No, I think he meant all notebooks......because having been the visionary that he was he knew right away that everyone else would eventually copy the design of the MacBook Air.
My bad.. I should have added the /s sarcasm hint. I meant that many consumers are choosing to own MacBooks and MBA's and forgoing that cheap PC garbage. Eventually, everyone will own Apple notebooks so in a way, Steve will have been right that all notebooks will look like a Macbook because the WILL be Macbooks.
It's still shameless copying by the competition. At least the HP guy did admit that Apple did recognize Apple for what it did.
I think you are confusing me with someone else.. please go find and quote me. thanks for calling me a dishonest liar. wow. check your facts before you go all postal. Oh btw.. nice to meet you too.. geez what a jerk.
I think the comment was meant for me, sorry for that.
Was that before or after Sony? They had a few with this look back around 2005. You just didn't look very far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy
It's just the 'natural evolution', 'natural development', or whatever other bullshit so phrased. Somehow, whatever Apple is is only the 'natural evolution' of things, and only after Apple does them.
Sony has used designs like this. The problem with this kind of journalism is that it's agenda driven. They don't look for any other reference. They don't comment on the two in use even though that is what should really define a computing device.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid
Intel isn't forcing Apple to go to ARM, but they've already given Apple a swift kick. I don't know what Apple's CPU pricing is, but they're probably not getting the same volume discounts that the larger PC makers are getting. When the first MacBook Air was introduced, it had a custom-made Intel CPU. Yes, it eventually found its way into competing laptops. And Apple paid boutique prices for early access to that chip and a few others after it.
But not any more. For whatever reason, Apple no longer gets exclusive early access to the latest Intel CPUs. My guess is that Intel ended the honeymoon because Apple went with ARM-based SoCs for iPhone / iPad / Apple TV instead of the power-hungry Intel Atom chipset. Intel finally rolled out an Atom x86-based SoC this year. Five years after the iPhone was announced.
I really thought you were smarter than this. The early access thing was a myth, and we've seen plenty of explanations on it in the past. Apple has purchasing contracts like the other oems, most likely giving them priority over distributors. Regarding ARM, you couldn't run OSX on it today without some massive work, at which point the cost and energy advantages may or may not still be there.
Erm, no. That Vaio and the MBA are not alike at all.
If they did it today, someone would call it a macbook air clone. You may see that they're not the same thing. You have to understand my issue is that no one really makes an objective comparison when suggesting something is a copy.
If they did it today, someone would call it a macbook air clone. You may see that they're not the same thing. You have to understand my issue is that no one really makes an objective comparison when suggesting something is a copy.
Can you please state a model? The only Sony model mentioned in this thread so far, X505, released in 2005, doesn't look like anything Apple ever made.
I think the comment was meant for me, sorry for that.
J.
jnjnjn,
no need to be sorry. You did nothing wrong. Its not your fault some people don't take the time to figure out who said what and then go off blasting their mouth and making accusations at people for things they didn't even say.
Regarding ARM, you couldn't run OSX on it today without some massive work, at which point the cost and energy advantages may or may not still be there.
OK, I'll bite. Could you elaborate what specific massive work you are referring to?
OK, I'll bite. Could you elaborate what specific massive work you are referring to?
The "bite" response suggests I was trolling. Aren't you aware that the ARM soc used in an ipad has something close to the number crunching power of a G4? It would take a lot of engineering time attempting to scale something up to a design that would be appropriate for an OSX based machine, and many of the advantages seen at the ultra low power level may not hold up if the design has to be significantly altered.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
Can you please state a model? The only Sony model mentioned in this thread so far, X505, released in 2005, doesn't look like anything Apple ever made.
That's one that comes to mind. Since you don't like that comparison, I'll use an earlier one from HP.
I couldn't find one with something on the display, but the keyboard style and latch are similar to this new one. The black bezel is there. The trackpad is obviously a different design, but this is quite old. This time I'm using an HP Pavillion dv2000 from 2006. You weren't off on the Sony model. I think there's a Vaio that's a bit closer, but the one you mentioned is the same one I referenced. This is just a different example. This time I'm showing that HP does have a logical preceding device, and all of the copy noise never came up at that time. I don't think people on here pay any attention to the other oems, so it's easy to see anything with similarity as a clone.
The "bite" response suggests I was trolling. Aren't you aware that the ARM soc used in an ipad has something close to the number crunching power of a G4? It would take a lot of engineering time attempting to scale something up to a design that would be appropriate for an OSX based machine, and many of the advantages seen at the ultra low power level may not hold up if the design has to be significantly altered.
Honestly, you are reading into my "bite" comment way too much. I was simply looking to understand the "massive work" specifics which you were referring to. I going to to choose not to follow up to the rational behind of your response. Thanks.
Blatent rip off....... Sue Apple, Sue. HP is just making THEIR laptop look identical to the MacBookAir.
I won't be shocked if Apple doesn't sue. Tim made decide that it's not worth the negative PR or the legal costs on something so scant. Better to focus on killing them with sales.
Now if they copied the whole 'brick' method for craving out the bodies, which Apple has a patent on, that might be worthy of a lawsuit. but it looks like they didn't
Quote:
That's one that comes to mind. Since you don't like that comparison, I'll use an earlier one from HP.
I couldn't find one with something on the display, but the keyboard style and latch are similar to this new one. The black bezel is there. The trackpad is obviously a different design, but this is quite old. This time I'm using an HP Pavillion dv2000 from 2006. You weren't off on the Sony model. I think there's a Vaio that's a bit closer, but the one you mentioned is the same one I referenced. This is just a different example. This time I'm showing that HP does have a logical preceding device, and all of the copy noise never came up at that time. I don't think people on here pay any attention to the other oems, so it's easy to see anything with similarity as a clone.
I'm sorry, but do you think I'm retarded? My Dell Studio 17 looks FAR more like that HP than any Apple. It looks like Dell stole almost all the sculpting cues, Apple didn't do anything like that. If you are telling me you think that the newer Apples look like they've ripped that HP, then I don't know where to go from here. There are quite a lot of differences that make it not nearly on the order of this new HP Spectre Envy 15 product. And let's not forget the Compaqs that came after the Powerbooks that look like cheap Powerbooks.
X505 have few apparent similarities that would suggest to me like a rip-off, other than that they're also thin and small. Not much of the design language translated to make it a design copy.
You want to tell me that I haven't been paying attention to PC laptops, fine, but it's not actually true. I still look at them from time to time, though it's been a while since I've been happy with one. I can also distinguish from similar-ish to a blatant ape of multiple pieces of design language at the same time.
No, you should look at the new GPUs from PowerVR, they will be equally powerful.
J.
No they aren't. The Rogue supports OpenGL 4.x but the performance of it won't remotely touch those of AMD/Nvidia, but then again their power requirements put them in a completely different market segment.
Not necessarily a fair comparison since you are compared a previous generation dual-core CPU to a latest generation quad-core CPU aside from the different usage.
I actually think it is notable that based on your data the dual-core Cortex-A9 1.0 GHz solution is within 5 generations of surpassing the Intel Core i7 2600k. I grant you that is for a static target rather than a real world dynamic target. I think it would be interesting to see what ARM could do with a more performance-based architecture.
ARM Designs will never surpass Intel/AMD Desktop/Laptop designs because their power requirement preclude that from ever happening.
I've read a lot of posts about this or that CPU and GPU not comparing to other CPUs and GPUs but I haven't seen any comments or qualifiers that are comparing performance for a specific power draw.
Even that would be axiomatically wrong. We always see ARM paired with a GPU on the SoC but the GPU in the iPad is by Img Tech, a company I think both Apple and Intel have ownership of.
They have investment stakes in ARM but I believe they are non-voting shares and solely for the purpose of having access to ARM Designs.
If they did it today, someone would call it a macbook air clone. You may see that they're not the same thing. You have to understand my issue is that no one really makes an objective comparison when suggesting something is a copy.
Both the computers you have posted, be it via link or picture, don't look anything like an MBA and I can't see that anyone would claim that they were copies of Apple's designs.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dickprinter
No, I think he meant all notebooks......because having been the visionary that he was he knew right away that everyone else would eventually copy the design of the MacBook Air.
My bad.. I should have added the /s sarcasm hint. I meant that many consumers are choosing to own MacBooks and MBA's and forgoing that cheap PC garbage. Eventually, everyone will own Apple notebooks so in a way, Steve will have been right that all notebooks will look like a Macbook because the WILL be Macbooks.
It's still shameless copying by the competition. At least the HP guy did admit that Apple did recognize Apple for what it did.
I think the comment was meant for me, sorry for that.
J.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daramouthe
True, but Apple came to it first.
Was that before or after Sony? They had a few with this look back around 2005. You just didn't look very far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy
It's just the 'natural evolution', 'natural development', or whatever other bullshit so phrased. Somehow, whatever Apple is is only the 'natural evolution' of things, and only after Apple does them.
Sony has used designs like this. The problem with this kind of journalism is that it's agenda driven. They don't look for any other reference. They don't comment on the two in use even though that is what should really define a computing device.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid
Intel isn't forcing Apple to go to ARM, but they've already given Apple a swift kick. I don't know what Apple's CPU pricing is, but they're probably not getting the same volume discounts that the larger PC makers are getting. When the first MacBook Air was introduced, it had a custom-made Intel CPU. Yes, it eventually found its way into competing laptops. And Apple paid boutique prices for early access to that chip and a few others after it.
But not any more. For whatever reason, Apple no longer gets exclusive early access to the latest Intel CPUs. My guess is that Intel ended the honeymoon because Apple went with ARM-based SoCs for iPhone / iPad / Apple TV instead of the power-hungry Intel Atom chipset. Intel finally rolled out an Atom x86-based SoC this year. Five years after the iPhone was announced.
I really thought you were smarter than this. The early access thing was a myth, and we've seen plenty of explanations on it in the past. Apple has purchasing contracts like the other oems, most likely giving them priority over distributors. Regarding ARM, you couldn't run OSX on it today without some massive work, at which point the cost and energy advantages may or may not still be there.
Erm, no. That Vaio and the MBA are not alike at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen
Erm, no. That Vaio and the MBA are not alike at all.
If they did it today, someone would call it a macbook air clone. You may see that they're not the same thing. You have to understand my issue is that no one really makes an objective comparison when suggesting something is a copy.
Can you please state a model? The only Sony model mentioned in this thread so far, X505, released in 2005, doesn't look like anything Apple ever made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnjnjn
I think the comment was meant for me, sorry for that.
J.
jnjnjn,
no need to be sorry. You did nothing wrong. Its not your fault some people don't take the time to figure out who said what and then go off blasting their mouth and making accusations at people for things they didn't even say.
In a way, this is absurdly laughable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm
Regarding ARM, you couldn't run OSX on it today without some massive work, at which point the cost and energy advantages may or may not still be there.
OK, I'll bite. Could you elaborate what specific massive work you are referring to?
Or a MacBook Pro:
How they can claim what they do isn't copying but a natural progression is laughable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by snova
OK, I'll bite. Could you elaborate what specific massive work you are referring to?
The "bite" response suggests I was trolling. Aren't you aware that the ARM soc used in an ipad has something close to the number crunching power of a G4? It would take a lot of engineering time attempting to scale something up to a design that would be appropriate for an OSX based machine, and many of the advantages seen at the ultra low power level may not hold up if the design has to be significantly altered.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
Can you please state a model? The only Sony model mentioned in this thread so far, X505, released in 2005, doesn't look like anything Apple ever made.
That's one that comes to mind. Since you don't like that comparison, I'll use an earlier one from HP.
I couldn't find one with something on the display, but the keyboard style and latch are similar to this new one. The black bezel is there. The trackpad is obviously a different design, but this is quite old. This time I'm using an HP Pavillion dv2000 from 2006. You weren't off on the Sony model. I think there's a Vaio that's a bit closer, but the one you mentioned is the same one I referenced. This is just a different example. This time I'm showing that HP does have a logical preceding device, and all of the copy noise never came up at that time. I don't think people on here pay any attention to the other oems, so it's easy to see anything with similarity as a clone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm
The "bite" response suggests I was trolling. Aren't you aware that the ARM soc used in an ipad has something close to the number crunching power of a G4? It would take a lot of engineering time attempting to scale something up to a design that would be appropriate for an OSX based machine, and many of the advantages seen at the ultra low power level may not hold up if the design has to be significantly altered.
Honestly, you are reading into my "bite" comment way too much. I was simply looking to understand the "massive work" specifics which you were referring to. I going to to choose not to follow up to the rational behind of your response. Thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daramouthe
True, but Apple came to it first.
And in like a month Apple will release a revamp of the Air and folks will be all HP who? and it won't matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meniac
That's probably the most stupid thing being said in this battle between Apple and their followers. Can't believe it.
but it's true .
they didn't TRY. they just did it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank
Blatent rip off....... Sue Apple, Sue. HP is just making THEIR laptop look identical to the MacBookAir.
I won't be shocked if Apple doesn't sue. Tim made decide that it's not worth the negative PR or the legal costs on something so scant. Better to focus on killing them with sales.
Now if they copied the whole 'brick' method for craving out the bodies, which Apple has a patent on, that might be worthy of a lawsuit. but it looks like they didn't
I'm sorry, but do you think I'm retarded? My Dell Studio 17 looks FAR more like that HP than any Apple. It looks like Dell stole almost all the sculpting cues, Apple didn't do anything like that. If you are telling me you think that the newer Apples look like they've ripped that HP, then I don't know where to go from here. There are quite a lot of differences that make it not nearly on the order of this new HP Spectre Envy 15 product. And let's not forget the Compaqs that came after the Powerbooks that look like cheap Powerbooks.
X505 have few apparent similarities that would suggest to me like a rip-off, other than that they're also thin and small. Not much of the design language translated to make it a design copy.
You want to tell me that I haven't been paying attention to PC laptops, fine, but it's not actually true. I still look at them from time to time, though it's been a while since I've been happy with one. I can also distinguish from similar-ish to a blatant ape of multiple pieces of design language at the same time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnjnjn
No, you should look at the new GPUs from PowerVR, they will be equally powerful.
J.
No they aren't. The Rogue supports OpenGL 4.x but the performance of it won't remotely touch those of AMD/Nvidia, but then again their power requirements put them in a completely different market segment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro
Not necessarily a fair comparison since you are compared a previous generation dual-core CPU to a latest generation quad-core CPU aside from the different usage.
I actually think it is notable that based on your data the dual-core Cortex-A9 1.0 GHz solution is within 5 generations of surpassing the Intel Core i7 2600k. I grant you that is for a static target rather than a real world dynamic target. I think it would be interesting to see what ARM could do with a more performance-based architecture.
ARM Designs will never surpass Intel/AMD Desktop/Laptop designs because their power requirement preclude that from ever happening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Even that would be axiomatically wrong. We always see ARM paired with a GPU on the SoC but the GPU in the iPad is by Img Tech, a company I think both Apple and Intel have ownership of.
They have investment stakes in ARM but I believe they are non-voting shares and solely for the purpose of having access to ARM Designs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm
If they did it today, someone would call it a macbook air clone. You may see that they're not the same thing. You have to understand my issue is that no one really makes an objective comparison when suggesting something is a copy.
Both the computers you have posted, be it via link or picture, don't look anything like an MBA and I can't see that anyone would claim that they were copies of Apple's designs.