Fantastic take up rate! But why not, it's cheap, it's good, it's fast & it's easy get and easy to install.
Resisted though.. for a whole day, then: did a Superduper bootable backup (just in case), went down to the nearest Apple Store with the MBA and a 16GB flash drive, DLed ML over their WiFi (20 mins), made a bootable ML installer (15 mins with free ML Diskmaker), installed ML (20 mins) and then DLed and ran the available Aperture, iPhoto, MBA Firmware and iMovie updates. (I'm on pay-as-you-go 3G dongle broadband at present).
BTW, both Lion and SL were fine - never gave any significant problems or failures - but seemed like transition OSs and that this is more the finished product in all its glory.
Well, let's look at a couple of other issues as well... IMMEDIATELY, after Mountain Lion installs, AND you TRY and start various, STANDARD, applications like mail, contacts or Safari, be REAL careful what happens.... Let's start with 'Contacts' (address book) ... On my install TODAY, the initial setup thought my old pop mail account was in fact an iCloud account... UGLY. So, the way that Mountain Lion looks at 'contacts' as part of 'mail' and iCloud is a bit odd. Mountain Lion could not figure out who it was or what it was or where to go to find out when trying to 'update' my contacts database (217 entries) .... It just sits and churns in a loop FOREVER. Luckily, I was sitting at a Genius Bar, otherwise I would STILL be trying to figure this out. A 'genius' helped me by deleting some .plist files (he did it too fast for me to follow) but it was not fun.
THEN, because the initial setup process thought my old pop account was an iCloud account and allegedly messed up my 'contacts' database, when I started the Mountain Lion MAIL client, things got REAL strange... the new Mail just IGNORED almost all of the mail FOLDERS in my mail client from Snow Leopard... Just ignored them... I had to retrieve my latest Time Machine back-up and get my old email folders from that back-up. NOW, I have to IMPORT these into the new Mountain Lion mail client... This will take hours...
All in all... UGLY. AND, I was at an Apple Store !!!!!
AND, it may STAY at like 5% .....
Well, let's look at a couple of other issues as well... IMMEDIATELY, after Mountain Lion installs, AND you TRY and start various, STANDARD, applications like mail, contacts or Safari, be REAL careful what happens.... Let's start with 'Contacts' (address book) ... On my install TODAY, the initial setup thought my old pop mail account was in fact an iCloud account... UGLY. So, the way that Mountain Lion looks at 'contacts' as part of 'mail' and iCloud is a bit odd. Mountain Lion could not figure out who it was or what it was or where to go to find out when trying to 'update' my contacts database (217 entries) .... It just sits and churns in a loop FOREVER. Luckily, I was sitting at a Genius Bar, otherwise I would STILL be trying to figure this out. A 'genius' helped me by deleting some .plist files (he did it too fast for me to follow) but it was not fun.
THEN, because the initial setup process thought my old pop account was an iCloud account and allegedly messed up my 'contacts' database, when I started the Mountain Lion MAIL client, things got REAL strange... the new Mail just IGNORED almost all of the mail FOLDERS in my mail client from Snow Leopard... Just ignored them... I had to retrieve my latest Time Machine back-up and get my old email folders from that back-up. NOW, I have to IMPORT these into the new Mountain Lion mail client... This will take hours...
All in all... UGLY. AND, I was at an Apple Store !!!!!
Mistakes do happen, sadly for you it was your turn.
I've upgraded through every version of MacOS from Tiger to ML and never had a single problem.
I have to agree. I didn't find Lion to be horrid. I don't even mind the faux leather etc 'crap'
Most of the folks that I know that hate Lion do so over this or that software not being compatible but that is the fault of companies that haven't bother to update their ppc code, not Apple
As for these numbers they are as accurate as the tv ratings. Both are based on a small sample and infer their 'millions' from the assumption that the same percents hold true. They may not. This 3% is from Chitka's ad network which might only measure 1% of the computers out there, Mac or otherwise. In truth, the other 99% could have 1%, 3% or even 30% adoption for all we know. Just like while 1% of the ratings sample watches a show, 50% of the much larger non sample group could be watching and a show that is listed as 2 million viewers could be more like 50 million
No wonder given how badly Lion sucked compared with Snow Leopard; too bad Mountain Lion Server is yet another step in the wrong direction, even though at least Mountain Lion's client OS fixes somewhat some of the horribly worst GUI transgressions Lion perpetrated on OS X users. At least Mountain Lion is somewhat useable again after the total disaster that was Lion. Still worse than Snow Leopard which (bugs aside) was the most productive OS I worked with. Apple's emphasis on simplicity is good, but when things get oversimplified it becomes a major problem..
If that is your experience then I can understand a rant. Out of curiosity, can you give one example of what you think was badly done in Lion? And make it a lasting statement, well founded, grounded, solid statement of why it was bad. Something like "I didn't like the Auto-version-ing as opposed to the Save-as commands because when working on a picture on my SD card it never asked me to safe changes; it all happened automatically and I cannot revert to the original version"
Apple deciding to exclude pretty much the headline Mountain Lion feature (Airplay mirroring) to 2011 only Mac's has annoyed many people. Apple's forums are flooded with complaints over this.
My 2010 MBP with Mountain Lion with AirParrot can do anything at the same quality my MBP 2011 can do with Mountain Lion's Airplay mirroring built in. Don't believe the post saying it is lower quality etc. It is identical.
If that is your experience then I can understand a rant. Out of curiosity, can you give one example of what you think was badly done in Lion? And make it a lasting statement, well founded, grounded, solid statement of why it was bad. Something like "I didn't like the Auto-version-ing as opposed to the Save-as commands because when working on a picture on my SD card it never asked me to safe changes; it all happened automatically and I cannot revert to the original version"
Examples, more than I care to remember:
a) kitschy, dysfunctionally decorated apps (AddressBook, iCal, etc.) that sacrifice functionality (e.g. the back and forth paging between AddressBook groups and address list view, which is a massive step backwards from the clean, functional Snow Leopard (and before) interface of AddressBook, which allowed you to adjust the width of the various columns and panes to fit your working style and screen space)
b) the "hunt for GUI elements" approach, which not only makes an artificial distinction between mouse and touch interfaces (cause there's no mouse-over in a touch interface), but is also unproductive, e.g. UI elements that only become visible when the mouse is near them, such as scroll bars, or the replacement of disclosure triangles with usually hidden "hide/show" tags
c) lack of UI precision, be that with the disappearance of scroll bar up/down buttons, or with the invisible, but existing window borders
d) the abandonment of what you see is what you manipulate: you can see a window below two neighboring windows, but you can't click it to the foreground, because the invisible (i.e. fully transparent), but existing, window borders register your click rather than the window that you see and think you're clicking. All in the name of "visual simplicity", when it castrates intuitive interaction
e) the un-natural "natural" scrolling, which neglects the difference between a full-screen touch interface and a windowed pointer interface
f) Mission Control and the disappearance of two dimensional spaces and the show all windows command, which results much less efficient window management for anyone who has more than just a few open windows.
g) the creation of an app rather than task centric interface, visible in both how iCloud document storage works, and in the lack of the all windows view of Mission Control
h) the discontinuation of keychain syncing, which is a massive step backwards in security, because if you can't sync keychains, you end up having to choose again passwords you can't remember, since you can't remember (and sync instead) a password like "ljkhOPU0-9ih(lG;Ghkglh_RDt" and will instead use something like "password123"
i) the creation of a standalone "Notes" app, instead of keeping it integrated into Mail.app, which just results in more app switching for no good reason, the creation of a separate Reminder's app instead of keeping To Do's in iCal, the removal of calendar groups, etc.
j) the new layout in Mail.app, and the naming of the "classic view" which is just a hair-width away from calling it "deprecated view" even though on a regular sized computer screen it's the much more productive view than the iPad inspired layout.
k) the AirPort utility, that no longer shows certain key information
l) OS X Server, which keeps losing functionality
etc. There is more, but that should give good enough of an impression.
Some of the most obnoxious things are somewhat fixed, e.g. Contacts now allows again a column for groups, even though the window layout is still more rigid than in Snow Leopard, and the kitschy, non-functional decorations still remain, or e.g. the ability to disable the "group windows by application" setting in Mission Control gives at least the "all windows" command back, even though not in the full glory of Snow Leopard.
But by and large, while Mountain Lion is a big improvement over Lion, it's still a step back from Snow Leopard.
I've been using NeXTSTEP since the 0.8 release, and Mac OS X since it was called Rhapsody Prerelease, and Lion is the worst in the entire 24 year history, and Mountain Lion is just a tad better.
Apple keeps dumbing down things past the point of usefulness.
Few people with 3+ year old computers ever upgrade, anyway. And it's not as if your old computer is going to stop working.
One of the reasons Macs work so well and upgrades are so painless is that Apple limits the scope of their OS. They have no desire to support every Mac ever built because the complexity increases exponentially for only very modest gain.
If you want to be able to install your OS on 10 year old computers, stick with Windows. Just don't complain if it doesn't work well because you're part of the reason it doesn't work well.
I don't think you understand Windows users.
They don't put new operating systems on old computers. They put old operating systems on new computers. Just look at the huge number of people still using Windows XP.
The retail version is still crap. I've been using the DP for months on my MBA 11" late 2010 with 4GB ram, and there were lots of problems with Safari and Quicktime crashing and the entire machine freezing to the point to where the way to restart was to hold down the power button. I was expecting all of this to be resolved with the full retail version, but it hasn't. I'm considering a fresh install, which is something I've never had to do for a Mac before. Has anyone experienced the same as me and did a fresh install help?
By the way, I noticed that Safari removed Activity Window and replaced it with a Develop menu. I use to download clips and other stuff off of the web with Activity Window, can anyone tell me how I can do this now?
If you want to be able to install your OS on 10 year old computers, stick with Windows. Just don't complain if it doesn't work well because you're part of the reason it doesn't work well.
Why would XP on a new i7 be inferior to XP on an old pIII?
My experience of putting older OSes on newer hardware is that they tend to run better than on older hardware.
Are you suggesting that the principle of making hardware backwards compatitble is a bad thing?
I think it would have hit MUCH better if AirPlay was supported in some fashion for all machines. The major feature of this release only works with a few machines, and Lion is a brilliant release. $20 might not be a lot of paper, but what do I get for my $20?
After some digging, I found its Intel's fault, not Apple's. (well, partially)
Support for Intel Quick Sync Video was added in OS X Mountain Lion for use with AirPlay Mirroring - but only high-end Sandy Bridge Processors or newer have Quick Sync video. From the benchmarks I've seen on the internet, Quick Sync is about 22x faster than software decoding/encoding on the same processor.
I've tried Air Parrot on my Arrandale i7 iMac (AirPlay Mirroring but in Software) and the CPU usage was surprisingly high.
Whilst AirParrot is running on the desktop with a web browser, there is a little bit of usage across all cores. Started playing a video full screen and all 8 threads became active, with the 4 physical cores (threads 1, 3, 5 and 7) running at around 50% each.
I can see /why/ Apple didn't want AirPlay Mirroring natively on setups without Quick Sync, but they should have at least let us try it! That kind of sustained processor usage can make any computer hot hot hot!
By the way, I noticed that Safari removed Activity Window and replaced it with a Develop menu. I use to download clips and other stuff off of the web with Activity Window, can anyone tell me how I can do this now?
No, the Develop menu has always been there. They removed Activity and gave the shortcut to the Inspector (that has also always been there).
When you find out how to do what the Activity window did, let me know. They better just bring the darn thing BACK in 6.0.1.
After some digging, I found its Intel's fault, not Apple's. (well, partially)
Support for Intel Quick Sync Video was added in OS X Mountain Lion for use with AirPlay Mirroring - but only high-end Sandy Bridge Processors or newer have Quick Sync video. From the benchmarks I've seen on the internet, Quick Sync is about 22x faster than software decoding/encoding on the same processor.
I've tried Air Parrot on my Arrandale i7 iMac (AirPlay Mirroring but in Software) and the CPU usage was surprisingly high.
Whilst AirParrot is running on the desktop with a web browser, there is a little bit of usage across all cores. Started playing a video full screen and all 8 threads became active, with the 4 physical cores (threads 1, 3, 5 and 7) running at around 50% each.
I can see /why/ Apple didn't want AirPlay Mirroring natively on setups without Quick Sync, but they should have at least let us try it! That kind of sustained processor usage can make any computer hot hot hot!
Why not use the GPU? Definitely the GPU could do this especially with OpenCL.
Comments
Fantastic take up rate! But why not, it's cheap, it's good, it's fast & it's easy get and easy to install.
Resisted though.. for a whole day, then: did a Superduper bootable backup (just in case), went down to the nearest Apple Store with the MBA and a 16GB flash drive, DLed ML over their WiFi (20 mins), made a bootable ML installer (15 mins with free ML Diskmaker), installed ML (20 mins) and then DLed and ran the available Aperture, iPhoto, MBA Firmware and iMovie updates. (I'm on pay-as-you-go 3G dongle broadband at present).
BTW, both Lion and SL were fine - never gave any significant problems or failures - but seemed like transition OSs and that this is more the finished product in all its glory.
Maybe more people would have upgraded to Lion from Snow Leopard if Apple didn't drop features like Rosetta and Front Row.
You actually think everyone still on SL that can get ML didn't upgrade because of Rosetta and Front Row? Front Row? Seriously?!
Well, let's look at a couple of other issues as well... IMMEDIATELY, after Mountain Lion installs, AND you TRY and start various, STANDARD, applications like mail, contacts or Safari, be REAL careful what happens.... Let's start with 'Contacts' (address book) ... On my install TODAY, the initial setup thought my old pop mail account was in fact an iCloud account... UGLY. So, the way that Mountain Lion looks at 'contacts' as part of 'mail' and iCloud is a bit odd. Mountain Lion could not figure out who it was or what it was or where to go to find out when trying to 'update' my contacts database (217 entries) .... It just sits and churns in a loop FOREVER. Luckily, I was sitting at a Genius Bar, otherwise I would STILL be trying to figure this out. A 'genius' helped me by deleting some .plist files (he did it too fast for me to follow) but it was not fun.
THEN, because the initial setup process thought my old pop account was an iCloud account and allegedly messed up my 'contacts' database, when I started the Mountain Lion MAIL client, things got REAL strange... the new Mail just IGNORED almost all of the mail FOLDERS in my mail client from Snow Leopard... Just ignored them... I had to retrieve my latest Time Machine back-up and get my old email folders from that back-up. NOW, I have to IMPORT these into the new Mountain Lion mail client... This will take hours...
All in all... UGLY. AND, I was at an Apple Store !!!!!
Mistakes do happen, sadly for you it was your turn.
I've upgraded through every version of MacOS from Tiger to ML and never had a single problem.
I have to agree. I didn't find Lion to be horrid. I don't even mind the faux leather etc 'crap'
Most of the folks that I know that hate Lion do so over this or that software not being compatible but that is the fault of companies that haven't bother to update their ppc code, not Apple
As for these numbers they are as accurate as the tv ratings. Both are based on a small sample and infer their 'millions' from the assumption that the same percents hold true. They may not. This 3% is from Chitka's ad network which might only measure 1% of the computers out there, Mac or otherwise. In truth, the other 99% could have 1%, 3% or even 30% adoption for all we know. Just like while 1% of the ratings sample watches a show, 50% of the much larger non sample group could be watching and a show that is listed as 2 million viewers could be more like 50 million
Context is key.
at least Mountain Lion's client OS fixes somewhat some of the horribly worst GUI transgressions Lion perpetrated on OS X users. At least Mountain Lion is somewhat useable again after the total disaster that was Lion.
Still worse than Snow Leopard which (bugs aside) was the most productive OS I worked with. Apple's emphasis on simplicity is good, but when things get oversimplified it becomes a major problem..
Originally Posted by rcfa
No wonder given how badly Lion sucked compared with Snow Leopard… …total disaster that was Lion.
Didn't we just cover that this is a giant lie?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcfa
...total disaster that was Lion.
If that is your experience then I can understand a rant. Out of curiosity, can you give one example of what you think was badly done in Lion? And make it a lasting statement, well founded, grounded, solid statement of why it was bad. Something like "I didn't like the Auto-version-ing as opposed to the Save-as commands because when working on a picture on my SD card it never asked me to safe changes; it all happened automatically and I cannot revert to the original version"
Wow, lots of still people using .6.
.8 fixes many of the things people didn't like about .7 (or at least reduces them) so maybe some of the moaners will be come back in the fold now.
My 2010 MBP with Mountain Lion with AirParrot can do anything at the same quality my MBP 2011 can do with Mountain Lion's Airplay mirroring built in. Don't believe the post saying it is lower quality etc. It is identical.
See my last post. Problem solved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcfa
...total disaster that was Lion.
If that is your experience then I can understand a rant. Out of curiosity, can you give one example of what you think was badly done in Lion? And make it a lasting statement, well founded, grounded, solid statement of why it was bad. Something like "I didn't like the Auto-version-ing as opposed to the Save-as commands because when working on a picture on my SD card it never asked me to safe changes; it all happened automatically and I cannot revert to the original version"
Examples, more than I care to remember:
a) kitschy, dysfunctionally decorated apps (AddressBook, iCal, etc.) that sacrifice functionality (e.g. the back and forth paging between AddressBook groups and address list view, which is a massive step backwards from the clean, functional Snow Leopard (and before) interface of AddressBook, which allowed you to adjust the width of the various columns and panes to fit your working style and screen space)
b) the "hunt for GUI elements" approach, which not only makes an artificial distinction between mouse and touch interfaces (cause there's no mouse-over in a touch interface), but is also unproductive, e.g. UI elements that only become visible when the mouse is near them, such as scroll bars, or the replacement of disclosure triangles with usually hidden "hide/show" tags
c) lack of UI precision, be that with the disappearance of scroll bar up/down buttons, or with the invisible, but existing window borders
d) the abandonment of what you see is what you manipulate: you can see a window below two neighboring windows, but you can't click it to the foreground, because the invisible (i.e. fully transparent), but existing, window borders register your click rather than the window that you see and think you're clicking. All in the name of "visual simplicity", when it castrates intuitive interaction
e) the un-natural "natural" scrolling, which neglects the difference between a full-screen touch interface and a windowed pointer interface
f) Mission Control and the disappearance of two dimensional spaces and the show all windows command, which results much less efficient window management for anyone who has more than just a few open windows.
g) the creation of an app rather than task centric interface, visible in both how iCloud document storage works, and in the lack of the all windows view of Mission Control
h) the discontinuation of keychain syncing, which is a massive step backwards in security, because if you can't sync keychains, you end up having to choose again passwords you can't remember, since you can't remember (and sync instead) a password like "ljkhOPU0-9ih(lG;Ghkglh_RDt" and will instead use something like "password123"
i) the creation of a standalone "Notes" app, instead of keeping it integrated into Mail.app, which just results in more app switching for no good reason, the creation of a separate Reminder's app instead of keeping To Do's in iCal, the removal of calendar groups, etc.
j) the new layout in Mail.app, and the naming of the "classic view" which is just a hair-width away from calling it "deprecated view" even though on a regular sized computer screen it's the much more productive view than the iPad inspired layout.
k) the AirPort utility, that no longer shows certain key information
l) OS X Server, which keeps losing functionality
etc. There is more, but that should give good enough of an impression.
Some of the most obnoxious things are somewhat fixed, e.g. Contacts now allows again a column for groups, even though the window layout is still more rigid than in Snow Leopard, and the kitschy, non-functional decorations still remain, or e.g. the ability to disable the "group windows by application" setting in Mission Control gives at least the "all windows" command back, even though not in the full glory of Snow Leopard.
But by and large, while Mountain Lion is a big improvement over Lion, it's still a step back from Snow Leopard.
I've been using NeXTSTEP since the 0.8 release, and Mac OS X since it was called Rhapsody Prerelease, and Lion is the worst in the entire 24 year history, and Mountain Lion is just a tad better.
Apple keeps dumbing down things past the point of usefulness.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
So what?
Few people with 3+ year old computers ever upgrade, anyway. And it's not as if your old computer is going to stop working.
One of the reasons Macs work so well and upgrades are so painless is that Apple limits the scope of their OS. They have no desire to support every Mac ever built because the complexity increases exponentially for only very modest gain.
If you want to be able to install your OS on 10 year old computers, stick with Windows. Just don't complain if it doesn't work well because you're part of the reason it doesn't work well.
I don't think you understand Windows users.
They don't put new operating systems on old computers. They put old operating systems on new computers. Just look at the huge number of people still using Windows XP.
The retail version is still crap. I've been using the DP for months on my MBA 11" late 2010 with 4GB ram, and there were lots of problems with Safari and Quicktime crashing and the entire machine freezing to the point to where the way to restart was to hold down the power button. I was expecting all of this to be resolved with the full retail version, but it hasn't. I'm considering a fresh install, which is something I've never had to do for a Mac before. Has anyone experienced the same as me and did a fresh install help?
By the way, I noticed that Safari removed Activity Window and replaced it with a Develop menu. I use to download clips and other stuff off of the web with Activity Window, can anyone tell me how I can do this now?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
If you want to be able to install your OS on 10 year old computers, stick with Windows. Just don't complain if it doesn't work well because you're part of the reason it doesn't work well.
Why would XP on a new i7 be inferior to XP on an old pIII?
My experience of putting older OSes on newer hardware is that they tend to run better than on older hardware.
Are you suggesting that the principle of making hardware backwards compatitble is a bad thing?
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerbrent
I think it would have hit MUCH better if AirPlay was supported in some fashion for all machines. The major feature of this release only works with a few machines, and Lion is a brilliant release. $20 might not be a lot of paper, but what do I get for my $20?
After some digging, I found its Intel's fault, not Apple's. (well, partially)
Support for Intel Quick Sync Video was added in OS X Mountain Lion for use with AirPlay Mirroring - but only high-end Sandy Bridge Processors or newer have Quick Sync video. From the benchmarks I've seen on the internet, Quick Sync is about 22x faster than software decoding/encoding on the same processor.
I've tried Air Parrot on my Arrandale i7 iMac (AirPlay Mirroring but in Software) and the CPU usage was surprisingly high.
Whilst AirParrot is running on the desktop with a web browser, there is a little bit of usage across all cores. Started playing a video full screen and all 8 threads became active, with the 4 physical cores (threads 1, 3, 5 and 7) running at around 50% each.
I can see /why/ Apple didn't want AirPlay Mirroring natively on setups without Quick Sync, but they should have at least let us try it! That kind of sustained processor usage can make any computer hot hot hot!
Originally Posted by capoeira4u
By the way, I noticed that Safari removed Activity Window and replaced it with a Develop menu. I use to download clips and other stuff off of the web with Activity Window, can anyone tell me how I can do this now?
No, the Develop menu has always been there. They removed Activity and gave the shortcut to the Inspector (that has also always been there).
When you find out how to do what the Activity window did, let me know. They better just bring the darn thing BACK in 6.0.1.
Why not use the GPU? Definitely the GPU could do this especially with OpenCL.