When I buy a new version of Word, I have to customize my toolbars and menus to my liking.
I like the way Apple does it better. If you learn how Apple does it, it just works. Then you don't miss "customizing toolbars and menus". You just do it how Apple intended it to be done.
After a while, you realize that Apple was right all along.
I like the way Apple does it better. If you learn how Apple does it, it just works. Then you don't miss "customizing toolbars and menus". You just do it how Apple intended it to be done.
After a while, you realize that Apple was right all along.
Only if they charge like $2.99 for it. Otherwise folks will go with Pages or one of the dozen Office clones that gets you all 3 programs for $9.99
Oh and it better launch with iCloud compatibility from day one and retina support etc. And be seriously bug checked up down left right and inside out. Because they are way way late to this game and anything that is missing or goes wrong will get them destroyed in the reviews and ratings.
Pages is actually pretty good, my only complaint about the iOS version is the inability to use text boxes etc to really layout a page. They went with only supporting their word processing templates and it's limited and a tad annoying. I'm hoping they will add at least their basic page layout stuff even if they don't include things like auto flow between text boxes etc.
Bullshit. Pages is $9.99. Word can be more IF it is 100% compatible with desktop Office, Sharepoint, etc.
IMHO the only iWork tool better than the MS Office equivalent is Keynote.
Word/Excel/Powerpoint can easily be $24.99 apps done correctly.
I have many of the Office clones on the iPad. They all suck in some way or another, even QuickOffice. So I'd rather spend $75 on the Official MS Office HD suite on the iPad if it works well within my enterprise environment. I certainly have quite a bit invested in productivity apps already so for business folks $$$ isn't that big an issue.
The problem is that MS Office Mobile is currently only a so-so product...limited by the WP7 size. On the iPad it could be something great but that remains to be seen.
99.999% of users who say Pages (or whatever) can't do what MS Word can do, really mean that they don't have the intelligence to find out how to use the other software properly.
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't.
By exporting as a Word or PowerPoint file. By exporting as a PDF or QuickTime movie if you don't need them to edit it.
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
A Keynote viewer for Windows would not have been of use for editing though. The solution then seems to be exporting to ppt, as Tallest Skil suggested.
By exporting as a Word or PowerPoint file. By exporting as a PDF or QuickTime movie if you don't need them to edit it.
This isn't a native file and loses formatting information. You can't round trip from Keynote and Powerpoint and get the same Keynote presentation back.
A Keynote viewer for Windows would not have been of use for editing though. The solution then seems to be exporting to ppt, as Tallest Skil suggested.
A keynote viewer for Windows means I can send a Keynote file to anyone using windows and they can see the presentation as intended. Not as a quicktime movie or a PDF file sans animations.
A keynote viewer for Windows means I can send a Keynote file to anyone using windows and they can see the presentation as intended. Not as a quicktime movie or a PDF file sans animations.
I was under the impression you wanted the file to be editable by your co-workers. A viewer wouldn't provide that option.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
Which is what the QuickTime movie is… I fail to see the problem here.
You fail to see the problem because you've never tried to give a keynote presentation at a facility that supported only windows. Or if your laptop breaks and the place you're giving the presentation only has windows machines. A powerpoint user with their presentation on a USB stick is still in business. A keynote user is dead in the water.
A quicktime movie is not nearly the same as being able to give the presentation in keynote. It's a movie, not a presentation. An example is that I might have a hyperlink to backup slides on a page. If asked a detailed question I can quickly navigate to those slides and back.
Or something as simple as quickly backing up a few slides to answer a question. Try that in whatever is playing your quicktime movie on windows.
Giving a presentation with your own hardware is all very good and many times this can be accommodated. Sometimes not so much.
A fully functional keynote viewer on Windows would make Keynote a far better powerpoint replacement. It's usually possible to ask folks to download some software for you to have no the machine...especially given the popularity of macs.
I was under the impression you wanted the file to be editable by your co-workers. A viewer wouldn't provide that option.
He was stating that folks that choose MS Office over iWork was stupid/lazy/whatever because you can do everything necessary in iWork. So I provided the key limitation of iWork...you can only use it on a Mac and most of the world still runs Windows.
If you're going to export to word or powerpoint anyway you might as well stay with MS Office in the first place. Which is primarily why I finally gave up on Keynote. My Keynote presentations looked great in Keynote and like ass in Powerpoint. I'm not big on fancy transitions or animations but I liked the templates I had purchased and those simply didn't translate will into PPT. I could dumb them down to work in PPT but then...what's the point in staying with Keynote?
He was stating that folks that choose MS Office over iWork was stupid/lazy/whatever because you can do everything necessary in iWork. So I provided the key limitation of iWork...you can only use it on a Mac and most of the world still runs Windows.
If you're going to export to word or powerpoint anyway you might as well stay with MS Office in the first place. Which is primarily why I finally gave up on Keynote. My Keynote presentations looked great in Keynote and like ass in Powerpoint. I'm not big on fancy transitions or animations but I liked the templates I had purchased and those simply didn't translate will into PPT. I could dumb them down to work in PPT but then...what's the point in staying with Keynote?
I see your point.
A Keynote viewer for Windows will not sell more Apple hardware though. Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to provide cross-platform compatibility.
A Keynote viewer for Windows will not sell more Apple hardware though. Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to provide cross-platform compatibility.
Porting iWork or iLife to Windows will not sell more Apple hardware agreed.
Having more Keynote presentations used regularly might since you can only create Keynote presentations on a Mac (or an iPad). I used to get asked "Nice presentation, how do I do that?" which got the response "Step 1: Buy a mac, Step 2: buy iWork..."
It's not all that important unless Apple has a hankering for more enterprise presence...or education which is another place that Powerpoint has dominance. My kid does Powerpoint presentations even through his computer lab is all 27" iMacs...heck, you can't even view a Keynote presentation on the Mac without iWork. I guess it requires too much Quartz to make work well on a PC but geez, at least let me send a .key file to folks on OSX without iWork and let them view it without editing capabilities.
I suppose I can ask that they log into iWork.com to bring up the presentation...sketchy though.
So use a converter to make an MKV version to take along with you.
No, it's a presentation.
Which you can do with the QuickTime option.
QuickTime lets you step through slides, and you can always just drag the time bar backward in another player.
It's pretty evident you've never tried this.
I have. Have you? It simply doesn't work as well and many if not most times you can't do it from the clicker. How many presentations do you give a month? Do you even use Keynote? And the hyperlink option in the QT export was buggy in the past...and when I was using it you got three options: manual advance (pauses at each slide), timed slides or hyperlinks (but only hyperlinks worked).
Often what you want is a nice clean presentation with good flow but the ability to set clickable links in the slide just in case you need to zip down into the weeds for a particular topic for a particular audience.
It's not a presentation. It's a movie. And for high quality it was a feaking huge movie. Don't tell me what the hell my experience has been.
It's not nearly the same as giving the presentation in Keynote which you would know if you actually had to do it on a regular basis.
Of course not. But it's what you have to deal with when you don't take your own hardware.
Not in comparison to PowerPoint. You can go anywhere in the business/edu world and reasonably expect that the pc connected to a projector or HDTV has MS Office sitting on it.
Of course not. But it's what you have to deal with when you don't take your own hardware.
You'd be surprised how many people go to give talks with their MacBooks and forget the VGA adapter. Many projectors are still only equipped with a VGA input.
If everyone was using only Apple products (Keynotes, Apple hardware) then everything would just work. It's other people's preferences for diverse products that destroy compatibility and can render an expensive Apple product useless in specific situations.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky
When I buy a new version of Word, I have to customize my toolbars and menus to my liking.
I like the way Apple does it better. If you learn how Apple does it, it just works. Then you don't miss "customizing toolbars and menus". You just do it how Apple intended it to be done.
After a while, you realize that Apple was right all along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyram Gestan
I like the way Apple does it better. If you learn how Apple does it, it just works. Then you don't miss "customizing toolbars and menus". You just do it how Apple intended it to be done.
After a while, you realize that Apple was right all along.
Ummm, yeah okay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stniuk
If they make it for iOS they will be shooting their own tablets in the foot before they even launch. Or maybe they know they will bomb anyway......
Why, it won't be the full version of Office. Just another neutered Office app like the rest of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
Only if they charge like $2.99 for it. Otherwise folks will go with Pages or one of the dozen Office clones that gets you all 3 programs for $9.99
Oh and it better launch with iCloud compatibility from day one and retina support etc. And be seriously bug checked up down left right and inside out. Because they are way way late to this game and anything that is missing or goes wrong will get them destroyed in the reviews and ratings.
Pages is actually pretty good, my only complaint about the iOS version is the inability to use text boxes etc to really layout a page. They went with only supporting their word processing templates and it's limited and a tad annoying. I'm hoping they will add at least their basic page layout stuff even if they don't include things like auto flow between text boxes etc.
Bullshit. Pages is $9.99. Word can be more IF it is 100% compatible with desktop Office, Sharepoint, etc.
IMHO the only iWork tool better than the MS Office equivalent is Keynote.
Word/Excel/Powerpoint can easily be $24.99 apps done correctly.
I have many of the Office clones on the iPad. They all suck in some way or another, even QuickOffice. So I'd rather spend $75 on the Official MS Office HD suite on the iPad if it works well within my enterprise environment. I certainly have quite a bit invested in productivity apps already so for business folks $$$ isn't that big an issue.
The problem is that MS Office Mobile is currently only a so-so product...limited by the WP7 size. On the iPad it could be something great but that remains to be seen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacHiavelli92
99.999% of users who say Pages (or whatever) can't do what MS Word can do, really mean that they don't have the intelligence to find out how to use the other software properly.
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't.
By exporting as a Word or PowerPoint file. By exporting as a PDF or QuickTime movie if you don't need them to edit it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
A Keynote viewer for Windows would not have been of use for editing though. The solution then seems to be exporting to ppt, as Tallest Skil suggested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
By exporting as a Word or PowerPoint file. By exporting as a PDF or QuickTime movie if you don't need them to edit it.
This isn't a native file and loses formatting information. You can't round trip from Keynote and Powerpoint and get the same Keynote presentation back.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio
A Keynote viewer for Windows would not have been of use for editing though. The solution then seems to be exporting to ppt, as Tallest Skil suggested.
A keynote viewer for Windows means I can send a Keynote file to anyone using windows and they can see the presentation as intended. Not as a quicktime movie or a PDF file sans animations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
A keynote viewer for Windows means I can send a Keynote file to anyone using windows and they can see the presentation as intended. Not as a quicktime movie or a PDF file sans animations.
I was under the impression you wanted the file to be editable by your co-workers. A viewer wouldn't provide that option.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
Okay Mr Genius. Answer me this:
How do I send native Keynote or Pages files to my co-workers for editing with the reasonable expectation that they can open them on their Windows machines or even view the document?
You can't. There's not even a Keynote viewer on Windows. Something they should have fixed YEARS ago. If I can't send a Keynote presentation around or use it at a conference that only has Windows boxes attached to their projectors then it's simply not viable an alternative no matter how great it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
A keynote viewer for Windows means I can send a Keynote file to anyone using windows and they can see the presentation as intended.
Which is what the QuickTime movie is… I fail to see the problem here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Which is what the QuickTime movie is… I fail to see the problem here.
You fail to see the problem because you've never tried to give a keynote presentation at a facility that supported only windows. Or if your laptop breaks and the place you're giving the presentation only has windows machines. A powerpoint user with their presentation on a USB stick is still in business. A keynote user is dead in the water.
A quicktime movie is not nearly the same as being able to give the presentation in keynote. It's a movie, not a presentation. An example is that I might have a hyperlink to backup slides on a page. If asked a detailed question I can quickly navigate to those slides and back.
Or something as simple as quickly backing up a few slides to answer a question. Try that in whatever is playing your quicktime movie on windows.
Giving a presentation with your own hardware is all very good and many times this can be accommodated. Sometimes not so much.
A fully functional keynote viewer on Windows would make Keynote a far better powerpoint replacement. It's usually possible to ask folks to download some software for you to have no the machine...especially given the popularity of macs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio
I was under the impression you wanted the file to be editable by your co-workers. A viewer wouldn't provide that option.
He was stating that folks that choose MS Office over iWork was stupid/lazy/whatever because you can do everything necessary in iWork. So I provided the key limitation of iWork...you can only use it on a Mac and most of the world still runs Windows.
If you're going to export to word or powerpoint anyway you might as well stay with MS Office in the first place. Which is primarily why I finally gave up on Keynote. My Keynote presentations looked great in Keynote and like ass in Powerpoint. I'm not big on fancy transitions or animations but I liked the templates I had purchased and those simply didn't translate will into PPT. I could dumb them down to work in PPT but then...what's the point in staying with Keynote?
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
He was stating that folks that choose MS Office over iWork was stupid/lazy/whatever because you can do everything necessary in iWork. So I provided the key limitation of iWork...you can only use it on a Mac and most of the world still runs Windows.
If you're going to export to word or powerpoint anyway you might as well stay with MS Office in the first place. Which is primarily why I finally gave up on Keynote. My Keynote presentations looked great in Keynote and like ass in Powerpoint. I'm not big on fancy transitions or animations but I liked the templates I had purchased and those simply didn't translate will into PPT. I could dumb them down to work in PPT but then...what's the point in staying with Keynote?
I see your point.
A Keynote viewer for Windows will not sell more Apple hardware though. Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to provide cross-platform compatibility.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
You fail to see the problem because you've never tried to give a keynote presentation at a facility that supported only windows
So use a converter to make an MKV version to take along with you.
Quote:
A quicktime movie is not nearly the same as being able to give the presentation in keynote. It's a movie, not a presentation.
No, it's a presentation.
Quote:
An example is that I might have a hyperlink to backup slides on a page. If asked a detailed question I can quickly navigate to those slides and back.
Which you can do with the QuickTime option.
Quote:
Or something as simple as quickly backing up a few slides to answer a question. Try that in whatever is playing your quicktime movie on windows.
QuickTime lets you step through slides, and you can always just drag the time bar backward in another player.
It's pretty evident you've never tried this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio
I see your point.
A Keynote viewer for Windows will not sell more Apple hardware though. Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to provide cross-platform compatibility.
Porting iWork or iLife to Windows will not sell more Apple hardware agreed.
Having more Keynote presentations used regularly might since you can only create Keynote presentations on a Mac (or an iPad). I used to get asked "Nice presentation, how do I do that?" which got the response "Step 1: Buy a mac, Step 2: buy iWork..."
It's not all that important unless Apple has a hankering for more enterprise presence...or education which is another place that Powerpoint has dominance. My kid does Powerpoint presentations even through his computer lab is all 27" iMacs...heck, you can't even view a Keynote presentation on the Mac without iWork. I guess it requires too much Quartz to make work well on a PC but geez, at least let me send a .key file to folks on OSX without iWork and let them view it without editing capabilities.
I suppose I can ask that they log into iWork.com to bring up the presentation...sketchy though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
So use a converter to make an MKV version to take along with you.
No, it's a presentation.
Which you can do with the QuickTime option.
QuickTime lets you step through slides, and you can always just drag the time bar backward in another player.
It's pretty evident you've never tried this.
I have. Have you? It simply doesn't work as well and many if not most times you can't do it from the clicker. How many presentations do you give a month? Do you even use Keynote? And the hyperlink option in the QT export was buggy in the past...and when I was using it you got three options: manual advance (pauses at each slide), timed slides or hyperlinks (but only hyperlinks worked).
Often what you want is a nice clean presentation with good flow but the ability to set clickable links in the slide just in case you need to zip down into the weeds for a particular topic for a particular audience.
It's not a presentation. It's a movie. And for high quality it was a feaking huge movie. Don't tell me what the hell my experience has been.
It's not nearly the same as giving the presentation in Keynote which you would know if you actually had to do it on a regular basis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
It's not nearly the same as giving the presentation in Keynote which you would know if you actually had to do it on a regular basis.
Of course not. But it's what you have to deal with when you don't take your own hardware.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Of course not. But it's what you have to deal with when you don't take your own hardware.
Not in comparison to PowerPoint. You can go anywhere in the business/edu world and reasonably expect that the pc connected to a projector or HDTV has MS Office sitting on it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Of course not. But it's what you have to deal with when you don't take your own hardware.
You'd be surprised how many people go to give talks with their MacBooks and forget the VGA adapter. Many projectors are still only equipped with a VGA input.
If everyone was using only Apple products (Keynotes, Apple hardware) then everything would just work. It's other people's preferences for diverse products that destroy compatibility and can render an expensive Apple product useless in specific situations.