPhone / iPad sales?
And of course, which company will Nokia go after next. My guess is HTC because they are on track to sell over 40 million smartphones this calendar year.
Your misinformation defines you. This is a small technology patent dealing with communications - how the phone contacts with the carriers. It's nothing about the operating system or the innovations of the iPhone. It's also licensed by many other companies.
This all started when Nokia wanted to charge Apple much more in royalties than they charge any other company. Apple wouldn't pay the excessive amount, which led Nokia to start the lawsuits, which Apple then escalated. I'll bet you that this settlement is for Apple to pay the same amount of royalties as everyone else (that's a small amount per phone), with a payment to make up for past royalties. The actual amount might be adjusted (or not) for Nokia using any Apple patents.
Perhaps not, but they are supposed to be nondiscriminatory. You can't require cross licensing.
No, F/RAND deals aren't fixed and equal for everybody
Can you provide any proof of Nokia demanding access to apple patents instead of money?
A phone that can't make phone calls or connect to a wireless network isn't going to sell very well.
you mean like the itouch?
Was it?
Yes it was. You continue your aggressively self interested flavor of word parsing.
Apple always recognised that they needed to pay Nokia for these licenses (they are mainly to do with mobile phone technology Nokia developed with others well before Apple got into phones). The dispute was over the terms. Nokia were demanding larger royalties from Apple than from other manufacturers, so Apple threw their own patents back at Nokia. Now they've finally agreed terms, terms we'll probably never know.
This should be the first comment after the original post to put off trolls and misconceptions.
Which ones?
GSM 08.58 is a good place to start. You'll need to register to access the archives.
This should be the first comment after the original post to put off trolls and misconceptions.
Threw their patents back and got nowhere. It should be the first comment for those trying to put a pro-apple spin on a situation where they had to eat it. And make no mistake, eat it they have my son. The full length.
This should be the first comment after the original post to put off trolls and misconceptions.
Misconceptions like that Nokia/Motorola/Qualcomm can't demand different royalties for the same patents to different companies?
So you are going to play dumb. Too bad. Read the article I posted. It will give you some understanding of this issue.
The article doesn't say nothing about fees been public or that everyone pays the same amount