Really? Can Foxconn just keep everything they make? I'm pretty sure they could make a bundle in their black market, especially given China's iPhone/iPad mania now. Apple's customer in the West would get pissed off big time though.
No one ever suggested that. Foxconn does not have a license to sell the product and would be guilty of patent and trademark infringement if they did so. (plus, I doubt very much that Apple would have signed a contract without specifically restricting Foxconn's ability to sell to the black market).
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
You write those claims as tho there's no question of them being unequivocally true.
IMHO the Chinese could consider those iPads as being manufactured/owned by Foxconn (or whoever) and being sold to Apple under contract and on upon completion, which includes packaging I believe. In which case it's conceivable that the product would be considered sold to Apple rather than being manufactured by Apple. If so, then Foxconn might not be permitted to sell/export them.
Just a thought.
The Chinese can't consider any such thing unless the contract is set up that way.
Furthermore, even if they are sold to Apple, as long as they're only exported, they do not infringe a Chinese trademark, so the government could not legally stop them.
No one ever suggested that. Foxconn does not have a license to sell the product and would be guilty of patent and trademark infringement if they did so. (plus, I doubt very much that Apple would have signed a contract without specifically restricting Foxconn's ability to sell to the black market).
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
The Chinese can't consider any such thing unless the contract is set up that way.
Furthermore, even if they are sold to Apple, as long as they're only exported, they do not infringe a Chinese trademark, so the government could not legally stop them.
You keep working under the assumption that a contract in China is actually worth something. The fact that Proview is not abiding by the original contract should be a hint that law is not going to be a significant factor in this case.
You keep working under the assumption that a contract in China is actually worth something. The fact that Proview is not abiding by the original contract should be a hint that law is not going to be a significant factor in this case.
Precisely what I keep saying. People are thinking logically and like business men, this is outside of that thought pattern.
The Chinese government is not so stupid as to ban export/import of Ipads. On the contrary, Proview might get an earful from the government asking them to make a deal with Apple.
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
I find it more probable that Apple IS required to pay if the reason for non-shipment is Apple's fault. No other structure makes sense to me. But we're both just guessing.
Foxconn is totally 100% innocent here, and the courts have already found Apple to have violated applicable laws. IMO, Foxconn should not get screwed over by Apple here. Foxconn did nothing wrong, and Apple lost in court already.
The Chinese government is not so stupid as to ban export/import of Ipads. On the contrary, Proview might get an earful from the government asking them to make a deal with Apple.
if they ruin our economy, the US bonds and US dollars they own become worthless as well.
Not sure why anyone is actually entertaining this thought process???? No country is going to go to Economic war with each other because of a company. Will not happen.
There you go. Can they achieve that? Well ignorants think not. The fact is that it is China that builds any Apple hardware as well as other merchandise. In that economic strangle it is just enough to convience China "rulers" who make anything happen and who run all this show (again ignorants frequenty corporate do not see this).
It is the same case as with oil lines in Europe through neiboring countries... just a little "preassure" with threataning that something would stop for a moment and everybody agrees to anything.
Wrong. China stops buying American debt, then either China must buy some other American asset or product OR see their currency appreciate significantly against the dollar, destroying their export industry.
Also, when you owe the band $1,000 it's your problem. When you owe the bank $1 trillion, it's the bank's problem.
Wrong as well. It'll hurt their export industry but not destroy it. There are plenty of other countries that but from them. China buys a great amount of scrap metal from us. They need us but we also need them.
The Chinese government is not so stupid as to ban export/import of Ipads. On the contrary, Proview might get an earful from the government asking them to make a deal with Apple.
who knows? Maybe there's Chinese Al Gore sitting in Proview's board. what if the CEO of Proview is a close friend of Jiang Zemin or Hu Jintao, like Jobs was to the Clintons?
Apple just needs to pay for using the name iPad, rather than infringing on other people's copyrights. They are just playing the game American companies love to play.
Apple just needs to pay for using the name iPad, rather than infringing on other people's copyrights rights. They are just playing the game American companies love to play.
The issue is how much. Proview is playing the game not Apple.
There you go. Can they achieve that? Well ignorants think not. The fact is that it is China that builds any Apple hardware as well as other merchandise. In that economic strangle it is just enough to convience China "rulers" who make anything happen and who run all this show (again ignorants frequenty corporate do not see this).
It is the same case as with oil lines in Europe through neiboring countries... just a little "preassure" with threataning that something would stop for a moment and everybody agrees to anything.
If Proview is to win, then thousands of thousands China people will be out of jobs, that's something the China gov't will not allow it. I'm sure Proview and Apple will work it out.
Why Apple is hoarding $100B and still refuses to build factories in the US? If iPad is mading the US, problem like this will not occur... Yeah, the price of iPad will increase. But if it's a good gadget, people will shell out the money especially it's made in the U.S.A.
Why Apple is hoarding $100B and still refuses to build factories in the US? If iPad is mading the US, problem like this will not occur... Yeah, the price of iPad will increase. But if it's a good gadget, people will shell out the money especially it's made in the U.S.A.
that's just a bad idea. Makes no sense to build low-end menial assembly jobs in US, IMO.
Why Apple is hoarding $100B and still refuses to build factories in the US? If iPad is mading the US, problem like this will not occur... Yeah, the price of iPad will increase. But if it's a good gadget, people will shell out the money especially it's made in the U.S.A.
They will pay through the nose, but the terms will be confidential and it will not have any severe or far reaching affect on Apple's bottom line.
Apple is gonna get screwed, but it's their own stupid fault. They didn't deal with the company which had the registered trademark in China. Or so says the court. Apple is appealing the decision to the highest court. We'll see what happens in the meantime.
Comments
Really? Can Foxconn just keep everything they make? I'm pretty sure they could make a bundle in their black market, especially given China's iPhone/iPad mania now. Apple's customer in the West would get pissed off big time though.
No one ever suggested that. Foxconn does not have a license to sell the product and would be guilty of patent and trademark infringement if they did so. (plus, I doubt very much that Apple would have signed a contract without specifically restricting Foxconn's ability to sell to the black market).
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
You write those claims as tho there's no question of them being unequivocally true.
IMHO the Chinese could consider those iPads as being manufactured/owned by Foxconn (or whoever) and being sold to Apple under contract and on upon completion, which includes packaging I believe. In which case it's conceivable that the product would be considered sold to Apple rather than being manufactured by Apple. If so, then Foxconn might not be permitted to sell/export them.
Just a thought.
The Chinese can't consider any such thing unless the contract is set up that way.
Furthermore, even if they are sold to Apple, as long as they're only exported, they do not infringe a Chinese trademark, so the government could not legally stop them.
sad, but glad apple is getting a taste of its own medicine.
Anybody who would side against Apple in this case doesn't belong on this forum, IMHO.
No one ever suggested that. Foxconn does not have a license to sell the product and would be guilty of patent and trademark infringement if they did so. (plus, I doubt very much that Apple would have signed a contract without specifically restricting Foxconn's ability to sell to the black market).
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
The Chinese can't consider any such thing unless the contract is set up that way.
Furthermore, even if they are sold to Apple, as long as they're only exported, they do not infringe a Chinese trademark, so the government could not legally stop them.
You keep working under the assumption that a contract in China is actually worth something. The fact that Proview is not abiding by the original contract should be a hint that law is not going to be a significant factor in this case.
You keep working under the assumption that a contract in China is actually worth something. The fact that Proview is not abiding by the original contract should be a hint that law is not going to be a significant factor in this case.
Precisely what I keep saying. People are thinking logically and like business men, this is outside of that thought pattern.
The point is that Apple is probably not obligated to pay Foxconn if Foxconn can't ship anything.
I find it more probable that Apple IS required to pay if the reason for non-shipment is Apple's fault. No other structure makes sense to me. But we're both just guessing.
Foxconn is totally 100% innocent here, and the courts have already found Apple to have violated applicable laws. IMO, Foxconn should not get screwed over by Apple here. Foxconn did nothing wrong, and Apple lost in court already.
The Chinese government is not so stupid as to ban export/import of Ipads. On the contrary, Proview might get an earful from the government asking them to make a deal with Apple.
Dear Apple,
We will stop buying American debt and destroy your economy. Don't forget that we have you by the short curlies.
Sincerely.
China
owning someone else's debt is a two-edged sword.
if they ruin our economy, the US bonds and US dollars they own become worthless as well.
owning someone else's debt is a two-edged sword.
if they ruin our economy, the US bonds and US dollars they own become worthless as well.
Not sure why anyone is actually entertaining this thought process???? No country is going to go to Economic war with each other because of a company. Will not happen.
It is the same case as with oil lines in Europe through neiboring countries... just a little "preassure" with threataning that something would stop for a moment and everybody agrees to anything.
Wrong. China stops buying American debt, then either China must buy some other American asset or product OR see their currency appreciate significantly against the dollar, destroying their export industry.
Also, when you owe the band $1,000 it's your problem. When you owe the bank $1 trillion, it's the bank's problem.
Wrong as well. It'll hurt their export industry but not destroy it. There are plenty of other countries that but from them. China buys a great amount of scrap metal from us. They need us but we also need them.
The Chinese government is not so stupid as to ban export/import of Ipads. On the contrary, Proview might get an earful from the government asking them to make a deal with Apple.
who knows? Maybe there's Chinese Al Gore sitting in Proview's board. what if the CEO of Proview is a close friend of Jiang Zemin or Hu Jintao, like Jobs was to the Clintons?
Apple just needs to pay for using the name iPad, rather than infringing on other people's copyrights rights. They are just playing the game American companies love to play.
The issue is how much. Proview is playing the game not Apple.
There you go. Can they achieve that? Well ignorants think not. The fact is that it is China that builds any Apple hardware as well as other merchandise. In that economic strangle it is just enough to convience China "rulers" who make anything happen and who run all this show (again ignorants frequenty corporate do not see this).
It is the same case as with oil lines in Europe through neiboring countries... just a little "preassure" with threataning that something would stop for a moment and everybody agrees to anything.
That hurt just reading.
Why Apple is hoarding $100B and still refuses to build factories in the US? If iPad is mading the US, problem like this will not occur... Yeah, the price of iPad will increase. But if it's a good gadget, people will shell out the money especially it's made in the U.S.A.
that's just a bad idea. Makes no sense to build low-end menial assembly jobs in US, IMO.
Why Apple is hoarding $100B and still refuses to build factories in the US? If iPad is mading the US, problem like this will not occur... Yeah, the price of iPad will increase. But if it's a good gadget, people will shell out the money especially it's made in the U.S.A.
So you're fine with $600 for an iPod nano?
I'm sure Proview and Apple will work it out.
That seems to be Apple's best option here.
They will pay through the nose, but the terms will be confidential and it will not have any severe or far reaching affect on Apple's bottom line.
Apple is gonna get screwed, but it's their own stupid fault. They didn't deal with the company which had the registered trademark in China. Or so says the court. Apple is appealing the decision to the highest court. We'll see what happens in the meantime.