If they Mac mini, a desktop, has lost the ODD who here doesn't think the future of the MBP is to lose the ODD?
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison
I like the lack of an internal optical drive.
This means you can run an incredibly clean system with a Apple Thunderbolt Display by simply mounting the Mac mini "out of sight out of mind" and hooking the external superdrive and other peripherals to the display. Voila
Thunderbolt is really nice. Even the base $600 dollar Mac mini sitting in front if a TB RAID would make for a fast NAS.
The only think I wish is they offered a PSU bypass on the Mac mini with the locking port for the new Thunderbolt-equipped LED display so you can have a single cable for power for both your display and Mac mini, with the single cable going to the back of the Mac mini. SInce the continuous power in for the Mac mini and out for the LED display are both 85W it's too far fetched to imagine. I assume Apple had thought of this but there were other complications that prevented it.
Glad to see the CPU muscle, but Apple's not doing anything more for me on supporting multiple displays. There's always the mac pro but that did not get the expected refresh today. I guess if you want hella monitors you have to get the 27" iMac which has dual Thunderbolt ports, then you could have three 2560x1440 monitors (counting the iMac). Its making me think about going hackintosh; straight PC hardware makes it easy to support two or 3 big monitors. Right now I have a 2009 mac mini driving a Dell u2711 and a generic 1920x1200, and these new models don't give me more.
It should be easy to upgrade the RAM. What about the hard disk? Anyone know does Lion support TRIM?
I believe you can daisy chain Thunderbolt connections. In fact the image used for the new Cinema Displays has two monitors hooked up to a macbook pro.
That makes sense enough. But the optical in my MBP went belly up last year and I replaced the functionality with a bus powered USB external for $35 and it doesn't do anything any worse.
As far as portability it stays in the TV cabinet anyway. Plays movies great and burns archives faster than what Apple gave me stock.
No idea if what I picked up (happens to be an Iomega Slimline, no bigger looking than the Superdrive) is functionally the same, but I've never run into anything it couldn't do and only needs one port for power.
Thus ends the life of the Mac Mini as a home-theater PC. Back to a table-top of mismatched remotes...
why?
dont tell me you were actually using the DVD drive for DVD playback?!? i figured anyone utilizing a HTPC would have the means to rip the disks to a server/NAS/drive....
getting the mini smaller and quieter (and faster-epsecially graphics) makes it an even better HTPC choice.
My HTPC software is SageTV, and since they just got bought out by Google, their hardware extenders are now going for $300 and $400 on ebay (MSRP $149) so the mini is being much much more attractive.
The Thunderbolt port lets you daisy chain monitors...
What I've read is you can daisy chain Thunderbolt devices. But only one monitor per Thunderbolt port/chain. I am pretty sure that new display only has one Thunderbolt plug on it... it sits at the end of the chain. That it doesn't have two plugs so it could sit in the middle and you could have 2 monitors on one chain. Furthermore, if I'm wrong, then why would the 27" iMac have TWO Thunderbolt ports, it wouldn't serve much purpose.
Then again, there is that picture of a Mac Book driving two of the displays, thanks James. So maybe I'm wrong. But what exactly is that cable in that photo?? If the regular Thunderbolt cable costs $49 I wonder what that cable costs, surely like the $49 cable only Apple sells it, but where? Yes, that photo really raises some questions, about how that works. Is there a Y cable or does the new monitor have two Thunderbolt ports so you can daisy chain?
I also stream content, but broadband Internet service in the US is still pretty primitive in places, and generally unsuitable for HD content at true Blu-Ray quality (not that Apple supported it anyway). And impending data caps make full-time streaming a risky proposition.
Quote:
i figured anyone utilizing a HTPC would have the means to rip the disks to a server/NAS/drive....
Sure, if you have a DVD drive sitting around. Which is what we're discussing here.
Quote:
getting the mini smaller and quieter (and faster-epsecially graphics) makes it an even better HTPC choice.
All of which can still be achieved whether it has an optical drive or not. But Apple just removed the option entirely, even if some of us were willing to pay extra for it.
What is the consensus opinion on the HDD vs SSD? Is it worth the extra $600?
Looking to get an i7 with discreet graphics for a home media setup, i.e. Netflix, iTunes, Hulu, and the Boxee app.
That said, is the i7 even necessary if I'm not doing much actual computing? Or is extra RAM (8GB) a better value?
My reading of the models in the Apple store says you can't get both quad-core-i7 and discrete graphics. You can get discrete graphics and dual-core i5 or i7. Or you can move to the server for quad core.
IMHO both i7 are overkill for HTPC. Its kind of ironic, the Mac Mini's new form factor (for this and previous model) were intended to also be used for a new Apple TV. But they probably realized it would be too expensive and canned it.
If you want a home media set up, suggest you look here www.iboum.com. On the other end of the spectrum, you have to use windows, and run Media Player Classic Home Cinema edition, with yCMS gamut and grey scale calibration, and play full Blu-Ray images into an AVR that can play the high def (True HD or DTS HD MA) audio. Apple is so far behind on this that it hurts. And its again ironic because they are using the same z68 chipset that supports mixing the audio into the HDMI.
That said, Apple was right about optical drives going away.
Though I am disappointed that there is not a Core i7 offering in the non-server model, I suppose the Core i5 with a discreet graphics card will do well enough. It would have been very nice indeed to have a Core i7 2.5 GHz quad core and discreet graphics.
Perhaps Apple did not think such a model would sell enough units to be worth their while. Oh well.
I do wonder if the hard drives in the new models are specific to Apple as in the iMacs or are still "generic" that you can swap out with any standard HD.
Not completely. Only for those who rely heavily on playing DVDs. I think the number of people wanting to play actual DVDs is getting smaller by the day. I think the majority either watch from ripped content, or what they can stream from Netflix, Hulu, and other online sources.
There is, of course, the issue of ripping the media in the first place. Some of use were using the Mac Mini's optical drive for that purpose. Having an extra drive (USB) really clutters up a nicely organized entertainment center.
Streaming doesn't cut it. Some of us still want the physical medium.
Apple just doesn't seem to understand the beauty of internal devices which is odd considering how much effort it puts into the look of its products. Apple really wants us to hide their designs behind third party external devices? I just don't get it.
.
The 80$ external drive is not "third" party because its made by Apple. And it looks pretty neat, you could put it on top of the mini and it would still look good since its the same aluminum casing. The drive is a little smaller than the MacMini.
Though I am disappointed that there is not a Core i7 offering in the non-server model, I suppose the Core i5 with a discreet graphics card will do well enough. It would have been very nice indeed to have a Core i7 2.5 GHz quad core and discreet graphics.
Perhaps Apple did not think such a model would sell enough units to be worth their while. Oh well.
I do wonder if the hard drives in the new models are specific to Apple as in the iMacs or are still "generic" that you can swap out with any standard HD.
You can build the $799 Mac Mini to order with a dualcore i7 for an extra $100.
I'm so happy to see the discrete GPU in the Mini as well as the quad-core i7 in the server model. I'll probably go for one of the discrete GPU models eventually, not least because you are actually getting two GPUs.
As for the Mini no longer being a media centre, they did pretty much exactly what I wanted them to do, which is cut the optical and drop the price by $100 so that you can buy whatever drive you want. You can even buy a Sony Blu-Ray burner for $180:
and you've basically only spent $80 more than the previous model and you get DVD and Blu-Ray playback as well as Blu-Ray burning.
The CPUs are more than twice as fast as before and we still have HDMI and now 500GB drives all round. The dedicated GPU is faster than a 5650 and 6490 so higher than the first i7 MBP, which costs much more.
This is pretty much the best outcome there could ever have been for the Mini. I am so pleased with every choice made here because they have given each model a clear role and specced the machines accordingly.
Once the quad i7 creeps down to the discrete GPU model with Ivy Bridge and you hook up a RAID system to Thunderbolt, there's your xMac right there. The server model is almost there already.
Silly question, but I'm not familiar with the i5 and i7. I'm looking at the new $799 mini. Is it worth the $100 extra to bump it up to an i7? My biggest gripe about my current mini (that I LOVE!!!) is that Aperture 3 really bogs it down. I'm currently running the last of the white minis (2.53 ghz Core 2 Duo) with 4 gigs of RAM.
Based on re specs would any of these minis be good for Final Cut Pro 7? I know the graphics are discrete, but is that good enough for FCP or Color? If they are and I could BTO with a quad core that'd be potentially pretty sweet.
I'm a bit shocked that 2GB of RAM is still the base memory.
With all of the billions of dollars that Apple is making, you'd think they'd open up their purse strings a bit and eliminate this embarrassment. I was wrong.
Air superdrive? Why couldn't you just plug it in the back of the Mini?
imo they just didnt update the superdrive page yet. If it works on the old MacMini server it should work on the new macmini. If that thing doesnt work I will fall out of my chair.
Apple just doesn't seem to understand the beauty of internal [optical] devices which is odd considering how much effort it puts into the look of its products. Apple really wants us to hide their designs behind third party external devices? I just don't get it.
It's all about pushing the App Store and the iTunes store. And it'll probably work out well for them, business-wise. And I must admit that it doesn't bug me; I've already got several external drives of various sorts sitting around. The extra hard drive really is more useful for most people.
Comments
Looking to get an i7 with discreet graphics for a home media setup, i.e. Netflix, iTunes, Hulu, and the Boxee app.
That said, is the i7 even necessary if I'm not doing much actual computing? Or is extra RAM (8GB) a better value?
I like the lack of an internal optical drive.
This means you can run an incredibly clean system with a Apple Thunderbolt Display by simply mounting the Mac mini "out of sight out of mind" and hooking the external superdrive and other peripherals to the display. Voila
Thunderbolt is really nice. Even the base $600 dollar Mac mini sitting in front if a TB RAID would make for a fast NAS.
The only think I wish is they offered a PSU bypass on the Mac mini with the locking port for the new Thunderbolt-equipped LED display so you can have a single cable for power for both your display and Mac mini, with the single cable going to the back of the Mac mini. SInce the continuous power in for the Mac mini and out for the LED display are both 85W it's too far fetched to imagine. I assume Apple had thought of this but there were other complications that prevented it.
Glad to see the CPU muscle, but Apple's not doing anything more for me on supporting multiple displays. There's always the mac pro but that did not get the expected refresh today. I guess if you want hella monitors you have to get the 27" iMac which has dual Thunderbolt ports, then you could have three 2560x1440 monitors (counting the iMac). Its making me think about going hackintosh; straight PC hardware makes it easy to support two or 3 big monitors. Right now I have a 2009 mac mini driving a Dell u2711 and a generic 1920x1200, and these new models don't give me more.
It should be easy to upgrade the RAM. What about the hard disk? Anyone know does Lion support TRIM?
I believe you can daisy chain Thunderbolt connections. In fact the image used for the new Cinema Displays has two monitors hooked up to a macbook pro.
james
I suspect he wants a DVD drive for movies...
That makes sense enough. But the optical in my MBP went belly up last year and I replaced the functionality with a bus powered USB external for $35 and it doesn't do anything any worse.
As far as portability it stays in the TV cabinet anyway. Plays movies great and burns archives faster than what Apple gave me stock.
No idea if what I picked up (happens to be an Iomega Slimline, no bigger looking than the Superdrive) is functionally the same, but I've never run into anything it couldn't do and only needs one port for power.
Thus ends the life of the Mac Mini as a home-theater PC. Back to a table-top of mismatched remotes...
why?
dont tell me you were actually using the DVD drive for DVD playback?!? i figured anyone utilizing a HTPC would have the means to rip the disks to a server/NAS/drive....
getting the mini smaller and quieter (and faster-epsecially graphics) makes it an even better HTPC choice.
My HTPC software is SageTV, and since they just got bought out by Google, their hardware extenders are now going for $300 and $400 on ebay (MSRP $149) so the mini is being much much more attractive.
The Thunderbolt port lets you daisy chain monitors...
What I've read is you can daisy chain Thunderbolt devices. But only one monitor per Thunderbolt port/chain. I am pretty sure that new display only has one Thunderbolt plug on it... it sits at the end of the chain. That it doesn't have two plugs so it could sit in the middle and you could have 2 monitors on one chain. Furthermore, if I'm wrong, then why would the 27" iMac have TWO Thunderbolt ports, it wouldn't serve much purpose.
Then again, there is that picture of a Mac Book driving two of the displays, thanks James. So maybe I'm wrong. But what exactly is that cable in that photo?? If the regular Thunderbolt cable costs $49 I wonder what that cable costs, surely like the $49 cable only Apple sells it, but where? Yes, that photo really raises some questions, about how that works. Is there a Y cable or does the new monitor have two Thunderbolt ports so you can daisy chain?
why?
dont tell me you were actually using the DVD drive for DVD playback?!?
Why, yes, I was.
I also stream content, but broadband Internet service in the US is still pretty primitive in places, and generally unsuitable for HD content at true Blu-Ray quality (not that Apple supported it anyway). And impending data caps make full-time streaming a risky proposition.
i figured anyone utilizing a HTPC would have the means to rip the disks to a server/NAS/drive....
Sure, if you have a DVD drive sitting around. Which is what we're discussing here.
getting the mini smaller and quieter (and faster-epsecially graphics) makes it an even better HTPC choice.
All of which can still be achieved whether it has an optical drive or not. But Apple just removed the option entirely, even if some of us were willing to pay extra for it.
What is the consensus opinion on the HDD vs SSD? Is it worth the extra $600?
Looking to get an i7 with discreet graphics for a home media setup, i.e. Netflix, iTunes, Hulu, and the Boxee app.
That said, is the i7 even necessary if I'm not doing much actual computing? Or is extra RAM (8GB) a better value?
My reading of the models in the Apple store says you can't get both quad-core-i7 and discrete graphics. You can get discrete graphics and dual-core i5 or i7. Or you can move to the server for quad core.
IMHO both i7 are overkill for HTPC. Its kind of ironic, the Mac Mini's new form factor (for this and previous model) were intended to also be used for a new Apple TV. But they probably realized it would be too expensive and canned it.
If you want a home media set up, suggest you look here www.iboum.com. On the other end of the spectrum, you have to use windows, and run Media Player Classic Home Cinema edition, with yCMS gamut and grey scale calibration, and play full Blu-Ray images into an AVR that can play the high def (True HD or DTS HD MA) audio. Apple is so far behind on this that it hurts. And its again ironic because they are using the same z68 chipset that supports mixing the audio into the HDMI.
That said, Apple was right about optical drives going away.
Perhaps Apple did not think such a model would sell enough units to be worth their while. Oh well.
I do wonder if the hard drives in the new models are specific to Apple as in the iMacs or are still "generic" that you can swap out with any standard HD.
Not completely. Only for those who rely heavily on playing DVDs. I think the number of people wanting to play actual DVDs is getting smaller by the day. I think the majority either watch from ripped content, or what they can stream from Netflix, Hulu, and other online sources.
There is, of course, the issue of ripping the media in the first place. Some of use were using the Mac Mini's optical drive for that purpose. Having an extra drive (USB) really clutters up a nicely organized entertainment center.
Streaming doesn't cut it. Some of us still want the physical medium.
Apple just doesn't seem to understand the beauty of internal devices which is odd considering how much effort it puts into the look of its products. Apple really wants us to hide their designs behind third party external devices? I just don't get it.
.
The 80$ external drive is not "third" party because its made by Apple. And it looks pretty neat, you could put it on top of the mini and it would still look good since its the same aluminum casing. The drive is a little smaller than the MacMini.
http://store.apple.com/ca/product/MC684ZM/A#overview
MacMini Size
Width: 7.7 inches
Depth: 7.7 inches
Superdrive size
Width: 5.47 inches
Depth: 5.47 inches
Though I am disappointed that there is not a Core i7 offering in the non-server model, I suppose the Core i5 with a discreet graphics card will do well enough. It would have been very nice indeed to have a Core i7 2.5 GHz quad core and discreet graphics.
Perhaps Apple did not think such a model would sell enough units to be worth their while. Oh well.
I do wonder if the hard drives in the new models are specific to Apple as in the iMacs or are still "generic" that you can swap out with any standard HD.
You can build the $799 Mac Mini to order with a dualcore i7 for an extra $100.
As for the Mini no longer being a media centre, they did pretty much exactly what I wanted them to do, which is cut the optical and drop the price by $100 so that you can buy whatever drive you want. You can even buy a Sony Blu-Ray burner for $180:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...8048&Tpk=s500u
and you've basically only spent $80 more than the previous model and you get DVD and Blu-Ray playback as well as Blu-Ray burning.
The CPUs are more than twice as fast as before and we still have HDMI and now 500GB drives all round. The dedicated GPU is faster than a 5650 and 6490 so higher than the first i7 MBP, which costs much more.
This is pretty much the best outcome there could ever have been for the Mini. I am so pleased with every choice made here because they have given each model a clear role and specced the machines accordingly.
Once the quad i7 creeps down to the discrete GPU model with Ivy Bridge and you hook up a RAID system to Thunderbolt, there's your xMac right there. The server model is almost there already.
With all of the billions of dollars that Apple is making, you'd think they'd open up their purse strings a bit and eliminate this embarrassment. I was wrong.
Air superdrive? Why couldn't you just plug it in the back of the Mini?
imo they just didnt update the superdrive page yet. If it works on the old MacMini server it should work on the new macmini. If that thing doesnt work I will fall out of my chair.
Apple just doesn't seem to understand the beauty of internal [optical] devices which is odd considering how much effort it puts into the look of its products. Apple really wants us to hide their designs behind third party external devices? I just don't get it.
It's all about pushing the App Store and the iTunes store. And it'll probably work out well for them, business-wise. And I must admit that it doesn't bug me; I've already got several external drives of various sorts sitting around. The extra hard drive really is more useful for most people.