So you have no proof of telecom involvement, then. So why bring it up? It seems more like a problem between Apple and Google than anything else.
If Google Voice had been blocked from use on Android devices or Windows Phone 7 devices, you'd have a talking point. As it stands, there's no evidence that says the telecoms had anything to do with that, and there's not much evidence of anything else happening, either.
If I remember correctly (*snort*), Google Voice's approval in the App Store was simply taking an inordinate amount of time. One could say it was someone at Apple lashing out against Google for their theft and betrayal, but if there's no evidence of that, you can't say it and expect it to be taken seriously. Wasn't it also rejected (for improper API use) the first time they submitted? If so, you have to have other considerations than 'petty bickering'.
I have no proof of telecom involvement, but I do have proof that the FTC does regulate and have influence over the types of circumstances I was mentioning, otherwise how would you explain their writing to AT&T and AT&T responding? If the FTC's jurisdiction didn't apply in these type of cases, they would have told Google that AT&T has nothing to do with these complaints and the FTC would not have bothered writing AT&T and investigating the complaint of anticompetitive behavior. In other words, the FTC would not have investigated the issues beyond the complaints filed against Apple.
Now you are correct, regarding that specific case that all the other considerations and alternative possible explanations make as much, if not more, sense as does the possibility that Apple was being anti-competitive. But my point wasn't to demonstrate Apple misbehaved. My point wasn't to show that poor Google got a tough deal. My point was that the FTC does play a role in these types of situations, and that is all I needed to make my point that, contrary to what you suggested, the telecoms cannot do whatever they please.
I've had my iPhone 4 for about over a year. I've never reset my usage statistics, so in all the time that I've owned it, I've Received 3.6 GB of data and Sent 673 MB. I'm under the $30/month "unlimited" grandfathered plan.
So really, I'm getting completely screwed on the deal. However the problem is that my only other option is to drop to the ludicrous 200MB/$15 plan which would burn even a normally low usage person like myself (as an aside, I'm really amazed at how some people can use so much mobile data. I feel like I'm using my data all the time, I constantly browse the web, read email, download apps, whatever. It must be insane amounts of HD video streaming or something)
So like if I compare the two plans currently available for new users, it's the $15 for 200 MB or $25 for 2 GB, so 1/10th the usage only costs 40% less. The only world that makes sense in is the one that says "we don't really expect anyone to buy the lower priced plan, we just offer it to pay lip service"
The other complaint I have about this is tethering. Again if folks are on an actually unlimited plan, I can see how it makes sense to charge extra for tethering, because they're going to use more data. But if a user is on a capped plan already, then tethering should be free. If I get to use 2 GB/month for my $25, then it shouldn't matter how I choose to use it. In a similar vein, if I have an iPhone and an iPad and I'm paying for a capped plan, I should be able to share the plan between the two devices.
In my dream world, the way the plans would work is that I'd pay some kind of basic access fee like $25 for 2 GB, then there would be a reasonable overage fee (like $10.00/1 GB for example) and then I'd be able to use that capacity in whatever way I like, pair as many devices as I want, use tethering, whatever. That way us normally low usage people who have exceptional months sometimes would be accommodated and that the high usage people would pay their fair share.
Of course before we get that there will be world peace, free universal health care, free college education for anyone that wants it, low taxes, an average life span of 250 years, Star Trek style replicators & transporters and flying cars.
Charging extra for SMS/MMS is BS. It is ALL DATA, so why pay for it? I do not use it, and you can use Google Voice as a free alternative to SMS charges too for non Apple people.
AT&T is also screwing the end users by not offering ANY tethering option on iPads, not to mention trying to charge extra for iPhone customers who have unlimited data -- yes, tethering should be part of unlimited! Tired of the word/marketing games companies play.
AT&T is NOT known for their infrastructure, just compare the lack of FFTH vs. Verizon FIOS -- AT&T is dragging their feet as long as possible to milk profits, where as Verizon is a technology leader. Granted, it's not cellular, but just shows the thinking of the AT&T dinosaur...
Where is TalkTime already? C-mon Apple, enable tethering, facetime on cell network, and roll out Talktime! Ya you lose carrier subsidies, but who cares!
Apple can't do any of that stuff on the cell nets if the carriers don't allow them. and given that they are dropping a load cause folks might stop using SMS which is basically pure profit for them, you can bet ATT will say no to anything that cuts off the need for big voice plans etc.
what I don't get is why they don't just use their powers to cut off those unlimited plans. Sure it means that folks might jump ship over it but really how many will. especially if you do it at the point of next upgrade and not in mid stream where they can cry foul and leave and ATT can't charge them an ETF since they changed the rules of the game
Talktime? Huh?! All you have to do is Facetime call someone and background it, then you switch to audio only. Bingo! Jailbreak and remove the WiFi only restriction. Bingo!
Only problem is there seems to be no way to do this on the Mac FaceTime side...
Where is TalkTime already? C-mon Apple, enable tethering, facetime on cell network, and roll out Talktime! Ya you lose carrier subsidies, but who cares!
The carriers cannot approve and disapprove anything they want. They can certainly try, but the US is a nation of laws and the carriers have to abide by those laws.
if it's going over their service they sure as heck can. US laws allow them that right.
so then Apple would have to restrict the service to wifi only.
A cellular network is private, and they can allow whatever they choose on their private network. If you do not like that, you have the choice to choose a DIFFERENT private network.
There is no such thing as a public cellular network!
The carriers cannot approve and disapprove anything they want. They can certainly try, but the US is a nation of laws and the carriers have to abide by those laws.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Oak
Thank god the AT&T and T-Mobile merger did not go through. Thank God
I hadn't thought about that since I heard it wouldn't be happening.
Thanks for that. The nightmares will probably start again… Horrific dystopian future with only two telecoms "competing"…
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
So you have no proof of telecom involvement, then. So why bring it up? It seems more like a problem between Apple and Google than anything else.
If Google Voice had been blocked from use on Android devices or Windows Phone 7 devices, you'd have a talking point. As it stands, there's no evidence that says the telecoms had anything to do with that, and there's not much evidence of anything else happening, either.
If I remember correctly (*snort*), Google Voice's approval in the App Store was simply taking an inordinate amount of time. One could say it was someone at Apple lashing out against Google for their theft and betrayal, but if there's no evidence of that, you can't say it and expect it to be taken seriously. Wasn't it also rejected (for improper API use) the first time they submitted? If so, you have to have other considerations than 'petty bickering'.
I have no proof of telecom involvement, but I do have proof that the FTC does regulate and have influence over the types of circumstances I was mentioning, otherwise how would you explain their writing to AT&T and AT&T responding? If the FTC's jurisdiction didn't apply in these type of cases, they would have told Google that AT&T has nothing to do with these complaints and the FTC would not have bothered writing AT&T and investigating the complaint of anticompetitive behavior. In other words, the FTC would not have investigated the issues beyond the complaints filed against Apple.
Now you are correct, regarding that specific case that all the other considerations and alternative possible explanations make as much, if not more, sense as does the possibility that Apple was being anti-competitive. But my point wasn't to demonstrate Apple misbehaved. My point wasn't to show that poor Google got a tough deal. My point was that the FTC does play a role in these types of situations, and that is all I needed to make my point that, contrary to what you suggested, the telecoms cannot do whatever they please.
Bummer man. You want to gouge your customers and other companies disrupt your gouging. Poor baby.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HKZ
Google Voice is a free app that allows free calls over data networks. Does it really need any more explaining than that?
No it doesnt. Google voice calls use cellular minutes.
Oops, accidentally posted twice.
Not once does this fscking a**hole EVER talk about:
"How can we benefit our customers?"
"How can we improve the lives of our customers?"
"How can we make things better & easier & faster for our customers?"
No, the only thing this jerk every talks about is:
"How can we make more profits and screw over our customers, every step of the way?"
I would absolutely love to beat the sh** out of this guy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
No it doesnt. Google voice calls use cellular minutes.
Depends. The GV app itself does, but other apps like Talkatone are data only.
Quote:
Originally Posted by johndoe98
Depends. The GV app itself does, but other apps like Talkatone are data only.
He only mentioned GV.
**** with my unlimited plan that I stuck with you for several years on and I will drop you like last weeks garbage. Hear that ATT.
It is the single reason you have any influence over my loyalty.
Remove the reason and I remove you from my monthly billing cycle payments.
I've had my iPhone 4 for about over a year. I've never reset my usage statistics, so in all the time that I've owned it, I've Received 3.6 GB of data and Sent 673 MB. I'm under the $30/month "unlimited" grandfathered plan.
So really, I'm getting completely screwed on the deal. However the problem is that my only other option is to drop to the ludicrous 200MB/$15 plan which would burn even a normally low usage person like myself (as an aside, I'm really amazed at how some people can use so much mobile data. I feel like I'm using my data all the time, I constantly browse the web, read email, download apps, whatever. It must be insane amounts of HD video streaming or something)
So like if I compare the two plans currently available for new users, it's the $15 for 200 MB or $25 for 2 GB, so 1/10th the usage only costs 40% less. The only world that makes sense in is the one that says "we don't really expect anyone to buy the lower priced plan, we just offer it to pay lip service"
The other complaint I have about this is tethering. Again if folks are on an actually unlimited plan, I can see how it makes sense to charge extra for tethering, because they're going to use more data. But if a user is on a capped plan already, then tethering should be free. If I get to use 2 GB/month for my $25, then it shouldn't matter how I choose to use it. In a similar vein, if I have an iPhone and an iPad and I'm paying for a capped plan, I should be able to share the plan between the two devices.
In my dream world, the way the plans would work is that I'd pay some kind of basic access fee like $25 for 2 GB, then there would be a reasonable overage fee (like $10.00/1 GB for example) and then I'd be able to use that capacity in whatever way I like, pair as many devices as I want, use tethering, whatever. That way us normally low usage people who have exceptional months sometimes would be accommodated and that the high usage people would pay their fair share.
Of course before we get that there will be world peace, free universal health care, free college education for anyone that wants it, low taxes, an average life span of 250 years, Star Trek style replicators & transporters and flying cars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
2007, 8, and 9 called.
… The call dropped because it was on AT&T, but I heard, "Tel… …ooch that we ha… …imited data and w… 'on't know w… …alking about."
sure ... you keep believing that ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooch
sure ... you keep believing that ...
They offered unlimited data. The burden of proof is on you to say otherwise.
Charging extra for SMS/MMS is BS. It is ALL DATA, so why pay for it? I do not use it, and you can use Google Voice as a free alternative to SMS charges too for non Apple people.
AT&T is also screwing the end users by not offering ANY tethering option on iPads, not to mention trying to charge extra for iPhone customers who have unlimited data -- yes, tethering should be part of unlimited! Tired of the word/marketing games companies play.
AT&T is NOT known for their infrastructure, just compare the lack of FFTH vs. Verizon FIOS -- AT&T is dragging their feet as long as possible to milk profits, where as Verizon is a technology leader. Granted, it's not cellular, but just shows the thinking of the AT&T dinosaur...
Quote:
Originally Posted by johndoe98
Where is TalkTime already? C-mon Apple, enable tethering, facetime on cell network, and roll out Talktime! Ya you lose carrier subsidies, but who cares!
Apple can't do any of that stuff on the cell nets if the carriers don't allow them. and given that they are dropping a load cause folks might stop using SMS which is basically pure profit for them, you can bet ATT will say no to anything that cuts off the need for big voice plans etc.
what I don't get is why they don't just use their powers to cut off those unlimited plans. Sure it means that folks might jump ship over it but really how many will. especially if you do it at the point of next upgrade and not in mid stream where they can cry foul and leave and ATT can't charge them an ETF since they changed the rules of the game
Only problem is there seems to be no way to do this on the Mac FaceTime side...
Quote:
Originally Posted by johndoe98
The carriers cannot approve and disapprove anything they want. They can certainly try, but the US is a nation of laws and the carriers have to abide by those laws.
if it's going over their service they sure as heck can. US laws allow them that right.
so then Apple would have to restrict the service to wifi only.
The idiots who trust CEO's with what should be a public trust deserve the high fees they have to pay.
There is no such thing as a public cellular network!