I disagree. I don't think I'm atypical and I can't really tell the difference between 720 and 1080 HD at the distances I normally view TV (perhaps 9-10 feet for a 55" set). I can tell the difference between BluRay and DVD, but only if I'm specifically looking for it. As soon as the movie starts, it no longer matters - either one is sufficient to not interfere with the movie. When people had B/W TVs, color was such an improvement that they jumped. When people were using VHS, DVD was a big enough improvement to spur a change. HD was a big enough improvement over SD to cause rapid acceptance. Now that we're at 1080HD and BR, any further improvements in picture quality will be pretty marginal.
Yes, a tiny number of people may be interested in something better than BR, but those are the people buying $100 audio cables and $25,000 speaker systems. That's not the market Apple would be interested in. So improving picture quality over BR/1080 isn't likely to be part of the story. If there is an Apple TV, the selling feature will be either usability or content - or both.
What is 1080HD? BR = 1080P. If you have not seen a 4K TV then you don't really know how primitive 1080P is. When you look at your TV and you cannot tell if you are looking out a window or watching a TV, that is when you can say marginal.
In particular, TPV Technology and LG Electronics are said to be either forming alliances with one another or are seeking out additional partners for smart TV alliances, sources speaking toDigiTimes say. They add that China-based TV brand Changhong has also formed an alliance and is placing bets on a cloud-based interface for its offerings which it hopes to solidify within three years.
The sources said the alliances are also forming as Apple is preparing to release a smart TV. Due to Apple's influence in the market, the sources fear it will further dominate the smart TV market, which is estimated to reach a 40% penetration rate by 2014.
Huddling together for warmth for the coming winter.
It doesnt matter whether someone has "cracked" the UI.
Most of the time the viewer is watching the programs rather than navigating to get to the content itself.
Therefore, the bigger importance is the picture quality and the set design rather than the UI.
I was just thinking the same thing. I interact with my phone more in one day than a week of interacting with my TV. I have my favorites set and with the click of one button very easily go through them.
The major difference will be that old AppleTV STBoxes won't have a antenna/cable port, whereas new ones will.
OTA requires a lot of hardware on the roof and is only available within 50 miles of the broadcast source. Cable can and already has encrypted signals on some channels. The only ports open are wifi and ethernet.
In my view the last thing Apple should waste time on is cable boxes and interfacing with them. Cable TV is fast becoming a lame duck as people dump it because of high cost, bundling of content, the sad-sack cable boxen and their horrible user interfaces.
That's not what I meant. What I said was to integrate the cable box INTO the set (their own solution), not interface with it. I know what you mean when you basically say get rid of cable all together, which I totally agree with, but in order to get live programming that isn't broadcast over the air, you will still need a cable interface built in. Now, it would be amazing if Apple comes out of the gate with all of that solved, but I think the providers are going to put up a good fight for a few years while Apple works towards a la carte and live channel solutions.
What is 1080HD? BR = 1080P. If you have not seen a 4K TV then you don't really know how primitive 1080P is. When you look at your TV and you cannot tell if you are looking out a window or watching a TV, that is when you can say marginal.
If you watched The Avengers you know what 4K looks like.
That's not what I meant. What I said was to integrate the cable box INTO the set (their own solution), not interface with it. I know what you mean when you basically say get rid of cable all together, which I totally agree with, but in order to get live programming that isn't broadcast over the air, you will still need a cable interface built in. Now, it would be amazing if Apple comes out of the gate with all of that solved, but I think the providers are going to put up a good fight for a few years while Apple works towards a la carte and live channel solutions.
and this is all hypothetical obviously.
It already exists, it's called Cable card and it has failed miserably. It would take a company like Apple to finally make it work correctly.
[...] Improving picture quality over BR/1080 isn't likely to be part of the story. If there is an Apple TV, the selling feature will be either usability or content - or both.
+1
It's all about merging
- the DVD player
- the OTA Antenna
- the cable connection (and delivered channels)
- the DVR for 'Local/Live' content (OTA/LocalCableAccess)
- Internet based media (netflix, iTMS, etc)
- Cloud based DVR and 'live delivery' of premade content (why should 1000's of people DVR Breaking Bad, when one Content Deal with the production company would do it)
- Cloud based 'network/Live[or DVR]' (Internet delivery of paywalled cable content... boxing, MLB, NHL, NFL network).
into an interface a 10 year old and a 65 year old can instantly grok ('touch - All Shows or On Now'....touch 'breaking bad' 'touch play last show' or 'add to one of your 'channels' [On Now gives you the selection of all 'live' media you currently have available to you, presented in a scrollable interface on you iOS device or onscreen]
The 'magic sauce' is all the content deals, and the revenue pass through (pay per view... through AppleID... I for one would pay $$ for Breaking Bad, but I'm not paying Comcast $55/month for the privilege, plus the DVR costs... I'll pay $1.99 at 720P internet delivered for it though).
In my view the last thing Apple should waste time on is cable boxes and interfacing with them. Cable TV is fast becoming a lame duck as people dump it because of high cost, bundling of content, the sad-sack cable boxen and their horrible user interfaces.
I'm not so sure that many people are dumping it (in the US at least). According to the survey below 87% of households subscribe to some form of cable/satellite service, and that's up from 80% in 2004. I'm skeptical Apple will be able to shake up the TV industry the way they did with music. And as far as horrible user interfaces, the current Apple TV interface is nothing to write home about. I'll take my directv interface over that any day.
It already exists, it's called Cable card and it has failed miserably. It would take a company like Apple to finally make it work correctly.
And what exactly would Apple be able to do that others have failed at? I'm skeptical Apple will be able to crack this nut. It's a lot more complicated and with more intrenched interests than the music industry. And does Apple really want to get in the middle of all that?
Imagine if Steve Jobs were alive in 2013 and he is on stage toward the end of a product announcemnt in Feb 2013:
Towards the end of the show . after share proce has dropped 50 points, because all that has been shown so far is new OS and newer iPAd, mac Pro refresh,
AND ONE MORE THING:
A big image of logo of Apple TV logo appears on the screen
Huge ovation:
"Remember I told you I had cracked TV?"
then a series of slides showing the TV from the 50's , the chunk chunk chunk kind, we had to get up off the couch to change channel. It got better, we had the first remote control ooooh, a bit better. Then cable came along, the VCR to record and watch movies. Then it gets real messy. I think you knw th story. slides of tivo's, cable boixes, 5 remotes to control it all, wires everywhere, major enibations j to connect it all togehter, a huge mess.
Today I'd like to intporduce you to the new way of interacting with your TV and here it is:
Up pops a huge TV from the floor.
Okay looks just like your common or graden TV right?
WRONG
Here is the remote:
It fit nicely in hand all white Its based on all the great thing we have with touch from iPhone, Ipad and track pad.
To tuirne the TV on he makes a great show of simply touching the device once with hsi finger.
boom it turns on and plays a TV show is playing
starts flicking thru channels by swiping with finger from left to right and back, Espn comes up, the Disney channel showing a movie. and other channels
he swipe up and itunes shows with slick Apple TV inteface to
There's an App for iPhone and iPad so you can use this remote or the iPhone/iPad, another wipe brings up the older Apple TV inteface with access to movies youtube, flicker, facebook , another brings up Comcast. Then he asks everyone to be quiet ans say, "Siri: show me ESPN" back comes ESPN. Siri, record the show to my iMac , and pause for 2 minutes" . waist 30 seconds: Siri: resume" . Siri : show me Scifi channel, up comes a commercial, "fast forward 1 minute" , up pops the scifi show after the commercial is done. He goes on like this showing off the interface.
How much does it cost? Goes thru explanation of current TV and their prices, VAriosu stae of the art models togehter with pricing. We decided to compete directly with all these models:
We have 5 sizes for you - 30", 40" 50" 60 and 70"
A typical apple slide shows up with pricing
30" is 999, 40" is 1499 is 50" is 2399, 60" is 2799, 70" is 3499
gasps from audience
You can subscribe to Disney by the month, cancel it, a restart subscription whenever you like, same for ESPN1,ESPN2, NFL, DISCOVERY, SCI-FI. more content to come later. Of course you can still connect your current cable provider to the TV.
Technically he wasn't wrong, Apple didn't build a decent "phone", it was plagued with call dropping. What Apple did do was build an awesome mini computer and put the Web in people's pockets. Can Apple eliminate my PS3, my cable box, and my Roku?
OTA requires a lot of hardware on the roof and is only available within 50 miles of the broadcast source. Cable can and already has encrypted signals on some channels. The only ports open are wifi and ethernet.
You're assuming I and 6Billion other people have cable. I have 22 channels OTA, and it's a pre-installed antenna on my roof that the cable comes out just behind my TV... in essense, it's free. and in the US, All cable companies must provide unencrypted local TV channels at a sub-basic rate.
And this is why I think Apple is out disintermediate the cable companies and networks, not the TV manufacturers, just like the iPod (media companies were the real problem... not the other media players) and iPhone (a little slower, but Apple is making carriers a dumb pipe). the iPod and iPhone were about easy navigation across multiple content/function channels... and that's what an Apple TV will be about.
If you have a new HDTV, Is anyone unhappy with it? The 'clicker'(s one for TV, Cable, DVR, and DVD), maybe, but the TV?
And what exactly would Apple be able to do that others have failed at? I'm skeptical Apple will be able to crack this nut. It's a lot more complicated and with more intrenched interests than the music industry. And does Apple really want to get in the middle of all that?
Who knows? That's what's great about Apple, the problem though is that I have 5 cable boxes in my house. I most certainly will not buy 5 Apple branded TVs.
You're assuming I and 6Billion other people have cable. I have 22 channels OTA, and it's a pre-installed antenna on my roof that the cable comes out just behind my TV... in essense, it's free.
I've got the same thing but I had to pay for it and install it myself and I'm right on the fringe so I had to go with an amplifier as well. I also have cable for other channels and Internet. I have to say the OTA is pretty high quality compared to cable.
I am thinking of switching to AT&T Uverse though because my cable gets all screwed up when there are a lot of people watching in the neighborhood, especially if there is a popular sports team playing even if that is not what I'm watching. The Internet through the cable gets congested and slow as well. Not sure if Uverse is going to be any better. They just put the fiber in and they say it is 100% better.
I learned that the communications conduits under my street are owned by the city. I thought the cable company owned them but apparently AT&T decided to lease them also, so now we have a choice between cable or fiber. About the same price too, although one channel I watch now is is only available on the super premium package on Uverse. I hate those packages because it seems like you always have that one channel you want in some other package.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
No, that would be 0.667 HD.
I disagree. I don't think I'm atypical and I can't really tell the difference between 720 and 1080 HD at the distances I normally view TV (perhaps 9-10 feet for a 55" set). I can tell the difference between BluRay and DVD, but only if I'm specifically looking for it. As soon as the movie starts, it no longer matters - either one is sufficient to not interfere with the movie. When people had B/W TVs, color was such an improvement that they jumped. When people were using VHS, DVD was a big enough improvement to spur a change. HD was a big enough improvement over SD to cause rapid acceptance. Now that we're at 1080HD and BR, any further improvements in picture quality will be pretty marginal.
Yes, a tiny number of people may be interested in something better than BR, but those are the people buying $100 audio cables and $25,000 speaker systems. That's not the market Apple would be interested in. So improving picture quality over BR/1080 isn't likely to be part of the story. If there is an Apple TV, the selling feature will be either usability or content - or both.
What is 1080HD? BR = 1080P. If you have not seen a 4K TV then you don't really know how primitive 1080P is. When you look at your TV and you cannot tell if you are looking out a window or watching a TV, that is when you can say marginal.
Quote:
In particular, TPV Technology and LG Electronics are said to be either forming alliances with one another or are seeking out additional partners for smart TV alliances, sources speaking to DigiTimes say. They add that China-based TV brand Changhong has also formed an alliance and is placing bets on a cloud-based interface for its offerings which it hopes to solidify within three years.
Huddling together for warmth for the coming winter.
I was just thinking the same thing. I interact with my phone more in one day than a week of interacting with my TV. I have my favorites set and with the click of one button very easily go through them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherGeoff
The major difference will be that old AppleTV STBoxes won't have a antenna/cable port, whereas new ones will.
OTA requires a lot of hardware on the roof and is only available within 50 miles of the broadcast source. Cable can and already has encrypted signals on some channels. The only ports open are wifi and ethernet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dualie
In my view the last thing Apple should waste time on is cable boxes and interfacing with them. Cable TV is fast becoming a lame duck as people dump it because of high cost, bundling of content, the sad-sack cable boxen and their horrible user interfaces.
That's not what I meant. What I said was to integrate the cable box INTO the set (their own solution), not interface with it. I know what you mean when you basically say get rid of cable all together, which I totally agree with, but in order to get live programming that isn't broadcast over the air, you will still need a cable interface built in. Now, it would be amazing if Apple comes out of the gate with all of that solved, but I think the providers are going to put up a good fight for a few years while Apple works towards a la carte and live channel solutions.
and this is all hypothetical obviously.
If you watched The Avengers you know what 4K looks like.
It already exists, it's called Cable card and it has failed miserably. It would take a company like Apple to finally make it work correctly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
[...] Improving picture quality over BR/1080 isn't likely to be part of the story. If there is an Apple TV, the selling feature will be either usability or content - or both.
+1
It's all about merging
- the DVD player
- the OTA Antenna
- the cable connection (and delivered channels)
- the DVR for 'Local/Live' content (OTA/LocalCableAccess)
- Internet based media (netflix, iTMS, etc)
- Cloud based DVR and 'live delivery' of premade content (why should 1000's of people DVR Breaking Bad, when one Content Deal with the production company would do it)
- Cloud based 'network/Live[or DVR]' (Internet delivery of paywalled cable content... boxing, MLB, NHL, NFL network).
into an interface a 10 year old and a 65 year old can instantly grok ('touch - All Shows or On Now'....touch 'breaking bad' 'touch play last show' or 'add to one of your 'channels' [On Now gives you the selection of all 'live' media you currently have available to you, presented in a scrollable interface on you iOS device or onscreen]
The 'magic sauce' is all the content deals, and the revenue pass through (pay per view... through AppleID... I for one would pay $$ for Breaking Bad, but I'm not paying Comcast $55/month for the privilege, plus the DVR costs... I'll pay $1.99 at 720P internet delivered for it though).
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
If you watched The Avengers you know what 4K looks like.
Only if you watched it via a 4K projector…
I'm not so sure that many people are dumping it (in the US at least). According to the survey below 87% of households subscribe to some form of cable/satellite service, and that's up from 80% in 2004. I'm skeptical Apple will be able to shake up the TV industry the way they did with music. And as far as horrible user interfaces, the current Apple TV interface is nothing to write home about. I'll take my directv interface over that any day.
http://www.leichtmanresearch.com/press/070512release.html
Towards the end of the show . after share proce has dropped 50 points, because all that has been shown so far is new OS and newer iPAd, mac Pro refresh,
AND ONE MORE THING:
A big image of logo of Apple TV logo appears on the screen
Huge ovation:
"Remember I told you I had cracked TV?"
then a series of slides showing the TV from the 50's , the chunk chunk chunk kind, we had to get up off the couch to change channel. It got better, we had the first remote control ooooh, a bit better. Then cable came along, the VCR to record and watch movies. Then it gets real messy. I think you knw th story. slides of tivo's, cable boixes, 5 remotes to control it all, wires everywhere, major enibations j to connect it all togehter, a huge mess.
Today I'd like to intporduce you to the new way of interacting with your TV and here it is:
Up pops a huge TV from the floor.
Okay looks just like your common or graden TV right?
WRONG
Here is the remote:
It fit nicely in hand all white Its based on all the great thing we have with touch from iPhone, Ipad and track pad.
To tuirne the TV on he makes a great show of simply touching the device once with hsi finger.
boom it turns on and plays a TV show is playing
starts flicking thru channels by swiping with finger from left to right and back, Espn comes up, the Disney channel showing a movie. and other channels
he swipe up and itunes shows with slick Apple TV inteface to
There's an App for iPhone and iPad so you can use this remote or the iPhone/iPad, another wipe brings up the older Apple TV inteface with access to movies youtube, flicker, facebook , another brings up Comcast. Then he asks everyone to be quiet ans say, "Siri: show me ESPN" back comes ESPN. Siri, record the show to my iMac , and pause for 2 minutes" . waist 30 seconds: Siri: resume" . Siri : show me Scifi channel, up comes a commercial, "fast forward 1 minute" , up pops the scifi show after the commercial is done. He goes on like this showing off the interface.
How much does it cost? Goes thru explanation of current TV and their prices, VAriosu stae of the art models togehter with pricing. We decided to compete directly with all these models:
We have 5 sizes for you - 30", 40" 50" 60 and 70"
A typical apple slide shows up with pricing
30" is 999, 40" is 1499 is 50" is 2399, 60" is 2799, 70" is 3499
gasps from audience
You can subscribe to Disney by the month, cancel it, a restart subscription whenever you like, same for ESPN1,ESPN2, NFL, DISCOVERY, SCI-FI. more content to come later. Of course you can still connect your current cable provider to the TV.
cost 4.99 per month each
Claps his hands and TV turns off!
Apple share price at $84 up 80 points on the day
YEAH the rest is history
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
It already exists, it's called Cable card and it has failed miserably. It would take a company like Apple to finally make it work correctly.
That is basically exactly what I said...
Technically he wasn't wrong, Apple didn't build a decent "phone", it was plagued with call dropping. What Apple did do was build an awesome mini computer and put the Web in people's pockets. Can Apple eliminate my PS3, my cable box, and my Roku?
I most certainly did and WOW
I Apple-lized what you said, you know made it easier to understand lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul94544
Imagine if Steve Jobs were alive in 2013 ...[BLAH BLAH BLAH]... YEAH the rest is history
Get a <p> for pete's sake
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
OTA requires a lot of hardware on the roof and is only available within 50 miles of the broadcast source. Cable can and already has encrypted signals on some channels. The only ports open are wifi and ethernet.
You're assuming I and 6Billion other people have cable. I have 22 channels OTA, and it's a pre-installed antenna on my roof that the cable comes out just behind my TV... in essense, it's free. and in the US, All cable companies must provide unencrypted local TV channels at a sub-basic rate.
And this is why I think Apple is out disintermediate the cable companies and networks, not the TV manufacturers, just like the iPod (media companies were the real problem... not the other media players) and iPhone (a little slower, but Apple is making carriers a dumb pipe). the iPod and iPhone were about easy navigation across multiple content/function channels... and that's what an Apple TV will be about.
If you have a new HDTV, Is anyone unhappy with it? The 'clicker'(s one for TV, Cable, DVR, and DVD), maybe, but the TV?
The game is content delivery and navigation.
Who knows? That's what's great about Apple, the problem though is that I have 5 cable boxes in my house. I most certainly will not buy 5 Apple branded TVs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherGeoff
You're assuming I and 6Billion other people have cable. I have 22 channels OTA, and it's a pre-installed antenna on my roof that the cable comes out just behind my TV... in essense, it's free.
I've got the same thing but I had to pay for it and install it myself and I'm right on the fringe so I had to go with an amplifier as well. I also have cable for other channels and Internet. I have to say the OTA is pretty high quality compared to cable.
I am thinking of switching to AT&T Uverse though because my cable gets all screwed up when there are a lot of people watching in the neighborhood, especially if there is a popular sports team playing even if that is not what I'm watching. The Internet through the cable gets congested and slow as well. Not sure if Uverse is going to be any better. They just put the fiber in and they say it is 100% better.
I learned that the communications conduits under my street are owned by the city. I thought the cable company owned them but apparently AT&T decided to lease them also, so now we have a choice between cable or fiber. About the same price too, although one channel I watch now is is only available on the super premium package on Uverse. I hate those packages because it seems like you always have that one channel you want in some other package.