Well this sucks. By the time the iPhone 5 comes out it will have the dubious distinction of being the smallest smartphone on the market. The only thing holding me back is the Find Friends feature and maybe Siri. Where is that Sammy brochure?
I maintain that I think it's a completely idiotic decision. I maintain that I see no benefit to it whatsoever. I also think it may be shortly discontinued and Cook and Co. thoroughly (and quite overly, though not incorrectly) blamed for a "bad choice".
Has hell frozen over or something? Even Tallest now agrees there will be an iPad Mini later this year so it must be true.
I think Cook & Co have learnt from their past mistakes and no matter how much they deny it I suspect they have done a lot of secret market research before deciding to launch this product. Even if it's just listening to customer comments on the current iPad.
I think they know exactly who their target market is for the iPad Mini and they know what features & price point they are looking for.
Having worked as a Product Manager in the IT industry myself I know this stuff just doesn't happen by accident or on a wing and a prayer.
I think Cook & Co have learnt from their past mistakes…
They haven't made any, though. They've had this gig for less than a year. You'd have to screw up royally to do something newsworthily bad in that amount of time.
Even if it's just listening to customer comments…
That's the worst way to go about making new products.
I think they know exactly who their target market is for the iPad Mini…
Guess Apple's wrong wrong wrong, as that's not how they made products in the last 15 years. Or in the early Steve days, either.
Do you believe everything Apple says?
No offence but considering how many posts you make on a daily basis you seem remarkably ill informed about things.
Would you like me mention the Apple products that failed miserably or the fact that they nearly went out of business in the 1990s. Apple III, Lisa, Pippin, Newton, Cube, etc, etc - it's quite a long list. They all failed under Steve's watch.
It's only in the past few years that Apple started to get things right - most of the time (cough) - forgetting Ping, Cube, MobileMe, iPod HiFi.
Steve made just as many mistakes as he did successes - it's only the fact that the recent products have proved so good that Apple are in such a good position now.
I don't think Tim Cook will make the same mistake - I think he is a more pragmatic person who will look to market research in a way Steve never did rather than relying solely on intuition.
[quote name="Shaun, UK" url="/t/151200/rumor-next-gen-iphone-ipad-mini-engineering-samples-pictured/40#post_2144981"]Would you like me mention the Apple products that failed miserably or the fact that they nearly went out of business in the 1990s. Apple III, Lisa, Pippin, Newton, Cube, etc, etc - it's quite a long list. They all failed under Steve's watch.[/QUOTE]
Nice try, pretending that Apple nearly went out of business on Steve's watch. That's very clever. Save for the part where anyone can see through it in a heartbeat. No offense, but considering how few posts you make…
I've accidentally pressed the home button when playing a game in landscape mode, and while it is frustrating, imagine how bad it would be if it were an off-screen capacitive button! One of the things I don't care about on the Android tablets is how a portion of the screen is dedicated to a band of touch buttons. To me, I am giving up real estate on the screen in lieu of a physical button on the bezel. I'd take the latter any day.
I am really amused by the lack of imagination people showing on this board.
1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)
2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.
3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.
Whatever works, just leave the real estate to the screen!
[quote name="jason98" url="/t/151200/rumor-next-gen-iphone-ipad-mini-engineering-samples-pictured/40#post_2145003"]1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)[/QUOTE]
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
[QUOTE]2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.[/QUOTE]
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
[QUOTE]3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.[/QUOTE]
And have it break [I]without[/I] human negligence, unlike the current button.
[QUOTE]Whatever works just leave the real estate to the screen![/QUOTE]
[quote name="jason98" url="/t/151200/rumor-next-gen-iphone-ipad-mini-engineering-samples-pictured/40#post_2145025"]You already have one. It is called a Power button.[/QUOTE]
That doesn't take me to the Springboard from an app.
[QUOTE]Do you often bump the Power button?[/QUOTE]
I never have my iPad upside down, because I have the Home Button as a frame of reference.
[QUOTE]It is actually the Home button that breaks the most on iPhones:[/QUOTE]
The Home Button is the one that PEOPLE break the most.
[QUOTE]No, not on a phone. You do not hold it like a tablet.[/QUOTE]
Oh, right, both in the same thread. So where on the phone would you put it?
1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
Quote:
2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
Quote:
3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.
And have it break without human negligence, unlike the current button.
Quote:
Whatever works just leave the real estate to the screen!
You realize we need a bezel, right?
I'm not convinced we do need a bezel but I do agree that apps and whatever you're viewing or working with should normally stay away from the bezel or hand holding area. That area could be used for things like notifications or status info (like how many are connected to your personal hotspot). Also if you're watching a movie and the ipad is standing on its own you could use the whole surface, edge to edge. I'll leave this to the imaginations of the developers to handle appropriately.
I still want a physical home button though, wherever they put it.
Spot on. Holding the iPad mini in one hand will be as critical as making it fit into those inside jacket pockers
From the pictures, I figure the size of the model is about 20cm x 14cm (7.9"x5.5"). Assuming a 7.85" screen, the bezels will be about 1cm (0.4") on the sides and about 2cm (0.8") on top and bottom. This won't fit in a jacket pocket but it will fit into bigger coat pockets and small purses, all in all maybe a reasonable tradeoff for a whole new market.
Would you like me mention the Apple products that failed miserably or the fact that they nearly went out of business in the 1990s. Apple III, Lisa, Pippin, Newton, Cube, etc, etc - it's quite a long list. They all failed under Steve's watch.
Nice try, pretending that Apple nearly went out of business on Steve's watch. That's very clever. Save for the part where anyone can see through it in a heartbeat. No offense, but considering how few posts you make…
Yada yada. Get it?
Maybe if you took the time to read my OP rather than jumping in to post another "clever" reply you would notice that I never said Apple nearly folded under Steve's watch. I said that Steve had just as many failures as he did successes - even in recent times. Apple's current position is founded entirely on 3 products - the iPod, iPhone and iPad. Without them Apple would be nowhere.
Steve famously never relied on market research. Some would say that's why they had so many failed products before the iOS devices came along. Who knows. I think Tim Cook will adopt a different approach based less on intuition and more on analysis and research.
A dedicated software gesture will work most of the time.
And you think that's good enough? Pitch this to Microsoft, then. "Most of the time" isn't Apple's gig.
…use Power button to get to lock screen.
Which then takes me right back into the frozen application, so it's pointless.
That's right. Using a device breaks it eventually, similar to "Life is dangerous - it leads to death"
Funny you should mention lifetimes, as the assumed lifespan of an iPhone is, what, two years? Let's be generous and say four.
My iPhone is a Day One 2007 model that is now twelve days past its fifth birthday. It has gone in my right pocket nearly every single morning since the day I obtained it and is used multiple times per day. Works like the day out of the box. Its Home Button is flawless.
Things always break. They last longer when you respect them.
The question in my mind is how wide is the tablet going to be (from a portrait perspective). Will it fit into a jacket or coat pocket? This will require the side bezels to be very narrow and then the question becomes whether it can be held conveniently in one hand.
If it doesn't fit into a coat pocket then I don't see it being much more mobile than a full sized ipad and doesn't differentiate itself enough.
Don't say that about it being "much more mobile than a full size ipad" to Island Hermit. Don't even suggest to him that can't fit in pockets or even pant pockets, that it is no less mobile than a iPad, because you see, it is "smaller than a ipad" and by that standard, it is therefor more mobile. It matters not, regarding how much smaller or even the dimensions of the item that determine if it is pocketable or not.
Yep, I'm sitting on the patio after dinner reading this and typing on my iPad 3 (the weather is a delightful 75° F no degree symbol on iPad by the way copy and paste from Wikipedia ) but tomorrow when I'm off to the office on mass transit I would totally dig a mini. iPhone is just too small except for emergency info or just checking email or txt messages. I'm a buyer on day 1 also.
Just hold down the "0" button on your iPad keyboard to make the ° symbol.
Just hold down the "0" button on your iPad keyboard to make the ° symbol.
I just did it.
I always forget about that on mine. I do appreciate how the Keyboard Dock operates just like a regular Mac's keyboard, however, with all the shortcuts with which we're familiar.
Comments
Well this sucks. By the time the iPhone 5 comes out it will have the dubious distinction of being the smallest smartphone on the market. The only thing holding me back is the Find Friends feature and maybe Siri. Where is that Sammy brochure?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I actually buy it.
Not this crap. Not this DigiTimes-level stuff.
I buy that there'll be a smaller iPad.
I maintain that I think it's a completely idiotic decision. I maintain that I see no benefit to it whatsoever. I also think it may be shortly discontinued and Cook and Co. thoroughly (and quite overly, though not incorrectly) blamed for a "bad choice".
Has hell frozen over or something? Even Tallest now agrees there will be an iPad Mini later this year so it must be true.
I think Cook & Co have learnt from their past mistakes and no matter how much they deny it I suspect they have done a lot of secret market research before deciding to launch this product. Even if it's just listening to customer comments on the current iPad.
I think they know exactly who their target market is for the iPad Mini and they know what features & price point they are looking for.
Having worked as a Product Manager in the IT industry myself I know this stuff just doesn't happen by accident or on a wing and a prayer.
They haven't made any, though. They've had this gig for less than a year. You'd have to screw up royally to do something newsworthily bad in that amount of time.
That's the worst way to go about making new products.
Then they're the only ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
That's the worst way to go about making new products.
Quote:
I think they know exactly who their target market is for the iPad Mini…
Then they're the only ones.
As usual you are wrong wrong and wrong.
Guess Apple's wrong wrong wrong, as that's not how they made products in the last 15 years. Or in the early Steve days, either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Guess Apple's wrong wrong wrong, as that's not how they made products in the last 15 years. Or in the early Steve days, either.
Do you believe everything Apple says?
No offence but considering how many posts you make on a daily basis you seem remarkably ill informed about things.
Would you like me mention the Apple products that failed miserably or the fact that they nearly went out of business in the 1990s. Apple III, Lisa, Pippin, Newton, Cube, etc, etc - it's quite a long list. They all failed under Steve's watch.
It's only in the past few years that Apple started to get things right - most of the time (cough) - forgetting Ping, Cube, MobileMe, iPod HiFi.
Steve made just as many mistakes as he did successes - it's only the fact that the recent products have proved so good that Apple are in such a good position now.
I don't think Tim Cook will make the same mistake - I think he is a more pragmatic person who will look to market research in a way Steve never did rather than relying solely on intuition.
Nice try, pretending that Apple nearly went out of business on Steve's watch. That's very clever. Save for the part where anyone can see through it in a heartbeat. No offense, but considering how few posts you make…
Yada yada. Get it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyTomato
I've accidentally pressed the home button when playing a game in landscape mode, and while it is frustrating, imagine how bad it would be if it were an off-screen capacitive button! One of the things I don't care about on the Android tablets is how a portion of the screen is dedicated to a band of touch buttons. To me, I am giving up real estate on the screen in lieu of a physical button on the bezel. I'd take the latter any day.
I am really amused by the lack of imagination people showing on this board.
1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)
2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.
3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.
Whatever works, just leave the real estate to the screen!
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
[QUOTE]2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.[/QUOTE]
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
[QUOTE]3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.[/QUOTE]
And have it break [I]without[/I] human negligence, unlike the current button.
[QUOTE]Whatever works just leave the real estate to the screen![/QUOTE]
You realize we [I]need[/I] a bezel, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason98
1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
Quote:
2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
Quote:
3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.
And have it break without human negligence, unlike the current button.
Quote:
Whatever works just leave the real estate to the screen!
You realize we need a bezel, right?
It's funny to see how my next arguments in the list addressed yours that you were about to post.
Here are some more.
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
You already have one. It is called a Power button.
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
Do you often bump the Power button?
And have it break without human negligence, unlike the current button.
It is actually the Home button that breaks the most on iPhones:
https://www.google.com/search?q=iphone+home+button
You realize we need a bezel, right?
No, not on a phone. You do not hold it like a tablet.
And on a tablet I would much prefer if it could be turned off when not needed.
That doesn't take me to the Springboard from an app.
[QUOTE]Do you often bump the Power button?[/QUOTE]
I never have my iPad upside down, because I have the Home Button as a frame of reference.
[QUOTE]It is actually the Home button that breaks the most on iPhones:[/QUOTE]
The Home Button is the one that PEOPLE break the most.
[QUOTE]No, not on a phone. You do not hold it like a tablet.[/QUOTE]
Oh, right, both in the same thread. So where on the phone would you put it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason98
1. Home button can be replaced with a UI gesture (for example, five-finger pinch)
Cannot. Can be supplemented, but not replaced. You always need a hardware out.
Quote:
2. If #1 is not good enough (for those desperate for hardware out) it can be moved to one of the edges.
Will be bumped far too often. Do you want to not be able to hold your iPad in a certain way or set it down on a certain side?
Quote:
3. If push button on edge is not good enough (hit by accident?) make it a slide button.
And have it break without human negligence, unlike the current button.
Quote:
Whatever works just leave the real estate to the screen!
You realize we need a bezel, right?
I'm not convinced we do need a bezel but I do agree that apps and whatever you're viewing or working with should normally stay away from the bezel or hand holding area. That area could be used for things like notifications or status info (like how many are connected to your personal hotspot). Also if you're watching a movie and the ipad is standing on its own you could use the whole surface, edge to edge. I'll leave this to the imaginations of the developers to handle appropriately.
I still want a physical home button though, wherever they put it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lantinian
Spot on. Holding the iPad mini in one hand will be as critical as making it fit into those inside jacket pockers
From the pictures, I figure the size of the model is about 20cm x 14cm (7.9"x5.5"). Assuming a 7.85" screen, the bezels will be about 1cm (0.4") on the sides and about 2cm (0.8") on top and bottom. This won't fit in a jacket pocket but it will fit into bigger coat pockets and small purses, all in all maybe a reasonable tradeoff for a whole new market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK
Would you like me mention the Apple products that failed miserably or the fact that they nearly went out of business in the 1990s. Apple III, Lisa, Pippin, Newton, Cube, etc, etc - it's quite a long list. They all failed under Steve's watch.
Nice try, pretending that Apple nearly went out of business on Steve's watch. That's very clever. Save for the part where anyone can see through it in a heartbeat. No offense, but considering how few posts you make…
Yada yada. Get it?
Maybe if you took the time to read my OP rather than jumping in to post another "clever" reply you would notice that I never said Apple nearly folded under Steve's watch. I said that Steve had just as many failures as he did successes - even in recent times. Apple's current position is founded entirely on 3 products - the iPod, iPhone and iPad. Without them Apple would be nowhere.
Steve famously never relied on market research. Some would say that's why they had so many failed products before the iOS devices came along. Who knows. I think Tim Cook will adopt a different approach based less on intuition and more on analysis and research.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
That doesn't take me to the Springboard from an app.
A dedicated software gesture will work most of the time. In the event (< 0.1%?) you need a hardware out, use Power button to get to lock screen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I never have my iPad upside down, because I have the Home Button as a frame of reference.
You may have camera and ear speaker as a reference point instead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
The Home Button is the one that PEOPLE break the most.
That's right. Using a device breaks it eventually, similar to "Life is dangerous - it leads to death"
And you think that's good enough? Pitch this to Microsoft, then. "Most of the time" isn't Apple's gig.
Which then takes me right back into the frozen application, so it's pointless.
Funny you should mention lifetimes, as the assumed lifespan of an iPhone is, what, two years? Let's be generous and say four.
My iPhone is a Day One 2007 model that is now twelve days past its fifth birthday. It has gone in my right pocket nearly every single morning since the day I obtained it and is used multiple times per day. Works like the day out of the box. Its Home Button is flawless.
Things always break. They last longer when you respect them.
It's funny that the first hit is:
The Many Uses of the iPhone Home Button
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonshf
The question in my mind is how wide is the tablet going to be (from a portrait perspective). Will it fit into a jacket or coat pocket? This will require the side bezels to be very narrow and then the question becomes whether it can be held conveniently in one hand.
If it doesn't fit into a coat pocket then I don't see it being much more mobile than a full sized ipad and doesn't differentiate itself enough.
Don't say that about it being "much more mobile than a full size ipad" to Island Hermit. Don't even suggest to him that can't fit in pockets or even pant pockets, that it is no less mobile than a iPad, because you see, it is "smaller than a ipad" and by that standard, it is therefor more mobile. It matters not, regarding how much smaller or even the dimensions of the item that determine if it is pocketable or not.
Just hold down the "0" button on your iPad keyboard to make the ° symbol.
I just did it.
I always forget about that on mine. I do appreciate how the Keyboard Dock operates just like a regular Mac's keyboard, however, with all the shortcuts with which we're familiar.
Even the Apple logo: ?