I think it is a clever modernisation of an old concept. It used to be that great warriors were vital to a country, now it is great businessman. Traditions should not be thrown out wholesale, that is cultural vandalism.
It would also have been acceptable to modernise it to be something given to special forces, who are modern equivalent of an elite warrior.
Clever is as far as it goes. The number of "Sirs" and "Lords" that are responsible for bringing the globe close to financial collapse... are probably numerous.
It would also have been acceptable to modernise it to be something given to special forces, who are modern equivalent of an elite warrior.
I think Jony Ive and Helena Bonham Carter are brilliant, talented people, but if you ask me what you propose above is a great idea, British Knighthood should only be for armed forces ~ not just special forces, but anyone serving in the military who has performed exceptionally.
?Heaven is where the police are British, the cooks are French, the mechanics are German, the lovers are Italian and it is all organised by the Swiss. Hell is where the police are German, the cooks are English, the mechanics are French, the lovers are Swiss, and it is all organised by the Italians?.
Apologies for the multiple replies in a row, but I couldn't resist...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secular Investor
Yea, look at all those wonderful Aussi designed and built Formula 1 cars .....Brrrrrrrrrm Car!\
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR
Don't worry about the English thing. That comes down to taste. If you ever get the chance to travel, you'll realise how much taste varies from country to country. Trust me on this. I'm from Australia and we look at both English AND American cars and go, 'WTF!'. And I'm sure you'd do the same if you saw our stuff...
Awwww yeah mate... Screw the Aston Martin! (is that even British still?). Give me a Holden HSV Ute any day!
“Heaven is where the police are British, the cooks are French, the mechanics are German, the lovers are Italian and it is all organised by the Swiss. Hell is where the police are German, the cooks are English, the mechanics are French, the lovers are Swiss, and it is all organised by the Italians”.
An oldie but a goodie!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman0
Erm?....
BAe wanted out of Rover so sold it to BMW. BMW and Honda were definitely not going to work together which is why that partnership broke up.
As for the MINI, that was asset striped out of Rover by BMW. The real 2nd generation Mini looked nothing like the MINI, and the designs were over-ruled by BMW who wanted something retro, hence the dreadfully large and expensive MINI.
BMW didn't even want the Kseries in the MINI and opted for an inferior Brazilian engine, rather than the highly rated K series. (And before we talk about HGFs, they were largely sorted out once BMW sold off Rover and Rover were allowed to fix the issue. Plus it was mainly the F/TF that had the HGF issues).
The MINI is nothing but a German car built in the UK.
I'm not sure you've actually modified any of the history I related. I am fully aware of the evolution of the new Mini, which I told only partially. The project started before the BMW takeover then was finished by BMW. The result was something of a hybrid -- a Rover gearbox and a BMW suspension were used, for example. Many cars made these days have a similarly complicated heritage.
I think everyone who cares to know already knows that the new Mini had little to do with the original Mini. FWIW, for many years the Mini was the shortest car sold in the US by any manufacturer, so "dreadfully large" is indeed a matter of reference points.
The car's original Tritec engine was a joint development between Chrysler and BMW that became essentially an orphan when Chrysler was bought out by Daimler-Benz. It was only manufactured in Brazil. If the Mini is nothing more than a German car built in the UK then the Tritec is nothing more than a US/German engine built in Brazil. You can't have that logic both ways.
Anyway, having owned one for nearly nine years now I can say it's a great car. It's got all the fun of my old MG without any of the mechanical headaches.
I just don't know what to think of Jobs - a man the press simultaneously calls genius and mercurial. I'm concerned that Apple's success may have resulted from his hard-driving, unreasonable approach... and now that Mr. Jobs is gone?! What now? I want Apple to continue to make great products and experience phenomenal success! I hope things will not deteriorate in his absence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanaCameron
Read the biography. Ive's comments quoted here are not out of context, but they'd bother you less (probably not at all, to be honest) after you read the biography. You'll also have a better sense of Apple's future.
My concern is that Jobs was the rudder and compass of the apple boat. When only months before it's debut at Macworld the iPhone didn't work it was Jobs who said "We don't have a product yet." What person is there now who will say this? Who will tell a team of 200 engineers their work isn't good enough and they have 3 months to fix it before we demo?
First of all, I'm very glad for Ive - well-deserved recognition!
I just feel like rambling about a couple things: and that's all this is - rambling.
1. I still haven't had a chance to read the Jobs biography. But Ive's comments about Jobs taking credit for some of his ideas bothers me. I just don't know what to think of Jobs - a man the press simultaneously calls genius and mercurial. I'm concerned that Apple's success may have resulted from his hard-driving, unreasonable approach... and now that Mr. Jobs is gone?! What now? I want Apple to continue to make great products and experience phenomenal success! I hope things will not deteriorate in his absence.
2. The English, to me, are an enigma. They have some wonderful car designs - the Jaguars and the Range Rovers are beautiful and the MG Midget my dad drove in his youth was splendid - but their build quality and reliability are terrible! And it's not for lack of smarts: the English built the Colossus computer during the World War II which decoded Nazi ciphers. I just don't understand why their designs are so good but their quality can be so bad! But I'm so glad that in the case of Apple Ive's wonderful designs are backed by outstanding quality!
All in all this is wonderful news about Ive and congratulations to him!!! :-)
Yeah and all Americans are fat and ignorant (not my view btw). Generalisations aren't nice are they!
Britain has always been known for quality, but people want cheep these days so most British goods are made in china theses days. We we compleat these days in ideas, services, design and in niche markets where quality is still valued. We actually have a growing market of high quality goods to China of all places as their growing middle class want to buy quality British products with a long tradition and heritage.
And yes class isn't just a British thing we just have names for it, every country has rich, and poor and those in between.
Wow. What a thrill, what a nice way to start off 2012!
A fabulous thread that celebrates Apple's greatness -- with the occasional wink and the informed nod -- not populated by the usual Android lowlifes that hijack it.
So, this is one of the guys who do all they can to take away user serviceability from Apple products, so they can hope to charge premium prices for everything.
You really don't get it, do you? Apple isn't designing machines for people like you, it's designing machines for the non-techie. And not changing batteries works fine for them. Consider: My wife just upgraded from a 3g to a 4s. That's three years with the same battery. Granted, the battery needs replacing now, but she got three years of use out of that phone. That's plenty.
What I really dislike is the "flip' on your comments that somehow Apple is ripping people off when all it's doing is giving most of us exactly what we want.
Thanks: ascii, DanaCameron, PhilBoogie, GTR, allblue, ichiva, jcsegenmd, PaulMJohnson, Dr Millmoss, 1st, timgriff84, Zoolook, Prof. Peabody, WelshDog, macadam212, and Sacto Joe!
Just want to thank everyone who replied to my "ramble" and let you know that you've helped get my New Year off to a terrific start!!! You are exactly the reason I visit AppleInsider daily and on occasion dare to post! I love your thoughtful insight and appreciate the fact that an ugly flame war didn't erupt - a disgraceful, counterproductive practice I've witnessed too many times at other sites.
You folks are world class!
My apologies to Prof. Peabody and anyone else I may have offended. This was not intended to be an insult but rather an informal dialogue - playful bandying - like might have occurred at a bar over a couple beers.
I won't reply like this every time but just this once in order to say that I revisit my posts to check for responses. I once read someone define a troll as "like a jerk who takes a sh!t in the middle of a room full of people and then leaves" and just wanted to say that's not me!
Kudos to Sir Jonathan Ive and thanks to all who make AppleInsider great! You've made my day! Happy New Year!
Speaking of toilet paper, I'd wager you've got more than a passing familiarity with it....
If we did, he wouldn't be spewing it all over here right? Paraphrasing the late Richard Pryor, this guy never goes to the toilet - he just talks his out.
Comments
I think it is a clever modernisation of an old concept. It used to be that great warriors were vital to a country, now it is great businessman. Traditions should not be thrown out wholesale, that is cultural vandalism.
It would also have been acceptable to modernise it to be something given to special forces, who are modern equivalent of an elite warrior.
Clever is as far as it goes. The number of "Sirs" and "Lords" that are responsible for bringing the globe close to financial collapse... are probably numerous.
"Knighthood", is at best, cute.
The UK has bigger issues at hand.
It would also have been acceptable to modernise it to be something given to special forces, who are modern equivalent of an elite warrior.
I think Jony Ive and Helena Bonham Carter are brilliant, talented people, but if you ask me what you propose above is a great idea, British Knighthood should only be for armed forces ~ not just special forces, but anyone serving in the military who has performed exceptionally.
?Heaven is where the police are British, the cooks are French, the mechanics are German, the lovers are Italian and it is all organised by the Swiss. Hell is where the police are German, the cooks are English, the mechanics are French, the lovers are Swiss, and it is all organised by the Italians?.
Yea, look at all those wonderful Aussi designed and built Formula 1 cars .....Brrrrrrrrrm Car!
Don't worry about the English thing. That comes down to taste. If you ever get the chance to travel, you'll realise how much taste varies from country to country. Trust me on this. I'm from Australia and we look at both English AND American cars and go, 'WTF!'. And I'm sure you'd do the same if you saw our stuff...
Awwww yeah mate... Screw the Aston Martin! (is that even British still?). Give me a Holden HSV Ute any day!
“Heaven is where the police are British, the cooks are French, the mechanics are German, the lovers are Italian and it is all organised by the Swiss. Hell is where the police are German, the cooks are English, the mechanics are French, the lovers are Swiss, and it is all organised by the Italians”.
An oldie but a goodie!
Erm?....
BAe wanted out of Rover so sold it to BMW. BMW and Honda were definitely not going to work together which is why that partnership broke up.
As for the MINI, that was asset striped out of Rover by BMW. The real 2nd generation Mini looked nothing like the MINI, and the designs were over-ruled by BMW who wanted something retro, hence the dreadfully large and expensive MINI.
BMW didn't even want the Kseries in the MINI and opted for an inferior Brazilian engine, rather than the highly rated K series. (And before we talk about HGFs, they were largely sorted out once BMW sold off Rover and Rover were allowed to fix the issue. Plus it was mainly the F/TF that had the HGF issues).
The MINI is nothing but a German car built in the UK.
I'm not sure you've actually modified any of the history I related. I am fully aware of the evolution of the new Mini, which I told only partially. The project started before the BMW takeover then was finished by BMW. The result was something of a hybrid -- a Rover gearbox and a BMW suspension were used, for example. Many cars made these days have a similarly complicated heritage.
I think everyone who cares to know already knows that the new Mini had little to do with the original Mini. FWIW, for many years the Mini was the shortest car sold in the US by any manufacturer, so "dreadfully large" is indeed a matter of reference points.
The car's original Tritec engine was a joint development between Chrysler and BMW that became essentially an orphan when Chrysler was bought out by Daimler-Benz. It was only manufactured in Brazil. If the Mini is nothing more than a German car built in the UK then the Tritec is nothing more than a US/German engine built in Brazil. You can't have that logic both ways.
Anyway, having owned one for nearly nine years now I can say it's a great car. It's got all the fun of my old MG without any of the mechanical headaches.
I just don't know what to think of Jobs - a man the press simultaneously calls genius and mercurial. I'm concerned that Apple's success may have resulted from his hard-driving, unreasonable approach... and now that Mr. Jobs is gone?! What now? I want Apple to continue to make great products and experience phenomenal success! I hope things will not deteriorate in his absence.
Read the biography. Ive's comments quoted here are not out of context, but they'd bother you less (probably not at all, to be honest) after you read the biography. You'll also have a better sense of Apple's future.
My concern is that Jobs was the rudder and compass of the apple boat. When only months before it's debut at Macworld the iPhone didn't work it was Jobs who said "We don't have a product yet." What person is there now who will say this? Who will tell a team of 200 engineers their work isn't good enough and they have 3 months to fix it before we demo?
That is what Jobs did at Apple. Who now?
I'm from Australia and we look at both English AND American cars and go, 'WTF!'. And I'm sure you'd do the same if you saw our stuff...
For sure ... We Do! ... We Do! ...
And my wife doesn't think much of the women's shoe "fashions" in England, either! (Do Ozzie women wear shoes??)
First of all, I'm very glad for Ive - well-deserved recognition!
I just feel like rambling about a couple things: and that's all this is - rambling.
1. I still haven't had a chance to read the Jobs biography. But Ive's comments about Jobs taking credit for some of his ideas bothers me. I just don't know what to think of Jobs - a man the press simultaneously calls genius and mercurial. I'm concerned that Apple's success may have resulted from his hard-driving, unreasonable approach... and now that Mr. Jobs is gone?! What now? I want Apple to continue to make great products and experience phenomenal success! I hope things will not deteriorate in his absence.
2. The English, to me, are an enigma. They have some wonderful car designs - the Jaguars and the Range Rovers are beautiful and the MG Midget my dad drove in his youth was splendid - but their build quality and reliability are terrible! And it's not for lack of smarts: the English built the Colossus computer during the World War II which decoded Nazi ciphers. I just don't understand why their designs are so good but their quality can be so bad! But I'm so glad that in the case of Apple Ive's wonderful designs are backed by outstanding quality!
All in all this is wonderful news about Ive and congratulations to him!!! :-)
Yeah and all Americans are fat and ignorant (not my view btw). Generalisations aren't nice are they!
Britain has always been known for quality, but people want cheep these days so most British goods are made in china theses days. We we compleat these days in ideas, services, design and in niche markets where quality is still valued. We actually have a growing market of high quality goods to China of all places as their growing middle class want to buy quality British products with a long tradition and heritage.
And yes class isn't just a British thing we just have names for it, every country has rich, and poor and those in between.
Britain has always been known for quality
Really?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqQ6Z-HmAqY
A fabulous thread that celebrates Apple's greatness -- with the occasional wink and the informed nod -- not populated by the usual Android lowlifes that hijack it.
Wow.
So, this is one of the guys who do all they can to take away user serviceability from Apple products, so they can hope to charge premium prices for everything.
You really don't get it, do you? Apple isn't designing machines for people like you, it's designing machines for the non-techie. And not changing batteries works fine for them. Consider: My wife just upgraded from a 3g to a 4s. That's three years with the same battery. Granted, the battery needs replacing now, but she got three years of use out of that phone. That's plenty.
What I really dislike is the "flip' on your comments that somehow Apple is ripping people off when all it's doing is giving most of us exactly what we want.
Next we will see knighthood for the person who designed fancy patterned toilet paper. This show the relevancy of he British empire.
Speaking of toilet paper, I'd wager you've got more than a passing familiarity with it....
The English are excellent engineers, designers and inventors and there is no one in America today that even comes close to someone like Ives.
Ever hear of Dean Kamen? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Kamen
You're taking umbrage was way over the top, Professor....
(Do Ozzie women wear shoes??)
No, they don't. They wear thongs.
Just want to thank everyone who replied to my "ramble" and let you know that you've helped get my New Year off to a terrific start!!! You are exactly the reason I visit AppleInsider daily and on occasion dare to post! I love your thoughtful insight and appreciate the fact that an ugly flame war didn't erupt - a disgraceful, counterproductive practice I've witnessed too many times at other sites.
You folks are world class!
My apologies to Prof. Peabody and anyone else I may have offended. This was not intended to be an insult but rather an informal dialogue - playful bandying - like might have occurred at a bar over a couple beers.
I won't reply like this every time but just this once in order to say that I revisit my posts to check for responses. I once read someone define a troll as "like a jerk who takes a sh!t in the middle of a room full of people and then leaves" and just wanted to say that's not me!
Kudos to Sir Jonathan Ive and thanks to all who make AppleInsider great! You've made my day! Happy New Year!
~ james h
"big"
Speaking of toilet paper, I'd wager you've got more than a passing familiarity with it....
If we did, he wouldn't be spewing it all over here right? Paraphrasing the late Richard Pryor, this guy never goes to the toilet - he just talks his out.
I admit "Sir I" is very clever.
Congratulations to Ive anyway.
You're taking umbrage was way over the top, Professor....
Not to worry. It's a new year and in the spirit of the season, Dr. Peabody promises to put that umbrage right back whence he took it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9u9QprLcvg
As for the award, I'm sure the product he has in his pocket is far more meaningful to him than a name given to him by an irrelevant monarch.
You can't earn respect with a title but you can by convincing over quarter of a billion people to buy your design.