I love the idea of Retina Display Macs but..... there is always a 'but'.... Every time we get more speed and storage there are 'improvements' to the system which means that the potential performance hike virtually disappear. It is inevitable and I wouldn't want it otherwise but I remember a friend who had a PC laptop on which he ran DOS, way after Windows appeared. He was a writer and didn't require all the candy. I thought he was nuts but I remember being impressed with the speed of his computer. Starting up and closing in the blink of an eye was impressive. That's pretty much all... but I'd love a system which could respond to my every command in a couple of milliseconds. I have spent a lot of time watching icons bounce and beach balls spin over the years. I can't even remember what I was looking at while MacOS was 'thinking' in the old days - pre beach ball.
I love the idea of Retina Display Macs but..... there is always a 'but'.... Every time we get more speed and storage there are 'improvements' to the system which means that the potential performance hike virtually disappear. It is inevitable and I wouldn't want it otherwise but I remember a friend who had a PC laptop on which he ran DOS, way after Windows appeared. He was a writer and didn't require all the candy. I thought he was nuts but I remember being impressed with the speed of his computer. Starting up and closing in the blink of an eye was impressive. That's pretty much all... but I'd love a system which could respond to my every command in a couple of milliseconds. I have spent a lot of time watching icons bounce and beach balls spin over the years. I can't even remember what I was looking at while MacOS was 'thinking' in the old days - pre beach ball.
You are referring to Wirth's Law made popular by Niklaus Wirth, "Software is getting slower more rapidly than hardware becomes faster." Wirth attributed the saying to Martin Reiser, who, in the preface to his book on the Oberon System, wrote: The hope is that the progress in hardware will cure all software ills. However, a critical observer may observe that software manages to outgrow hardware in size and sluggishness.
- Wikipedia
In economics this is referring to as Jevon's paradox.
Do we have any chance of seing a Macbook Air refresh before the end of june? I am going to disney world for 2 weeks and would like to bring a MBA with us.
I believe 17" is the least popular of Apple's laptops. It is a niche product so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Alternatively they just might not update the design: The 13" and 15" MacBook Pros lose the optical drives and get all new and much thinner cases but have retina displays to differentiate them from the MacBook Airs, whilst 17" MacBook Pro is a carrier over of last year's model, maybe with a faster CPU.
Ask yourself this: If 17" retina displays are not yet available, does it really make sense for Apple to delay adding retina displays to their most popular models? How many sales would they really lose by not having a 17" retina display?
I believe 17" is the least popular of Apple's laptops. It is a niche product so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it.
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
In the same speech he said the clones were a good idea. He also wasn't in charge of Apple yet in any capacity. You can't use that as example of his modern perspective.
getting a bit tired waiting for news on the new Ivy Bridge mac books. actually quite tempted by the Samsung 9 series +/- ivy bridge
Yes, that makes complete sense. I'm sure you're 'tired of waiting', since you jump to call someone an Apple fanboy in your next post. And I wonder what kind of logic you use when you're so willing to substitute a completely different laptop, with a different OS, simply because of a slightly different chipset that you probably will never, ever notice in daily usage. Please, just buy the Samsung and stop with the stealth trolling bullshit.
In the same speech he said the clones were a good idea. He also wasn't in charge of Apple yet in any capacity. You can't use that as example of his modern perspective.
I use it as an example of his business sense.
Somebody's getting sentimental over the MBP 17" or the Mac Pro (that would be me) and not getting any love from their Apple fan brethren? Well, hell, we're dumping the whole Mac line!
You are referring to Wirth's Law made popular by Niklaus Wirth, "Software is getting slower more rapidly than hardware becomes faster." Wirth attributed the saying to Martin Reiser, who, in the preface to his book on the Oberon System, wrote: The hope is that the progress in hardware will cure all software ills. However, a critical observer may observe that software manages to outgrow hardware in size and sluggishness.
- Wikipedia
In economics this is referring to as Jevon's paradox.
BTW, Do you know "Aunt Minnie?"
Thanks for info - I have observed the Wirth / Reiser truth repeatedly for years. The MBA was the first major step forward. The SSD's make these machine wickedly fast at anything that involves the HD - e.g. opening apps.
Aunt Minnie? Should I know her? Sounds less sexy than Sadie, but whatever. You gonna introduce me?
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
[QUOTE]I believe 17" is the least popular of Apple's laptops. It is a niche product so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Alternatively they just might not update the design: The 13" and 15" MacBook Pros lose the optical drives and get all new and much thinner cases but have retina displays to differentiate them from the MacBook Airs, whilst 17" MacBook Pro is a carrier over of last year's model, maybe with a faster CPU.
Ask yourself this: If 17" retina displays are not yet available, does it really make sense for Apple to delay adding retina displays to their most popular models? How many sales would they really lose by not having a 17" retina display?[/QUOTE]
I agree with Orlando. Remember, in the past, the 17" has always lagged behind the 15" by several months whenever there's been a major design overhall, so the best you can hope for is a release in the fall, long after the introduction of the 13" and 15" models in June. Maybe that's enough time for them to ramp up 17" retina panels, or maybe they don't feel it's worth it and will continue with the old design. Remember also that they've tended to let "niche" designs stagnate when they intend to drop or replace it eventually but aren't quite ready to pull the trigger because its replacement is either late or too expensive. See: 30" Cinema Display; white MacBook; Mac Pro; XServe.
Can someone tell me why I need "retina" resolution in a display I'm viewing from 30" away? At this distance I certainly can't resolve individual pixels at a .25mm dot pitch, and I wouldn't be that happy burning the additional GPU cycles to push 4x pixels around.
Most people do not sit two and a half feet away from their displays. I can most definitely make out the pixels on an Apple Cinema Display at 15" away and the PPI is not that different.
Also remember we're talking strictly about laptop displays here; people get even closer to them because of the proximity of the keyboard. That's where the need is greatest, which is why you saw it happen first on the devices people hold closest -- iPhone, then iPad, now (smaller) laptops.
Thanks for info - I have observed the Wirth / Reiser truth repeatedly for years. The MBA was the first major step forward. The SSD's make these machine wickedly fast at anything that involves the HD - e.g. opening apps.
Aunt Minnie? Should I know her? Sounds less sexy than Sadie, but whatever. You gonna introduce me?
Many people are familiar with Moore's Law but few are familiar with the counterpoint, Wirth's Law.
I asked about Aunt Minnie because an "Aunt Minnie" is a medical imaging (aka Radiology) term for a finding (disease or condition) so obvious the late, great Ray Charles could see the finding. The term is analogous to a physician telling you that your arm is broken when your ulna is sticking 6 inches out to the side. "Aunt Minnie" is also a popular website for Radiology professionals. The association is that there is someone with a nom de plume "paxman" on the aforementioned website. "PACS" (sometimes misspelled "PAX") is a term associated with Radiology as "Picture Archiving and Communications System" (aka "PACS") is, typically, a client-server application for management, storage and remote viewing of medical images (CT, MR, Ultrasound, X-rays (radiographs)) etc.
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
Oh, please, the Mac has long had such small share of the U.S. market and an absolutely puny share of the worldwide market. Just get it over with.
I agree with Orlando. Remember, in the past, the 17" has always lagged behind the 15" by several months whenever there's been a major design overhall, so the best you can hope for is a release in the fall, long after the introduction of the 13" and 15" models in June.
That happened twice. Once for the Intel transition and once for the case redesign. Not "always".
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
Premature, not to mention completely idiotic. Macs are now selling more than they ever have been in Apple's entire history, by far. The fact that iPhones/iPads are seeing such insane, earth-shattering success doesn't change that fact. Mac sales and growth will keep increasing, while the rest of the PC industry shrinks, and the soon expected overhaul should accelerate that. Macs will not be discontinued until iOS products can replace them completely, and that won't be happening anytime soon. All you concern trolls can sleep tight.
Comments
I love the idea of Retina Display Macs but..... there is always a 'but'.... Every time we get more speed and storage there are 'improvements' to the system which means that the potential performance hike virtually disappear. It is inevitable and I wouldn't want it otherwise but I remember a friend who had a PC laptop on which he ran DOS, way after Windows appeared. He was a writer and didn't require all the candy. I thought he was nuts but I remember being impressed with the speed of his computer. Starting up and closing in the blink of an eye was impressive. That's pretty much all... but I'd love a system which could respond to my every command in a couple of milliseconds. I have spent a lot of time watching icons bounce and beach balls spin over the years. I can't even remember what I was looking at while MacOS was 'thinking' in the old days - pre beach ball.
Well there are rumors that Apple will drop the 17" MacBook Pro.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando
Well there are rumors that Apple will drop the 17" MacBook Pro.
Which is crap. They better darn well not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
I love the idea of Retina Display Macs but..... there is always a 'but'.... Every time we get more speed and storage there are 'improvements' to the system which means that the potential performance hike virtually disappear. It is inevitable and I wouldn't want it otherwise but I remember a friend who had a PC laptop on which he ran DOS, way after Windows appeared. He was a writer and didn't require all the candy. I thought he was nuts but I remember being impressed with the speed of his computer. Starting up and closing in the blink of an eye was impressive. That's pretty much all... but I'd love a system which could respond to my every command in a couple of milliseconds. I have spent a lot of time watching icons bounce and beach balls spin over the years. I can't even remember what I was looking at while MacOS was 'thinking' in the old days - pre beach ball.
You are referring to Wirth's Law made popular by Niklaus Wirth, "Software is getting slower more rapidly than hardware becomes faster." Wirth attributed the saying to Martin Reiser, who, in the preface to his book on the Oberon System, wrote: The hope is that the progress in hardware will cure all software ills. However, a critical observer may observe that software manages to outgrow hardware in size and sluggishness.
- Wikipedia
In economics this is referring to as Jevon's paradox.
BTW, Do you know "Aunt Minnie?"
Do we have any chance of seing a Macbook Air refresh before the end of june? I am going to disney world for 2 weeks and would like to bring a MBA with us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando
Well there are rumors that Apple will drop the 17" MacBook Pro.
I hope not, I would love to replace my current iMac with a 17" Macbook later on, especially if they come up something thinner and lighter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Which is crap. They better darn well not.
I believe 17" is the least popular of Apple's laptops. It is a niche product so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Alternatively they just might not update the design: The 13" and 15" MacBook Pros lose the optical drives and get all new and much thinner cases but have retina displays to differentiate them from the MacBook Airs, whilst 17" MacBook Pro is a carrier over of last year's model, maybe with a faster CPU.
Ask yourself this: If 17" retina displays are not yet available, does it really make sense for Apple to delay adding retina displays to their most popular models? How many sales would they really lose by not having a 17" retina display?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando
I believe 17" is the least popular of Apple's laptops. It is a niche product so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it.
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
In the same speech he said the clones were a good idea. He also wasn't in charge of Apple yet in any capacity. You can't use that as example of his modern perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkqd1337
getting a bit tired waiting for news on the new Ivy Bridge mac books. actually quite tempted by the Samsung 9 series +/- ivy bridge
Yes, that makes complete sense. I'm sure you're 'tired of waiting', since you jump to call someone an Apple fanboy in your next post. And I wonder what kind of logic you use when you're so willing to substitute a completely different laptop, with a different OS, simply because of a slightly different chipset that you probably will never, ever notice in daily usage. Please, just buy the Samsung and stop with the stealth trolling bullshit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
In the same speech he said the clones were a good idea. He also wasn't in charge of Apple yet in any capacity. You can't use that as example of his modern perspective.
I use it as an example of his business sense.
Somebody's getting sentimental over the MBP 17" or the Mac Pro (that would be me) and not getting any love from their Apple fan brethren? Well, hell, we're dumping the whole Mac line!
For laptops use primarily as a home desktop replacement 17" is a prime choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro
You are referring to Wirth's Law made popular by Niklaus Wirth, "Software is getting slower more rapidly than hardware becomes faster." Wirth attributed the saying to Martin Reiser, who, in the preface to his book on the Oberon System, wrote: The hope is that the progress in hardware will cure all software ills. However, a critical observer may observe that software manages to outgrow hardware in size and sluggishness.
- Wikipedia
In economics this is referring to as Jevon's paradox.
BTW, Do you know "Aunt Minnie?"
Thanks for info - I have observed the Wirth / Reiser truth repeatedly for years. The MBA was the first major step forward. The SSD's make these machine wickedly fast at anything that involves the HD - e.g. opening apps.
Aunt Minnie? Should I know her? Sounds less sexy than Sadie, but whatever. You gonna introduce me?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro
The Mac is the least popular of Apple's products. It is a niche product, so I could easily envision Apple getting rid of it. Steve Jobs said as much ca. 1996 (to paraphrase "If I was in charge of Apple again, I'd milk the Mac for all it's worth and move on to the next big thing.")
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
Ask yourself this: If 17" retina displays are not yet available, does it really make sense for Apple to delay adding retina displays to their most popular models? How many sales would they really lose by not having a 17" retina display?[/QUOTE]
I agree with Orlando. Remember, in the past, the 17" has always lagged behind the 15" by several months whenever there's been a major design overhall, so the best you can hope for is a release in the fall, long after the introduction of the 13" and 15" models in June. Maybe that's enough time for them to ramp up 17" retina panels, or maybe they don't feel it's worth it and will continue with the old design. Remember also that they've tended to let "niche" designs stagnate when they intend to drop or replace it eventually but aren't quite ready to pull the trigger because its replacement is either late or too expensive. See: 30" Cinema Display; white MacBook; Mac Pro; XServe.
Most people do not sit two and a half feet away from their displays. I can most definitely make out the pixels on an Apple Cinema Display at 15" away and the PPI is not that different.
Also remember we're talking strictly about laptop displays here; people get even closer to them because of the proximity of the keyboard. That's where the need is greatest, which is why you saw it happen first on the devices people hold closest -- iPhone, then iPad, now (smaller) laptops.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
Thanks for info - I have observed the Wirth / Reiser truth repeatedly for years. The MBA was the first major step forward. The SSD's make these machine wickedly fast at anything that involves the HD - e.g. opening apps.
Aunt Minnie? Should I know her? Sounds less sexy than Sadie, but whatever. You gonna introduce me?
Many people are familiar with Moore's Law but few are familiar with the counterpoint, Wirth's Law.
I asked about Aunt Minnie because an "Aunt Minnie" is a medical imaging (aka Radiology) term for a finding (disease or condition) so obvious the late, great Ray Charles could see the finding. The term is analogous to a physician telling you that your arm is broken when your ulna is sticking 6 inches out to the side. "Aunt Minnie" is also a popular website for Radiology professionals. The association is that there is someone with a nom de plume "paxman" on the aforementioned website. "PACS" (sometimes misspelled "PAX") is a term associated with Radiology as "Picture Archiving and Communications System" (aka "PACS") is, typically, a client-server application for management, storage and remote viewing of medical images (CT, MR, Ultrasound, X-rays (radiographs)) etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
Oh, please, the Mac has long had such small share of the U.S. market and an absolutely puny share of the worldwide market. Just get it over with.
/sarcasm
Quote:
Originally Posted by brianus
I agree with Orlando. Remember, in the past, the 17" has always lagged behind the 15" by several months whenever there's been a major design overhall, so the best you can hope for is a release in the fall, long after the introduction of the 13" and 15" models in June.
That happened twice. Once for the Intel transition and once for the case redesign. Not "always".
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
I wouldn't qualify 'the Mac' as a niche product quite yet. The ATV may be a niche product and I have always thought of the Mini as a bit niche, but to group all Macs and call them niche at this point is premature.
Premature, not to mention completely idiotic. Macs are now selling more than they ever have been in Apple's entire history, by far. The fact that iPhones/iPads are seeing such insane, earth-shattering success doesn't change that fact. Mac sales and growth will keep increasing, while the rest of the PC industry shrinks, and the soon expected overhaul should accelerate that. Macs will not be discontinued until iOS products can replace them completely, and that won't be happening anytime soon. All you concern trolls can sleep tight.