The smartphone maker for the third world. Seems they aren't out selling Apple in the US.
It isn't so hard to fill the world with cheap junky phones ate a discount rate. As in the US, eventually people will want to move up to the best.
Not to mention that Siri just smokes everyone, although the android freaks deny it. After buying an iPad I hardly used my iPhone until Siri came along. Now the iPhone is the perfect mobile companion for stuff you do on the move.
With Third Recession on the way, Samsung decided it is better off to left Apple to sink with the U.S. while consolidating China and India.
As far as I'm concerned, I really don't care if Samsung or anyone else makes/sells more mobile phones than Apple so long as as Apple continues to make "insanely great products" that I like. To paraphrase Steve Jobs, Samsung doesn't have to lose for Apple to win.
So Samsung is happy to be Toyota while let Apple become BMW. Fair enough. Just don't mind odd Lexus(Galaxy) coming along now and again.
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Samsung do not supply any figures for sold or shipped. Thats my point, they leave it to market research firms to make figures up then post their invented shipped figures against the real sales figures from Apple.
But MORE = MORE $. They do good now but as a stock holder, I still want to see more phones sold. ;-) I don't think at all they need to dilute the brand at all but I'd love to see all the imitators out of the picture and Apple sell MORE phones at the prices now.
Ah... I see. You mean more Apple phones means more money for Apple.
Because the other guys already sell tons more phones... but don't make nearly as much money at it.
Erm, Apple provides REAL sales figures, Samsung reported their profit only, why? So analysts can make wild guesses as to the numbers of devices sold. It's all pie in the sky unless Samsung provide figures to back it up.
Absolutely. Lots of guesstimates, no data.
Analysts are well paid to make stuff up. Nothing to see here. Move along.
Whilst having number 1 market share is an envious and marketable position, somehow I don't think Apple minds being second, or even third, given they make more profit on their mobile phone business than all other manufacturers combined.
Of course, if *Apple* was #1, this board would be lit up with triumphant fan boys saying how awesomely important and dominant that ranking is. One thing about Apple users, they can make apple juice out of anything, even sour apples...
The smartphone race between Apple and Samsung is expected to heat up even further next week when Samsung unveils its new Galaxy S smartphone.
Which race? There are several involved:
- Race to sell most phones. Apple doesn't even compete. They aren't interested in selling lots of cheap phones.
- Race to provide innovative, market leading products. Apple has this race all sewed up - no one else comes close.
- Race to make the most profits. Apple has this one sewed up.
- Race to copy Apple's products. Samsung is the clear winner.
This 'race to gain the most market share' is all in the media's mind. Market share is not what drives Apple. Rather, Apple is driven by the desire to create fantastic products and to manufacture and sell them profitably.
Quote:
Originally Posted by djkikrome
But MORE phones does equal MORE MONEY which is good business. ;-)
Neither part of that is necessarily true.
1. "more phones equals more money". Not at all true. Apple currently sells tens of millions of phones at $600+ each. If they lowered the price to $1.99, they could sell more phones, but probably not enough to increase their revenues.
2. "more money which is good for business". Depends on which money you're talking about. If you're talking about profits, then the statement is mostly true. But you seem to be talking about more revenues, so the statement is not necessarily true. HP's Touchpad added revenues for the company which they company did not have in the previous year, so they had 'more money'. However, the product cost them more to make than the amount of money they received, so they lost money on the product line - which is generally NOT good for business.
As far as I'm concerned, I really don't care if Samsung or anyone else makes/sells more mobile phones than Apple so long as as Apple continues to make "insanely great products" that I like. To paraphrase Steve Jobs, Samsung doesn't have to lose for Apple to win.
So Samsung is happy to be Toyota while let Apple become BMW. Fair enough. Just don't mind odd Lexus(Galaxy) coming along now and again.
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
*Figure estimated by sight every time I walk into a Verizon or AT&T store.
Where do these research firms get their estimates from? What sucks about them is they get reported as fact rather than guesstimates. Same with tablet figures. I've seen figures that Android is 45%+ of the tablet marketbut yet we never get actual sales figures from Amazon or anyone else. Amazon's stock is set to open 16% higher (even though their profit was down) because they blew out wall street estimates. They can tell us how many new book titles are exclusive to Amazon yet they won't tell us how many Kindle Fire's they sold. Why not? I'll be interested to see where Amazon ends the day at but I'm amazed that Apple could have a blow out quarter in all ways but the stock increased only about 8% on Wednesday, was down slightly on Thursday (while other technology stocks were up) and is set to open down again today, What gives?
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
That's a very silly comment.
Samsung doesn't give phones away any more than Apple does. If ATT or Verizon or whoever bundles a phone with a data plan it doesn't mean the any manufacturer gave it to the telecom as a free phone. Verizon, ATT, etc paid for it whether it was an iPhone or a Galaxy or an LG or a Razr. Just like an iPhone when the carrier paid for a Galaxy S2 for their inventory It was "sold not shipped" whether it was in a consumer's hands or not. You have to use common sense.
BTW, yes Apple iPhones are given away "free" with contract just like other phones are bundled. While in the US it's only the 3GS, in other countries such as China even the newest iPhones can be had for "Free"
Apparently you are not a car guy, or you would realize the BMW is without a doubt the best comparison. Suberb engineering, incredible attention to detail, highly refined and great performance are all thoughts that come to mind when I think of BMW and Apple. Ferrari I think more insane performance, but not reliable, not practicle and not affordable. Apple, like BMW, is on the high end of the(relatively) affordable spectrum, with products that can range into the stratosphere. Ferrari, not so much.
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
*Figure estimated by sight every time I walk into a Verizon or AT&T store.
iPhones have been given away for free for some time now. You can get them from the Apple Store:
So they could sell one phone and it wouldn't matter to you that they're being called the "top vendor"?
Who's calling them the top vendor? Not Samsung themselves is it? I have no idea why it matters at all who's #1. I think even you have commented that the only thing that really counts is the profit, and in that area both Apple and Samsung seem to be getting by OK.
It also means that the more apple sells, the more money Samsung makes. Who supplies probably 25% of the hardware, including the display, to Apple for the iPad? Samsung.
Gotta love the bitterness and the denial that's oozing out around here.
Like it or not, people are buying these phones. You guys can keep on bleating the same tired, old "Shipped vs sold" talking point. It still doesn't stop the rally we've seen Samsung making even during the recession. You guys will probably still be rehashing that line during q2, q3, and q4 of 2012 and on as Samsung's fortunes continue to rise.
Let's try to have some logic in the way we approach this issue. Samsung can't "pad" retain channels by (somehow) forcing retail stores to just buy their phones several consecutive years. Never mind there's no "force" involved! Retail stores will only accept phones they expect to sell. Judging from the number of years they've been selling dumbphones and smartphones worldwide and garnering market share, I'd say those B&M stores have had high expectations of selling those phones, and they're repeat customers.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icelus
The smartphone maker for the third world. Seems they aren't out selling Apple in the US.
It isn't so hard to fill the world with cheap junky phones ate a discount rate. As in the US, eventually people will want to move up to the best.
Not to mention that Siri just smokes everyone, although the android freaks deny it. After buying an iPad I hardly used my iPhone until Siri came along. Now the iPhone is the perfect mobile companion for stuff you do on the move.
With Third Recession on the way, Samsung decided it is better off to left Apple to sink with the U.S. while consolidating China and India.
Quote:
Originally Posted by waybacmac
As far as I'm concerned, I really don't care if Samsung or anyone else makes/sells more mobile phones than Apple so long as as Apple continues to make "insanely great products" that I like. To paraphrase Steve Jobs, Samsung doesn't have to lose for Apple to win.
So Samsung is happy to be Toyota while let Apple become BMW. Fair enough. Just don't mind odd Lexus(Galaxy) coming along now and again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neiltc13
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Samsung do not supply any figures for sold or shipped. Thats my point, they leave it to market research firms to make figures up then post their invented shipped figures against the real sales figures from Apple.
Lets see if I can make this simple for you..
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by djkikrome
But MORE = MORE $. They do good now but as a stock holder, I still want to see more phones sold. ;-) I don't think at all they need to dilute the brand at all but I'd love to see all the imitators out of the picture and Apple sell MORE phones at the prices now.
Ah... I see. You mean more Apple phones means more money for Apple.
Because the other guys already sell tons more phones... but don't make nearly as much money at it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz
Erm, Apple provides REAL sales figures, Samsung reported their profit only, why? So analysts can make wild guesses as to the numbers of devices sold. It's all pie in the sky unless Samsung provide figures to back it up.
Absolutely. Lots of guesstimates, no data.
Analysts are well paid to make stuff up. Nothing to see here. Move along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieinHK
Whilst having number 1 market share is an envious and marketable position, somehow I don't think Apple minds being second, or even third, given they make more profit on their mobile phone business than all other manufacturers combined.
Of course, if *Apple* was #1, this board would be lit up with triumphant fan boys saying how awesomely important and dominant that ranking is. One thing about Apple users, they can make apple juice out of anything, even sour apples...
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
The smartphone race between Apple and Samsung is expected to heat up even further next week when Samsung unveils its new Galaxy S smartphone.
Which race? There are several involved:
- Race to sell most phones. Apple doesn't even compete. They aren't interested in selling lots of cheap phones.
- Race to provide innovative, market leading products. Apple has this race all sewed up - no one else comes close.
- Race to make the most profits. Apple has this one sewed up.
- Race to copy Apple's products. Samsung is the clear winner.
This 'race to gain the most market share' is all in the media's mind. Market share is not what drives Apple. Rather, Apple is driven by the desire to create fantastic products and to manufacture and sell them profitably.
Quote:
Originally Posted by djkikrome
But MORE phones does equal MORE MONEY which is good business. ;-)
Neither part of that is necessarily true.
1. "more phones equals more money". Not at all true. Apple currently sells tens of millions of phones at $600+ each. If they lowered the price to $1.99, they could sell more phones, but probably not enough to increase their revenues.
2. "more money which is good for business". Depends on which money you're talking about. If you're talking about profits, then the statement is mostly true. But you seem to be talking about more revenues, so the statement is not necessarily true. HP's Touchpad added revenues for the company which they company did not have in the previous year, so they had 'more money'. However, the product cost them more to make than the amount of money they received, so they lost money on the product line - which is generally NOT good for business.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairthrope
Quote:
Originally Posted by waybacmac
As far as I'm concerned, I really don't care if Samsung or anyone else makes/sells more mobile phones than Apple so long as as Apple continues to make "insanely great products" that I like. To paraphrase Steve Jobs, Samsung doesn't have to lose for Apple to win.
So Samsung is happy to be Toyota while let Apple become BMW. Fair enough. Just don't mind odd Lexus(Galaxy) coming along now and again.
Apple is not like BMW.
Apple is like Ferrari.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neiltc13
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
*Figure estimated by sight every time I walk into a Verizon or AT&T store.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jims1973
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
That's a very silly comment.
Samsung doesn't give phones away any more than Apple does. If ATT or Verizon or whoever bundles a phone with a data plan it doesn't mean the any manufacturer gave it to the telecom as a free phone. Verizon, ATT, etc paid for it whether it was an iPhone or a Galaxy or an LG or a Razr. Just like an iPhone when the carrier paid for a Galaxy S2 for their inventory It was "sold not shipped" whether it was in a consumer's hands or not. You have to use common sense.
BTW, yes Apple iPhones are given away "free" with contract just like other phones are bundled. While in the US it's only the 3GS, in other countries such as China even the newest iPhones can be had for "Free"
Quote:ZITHER GUY
Apple is not like BMW.
Apple is like Ferrari.
Apparently you are not a car guy, or you would realize the BMW is without a doubt the best comparison. Suberb engineering, incredible attention to detail, highly refined and great performance are all thoughts that come to mind when I think of BMW and Apple. Ferrari I think more insane performance, but not reliable, not practicle and not affordable. Apple, like BMW, is on the high end of the(relatively) affordable spectrum, with products that can range into the stratosphere. Ferrari, not so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jims1973
Quote:
Originally Posted by neiltc13
Apple can track the number of units sold and activated through iTunes. It's much more difficult for Samsung to track the number of units sold and the "shipped" number is probably the closest and most realistic they have.
Contrary to popular believe here, they don't report it because it somehow makes them look good - they do it because they have nothing else.
Actually Samsung reports the "Shipped" number because they give away half their phones. Apple doesn't offer a "buy one get one free" on any of their iOS devices, where Samsung does for about 80%* of their product line.
*Figure estimated by sight every time I walk into a Verizon or AT&T store.
iPhones have been given away for free for some time now. You can get them from the Apple Store:
http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/shop_iphone/family/iphone/iphone3gs?afid=p219%7CGOUS&cid=AOS-US-KWG
If Samsung didn't release exactly how many smartphones they sold, I'm not sure how they can be crowned King of smartphone land.
I'm not sure why it even matters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
I'm not sure why it even matters.
So they could sell one phone and it wouldn't matter to you that they're being called the "top vendor"?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
I'm not sure why it even matters.
So they could sell one phone and it wouldn't matter to you that they're being called the "top vendor"?
Usually you only see stuff like this in really bad movies.
Life imitates art, it would seem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
So they could sell one phone and it wouldn't matter to you that they're being called the "top vendor"?
Who's calling them the top vendor? Not Samsung themselves is it? I have no idea why it matters at all who's #1. I think even you have commented that the only thing that really counts is the profit, and in that area both Apple and Samsung seem to be getting by OK.
It also means that the more apple sells, the more money Samsung makes. Who supplies probably 25% of the hardware, including the display, to Apple for the iPad? Samsung.
Gotta love the bitterness and the denial that's oozing out around here.
Like it or not, people are buying these phones. You guys can keep on bleating the same tired, old "Shipped vs sold" talking point. It still doesn't stop the rally we've seen Samsung making even during the recession. You guys will probably still be rehashing that line during q2, q3, and q4 of 2012 and on as Samsung's fortunes continue to rise.
Let's try to have some logic in the way we approach this issue. Samsung can't "pad" retain channels by (somehow) forcing retail stores to just buy their phones several consecutive years. Never mind there's no "force" involved! Retail stores will only accept phones they expect to sell. Judging from the number of years they've been selling dumbphones and smartphones worldwide and garnering market share, I'd say those B&M stores have had high expectations of selling those phones, and they're repeat customers.
You don't need to be an MBA to figure this out.